Move from Mag to Sp Shocker... Why SP?!?!

[Resurection]

So I have been looking at all the currently available guns and I am real bummed. One of the best features of my mags are their profile (single tube, not too long, etc).

And looking at other guns they all look big, ungainly, or just plain dumb. Except the new shockers. If I were to get a new gun I think it might be a shocker (used of course because damn if I buy from them bastiches) and that just irks me...

Am I the only one that likes no other gun profile except mags/shockers?

[Pyroboy597]

::ion:: :ninja:

[minimag03]

Have you checked out the Freestyle? They are just a tad taller than shockers. The Freestyle is also a flow forward bolt system similar to the mags. In my experience the Freestyle, especially the newer FSP and FS7, will out perform a Shocker.

[peewee]

FS7's are great guns. I have a gen 2 . I just measured the length of the body in comparison to my mag. Mag = 8-7/16, freestyle 7-5/16 long. Heres a link to a gen 2 & mag side by side.

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/axion12000/detail?.dir=/7c1f&.dnm=c650scd.jpg&.src=ph

[trevorjk]

A Gen 2 freesyle... wich i beleive is taller and a little longer then the FS7 wich can now be bought new for $675ish? if i remember correctly

the mag is an xvalve ule body and yframe and a 10 inch JnJ ceramic .... Freestyle is stock in picture except for Reg

<a href="http://www.jayloo.com/photo_gallery/show_pic.html?pIMAGE_ID=10551"> <img src="http://www.jayloo.com/files/pics/9000/DSC01081_4061_rs.JPG"> </img></a>

<a href="http://www.jayloo.com/photo_gallery/show_pic.html?pIMAGE_ID=10552"> <img src="http://www.jayloo.com/files/pics/9000/DSC01082_9345_rs.JPG"> </img></a>

[REDRT]

Yeah I can see where your coming from. I have thought about it also. You know the "what if I didn't use a mag" idea. Looking at the Shocker it is alot like a mag. A ton ton feels like a non ULE emag to me, but the idea of going SP isn't too aluring to me. I've never really liked anything else other than mags, but I had the oppertunity to handle the G7 Angel with the 45* grip. Me likes it alot. I could grow very acustomed to shooting that marker. Will I ever buy one? Eh, most likely not. But if I was to jump ship The G7 is where I'd go hands down over anything currently on the market. Not only that but there is an Angel forum right here. I wouldn't have to change anything. :clap:

[trevorjk]

Yeah I can see where your coming from. I have thought about it also. You know the "what if I didn't use a mag" idea. Looking at the Shocker it is alot like a mag. A ton ton feels like a non ULE emag to me, but the idea of going SP isn't too aluring to me. I've never really liked anything else other than mags, but I had the oppertunity to handle the G7 Angel with the 45* grip. Me likes it alot. I could grow very acustomed to shooting that marker. Will I ever buy one? Eh, most likely not. But if I was to jump ship The G7 is where I'd go hands down over anything currently on the market. Not only that but there is an Angel forum right here. I wouldn't have to change anything. :clap:


that and if you got a Freestyle, i could easily tech it anyday ;)

[master_alexander]

vikings

mags

shockers

thats what i like.

[minimag03]

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/g.jpg

There is a quick pic of some of my markers. The Freestyle feels a lot like a mag in my opinion.

[Chaos_Theory!]

I love small profile guns which is why i like mags, shockers, and ions. Im surprised only one person other than me has said ion.

[REDRT]

that and if you got a Freestyle, i could easily tech it anyday ;)

Not a chance on the Freestyle. PUKE GAG GASP. Not for me. The G7 has a kind of DW Cord V2 look about it that I also like. If I were to buy something like an Angel for one. I'd study to the point of being a master tech long before I ever bought it, but good to know. :cheers:

[Cow hunter]

love the look and feel of mags
shocker..... not really my favorite, but dynasty ones look awesome
love the look/feel of angels too
never shot a freestyle
and AKA's, not best looking, but shoot awesomely

[Chaos_Theory!]

shocker..... not really my favorite, but dynasty ones look awesome

I guess it depends on what your into. IMO Dynasty Shockers are one of the ugliest made. Same goes for the Dynasty ion shell (only because they made the center part of the shell black plastic).

[Lohman446]

I personally really liked my Shockers, when I got them working right.

One big difference between SP and AGD - SP quality control sucks, they produce a great performance product but I seldom get them working right out of the box.

[WARPED1]

Go SP, because in the real real world(read: not AO Fantasy-land where everything SP sucks, and the mag is still the best gun ever.). SP has great guns. Sure not the best legal department, but product wise very great.

[Chaos_Theory!]

The only thing i can really thank SP for is coming up witht he ion in general. Only reason being is only one part of my ion is actually a stock part (and its the one part i realyl cant just replace).

[Lohman446]

Go SP, because in the real real world(read: not AO Fantasy-land where everything SP sucks, and the mag is still the best gun ever.). SP has great guns. Sure not the best legal department, but product wise very great.

SP markers, once working right (and I'm told mine are all flukes, despite strings of bad luck I kinda accept that based on otheres experiences), are great performance markers. Anno quality over time seems poorer than other manufacturers, but performance continues.

[Chaos_Theory!]

The anno quality isnt that good cus they use a lower grade aluminum that doesnt anno as well as 6061.

[WARPED1]

SP markers, once working right (and I'm told mine are all flukes, despite strings of bad luck I kinda accept that based on otheres experiences), are great performance markers. Anno quality over time seems poorer than other manufacturers, but performance continues.
Yall must fark around with guns before you shoot them. :
Every SP gun I've owned or given and told to use by sponsors, has worked perfectly until either I gave it back or sold/traded it. The only people I see to have thier guns go down, are the ones who swap out bolts or valves or remove the stock MaxFlo [i]before[i] they even read the dman manual. In my years in this game, I've owned or used every single style of SP markers, even the closed bolt 03 Shocker proto type(ok, that one sucked arse :p ). From the original 4x4 is 1997 to the Ion of today, and the few inbetween:).
To the best of my memory it went 4x4-->SF-->Imp-->SFT-->Nerve--> Ion-->SP8.
And I've heard that recently SP has stopped using the cheaper aluminum.

[bentothejam1n]

they produce a great performance product but I seldom get them working right out of the box.
Yea some of my friends have had horrible experiences with sp. Both of my friends who have ions said that they had to pay dz (proshop) to fix/ replace

[Lohman446]

Yall must fark around with guns before you shoot them. :
Every SP gun I've owned or given and told to use by sponsors, has worked perfectly until either I gave it back or sold/traded it. The only people I see to have thier guns go down, are the ones who swap out bolts or valves or remove the stock MaxFlo [i]before[i] they even read the dman manual. In my years in this game, I've owned or used every single style of SP markers, even the closed bolt 03 Shocker proto type(ok, that one sucked arse :p ). From the original 4x4 is 1997 to the Ion of today, and the few inbetween:).
To the best of my memory it went 4x4-->SF-->Imp-->SFT-->Nerve--> Ion-->SP8.
And I've heard that recently SP has stopped using the cheaper aluminum.


Nope...

Let's see, if I recall this correctly

03 Shocker 1 - worked :)

03 Shocker 2 (direct from SP)- Back plate seized in body prior to removal, removal involved lag bolts and a channel locks, one thread in body folded forward - minor work to repair threading

03 Shocker 3 - Heavy leak - O-ring to fix

Max-flo one On off o-ring leaked immediatly

Max-flo two - body halves seized together, could not adjust springs. I got apart (involved putting in sealed container with the four main bolts loose, reaching in with hands, and turning on... made a serious pop noise when it came apart too).

Ion - Banjo bolt leaked immediatly.

Nothing was major, Shocker 2 most people would have ended up sending back to get fixed, but they all required some work to make work right out of the package.

[WARPED1]

Mine was the order from the factory, since 1996-97. I've been involved with SP since they were just a barrel company and shot mags! :)

[Lenny]

I've always heard good things about SP stuff, too. I don' t ever plan on owning one, but they are nice. A few of my buddies have Ions, and as much as I hate to admit, they shoot REALLY nice, though I'm waiting for the Worr-Blade Trilogy's (? grammar) to come out. $300 for a light, fast, durable, dependable. easy to mess with gun, I'm in. Not to mention, I just like Auocockers.

Though, contrary to WARPED1, I personally do think Automags are the greatest guns out there, simply because of profile, weight, and customizability. I know 'cockers and such are all that, but not as easy to do as with a mag. Just my opinion.

[hobbesTZ]

I liked my shocker when I had it, but it broke paint in the barrel constantly until I put a 17/70 oring in, which I hear can come out and jam up the bolt. Also, the solenoid isn't very economical for the owner because if it breaks it's more expensive than any of the other solenoids other electros use. The aluminum is definately scetchy. Otherwise I never had any leaks or FSDO when I lubed up the bolt right. Unforutunately the affordmentioned bothered me a little too much.

Have you considered a Defiant 2? Those are pretty tiny. Here's a picture comparing that to my 'mag.

http://www.jayloo.com/files/pics/35000/2006_0305Image0005.JPG

[Cow hunter]

I've always heard good things about SP stuff, too. I don' t ever plan on owning one, but they are nice. A few of my buddies have Ions, and as much as I hate to admit, they shoot REALLY nice, though I'm waiting for the Worr-Blade Trilogy's (? grammar) to come out. $300 for a light, fast, durable, dependable. easy to mess with gun, I'm in. Not to mention, I just like Auocockers.

do you mean the triliogy thats been out for a year or two now?
http://www.discountpaintball.com/product_info.php?cPath=21_24&products_id=1978&osCsid=0f72d74b57d1ebf5e51a4964ba96d12f

[Chaos_Theory!]

No, hes refering to the ones that come with Eblades stock. Why anyone would waste there money on an ebladed trilogy is beyond me. You can get a nice used cocker with E2 for the same price if not less. Trlogys are a waste of money imo.

[b&r automag]

The Shocker is the way to go. Lower profile body wise it's almost similar to the automag. I've never had any problems with my 05 Shocker...but then again I did read the manuel on how to break down and assemble my marker.

Even if the shocker breaks down, it is so simple to fix. People always complain that Shockers break down, but they don't realize how simple the internals of a Shocker really is.....it's almost as simple as a automag valve. Sometimes I wonder if people even own a shocker or do they just make like they do and jump in all the gossip that shockers suck. I'm not the smartest of people but I was able to take my shocker apart to clean, lube and put it all back together. I even went as far as to getting a new frame and transfering the frame internals over.

If your looking for lower body profile you should also check out the DM6. Yes it's not a single tube look and I really wasn't a fan of the flat boxy looking shape, but until you fire one and see how small and thin the body really is, then you can really appreciate what a DM6 is all about. Another great plus for the DM6 is that it's also LIGHTER than my mag. It's a little...O.K. a lot more expensive, but you do get you dollars worth.

[Resurection]

Lot's of good discussion, and only one post about the "AO-Flux-of-Knowledge"... right on.

I actually have looked at Freestyles and the Defiant. I have not had the chance to shoot either yet. I'm not a bog BL fan from years ago so the defiant sits funny with me, but the Freestyle has caught my eye. I like it's look and the profile is nice. I like how the frame sits way back on the body, where as some mags are almost Star Trek-like with the frames in the middle or almost up front.

I have heard a lot of bad about Ion's in that they are not very reliable. Easy to tech I hear, but still you have to tech them a lot. <--Main reason I have stayed away from cockers. I know they are smooth and I liked shooting one, but I never wanted to tinker that much just to play.

Mags number one appeal for me is the 1. 3-5 drops of oil; 2. gas it up; 3. Play; process. I have found nothing simpler.

[NoForts4Me]

Easy to tech I hear, but still you have to tech them a lot.They are very easy to tech because there isn't much to them. Other than cosmetic upgrades (feedneck, asa, trigger, barrel) the only upgrade on mine is a QEV. The rest is bone stock. I had to replace the detents because the stock ones suck, and had a bad o-ring in the regulator from the start (bad QA, I suppose). Granted, I don't play every weekend, but mine has not had any problems, other than the ones metioned when I first got the gun. I just play with it, clean it, and put it up. I think most people mess with their IONs too much, hence the problems (of course that goes with most markers I believe). While I loved my Classic Automag, I had to fiddle with the lvl 10 from time to time, so maintenance has been about equal.

If I played every weekend, I might have a different opinion, but for my type of play, it has been great.

[Lohman446]

Stock ions are easy to tech? Compared to what guys? There one of the few blow forward markers that you have to totally disassemble in order to get to the bolt. Come on, Ions are a lot of (good) things, easy to tech is not one of them.

[White_Noise]

o6 protos and dm's are about the same profile as a mag.

if i put my proto up next to my mag, the trigger, back of the tank, feedneck, and tip of my barrel line up perfectly between the two. makes it great if i need to use both because there is no difference except a little bit of weight.

[NoForts4Me]

Stock ions are easy to tech? Compared to what guys? There one of the few blow forward markers that you have to totally disassemble in order to get to the bolt. Come on, Ions are a lot of (good) things, easy to tech is not one of them.Well, I have had very little experience with other electronic markers, but the lack of wires running everywhere (unlike a B2K3 I had for a short time) leads me too think it's pretty easy. Not having easy bolt access is the main thing I would change, but other than that, I don't see what's hard about them. I think it's more of a pain to change out the springs in my Sniper II than get to the bolt on my ION.

On subject, I guess, I like the profile because it is like a mag, very small and compact.

[Lohman446]

Well, I have had very little experience with other electronic markers, but the lack of wires running everywhere (unlike a B2K3 I had for a short time) leads me too think it's pretty easy. Not having easy bolt access is the main thing I would change, but other than that, I don't see what's hard about them. I think it's more of a pain to change out the springs in my Sniper II than get to the bolt on my ION.

On subject, I guess, I like the profile because it is like a mag, very small and compact.

It seems to me to be one of the few markers out there that you have to nearly totally disassemble to get to the bolt and failure prone o-rings.

[superannuated]

When I was in the market for a new high-end marker last year I considered the Shocker (decided no because of its reportedly frequent need for disassembly for lubing and o-ring inspection) DM5 or Proto (decided no for the same reason). Got an Ego. The performance is up there with any marker, it's a bit taller than the Proto but seems skinnier and lighter than every other marker out there. Very importantly, the maintenance has been very simple and straightforward, the reliability has been tops and the air consumption is very good.

To my eye, nothing matches the visual elegance of the mag. Its resemblance to the Shocker seems to me to be superficial. And while the Ego looks fine on its own, to me it doesn't compare to the looks of my RPG Paradigm.

Superannuated

[Chaos_Theory!]

Lohman is right when it comes to teching an ion. Stock ions are a pain in the *** cus ya have to take everythign apart to get to a lot of the parts.

[FinchMan]

Lohman is right when it comes to teching an ion. Stock ions are a pain in the *** cus ya have to take everythign apart to get to a lot of the parts.

sounds like the mag, you gotta take half of the screws out and then take the valve out to get to the bolt. :rofl:

[Baby Huey]

2 shockers and no real problems. Go Shocker. I does feel a little like my mag, my mag is just a little heavier.