Spydermag

[mastershake44]

Would you only have to modifie the rail to make a spydermag?

[warbeak2099]

No, no modification gets done to the rail.

The spyder e-frame is dremeled/milled to accept the mag sear and is drilled to fit on a mag rail. The spyder sear and mag sear are cut and modded to work together. That is all that is done. No work gets done to the rail at all unless you want to route eyes through it.

[11 Bravo]

Yeh nothing is done to the rail. An easier mod to the spyder frame is where u just reverse the noid.
Check with Arstron he is the expert. I think he is on AO, but I know he frequents Automags on Pbnation.

[Arstron]

Yes, AO is my home, pbn just doesnt get alot of post so it seems like im there more. :tard:

For info on the reverse solenoid spydermag mod, look here:
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=185749

I will gladly answer any questions you have about it.

[wolfspawn]

:confused:
what is the point of this mod though?
just wondering if fire rate is gained do you loose accuracy?
I own a mag cause I like to hit what I aim at :D
but I will be a back next year and fire rate would be nice something around 17 BPS so this seems like one of the few options other then the ultimate mech frame.
the electric is just way to much... yeah they are parts pricy thats why so much but still I could just sell my mag and get an ion or older timmy no?
so now that your confused too, what I really want to know is can I slap a 17BPS frame on my mag and keep accurate? ;)

[Arstron]

:confused:
what is the point of this mod though?
just wondering if fire rate is gained do you loose accuracy?
I own a mag cause I like to hit what I aim at :D
but I will be a back next year and fire rate would be nice something around 17 BPS so this seems like one of the few options other then the ultimate mech frame.
the electric is just way to much... yeah they are parts pricy thats why so much but still I could just sell my mag and get an ion or older timmy no?
so now that your confused too, what I really want to know is can I slap a 17BPS frame on my mag and keep accurate? ;)

Trigger frame/gun/hopper/bolt none of that will effect accuracy, paint to barrel match is your main factor when it comes to accuracy.

The reason for the spyder mod is so you can give your mag a very light trigger pull. The lighter the trigger pull is, the easier you can walk the trigger. If you want 17 bps, chances are you will have to add a t-board and ramping chip (if where you play allows ramping, im not for it), but chances are you will have to have a ramping chip anyway to reach 17bps. The t-boards have a tournament lock on them (15 bps), you can add ramping chips or multi-mode chips (burst modes, full auto, etc.), eyes, and stock they have an unlimited rate of fire. It makes your mag a nice sleeper gun. ;)

[wolfspawn]

Step Three, Getting the sear close enough to the solenoid so the solenoid can trip it. I used a bench grinder for this. You just have to shave enough metal off of the top of the frame so that the bottom of the sear will be at the piston in the solenoid. You should start by removing a little less then a 1/8th of an inch where the sear will go into the frame. I am sure different frames will vary in size, but should be pretty close. In the 2 frames I built for my self, I angled it so the rear was closer then the front, but being completely strait should work as well. This is also a good time to chop the front piece off so that it is even with the trigger guard. The front piece gets in the way of a foregrip and is not needed.

on this step could you not just replace the rail with say a 16gauge piece of metal shaped like the body which is shaped like your average spider body on the under side?
true you would need your body to be cocker threaded but you really dont need that thing at the back cause the rear screw keeps the valve in place.

[wolfspawn]

no I cant get abouve 14 realisticly with my kids timmy but if I was doing this I would want to make it as fast as I can . I dont like guns over 15 iether but we are behind up here in winnipeg :mad: ...
I would love an all mech league but it aint gonna happen here so ...
I used to have piranahs and I just find with even a stock barrel my mag could out shoot tear droped spiders and the trigectory is different .
on spider and clones from end to end they seem to arch in as apposed to cockers and mags that just about shoot straight ?
even my kids timmy and his buddies angel lobed with pipe kits at the range I could still shoot pretty straight.
Oh yeah I dont care for multi options either I loved my old eframe ext.
just turn on and shoot thats all.


At any rate if I go this way would you higher out to do it ?

PS thanks for the info...

[Arstron]

on this step could you not just replace the rail with say a 16gauge piece of metal shaped like the body which is shaped like your average spider body on the under side?
true you would need your body to be cocker threaded but you really dont need that thing at the back cause the rear screw keeps the valve in place.

I am not sure exactly what you are talking about here, do you mean making a new rail so that you dont have to shave off any metal? It would be much easier to shave the 1/8" off of the trigger frame. I am not really sure what you mean...


no I cant get abouve 14 realisticly with my kids timmy but if I was doing this I would want to make it as fast as I can . I dont like guns over 15 iether but we are behind up here in winnipeg :mad: ...
I would love an all mech league but it aint gonna happen here so ...
I used to have piranahs and I just find with even a stock barrel my mag could out shoot tear droped spiders and the trigectory is different .
on spider and clones from end to end they seem to arch in as apposed to cockers and mags that just about shoot straight ?
even my kids timmy and his buddies angel lobed with pipe kits at the range I could still shoot pretty straight.
Oh yeah I dont care for multi options either I loved my old eframe ext.
just turn on and shoot thats all.


At any rate if I go this way would you higher out to do it ?

PS thanks for the info...

As for the acuracy, if you have an automag and a spyder that are setup on a mounted stand, have them shooting at exactly same FPS, could use the exact same barrel on both, have a area with no wind, and shoot the same paint, they should both shoot identical. You can never get any of those variables to be the same though.

I am fixing to order 2 more frames, one is being donated to "Project Red Eye," and the other will be my final version of my dragun-mag. I have built 3 and have tried diffrent things on all 3 to see what could make things better. Considering it goes good, I would be glad to sell it to you or to build you one. PM me if you are interested about that. :)

[Asym]

:confused:
what is the point of this mod though?
just wondering if fire rate is gained do you loose accuracy?
I own a mag cause I like to hit what I aim at :D
but I will be a back next year and fire rate would be nice something around 17 BPS so this seems like one of the few options other then the ultimate mech frame.
the electric is just way to much... yeah they are parts pricy thats why so much but still I could just sell my mag and get an ion or older timmy no?
so now that your confused too, what I really want to know is can I slap a 17BPS frame on my mag and keep accurate? ;)

The mod takes the mag you already have and like Arston said makes the pull much lighter. Even if you make a new rail you are still going to either mod the sears to work together or mill the frame so the mag sear will even drop down far enough to be triped by the solinoid. If you like the way your mag shoots it will shoot the same after the mod, except you will need a ULT installed. I did the same mod with a classic and I've only tried it at 16bps ramping, it keeps up with any electro out there.

On a side note a few weeks ago I played a 3 man tournament limited to semi only. After the last game the mag was leaking and I had to switch the carrier for the first time since tuning the level 10, after roughly a season of about 10 cases of paint.

[Arstron]

On a side note a few weeks ago I played a 3 man tournament limited to semi only. After the last game the mag was leaking and I had to switch the carrier for the first time since tuning the level 10, after roughly a season of about 10 cases of paint.

Sounds like the level 10 is just getting broken in. ;)

[nevtangle]

I am fixing to order 2 more frames, one is being donated to "Project Red Eye," and the other will be my final version of my dragun-mag. I have built 3 and have tried diffrent things on all 3 to see what could make things better. Considering it goes good, I would be glad to sell it to you or to build you one. PM me if you are interested about that. :)
Which is a better frame to use the spyder or dragun? Is there any difference?

[wolfspawn]

will keep in touch on the build or sell thing ok I am interested.just so I know what might something like this run? I may need as many as 3 eventualy 6 as if it works out I would like to put the wjhole team in mags :cool:

as for my idea I dont mean to build a new rail per say I mean you know how the spider frame just bolts to the body right ?
ok the mag needs the rail really just to hold the parts together and prevent the on/off pin from comming out.
ok this is what I was wondering :
could you use a thin but sturdy piece of metal to keep the on/off pin in place and to mount the forword grip.
if you have a cocker threading you dont need the twist assembly right so whats left to hold together the valve which the rear bolt should hold in place.

simply put imagine a rail say classic and just see the top 16" of an inch across the rail now if it conforms to the top the bottom should match up good with a spider frame , no ?
then you just need to mod the solinoid and fit the mag sear right or am I missing some thing?

just thought it would save time and keep the new grip cleaner as you dont have to grind away the top...
maybe wouldn`t work just wondering if you thought of it.

[Arstron]

Both are very similar, I like the dragun frame becuse they are cheaper, and they come with a lighter micro switch. The frames I get, the stock board is capped at 9 bps and they are semi only. The spyder ESP frames are capped at 13 bps, and have diffrent firing modes. There is t-boards for both frames though. :)

[wolfspawn]

I would like the dragon frames too :dance: :hail: :bounce:

[Arstron]

will keep in touch on the build or sell thing ok I am interested.just so I know what might something like this run? I may need as many as 3 eventualy 6 as if it works out I would like to put the wjhole team in mags :cool:

as for my idea I dont mean to build a new rail per say I mean you know how the spider frame just bolts to the body right ?
ok the mag needs the rail really just to hold the parts together and prevent the on/off pin from comming out.
ok this is what I was wondering :
could you use a thin but sturdy piece of metal to keep the on/off pin in place and to mount the forword grip.
if you have a cocker threading you dont need the twist assembly right so whats left to hold together the valve which the rear bolt should hold in place.

simply put imagine a rail say classic and just see the top 16" of an inch across the rail now if it conforms to the top the bottom should match up good with a spider frame , no ?
then you just need to mod the solinoid and fit the mag sear right or am I missing some thing?

just thought it would save time and keep the new grip cleaner as you dont have to grind away the top...
maybe wouldn`t work just wondering if you thought of it.

I see what you are saying now, you have to rember though that besides keeping everything togeter, it also holds the sear in the right spot. You would have to machine a new rail, but trust me, grinding the top off the frame is much easier. As far as being cleaner, its not that hard to smooth it out, also I have a powder coater near me that I know pretty well. ;)

As for the price, I will pm you.

[afortuna]

How much different are the semi-new Spyder Rocking Trigger frames versus the older ESP frames? They are claiming up to 30 BPS on their stock board. It does look from the picture to be a different style of trip on the sear.

[BigEvil]

http://www.jayloo.com/files/pics/29000/Spydermag__1__rs.JPG (http://www.jayloo.com/files/pics/29000/Spydermag__1_.JPG)

:D just showing off

If anyone needs help with this mod I can try my best, or at least point you in the right direction.

[Coralis]

Just a thought but have you looked into a hyperframe from centerflag, they arent made anymore but you can still find them at Ebay, AO, etc they are more expensive but they are drop on so you dont have the extra work and expense of converting a spyder frame.

[tonybhall]

Hey Mastershake,

I have a completed fully functional SpyderMag for sale. You can see it here...
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=187685

Also, there is a link there to my PBN thread on how to make one.... Let me know if you're interested. If not, good luck with making your own. Let me know if you need any help.

thanks.

[tonybhall]

An easier mod to the spyder frame is where u just reverse the noid.


thats debatable. At least half a dozen people that did the reverse noid mod have e-mailed me telling me if they had to do it again they would mod the sears because reversing the noid took so much work. When I did mine, I looked at reversing the noid and decided that moding the sears would be easier. I've only talked to one person who has tried both and he says moding the sears is less work if you have the stuff to do it.

[luke]

Anyone know where I can pick one of the ESP frames up for cheap? :)

[tonybhall]

Anyone know where I can pick one of the ESP frames up for cheap? :)

try ebay and pbn forums... I've seen used ones for between $50-$75.

Most places sell them new for around $95 the last time I checked.

also, look in the used marker forums for complete spyders. sometimes they are just as cheap as just the frame.

[Scott Hudnall]

could you mod an intelliframe to accept the electronics of the spyder frame? also, does this require the ULT and if so, how well does it work with a classic valve? I noticed that one of the pics on this thread is using a classic valve. give some specs on it, please. thanks a million. I need a winter project. would prefer not to have to use a spyder frame.

[tonybhall]

could you mod an intelliframe to accept the electronics of the spyder frame? also, does this require the ULT and if so, how well does it work with a classic valve? I noticed that one of the pics on this thread is using a classic valve. give some specs on it, please. thanks a million. I need a winter project. would prefer not to have to use a spyder frame.

moding an intelliframe to hold the electronics, if possible, would be a ton of work.

The spydermag mod does require the ult to work properly. The spyder noid is not powerful enough to provider the 3lbs of force required to trip the stock on/off. It will fire it, but it will be slow and eat batteries and wear out the noid.

You can do the spyder mod with a classic if your classic will accept a ULT. But the classic will not keep up with the increased ROF. Unless you are really slow.

The Kingman Frame used on spyders is actually pretty decent if you replace the trigger and grips. I suggest a slasher trigger and dye stickys.

Hope that helps.