woa! mag bounce, gun getting cold with nitro!

[master_alexander]

ok so i just tuned my brothers gun (thanks hockeynoodles) and we got it so you can just touch it and it will start to rip really fast. i dont know how fast... but probably 15.

annyway we are using nitro (68/45 crossfire 850 psi output) and paint, and we shot it for about 3 seconds and then stopped and the tank reg was cold. and the valve.

is this normal or should i make it not as reactive?

[68magOwner]

...if you want it to be legal at all you should not have it like that, but, otherwise, should be fine?

[Army]

Cold as in frost formed,

or cold as in bare-feet-on-the-tummy?

If the latter, totally normal.

If the former...someone swapped HPA with Co2 :rofl:

[master_alexander]

i dont think they did swap it with co2... they have been there over 10 years :D

also i think im going to make it not as reactive, but it isint even my gun (it was my tank though) i think my brothers tank has an output of only 800 psi, so that might make a slight difference.

and i dont think they will elt him have it that way either... o well...

so i am re-formatting my question a bit

what happens if you put co2 in a nitrogen tank?

[behemoth]

i dont think they did swap it with co2... they have been there over 10 years :D

also i think im going to make it not as reactive, but it isint even my gun (it was my tank though) i think my brothers tank has an output of only 800 psi, so that might make a slight difference.

and i dont think they will elt him have it that way either... o well...

so i am re-formatting my question a bit

what happens if you put co2 in a nitrogen tank?

I've heard it ruins the tank.

[Thordic]

If you vent high pressure air fast enough, it gets cold. Not sure why. I remember I had to vent a full tank of air on my Flatline once, so I just disconnected the hose and opened the on/off, and about halfway through the venting frost began to form.

I suppose it makes some sense, though. When you compress the air, it gets warm (often uncomfortably hot to the touch), so when you expand it, it gets cold. I'm assuming it has something to do with there is only enough heat energy in the tank to keep the tanks volume of gas at room temperature, so when you let the gas all expand rapidly you don't have enough heat energy to keep the gas at room temperature. Or else I'm totally full of crap and making this all up. You decide until someone who knows better comes to correct me :)

[BigEvil]

I think it also depends on what kind of air mixture they are filling the tanks with. Breathing air gets hotter than normal copmpressor air for some reason.

[Mr. Mouse]

its normal, ive had it happen to me this weekend at the field when i had to get a fill nipple replaced on my hpa tank and had to let the air out, the airline froze up and stuff that he used to let it out

[warbeak2099]

Yea, venting hpa real fast does turn it cold. I was fiddling with an electro-pneu marker one time with the tank in. Not smart. I accidentally slipped a peice of micro hose of of one of the barbs on the noid and got sprayed with a little stream of hpa. It was so cold it burned.

[cdacda13]

heat and pressure and something else are all connected.
As pressure increases, so does heat.
As pressure decreases, so does heat.
and, vicsa versa

Thats why when you get a quick fill on your tank, the reg is hott.
And, its the same reason why when shooting fast, the reg gets cold, and condensition happens.

[master_alexander]

another question:

is shooting that fast for 5 seconds bad? (5 seconds go, one second stop, 5 seconds go etc...)

[slade]

heat and pressure and something else are all connected.
As pressure increases, so does heat.
As pressure decreases, so does heat.
and, vicsa versa
true. it makes sense easily when i think about it, but its hard to explain or put words to. when the air is compressed the molecules are pushed close together so there is more energy and friction in a small area.


my HPA tank and freestyle have become completely frosted before when i just dry fire it practicing walking the trigger, but also my freestyle is an air hog. about as much of one as a mag, if not more.

[ntn4502]

Bernelli's Tube(tube)

its why planes need to use carb heaters on 70 degree days

[buzzboy]

My dad is a volunteer fire fighter so I have helped out at the station on occation. One time I got to bleed the SCBA tanks of their air so we could send them off to be hydroed. When you crack open that valve it gets really cold. Then after the tank was emptied it had frost on the reg area.

What happens is this. When the air is compressed into the chamber the molecules get very close together and therefore create a lot of friction and cause heat. When the molecules are rapidly depressurized the heat leaves. It's not like the air is getting colder, it's just losing its warmth.

[magman007]

Bernelli's Tube(tube)

its why planes need to use carb heaters on 70 degree days


bernoulli :) and only your crappy carbeurated planes need carb heat :)

/me <3s Fuel injected :)

[spacedtedybear]

what happens if you put co2 in a nitrogen tank?
It'll eat way at the tank. Co2 is acidic. The little itty bitty bits of metal you get stuck in an gun using Co2 is pieces of the tank.

[brianlojeck]

I'm pretty sure co2 isn't THAT acidic. It is all around us after all, it's not like dumping your tank in a big james-bond-villan style acid vat., I figured the chunks of metal are from sloppy/unclean filling stations (cross-threaded tanks and the like...)

I was told the big problem with co2 in a fiber tank is the temperature changes. the fiber is wrapped around an aluminum tank, and as the co2 fill cools the tank, then warms up, then firing cools the tank, then warms up, then venting cools the tank, then warms up, etc... the aluminum distorts at a different rate then the fiber, and they start to delaminate, then the aluminum starts to crack, then your tank sucks.

I've heard its "safe" to fill an aluminum hpa tank with co2, but that the seals in the reg might not like the cold, and you need to make sure you've got the right burst disks in place.