When does 'No' mean 'No'?

[Automaggot68]

When a girl tells you 'No', does it always mean 'No'?

Answer below.



Yes. It always means NO.


Recently a friend of mine was in a situation where a guy was trying to kiss her, put his hands on her.
She resisted several times.
She told him that he wasn't going to get anything from her, not a kiss or otherwise.
After she resisted more he gave up,'I'm going to bed then'.
He Left her dorm-but not before giving her a slap on her rear.
I asked her how hard, and she told me,"It was a sexual thing, it wasn't to cause pain".
This was in her dorm room, with the door open.

This girl, I've known her for several years.
She can be a flirt, but she has never led anyone on that I've ever been aware of.
The kind of flirting where a guy says something, the girl quips back-nothing more after that.
Further more, she is a well...Jerk<insert 'B' word here>. When something bothers her, she lets you know. She is clear, and is loud.
There was nothing lost in translation, she was verbal regarding his actions.

I told her no means no. I told her not to hang around with him one-on-one anymore.
I told her you don't cross the line when you don't get what you want.
I told her that it doesn't matter, you don't touch a girl--No. you don't touch a person that doesn't want to be touched.

This should be Added.
He has tried to kiss her twice before.
I asked her why why hung out with him a third time.
"because I defused the situation before it got out of hand and he wasn't aggressive about it. Furthermore, while I got the impression that that's what was happening, and he was definitely closer than I was comfortable with, he always let it go after I moved away. I figured since he didnt pursue it those times, a 'no' the next time will be taken the same way."


What about you AO?
What would you tell the girl who came to you?
Do you think she's overreacting to his actions?
Smart *** comments and the like wont be welcome in this thread, or any of that rubbish.

[JoshK]

No does mean no.

If someone doesn't want to go past a certain point, you should do nothing to make them go past that point. Accidently or on purpose.

As a christian that's why I discussed with my girlfriend what my line is, so that once we get there she will understand we won't go past it. Same with me and her line.

[Indignant]

Well, the guy sounds like a dick. Sounds like the type I end up getting in fights with because alot of the time people are just to goddamn blind to see that they are being taken advantage of. People like that just need to GTFO, the world is a better place without them.

[slade]

I agree with what you told her. if she says and means no, and clearly conveys that, he should respect what she said. it looked like he did at first though, since she said that he let it go the first two times he tried to kiss her, and she moved away. however after he slapped her... she did clearly show that she was not interested in him, and he aparently decided to not respect that. so i agree with what you said, she should stay away from him.

[CprodigyX]

Like you said no means no!!! Guys like that one need to be disposed of. As an RA at my school I've had to deal with this type of situation before. I strongly suggest that your friend bring the issue up with her RA or someone on campus. If this has happened before with this guy there’s no telling what he might try next.

[FooTemps]

Tell her that she should carry some sort of self defense the next time she hangs around the guy. Pepper spray ought to diffuse the situation if it really gets out of control. lol. That's an extreme measure though. I suggest that she stay away from the guy if he tries to get what she doesn't want to give. And if she still insists on hanging out with him, a well placed slap ought to tell him "no". Those methods are really confrontational and would piss the guy off though so I don't think those would be all that good of an idea. She should just avoid the guy from now on.

[RevBrown]

She should definitly stay away from this guy. It sounds as if he believes no means "Try again later" Definitly sounds like he has the potential to get more aggresive.

[Kevmaster]

no always means no. it never means anything short of STOP.

technically...he could be arrested for what he did.

i don't respect any man who doesnt understand this.

[quik]

phpppptttt everybody knows no means yes, and yes means no!

[Target Practice]

I was once accused of being a rapist.

It made me so mad, I knocked the guy down, flipped him over, and pounded him like there was no tomorrow.

[Dubstar112]

I agree, NO definatley means NO, except when said after the fact. At that point you have to wonder of her intentions. I mean going so far and then her saying no she didnt want any of that to happen is complete bull. I believe girls are in control as much as us guys and trying to fool the system is just plain wrong. I know of one guy who went to trial and was aquitted of all charges because the girl admitted she lied about saying no. In his case it didnt go on his record but normally if you are acused of rape it sticks with you whether guilty or not.

Confront him about it. If he has nothing to say then that should be the end. But I dont care how long you know a person, and I still know girls(read friendly type) who Ive grown up with that always after the fact have said "I'd wish nothing would have happened". If she let it go that far its her fault. Say no before saying no isnt an option and its his fault. Saying no during or after and its hers. Regret doesnt mean no, and hopefully you can decipher the situation yourself.

Dont take this, or any of this forum as legal or professional help either. This is opinion not law.

I would tell her to stay away from him also. But dont overrule the fact she may be overreacting. Its a per-situation kind of decision that you have to judge as it comes.

[billybob_81067]

I was once accused of being a rapist.

It made me so mad, I knocked the guy down, flipped him over, and pounded him like there was no tomorrow.

You flipped him over and POUNDED him??? Wow I think you ARE a rapist! :rofl:

[Automaggot68]

Editted for Civility:

Going so Far?
She didn't do ANYTHING.
How far did she go?
She was laying face down on her bed, while he and others were watching a movie.
When the others left, he tried to roll her over, to kiss her.
She resisted, and gave him the what's what.

I left this out because I wanted a broad range of opinions, but you took this in a completely diffrently direction.

Trying to fool the system? I'm not sure i'm follwing you.
This person is alot more standup than ALOT of the people on this forum.
She volunteers at the Women's Shelter, she tutors middle schoolers, she was a Lifeguard down here in San Diego, and helped train the younger interns over the summers.

Said after the Fact? This was said before and during. When he got the picture, then he used his hand.


I agree, NO definatley means NO, except when said after the fact. At that point you have to wonder of her intentions. I mean going so far and then her saying no she didnt want any of that to happen is complete bull. I believe girls are in control as much as us guys and trying to fool the system is just plain wrong. I know of one guy who went to trial and was aquitted of all charges because the girl admitted she lied about saying no. In his case it didnt go on his record but normally if you are acused of rape it sticks with you whether guilty or not.

Confront him about it. If he has nothing to say then that should be the end. But I dont care how long you know a person, and I still know girls(read friendly type) who Ive grown up with that always after the fact have said "I'd wish nothing would have happened". If she let it go that far its her fault. Say no before saying no isnt an option and its his fault. Saying no during or after and its hers. Regret doesnt mean no, and hopefully you can decipher the situation yourself.

Dont take this, or any of this forum as legal or professional help either. This is opinion not law.

I would tell her to stay away from him also. But dont overrule the fact she may be overreacting. Its a per-situation kind of decision that you have to judge as it comes.

[3pac]

No means NO! How hard is it to respect someone's wishes? If anything, that guy is a complete idiot for believing that something means another thing. If something is said out of the mouth, there is definately some meaning behind it, else you wouldn't say it. That's just my 2 cents

[Dubstar112]

Editted for Civility:

Going so Far?
She didn't do ANYTHING.
How far did she go?
She was laying face down on her bed, while he and others were watching a movie.
When the others left, he tried to roll her over, to kiss her.
She resisted, and gave him the what's what.

I left this out because I wanted a broad range of opinions, but you took this in a completely diffrently direction.

Trying to fool the system? I'm not sure i'm follwing you.
This person is alot more standup than ALOT of the people on this forum.
She volunteers at the Women's Shelter, she tutors middle schoolers, she was a Lifeguard down here in San Diego, and helped train the younger interns over the summers.

Said after the Fact? This was said before and during. When he got the picture, then he used his hand.

Right, respect that this is the internet and not every aspect can be accounted for. Im only making comments, and asking you to judge whether or not they fit the situation.

I also agreed and she shoudl tell him to stay away.


If you left it out and I took it in another direction it isnt my fault. I AM trying to cover all the aspects but like I said above not all can be accounted for.

I also appreciate your civility, as you can obviously tell this is the internet. Too bad not everyone could be like that.

[Automaggot68]

Right, respect that this is the internet and not every aspect can be accounted for. Im only making comments, and asking you to judge whether or not they fit the situation.

I also agreed and she shoudl tell him to stay away.


If you left it out and I took it in another direction it isnt my fault. I AM trying to cover all the aspects but like I said above not all can be accounted for.

Yeah. Sorry about that--you can imagine my frustration.

[Dubstar112]

Has she said any thing other than NO to him. Like, Never, and dont try again? This is relative and HE should know that 3rd time isnt a charm.

Also, No could mean no in different instances. NO as in maybe if we decide to like eachother, and NO as in never. To him this may not be as clear and concise as you think. If hes really into her, but shes definatley not she should make that known. Persistance should only go so far and I agree he should get the hint. But hints and NO may not always be enough. She may need to explain that she doesnt want any thing to do with him. Im not saying that she should have to, but if just NO doesnt work on this situation, go one step further. NO NEVER. see where Im going?

[Target Practice]

Funny, I feel the need to eviscerate (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=eviscerate) this worthless bastard here in SLO. Perhaps we can do it simultaneously, with the same MO. That'll keep those CSI jerks guessing.

[3pac]

random thought

a b c d e f g h i j k l m NO p q r s t u v w x y z



just a random thought.

[Indignant]

gone.

[Recon by Fire]

No, means NO.

You shoudl let this girl handle her own affairs and stay clear of it. Don't try to be or have her play you as the knight in shining armor. Try to associate with mature women instead :)

[Indignant]

Ok, maybe that wasn't in the best tastes.

[Indignant]

No, means NO.

You shoudl let this girl handle her own affairs and stay clear of it. Don't try to be or have her play you as the knight in shining armor. Try to associate with mature women instead :)


Well, up until now that's what she has been doing, handling her own affairs. And look where it's got her. Someone needs to help out,

[tropical_fishy]

Has she said any thing other than NO to him. Like, Never, and dont try again? This is relative and HE should know that 3rd time isnt a charm.

Also, No could mean no in different instances. NO as in maybe if we decide to like eachother, and NO as in never. To him this may not be as clear and concise as you think. If hes really into her, but shes definatley not she should make that known. Persistance should only go so far and I agree he should get the hint. But hints and NO may not always be enough. She may need to explain that she doesnt want any thing to do with him. Im not saying that she should have to, but if just NO doesnt work on this situation, go one step further. NO NEVER. see where Im going?


If he was that into her, he wouldn't have slapped her butt and left. If he was into her, wouldn't he want to stay and hang out? And from what I can tell she SAID no... verbally and physically.


Just sayin'.

[Dubstar112]

Agreed, but there is whackos out there who just dont get it.

[SpecialBlend2786]

Of course it means no, but I have little sympathy for girls who still hang around those kind of guys and have continued problems. If she thinks she can simply "diffuse it" or whatever... she is mistaken and is asking for trouble. Guys like that don't learn, they will try again given the opportunity... regardless of her naive belief that she has control of the situation while being around him. She needs to cut contact with him.

If she gets hurt, and does not do this: Don't feel sorry for her. If something does happen... she needs to take care of it immediately, as far as reporting it. "Why did it take you a week to contact us?" will be the first question... nothing will be resolved.

. If she gets hurt dont feel sorry for her? what the hell is wrong with you.

You honestly dont think that she is trying to cut contact with him after this incident? You dont think that she's been tryinig to avoid him at all costs after this? It's obvious that the situation can no longer be diffused, but before this i dont believe the guy was ever this agressive.

You have little sympathy for girls who still hand around these kind of guys? Well you're sure as hell not showing any sympathy for girls that have had run-ins with those kind of guys and are trying to get away.

[Miscue]

Of course it means no, but I have little sympathy for girls who still hang around those kind of guys and have continued problems. If she thinks she can simply "diffuse it" or whatever... she is mistaken and is asking for trouble. Guys like that don't learn, they will try again given the opportunity... regardless of her naive belief that she has control of the situation while being around him. She needs to cut contact with him.

If she gets hurt and does not do this: Don't feel sorry for her. If something does happen... she needs to take care of it immediately, as far as reporting it or whatever. Otherwise, "Why did it take you a week to contact us?" will be the first question... nothing will be resolved.

If something really bad happens, she needs to take care of it immediately... call the police/sexual assault... which will follow with an invasive/uncomfortable inspection by the doctor - and if you're quick and they can get the guy... he'll get swabbed for fluids and such. Crying about it and waiting will make conviction difficult to impossible.

This is reality. Girls get raped all the freakin' time. Rich girls, educated girls... hell no are they immune... there are victims all the time... the kind that think they have control over the situation... yet they keep hanging around these fools.

[slade]

Confront him about it.
thats what i thought at first. but remember, a lot of people in situations like this just want to get away from the person, and never see them again. the last thing they want is to be forced to see them again.

oh, and you can tell from the first post that the girl said no clearly both verbally and through body language. you did take the subject of girls saying "no" into a direction contrary to the situation given in the origional post.


Has she said any thing other than NO to him. Like, Never, and dont try again? This is relative and HE should know that 3rd time isnt a charm.
that should already be evident to him, although telling him that couldnt hurt... although as i said, she probably wants to stay away from him.


You shoudl let this girl handle her own affairs and stay clear of it. Don't try to be or have her play you as the knight in shining armor. Try to associate with mature women instead
that post was not needed at all. you just essentially said the girl is overreacting and immature, while insulting derek at the same time, and possibly implying that she is using him.

[SpecialBlend2786]

Of course it means no, but I have little sympathy for girls who still hang around those kind of guys and have continued problems. If she thinks she can simply "diffuse it" or whatever... she is mistaken and is asking for trouble. Guys like that don't learn, they will try again given the opportunity... regardless of her naive belief that she has control of the situation while being around him. She needs to cut contact with him.

If she gets hurt and does not do this: Don't feel sorry for her. If something does happen... she needs to take care of it immediately, as far as reporting it or whatever. Otherwise, "Why did it take you a week to contact us?" will be the first question... nothing will be resolved.

If something really bad happens, she needs to take care of it immediately... call the police/sexual assault... which will follow with an invasive/uncomfortable inspection by the doctor - and if you're quick and they can get the guy... he'll get swabbed for fluids and such. Crying about it and waiting will make conviction difficult to impossible.

This is reality. Girls get raped all the freakin' time. Rich girls, educated girls... hell no are they immune... there are victims all the time... the kind that think they have control over the situation... yet they keep hanging around these fools.

The girls that think they have control of the situation are not the only girls that get raped. So in your reality you show no sympathy for a girl that goes through that? You show no sympathy for a miscalculation? for a girl thinking that she knows a guy as a friend, only to find out that the only thing he wants is her body?
How could you tell someone not to feel sorry for a friend? Where the **** are your morals, or more importantly your heart.

I think that if a close friend of yours was raped, someone who you really cared about, you'd feel something.
If not you're no better then the guys that do this ****.

[Miscue]

. If she gets hurt dont feel sorry for her? what the hell is wrong with you.

You honestly dont think that she is trying to cut contact with him after this incident? You dont think that she's been tryinig to avoid him at all costs after this? It's obvious that the situation can no longer be diffused, but before this i dont believe the guy was ever this agressive.

You have little sympathy for girls who still hand around these kind of guys? Well you're sure as hell not showing any sympathy for girls that have had run-ins with those kind of guys and are trying to get away.

You're misunderstanding my point of view... going off on a tangent.... and have no idea of what my personal experience has been with this subject. I won't explain, I don't want to talk about it.

Certain types of sex offenders are among the lowest scum in my mind and should be hung by their genitals.

Note that I said "little sympathy," not "no sympathy." Interpret that how you wish. My sympathy for children... someone who had a random attacker... things of this sort - is going to be different from a girl who keeps hanging around a guy that's been acting stupid.

Note the part where he said: "she's still hanging out with him a 3rd time." Is she making large efforts in trying to avoid him?

[Archangel Zer0]

The girls that think they have control of the situation are not the only girls that get raped. So in your reality you show no sympathy for a girl that goes through that? You show no sympathy for a miscalculation? for a girl thinking that she knows a guy as a friend, only to find out that the only thing he wants is her body?
How could you tell someone not to feel sorry for a friend? Where the **** are your morals, or more importantly your heart.

I think that if a close friend of yours was raped, someone who you really cared about, you'd feel something.
If not you're no better then the guys that do this ****.
Are you out of your mind? This girl has been through this three times and she'll hang out with him again why? She needs to take some responsibility, kick the freak out of her room, and report the situation to her RA, dorm supervisor, College Board, etc.

You learn as a small child to keep your hands out of fire or you'll get burned. Since this girl seems to not want to learn that lesson she'll probably end up getting hurt. Is it sad? Sure, but she has the power to stop it now. She is making a choice not to. No pity here, either.

This victim mentality we have going on in America needs to stop.

[SpecialBlend2786]

You're misunderstanding my point of view... going off on a tangent.... and have no idea of what my personal experience has been with this subject. I won't explain, I don't want to talk about it.

Certain types of sex offenders are among the lowest scum in my mind and should be hung by their genitals.

Note that I said "little sympathy," not "no sympathy." Interpret that how you wish. My sympathy for children... someone who had a random attacker... things of this sort - is going to be different from a girl who keeps hanging around a guy that's been acting stupid.

Note the part where he said: "she's still hanging out with him a 3rd time." Is she making large efforts in trying to avoid him?

She opens her dorm room door, see's the guy down the hall and slams it. She avoids him at all costs. I'd say she's making an effort to avoid him.

She isn't ASKING for anything. The two other times have been MINOR, and if i understand correctly this is the first serious attempt where there was a physical incident. After things turned physical she's been avoiding him.

If something happens now, even after she's made all efforts to avoid him, including contacting her RA, is it still her fault? Would you still show little sympathy?

You're not the only one with personal experience on this subject.

[SpecialBlend2786]

Are you out of your mind? This girl has been through this three times and she'll hang out with him again why? She needs to take some responsibility, kick the freak out of her room, and report the situation to her RA, dorm supervisor, College Board, etc.

You learn as a small child to keep your hands out of fire or you'll get burned. Since this girl seems to not want to learn that lesson she'll probably end up getting hurt. Is it sad? Sure, but she has the power to stop it now. She is making a choice not to. No pity here, either.

This victim mentality we have going on in America needs to stop.

SHGE"S ALREADY CONTACTED HER ****ING RA! SHE"S ALREADY MADE EVERY ATTEMPT TO STAY AWAY! WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT??!?

WHERE was it said that she had hung out with him after this third time?! where was it said that she wants to have ANYTHING to do with him anymore?!

[tropical_fishy]

Azaam, chill out, or Derek's gonna delete the thread. Let it go. Stop posting.

[slade]

Is she making large efforts in trying to avoid him?
id say yes.


Are you out of your mind? This girl has been through this three times and she'll hang out with him again why? She needs to take some responsibility, kick the freak out of her room, and report the situation to her RA, dorm supervisor, College Board, etc.

You learn as a small child to keep your hands out of fire or you'll get burned. Since this girl seems to not want to learn that lesson she'll probably end up getting hurt. Is it sad? Sure, but she has the power to stop it now. She is making a choice not to. No pity here, either.

This victim mentality we have going on in America needs to stop.
read the first post again. she SAID why she didnt do anything at first. he stopped pursuing it and seemed like he was accepting her wishes, and accepting that they were to be friends only. but the last time it clearly went over that line. dont assume she hasnt taken responsibility for it, youre assuming too much, dont jump to conclusions. she HAS reported it to her RA, but he hasnt done much about it.

oh, and to you, miscue and everyone who says shes stupid etc for being around him. ive talked to her too. shes at college, and he lives 2 doors down from her. she opens the door, and hes walking by in the hall. her dorm has a party? hes there. its not like shes calling him up and saying, "hey, want to get together, you know so you can make me uncomfortable and sexually assault me again?" shes not stupid, and after he slapped her she definately DOESNT want to be anywhere near him. but also its not like shes going to hide in her room her room for 4 years, shes going to go out which means shes likely to run into him.

[Miscue]

I think that if a close friend of yours was raped, someone who you really cared about, you'd feel something.
If not you're no better then the guys that do this ****.
I cannot explain to you how angry your comments have made me and the self-restraint it took to keep civil - I don't think you would have liked my first draft of this post.

Holding someone as tight as you can who just told you, "I've been raped..." crying with her - as helpless as I felt I knew I could not know what she felt. And that's just the beginning. Multiple people, multiple stories... long periods of dealing with the aftermath... I don't want to get into it any further. I'm not saying that you don't have your experiences, or am trying to make any comparisons... but don't tell me that I am as bad as them.

[SpecialBlend2786]

I cannot explain to you how angry your comments have made me and the self-restraint it took to keep civil - I don't think you would have liked my first draft of this post.

Holding someone as tight as you can who just told you, "I've been raped..." crying with her - as helpless as I felt I knew I could not know what she felt. And that's just the beginning. Multiple people, multiple stories... long periods of dealing with the aftermath... I don't want to get into it any further. I'm not saying that you don't have your experiences, or am trying to make any comparisons... but don't tell me that I am as bad as them.

that was in bad taste, I wasn't thinking straight, and i'm sorry for saying what i did.

Just got angry, ya know? Having someone tell me not to feel sorry for her if she gets hurt.

I'll srtop posting now

[Recon by Fire]

that post was not needed at all. you just essentially said the girl is overreacting and immature, while insulting derek at the same time, and possibly implying that she is using him.


No, you have it wrong. I am just advising him to be wary of women who would lure you into being a knight in shining armor. These women are pretty much trouble with a capital T.

[Indignant]

Well this one isn't, so leave. This thread will probably be gone soon anyways.

[Cameo]

Agreed, but there is whackos out there who just dont get it.

They don't get it because some girls like to play mind games. they like to say no to see how far a guy will push it. they say the oposite of what they mean and it confuses the guy. Some will say things just to get a reaction.. If you find one of these girls run far far away.


But a basic rule to be safe is if she says no, then don't.

[mutigerfan04]

They don't get it because some girls like to play mind games. they like to say no to see how far a guy will push it. they say the oposite of what they mean and it confuses the guy. Some will say things just to get a reaction.. If you find one of these girls run far far away.


But a basic rule to be safe is if she says no, then don't.

Bravo well put. :cheers:

[devildog]

i didnt read this whole thing, but my point of view is there is 2 sides to every story. im not saying i dont believe, just remember that.

also, i agree with the guy above about the mind games. women are wierd, they dont even know what they want. most of the time.

[SpecialBlend2786]

i didnt read this whole thing, but my point of view is there is 2 sides to every story. im not saying i dont believe, just remember that.

also, i agree with the guy above about the mind games. women are wierd, they dont even know what they want. most of the time.

Well, in this case i'm sure that when she said no, she ment no.

[Dubstar112]

Thats kinda where I was headed, but I didnt want to offend anyone, and I think the title answered itself way before anyone replied.