How exactly does a Pneumag frame work?

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Im wondering exactly how a pneumag frame works....Ive looked around at how to's and been frantically searching for a DIY thread, and I still cant find a thread or something that explains how it operates... I know it consists of a 3 way, ram , reg, and etc...but id like to know exactly how it works and what else is needed with it ULT, Xvalve, etc in order for it to work. Thanks and im looking for some help because im trying to get a mag again and try to build one. Thanks AO!

[frontsniper]

Im wondering exactly how a pneumag frame works....Ive looked around at how to's and been frantically searching for a DIY thread, and I still cant find a thread or something that explains how it operates... I know it consists of a 3 way, ram , reg, and etc...but id like to know exactly how it works and what else is needed with it ULT, Xvalve, etc in order for it to work. Thanks and im looking for some help because im trying to get a mag again and try to build one. Thanks AO!

All the pneumatics do is when you hit the 2-way, it releases air from the 2-way to the ram/cylinder. After the air gets to the cylinder a rod attatched to the cylinder hits the sear, thus firing the marker. It's not complicated at all. Just logic will solve this little problem of yours.

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Got ya. Ive got the idea established and the way Id like to have it setup, but im having a hell of time finding all the parts needed, specifically the MSV-1 2 way by FABCO Air, so if anyone could point me to the right direction...maybe a link?? It would be greatly appreciated.

[WakeJake05]

go to thealphamag.com and look at his parts list, there are links to everything you need

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Thanks alot guys for the help with links and such. Found out everything I needed to know, now I just need to get ahold of another mag, and the parts needed for the frame to start producing on it. I think im going to try it on a Intelliframe and stick with an all black approach, been a while since ive owned a mag, and getting the parts seems to be the hardest part. AO Thanks again, you guys are always a great help, best damn forum around!

[BigEvil]

Check these guys out. They did a hell of a nice job on a Pneumag.


http://www.beog.org/redeye/

http://www.beog.org/redeye/images/pneumag/pneumag19.JPG

Also before you go buying parts from Clippard and paying their $20 handeling charge, ask Have Blue over at www.airsoldier.com if he has any of the parts you are looking for.

[WakeJake05]

i just finished by pnuemag, i will post pics up this weekend, it is pretty cool, not as walkable as i thought so i guess i have to bug all that out. i like how i cannot short stroke it at all

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Question number 2-

Out of most of the things ive read ive heard mixed about the ULT, so im coming here again to ask so I know this last detail before I start on my pneumag project. Is the mod more compatiable with the ULT or without it??

[WakeJake05]

i did mine with it

[wjr]

I have a question also. Will you be needing an x-valve or retro for this project?

[tae]

Any valve works.

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

My project beings once I get the mag I just bought off of a fellow AO'er, once it arrives its just a matter of getting the parts put together..It will be being done with a retro valve, seeing as I currently cant afford to do a xvalve as of yet

[tae]

Bah, no need, the X valve is just lighter(aluminium instead of stainless).

GL!
:cheers: .

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Thanks guys, once I get it going Ill post pics the best I can(I have alot of trouble posting them on here) and an as througho walkthrough as I can type for you guys! Also if this mod goes as well as im hoping I may start building the frames for people if there is any demand for it at all.. we will soon see what the near future withholds!

[gunselman]

I have a question also. Will you be needing an x-valve or retro for this project?

actually you can't use a ULT with a standard retro valve. It doesn't use the same o-ring setup as an x valve. I am not sure about the rt.pro/ emag valves. Anyone know?

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

The RT valve I believe your talking about is the one using a banjo bolt, I dont see any reason on why you couldnt use ULT in a RT valve...ive seen it before...

[gunselman]

The RT valve I believe your talking about is the one using a banjo bolt, I dont see any reason on why you couldnt use ULT in a RT valve...ive seen it before...


Here this will settle it.

http://store.airgun.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=catalog.prodInfo&productID=358&categoryID=9

it tells the story about the ULT

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Thats odd, doesnt anyone know what it means by modified retro valve??

[gunselman]

yeah what they do is they drill out the top of the on/off chamber so that it can take the 2 o.ring style on offf. Simple mod for a machinist/ airsmith

It says in the link who does it.



Thats odd, doesnt anyone know what it means by modified retro valve??

[bbearboizz]

I have a question about the airflow in the entire setup.

(btw i thought you were supposed to use a 3-way, not a 2-way?)

So I assume the 3way will have a constant air input going into it. When you pull the trigger of the marker, the part inside moves, providing a way for the air to flow into ram, pushing the sear and firing the gun. Where in this little "story" does the air exhaust? What would happen if i held down the trigger? Would the ram remain in the "activated" position?

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

Technically the valve is a 3 way valve, and input,output, and exhaust port. The valve works exactly like a cocker 3 way does and your using an acutator, not a ram. Also a QEV can be thrown into this setup but isnt a must. The LPR feeds air from your bottomline, drop, etc to the 3 way valve which is mounted directly behind your trigger in the frame. You pull the trigger, activate the valve, move from the input to output which moves the regulated air from your LPR to the acutator which "pushes" or activates the sear. You hold down the trigger all your going to do is keep the valve open , youre not going to get full auto firing.

[bbearboizz]

I am not familiar with the autococker three ways, but i know there are 2 kinds.. the normal one, and a "bomb" correct? Does it exhaust when you let go of the trigger? Or does it exhaust at the end of the trigger pull. Wouldnt the sear be held in the "fire" position if the valve continues to feed air to the actuator?

[ThisStarNeverFalls]

See thats what your missing, your not using an autococker 3 way, which technically an autococker 3 way, is a 4 way valve, one input, two out puts, and an exhaust. For the pneumag mod you use a fabco 3 way valve which has only on input, one output, and one exhaust port. The air of which your referring to is exhaust after the trigger is released,through the 3 way valve, unless you attach a QEV(quick exhaust valve) to the acutator, in which the air can exhaust there allowing for a quicker rate of fire because youre not having to wait for the air to come all the way back to the valve in order to exhaust. LMK if you have anymore questions!

[bbearboizz]

Thanks for the information. I think I understand most of it now. I just wanted to learn the absolute basics of the pneumatics here before I tried it. It would also help me apply the same mod to other various mech guns, IF it works correctly.

Question though: Is the actuator CONNECTED to the sear? Or simply placed so that it hits the sear pin when actuated?

I am trying to attempt to mod this onto a tippmann a5 as well as my 'Mag. But if the sear was held in the "fire" position for the A-5 I really would get "fully auto" action as the sear would continiously fail to catch the rear bolt. I'm trying to prevent this from happening.

[wjr]

go to thealphamag.com and look at his parts list, there are links to everything you need

I went to the alphamag.com for a parts list. Are you sure thats the right name because when I went there it was an ad sight.

[frontsniper]

The pneumatic frame does not use a autococker 3-way. The technical term is the 3-way, but it is commonly called the 2-way. Autocockers use 3-ways, which technically is a 4-way valve.

autococker 3-ways direct two separate air passages, pushing and pulling the ram using air pressure.

The 2-way, technical term 3-way, directs only one air passage. There are two pneumatic fittings used. One is for the regulated pressure to enter the 2-way, and one to direct pressure through the passage to another area. The air pushes the cylinder to move the cylinder internals, and bleeds immediately to relieve pressure to retract the cylinder.

[bbearboizz]

So if i understand your post correctly frontsniper, even if i held down the trigger, keeping the 3-way(Called 2-way) in the open position, the actuator/ram will NOT remain in the acuated/forward position?