Typhocker History

[Muzikman]

After a few emails, Private Messages and Tom's suggestion of posting pictures of this gun on the forum. I am going to do just that. I know many of you have seen the pictures, commented on the looks and asked how it shoots. I know a few of you where interested when I had it at the AGD tour. I also know, one of you got to play with it. I would really like to know what you thought about it, and if there would be anything you would change, Bug.

Before:
http://pittsburgh-music.com/paintball/typhocker/images/minicocker01.jpg

http://pittsburgh-music.com/paintball/typhocker/images/minicocker03.jpg

After:
http://pittsburgh-music.com/paintball/typhocker/images/typhocker01a.jpg

http://pittsburgh-music.com/paintball/typhocker/images/typhocker02a.jpg

http://pittsburgh-music.com/paintball/typhocker/images/typhocker03a.jpg


A Little History...

I bought a used MiniCocker back about 4 years ago. Played with the gun one day and disliked the trigger so much that I threw it in a box and never touched it again. What I disliked so much was the sliding trigger. Have had all pivot trigger guns I could not get use to the sliding trigger and being able to shoot fast.

So, the story goes like this...

After letting a gun that I had paid $600 for sit in a box for 3 years, I figure it was time to do something with it. Knowing my problem with the gun was nothing more than the trigger I figured there would have to be a way to solve this problem. Having owned a few other Palmer guns, and liking them a lot. I figured Glenn and Craig would be able to throw a pivot trigger on a cocker. This was before the pivot trigger frames that are out now. After a few emails to Glenn and finding out what can and can not be done, I came to the conclusion that Glenn knew exactly what I wanted. I was warned that it would not be cheap. Being the big spender (and not so logical spender) I am, I told him the gun would be out that week and I was in no hurry to get it back.

What I wanted...

Since I was going to send the gun out for a pivot trigger, I figured I might as well have a few other things changed. I always disliked the pneumatics on the front of the cocker. I also never could figure out why the ram was way up front when the part you are moving is way in the back. With the pivot trigger being added the 4way was going to be moved to inside the grip frame. I figured that to cut down on the amount of LP hose I wanted to move the rest of the pneumatics closer to the frame. I originally wanted just the ram moved to the side and the LP reg moved to be centered under the barrel. Glenn said this would be difficult and expensive since a whole new front block would need to be built. He asked if I had any problems with it being on the side. He then said that with the reg on the side he could mount a Blazer vert adapter on the front.

After a few emails sent by Glenn, three weeks later he said that it was finished and "working quite spiffy" I do believe where his exact words. I was expecting a serious hack job, but what I found was a very unique and very well built gun.

What I got back…

During the emails, questions popped up and additional parts where added. I sent the gun in with a max amount I wanted to spend set, and we worked within this set amount pretty well. Below is the list of components that where on the gun when I sent it out and the list when I got it back. I also got back a nice baggie of spare cocker parts.

Before:
MiniCocker Body
Stock Front Block
Stock Back Block
Kapp SS Cocking Rod
Kapp Hammer Kit
Kapp Valve
Benchmark Chrome Grip Frame
Unknown Bolt
Brass Clippard Ram
Palmer Quick Switch
Palmer Rock Reg
Unknown Beaver Tail

After: (parts changed/added)
No front black
Lighting Bolt
Palmer Micro Rock
Palmer Quick Ram
Palmer Quick Switch
Lapco Drop Forward
PMI Grip Frame w/ UMB
PMI Rubber Grips
Palmer 12” spiral porting nickel barrel
Blazer Vert Adapter
Male Stabilizer
2 – 90 degree fittings
1 – QD fitting
4” SS braid hose

The Name...
The gun was dubbed "Typhocker" by Craig or Glenn Palmer. Since the gun wasn't really a cocker and wasn't really a Typhoon, the name fit well. I like to describe the gun as the ******* child of a Cocker, Typhoon, and Blazer.:)

If you want more info let me know.

[Cha0tic]

around what price range did you pay for all these modifications? be general if you don't want to give out anything.

[jthom3]

Hey I was at the shop when craig and glenn wer building it. They were doing a mini conversion and ano to my cocker a while back. And they showed me what they were working on (your gun), and they said the guy was from the east coast, so i take it, it was yours. Believe me they put alot of work into that gun, it shot nice too.

[headcase]

Yeah, I remember the first pics of that showing up on the net, I think Craig posted them on the POG message board. It's cool, and definatly different. But I like Blazers, and 'cockers alot because what each brings to the table. Thats why when I decided to get my wife a marker, she got a Blazer with pretty much every option, and I'll start building my cocker sometime next year, Feb-March, after I get my E-mag in my hands.

Later
SSDD

[XR4]

thanks for letting me shoot it at the tech tour, I'll post more when I've got time. I've bombed two finals and I've got two more to go.

XR

[Muzikman]

Chaotic: Well..lets just say, the price cap I gave was $1000, they went a tad over that. If you look at it, I figured out the cost of all the parts, and I fiure they charged me about $175 for labor. That isn't bad.

jthom3: I had it done last March I beleive it was. And seeing as I think this is the only one just like this, it was probably it.

Headcase: yeah, Craig posted it on the message board before it was totally finished. I love Blazers, but if I was going to spend $800+ on a new gun (which is about that I would spend on the Blazer I want) I figure I might as well do somthing vert different. To be honeslt, I like the way it shoots a lot more than a Blazer, but it is also a bit bigger and quite a bit heavier. Some day, I plan on owning a Blazer, it might be a soon as Summer.

[Cha0tic]

is that a trigger stop behind the trigger?

[headcase]

Originally posted by Cha0tic
is that a trigger stop behind the trigger?

I assume you are talking about the rod that can be see behind the top half of the trigger? If so, than no that should be connected to the 4-way (3 way in normal 'cocker speak), it's basicly the timing rod if you have an knowledge of 'cockers.

Later
SSDD

[Muzikman]

Headcase is correct, that is the "Timing" rod. It is attached to the back of the trigger shoe and then to a plastic arm that actuates the 4way.

[Cha0tic]

yep, know what your talkin about....just not familiar with that type of setup. you should mill that body to reduce the size and weight....as if you haven't dished out enough money for it already.

[headcase]

Well I can't know for sure, but I assume the trigger + frame is basicly a typhoon set up which looks like this in side the frame.

http://www.paintballravi.com/Articles/TyphoonTJ/TyphoonStockTrig.gif

Thanx to Ravi for the pic, it comes from his Typhoon trigger job page.

Later
SSDD

[RaV3n_Pa1ntba||]

would you ever sell her? and If you would how much would you?

[thei3ug]

You can tell by the trigger that Craig put a lot of care into it. It has a smooth and very natural release. I never notice weight when I'm playing (I carry a hunk of brass), but I did notice that the balance was shifted considerably closer to the handle, though I don't remember what it was like with the tank on.
naturally I liked the barrel choice :) And the trigger i honestly liked better than the pivot styles that have been coming out for cockers as of late.

have you seen those aluminum typhoon frames doc is making? One piece 2x frame. Pretty spiffy if you're looking to get rid of the stainless guard.

But Honestly i wouldn't change a thing.

The older beavertail looks like a Belsales style.

[mykroft]

Nifty conversion. I can't say I like palmers, because I don't, but that was definitely a nicely done conversion, the pneumatics placement looks similar to what PaintballMaxx does, except for the 3-way.

[Muzikman]

Rav3n: I don't think I'll ever sell it. But if I did, i would like to get what I paid for it. That would probably be unrealistic price, so I think I'll probably own it until it is a piece of junk then throw it away:)

Mykroft: Ya don't like Palmers? :( My favorite guns where all built from Palmer.

Bug: you say that Doc is making a dbl trigger Sheridan frame? Hmm..I might have to look into that...

[headcase]

Yep, Doc's at it again....from what I understand be milled it from a block of aluminum and what looking for a machine shop to do a run of them.

http://www.docsmachine.com/galleries/phoongrip1.jpg

[mykroft]

muzikman: They're way overpriced, too heavy, and I loath the triggers. I also really don't like Glenn, got a real bad impression when I met him at IAO (Of course he could have been having a bad day).

I don't see any reason that the blazer should be 3x the price of a cocker, with less features.

And I do admit that the workmanship is superb.

[Muzikman]

Well..a stock Blazer is $400. What is a stock Cocker? $350? And a stock Blazer is much better than a stock cocker as far as quality parts and performance. Also, I am unsure of the less features part. There are less "Pretty" features, but there are still features. When you where at the IAO, you where probably looking at the $900 Blazer. That was with every available performance upgrade. Cockers are pretty and function, Blazers are ugly and function.:)

As for Glenns attitude, he is a great guy. I guess he is alittle short to talk unless you really bring up a good conversation. I think he gets real sick of people asking why his guns are so old and so ugly.:)

[mykroft]

Muzikman: Sorry I disagree on the performance part between a stock cocker and Blazer. Quality wise, sure the blazer's better than a stock cocker, but that $900 Blazer is pretty much a $350 cocker + a $110 Eclipse Hinge frame and $90 boomstick at best, that's what $550? and I'll bet the cocker is faster and just as accurate. Out of the box, the cocker has a 45 frame and a pretty good little vertical reg too, that's $190 extra on the Blazer. Sorry, Palmer just doesn't justify the money.

[headcase]

Well what is stock on a blazer--
Quick Swith
Quck Ram
Rock
Much better barrel.
400 + male stab = 490
and if you want the .45 + 65 = 555
matched barrel + 20 = 575

Cocker 350
Upgraded front block - at least 120, 150 if your looking at PPS
You said add a boomie so + 90
at that point you're looking at 560 or so. And your still left with a plasic grip frame.

The performance of the above two markers isn't even close. The Blazer will wipe out the cocker at this point. At that is basicly a blazer with all the preformance options, everything else is basicly cosmetic.

The Blazer will be more effiencnt, lighter and more compact, most people with no experience with either marker will shoot it better because of the pivot vs sliding trigger(add another 84+ to the cocker for the same)

People don't like Blazers because they are "ugly" and not alot of people have experience with one, everyone that has tried any of the one's I've owned, or the one my wife currently owns, haven't loved it.

[mykroft]

Why bother with a new front block? the only thing that might need upgrading on a 2k2 cocker is the 3-way, and those are sub-$40. Add a Bomb or Dye 3-way and my cocker is $580, with an eclipse frame and a boomer, and will run away from the Blazer performance-wise. That super heavy blazer trigger is NOT faster than a Eclipse'd cocker. The Quick Ram and Rock regs are really just bragging rights, the Stock/STO Ramis as good, if not better performing than the palmer part, and the Sledgehammer is a sweet reg, hence it being spec'd on Evo's and Eclipse cockers.

I've shot a Blazer, and I'll take the CF STO 45 frame currently spec'd on the stock cockers over the stock blazer trigger anyday.

[headcase]

So I'm guessing you've shot a stock blazer trigger? The .45 trigger is simple wonderful, I'll admit I haven't seen/shot an eclipse pivot, but out running a revy with the .45 is easy. I'm not trying to change your mind, I stopped doing that a long time ago, it's not worth it people like what they like. Also I don't hate cockers, I'm starting the build up on my 3rd one this winter sometime, but the only reason I'm doing it is becuase I like to screw with 'cockers, if I cared only about preformance(or if my wife didn't already have one) I would by another Blazer.

Blazer
400 + male stab = 490
and if you want the .45 + 65 = 555
matched barrel + 20 = 575

Cocker 350
bomb 40
eclipse 110
boomie 90 = 580

At this point you still don't have an adjustable LPR. Yeah the sledge is a fine reg, Bud has been saying that for years, but it's still not externally adjustable without that big stupid looking end cap. The Blazer is still lighter, more compact, more effiencent, and just a much better designed marker.

To each there own.

[mykroft]

I don't dispute that the Blazer is a well built gun. In Fact the Phantom is about the only thing built as well.

Adjustable reg=quick way to screw up your cocker. I had one on my 99 cocker, set it once (To match the Sledge) and never touched it.Don't see the need.

I've tried a stock blazer, and the trigger on that $900 job that was at IAO (Ungassed), it in no way compares to the Eclipse frame. The one time I had an eclipse hinged STO in my hands with paint, I was easily outshooting the hopper, and I only usually do 10-11bps on my Defiant and RT, I'm not particularily fast. The Eclipse hinge trigger, is light, smooth like buttah and perfectly sprung, fully adjustable too, if that floats your boat, adjustment is the same as a Bushy.

I'm not disputing that the Blazers are good guns, I just don't think they justify the cash, I'd be a lot happier with a stock cocker and a CP barrel for $390 than that $575 Blazer you spec'd out.

It's a personal preference thing on whether the gun is worth the money, I'll gladly say the same for a Bushy vs. an Angel, I just don't see the advantage of the Angel, but I would pay a stupid amount of money for a Mag or Bushy, because they're my thing.

[headcase]

At least we agree on one thing, it's all about what you like. I also don't like Angels, but then again I don't like any off the electros with the "click" triggers, and why I'll have my E-mag at the end of the week - crosses fingers.

Well I guess this topic has gone far enought off course. SO I'll just say I like how the Typhocker looks, and would love to shoot it someday, but I wouldn't pay for it. I would, at this point, have a CF Tyhoon w/Pump kit for what was paid for it and then build a 'cocker too.

[Chaos]

I'd like to add, you cant get much more than the eclipse frame. Its just like you described it, smooth like butter, fully adjustable, and nice as hell. Just wanted to support it, since I have a cocker being built right now with an eclipse blade, and my friend has the blue-silver eclipse cocker with blade, that cocker he has is the nicest cocker I've ever shot (and I've shot em all, revenge, shocktech, kapp, everything).

I've never shot a blazer, so I cant get into that. But I can get into the angel/bushy convo. The angel is built nicer, it feels nicer, and wont break. I've seen angels thrown accross fields and work perfectly. I've never seen an angel break down (and I've been with thousands of angels), the only one I've seen that didn't work was one that some guy was trying to 'reinvent' the internal operation or something like that, which was his own fault cause he took the thing apart and mangled all the parts and stuff. As for bushmasters, the only one I've seen that I like is an eclipse skys bushy that my friend had, it was nice, but was far from stock.

Let me have this example: CalJam 2001, WDP was there, Cobra was there, and ICD was there. At the WDP booth, I didn't see anyone bringing up angels to fix, I didn't even seen them 'fixing' and angels, just tuning them for people to get the trigger the way the person wanted it or something like that. Same with cobra. Then i saw the ICD booth. The techs were sitting there with a pile of bushys to fix, and they were litterally to the point that they were just beating them with hammers. The whole event they spent fixing bushys, and thats it. They sat there with a boat load of parts that they admitted were cheap (even down to the gauges), that they had to replace on gun after gun.

As for me personally, I wouldn't own either, I dont really like them. Having a gun that I spent $1500 on that if I were to scratch it, its another $500 or so to get it reanodized, if I were to need to replace something like the body (its another $700 or so + $200 for ano) and things like that. I'm happy with my mags and cockers, and true I put about $900 into my centerflag electro cocker and all that, every part can be replaced (the only expensive part is the centerflag frame, which CF fully stands behind so I'm fine with it). Give me a stock cocker with eclipse frame and timed perfectly and i'll be completely happy.

[Muzikman]

Ok...I have to ask...Headcase, is that your rabbit with the pancakes on it's head? And if so, Why?:)

[headcase]

Nope not my rabbit, have no idea why it has pancakes on it's head, I just like the picture.

It's just too many people just except things without any explaination, I really don't like that. So always ask why.

That's just me I guess.

[thei3ug]

If you put all the things that were put into that 900 dollar blazer on a cocker, it would come to well over 1k. You can be opinionated all you want on the necessity of the individual parts, but if you're parting it out, you're basically saying that buying a thousand dollar SFL is no better than buying a stock cocker. I'm really missing where the "less features" comes in. I'd seriously like to know. Oh, I'd like to know where the "too heavy" comes in as well.

I guess I first took offense when you called glenn a bad guy, especially when he's bought me dinner and boozed me out, and helped me with my shyness around women. Maybe loyalty can be bought with dinner and a beer, and maybe Glenn should do that for everyone who gives him a glance to win the hearts and minds of the children of america. But this hostility and intent to compare and belittle pps products where someone's trying to show off something people asked about... i just don't get it.

[WARPED1]

Last I knew,Blaxers are hand built.The cocker is just another masspeoduced gun,like any other.To me,it justifies the price difference.

[Muzikman]

Accually, the Blazer is mass-produced. It's the only gun that Palmers makes that is. Most of the parts are made at other machine shops and then sent back to Palmers to be assembled. But they are still VERY high quality.

[personman]

BAH I saw the Typhocker on the palmer web site a half or so year ago..I need your Typhocker... how does $140 sound?
heh..

[mykroft]

the13ug:


My Bad on Glenn, I got him and Craig mixed up. I definitely apologize to Glenn, It's Craig that I didn't like. He may still have been having a bad day, I don't know.

I don't think that $1000 SFL is worth the cash, sure it's pretty, but it doesn't shoot any better than an STO, and worse than a Stock 2k2 vert feed with Eclipse Hinge. Most aftermarket cockers are simply cosmetic improvements. The only ones I've seen that come close to justifying the extra $$ are the KAPP, Evolution and Eclipse, which all have improved internals that are noticably better than stock. All 3 of the above still don't justify the extra $$.
My beef with Palmers, is apart from the Stabilizer, and they're high-end custom guns (Stroker and Typhoon)I don't feel their products are worth the cash. As to the price comparison, upgrading the cocker doesn't cost more than the Blazer. I priced them out, and even with upgraded pneumatics, they're roughly similar prices, and you don't need to upgrade the Pneumatics on a Cocker these days.

I'm not saying the Blazer is a bad gun. It's incredibly well built, it's just doesn't seem to justify the extra cash. If you dig the trigger, and can afford it, buy one.

[OldSchoolMag]

Chaos, I've never heard of anybody replacing an Angel body... but as for what you said, I heard the same thing about CalJam'01. And pretty much a lot of other major tournies, too. WDP - there, pimping products. ICD - there, fixing products. Plus, everyone I know who's owned both Angel and Bushy prefer their stock Angels to their upgraded Bushys hands down.

As for the Blazer v. Cocker, haven't yet shot a Blazer, same for the Sovereign, but I hear that they're BOTH nice guns. Hmm, hopefully will get a chance soon.

OSM

[WARPED1]

I see............

[Muzikman]

I just finished pricing it out and I think I am going to have another Typhocker built. Based on a conservatively milled vert feed body and a Doc Nickel one piece grip frame. I figure it should cost about $1100 (That includes custom milling and ano) for an entirely new gun.

I love this gun to death, so I just now need to make one that performs just as well, but looks better:)

[MikeCouves]

Well, I was just on the PPS website, and watched the video where the guy is shooting a Blazer with a warp. That's fast!!!!!!!