What makes guns like the DM6 and Angels better then lower end electros?

[Corbet]

I look at higher end electros and wonder what makes them better then lower end ones like the Ion or ProMaster. Obviously the parts are higher quality, but what makes them better?

[buzzboy]

Really I don't know. I don't see why people buy these super expensive monsters over the little guys that perform the same. Mostly it is about durrablity/look/upgradablitity/fastness. Most of which can be bought in a cheaper gun.

[RapidTransit]

Kick, Gas Efficiency, Weight, Reliable speed, higher grade parts ever seen the noid on a an Ion?, Consistency, Tournament Functions, and Adjustibility.

[stop whining buy a mag]

Kick, Gas Efficiency, Weight, Reliable speed, higher grade parts ever seen the noid on a an Ion?, Consistency, Tournament Functions, and Adjustibility.

Nailed every single one of them. You can't go out an play professionaly paintball with a low end electro that has no reliability (ICD minus Freestyle which is not low end). That's the way the pros work so everyone in paintball must do it.

[master_alexander]

things that you should take into consideration when deciding that bigge and more expensive > "the little guys" :

reputation
upgrades available
resale
reliability
stock


reputation: would you feel cooler if you went onto the field with a shocker, as opposed to the ion? people say ions are crap and stuff... they arent, but people say that and think that as well as if you do have an ion, you are some idiot newb on ramping... IMO, reputation does play a part in why the higher end guns are better than the lower ends.

Upgrades available: with the lower end guns you can get x amount of upgrades and people will not think much of it, while you could get this "better" gun and not have to upgrade it... like a karni, it doesent really need any upgrades, so why buy a different cocker, get an e2, and all thoes other parts to make it equal to the karni, when you can just have a karni?

resale: you would get a better percentage of the msrp on a high end than a low end.

reliability: the more expensive guns are able to shoot faster stock, most likley have a better bolt reg and asa.

stock: now, a stock shocker is better than a stock ion in my opinion (as an example), most guns that are high end come stock better than the low ends. this is because, high end = on the high end of the totem pole when stock, and then the low ends are the opposite (der... lol..) and the stock hign end would be better than an upped low end.


there is so many things to take into consideration... an interesting study would be to take a stock shocker and a stock ion and test them stock, then get the best proven upgrades and test them again, and see which one is really worth it. i used ion and shocker because they are by the same company and such...

my 2 cents..

[master_alexander]

Kick, Gas Efficiency, Weight, Reliable speed, higher grade parts ever seen the noid on a an Ion?, Consistency, Tournament Functions, and Adjustibility.


and that is more or less the simplified version.

[PnueMagger]

Isn't SP going to sponsor a team on the Pro circuit with just IONS for publicty to show ION can hang? This was talk on the nation i was following.

I'm sure they wont be entirely stock. However, if you gave a team like the DYNASTY a bunch of ions, they would still roll teams just as easily. A well maintained mid level electro can be very reliable. You just need to give them more TLC.

[Corbet]

Nailed every single one of them. You can't go out an play professionaly paintball with a low end electro that has no reliability (ICD minus Freestyle which is not low end). That's the way the pros work so everyone in paintball must do it.

What do you mean by (ICD minus Freestyle)? I was under the impression that most guns are reliable unless its a autococker. With the exception of blown or old o-rings I never really had a ton of problems with any gun I used on the field.

But when it comes to weight, kick, gas efficency, shooting speed, ect, are you gonna notice a huge difference between the 2? I don't know about you but rarely do I have opportunity to shoot off 15 bps all the time, usually its snap shooting. When it comes to weight, does and extra pound really make that big of a difference, especially when your carrying 5-8 pods on your back?

Kick and Gas Efficency I'll give you, along with resale value and adjustibility (one thing I don't like about lower guns is the lack of tourney features). But frankly I think lower end guns have more upgrades then higher end guns. Look at upgrade parts for IONs, Spyders, ect.

I must admit, I do feel kinda stupid buying a $350 electro marker (that will be un named) and now wanted to put a bunch of upgrades on it. I kinda wish I would have spent another $200, but what kind of electros can be found at $550 range? One thing I noticed when buying a new electro is you've either got the super expensive $1000 guns or the lower range $300 guns. Nothing in the middle

[SpitFire1299]

A gun is as reliable as you make it. Maintanence it regularly, and you will be fine. :)

[ABTOCMEPTb]

Its pointless. People buying different stuff because A) they can afford it, B) they like it, C) bragging rights.

Same we can talk why people driving BMW or Hundai. Its not all about to deliver paintball from point A to point B. Its about delivering it with pleasure.

[PnueMagger]

One thing I noticed when buying a new electro is you've either got the super expensive $1000 guns or the lower range $300 guns. Nothing in the middle

Shocker. But then again it's cheaper to upgrade the ion to the shocker's level.

[Corbet]

Shocker. But then again it's cheaper to upgrade the ion to the shocker's level.

I really don't wanna turn this into a "what gun should I get" thread but I'm not into smart parts guns.

[Dark Frost17]

What do you mean by (ICD minus Freestyle)? I was under the impression that most guns are reliable unless its a autococker. With the exception of blown or old o-rings I never really had a ton of problems with any gun I used on the field.

But when it comes to weight, kick, gas efficency, shooting speed, ect, are you gonna notice a huge difference between the 2? I don't know about you but rarely do I have opportunity to shoot off 15 bps all the time, usually its snap shooting. When it comes to weight, does and extra pound really make that big of a difference, especially when your carrying 5-8 pods on your back?

Kick and Gas Efficency I'll give you, along with resale value and adjustibility (one thing I don't like about lower guns is the lack of tourney features). But frankly I think lower end guns have more upgrades then higher end guns. Look at upgrade parts for IONs, Spyders, ect.

I must admit, I do feel kinda stupid buying a $350 electro marker (that will be un named) and now wanted to put a bunch of upgrades on it. I kinda wish I would have spent another $200, but what kind of electros can be found at $550 range? One thing I noticed when buying a new electro is you've either got the super expensive $1000 guns or the lower range $300 guns. Nothing in the middle


when it comes to kick....huge difference going from a spyder to a emag ...night and day..... :)


5 to 8 pounds on your back is a little different then having 5-8 pounds in your arms.....it kinda makes a big difference......sliding in to a bunker or the snake with a heavy marker kinda gives you a higher Chance e of it hitting the ground or you loosing grip of it when you land.....snap shooting is different with that added wight.... try snap shooting with a SS Lapco big shot then going to a alum barrel with the same length....

:D

[Corbet]

I dunno I think one reason I think expensive guns are stupid is because it seems like the people who have them look at a person's skill by how much their marker costs. If a really good player has something like a model 98 the person (or people) with Angels and DM6s are going to think they are a noob. I've also noticed that it seems like alot of players with expensive guns will refuse to use anything cheaper. If your good it doesn't matter what gun you have.

[Dark Frost17]

I dunno I think one reason I think expensive guns are a waste of money is because it seems like the people who have them look at a person's skill by how much their marker costs. If a really good player has something like a model 98 the person (or people) with Angels and DM6s are going to think they are a noob. I've also noticed that it seems like alot of players with expensive guns will refuse to use anything cheaper. If your good it doesn't matter what gun you have.


not really a wast of money.......but i have seen guys with the tippmans and spyder walk all over the guys with the higher end markers.......you cant rate some one by there marker..... :ninja:

[Corbet]

not really a wast of money.......but i have seen guys with the tippmans and spyder walk all over the guys with the higher end markers.......you cant rate some one by there marker..... :ninja:

I'm gonna edit that. Not really what I meant.

But I'll agree with you. You can't look at a person's marker, but the fact is, ALOT of people do. If your picking teams your gonna pick the people decked out in a expensive mask, jersey, pants, with a high end marker, instead of the guy with the Model 98/Spyder. I feel like that applies more to people with the $1000+ setups.

[fire1811]

Nailed every single one of them. You can't go out an play professionaly paintball with a low end electro that has no reliability (ICD minus Freestyle which is not low end). That's the way the pros work so everyone in paintball must do it.

Hmm that's weird I play with my ION every weekend and compete in tournaments with it quite often and don't seem to have a problem.



No paintball gun is or ever was worth a $1000. Antiques not included

[stop whining buy a mag]

When you start playing paintball, you move your way up through the levels of markers. After playing with high end guns, you wouldn't want to shoot anything on the real low end side. IMO, cheap electros do not feel right when shooting. They feel cheap and do not shoot smooth. They can be slow and made poorly. All the ICD guns I have shot minus the Freestyle are just pieces. I'd still like to shoot the Promaster but I've heard mixed reviews about it.

If someone handed me a high end gun to shoot and a low end gun to shoot while I was blindfolded, I could easily tell the difference. It's like people saying some pizza is better than other pizza. They are made with the same ingredients but the better pizza was probably given more attention to detail instead of just being mass produced.

[PnueMagger]

Higher end guns are better than mid level and low level electros. That's just a fact. But what some fail to realize is this. As markers get more and more high end, the marginal gains per dollars spent drastically decreases. The relationship of dollars spent to performance is not by any means linearly proportional

Example: Dragun LCD $100
Spyder E marker $150
Ion w/ Ups $300
E2 Cocker $400-500
Shocker $600
DM6/Angels/Egos $1000+

You'll notice that toward the beginning of the list...a little price increase dramatically ups performance
In the middle there is noticeble difference in performance denoted by a nontrivial price difference
Towards the end of the list there is multi hundred dollar price gaps with negligably better markers than the previous marker

Bottom line: Higher end guns are better. And to some people, the slight edge is woth the eaxrta $600 :tard:

[BD_Paintball]

Bottom line: Higher end guns are better. And to some people, the slight edge is woth the eaxrta $600 :tard:
every advantage helps and some ppl are willing to spend extra money for that advantage which i dont blame them if they have the money

[BigEvil]

Its pointless. People buying different stuff because A) they can afford it, B) they like it, C) bragging rights.

Same we can talk why people driving BMW or Hundai. Its not all about to deliver paintball from point A to point B. Its about delivering it with pleasure.

Absolutely true.

But go take the Pesi challenge with a Spyder Electra and a DM6 and tell me what one is high end? There is a difference. To some people, it is irrelevent, as long as the gun works reliably. Which is not a bad philisophy.

[peewee]

[QUOTE=stop whining buy a mag] I'd still like to shoot the Promaster but I've heard mixed reviews about it.

I'm using a lasoya promaster & it has been flawless. They finally got it right.

[jenarelJAM]

Kick, Gas Efficiency, Weight, Reliable speed, higher grade parts ever seen the noid on a an Ion?, Consistency, Tournament Functions, and Adjustibility.

Kick- Try a spyder, then try anything over $250. Plus, low end guns just sound loud/bad

Gas efficiency- Depends on the marker. My emag gets the same efficiency as a spyder, but my viking gets half again as much.

Weight- eh, I don't care so much

Reliable speed- or just speed. I don't care if my marker can cycle 30+ bps, but I'd like to know it can shoot faster than 20. The Ion is capped at 17(stock board) and even though this is higher than 15 bps ramp cap, I think it's capped too slow.

Higher grade parts- Definately a big one. The reason you see people still playing with 15 year old mags is because they work forever. Alot of higher end guns are used for a year, sold, used by their next owner for awhile, sold again, and fade into oblivion. How many people do you see running around with the old dye matrices (03) now that the newer DM4/5/6 are out? the DM(3)'s are perfectly good markers, but they just don't stand the test of time. You look at the Viking and Excal however, and even though they are 04 and earlier models, they are still regarded as cutting edge markers.

Consistency- Well, this affects one of the three dimensions of accuracy. The up-down one. So it's fairly important. Consistency is affected more by co2 vs hpa and good paint than by gun quality. Anything over $250 should have decent consistency.(with hpa and good paint)

Tournament functions- Big one. Many people who wants to play in a tournament(we're talking just a general tourney here) will want to have 15 bps ramping, dwell/debounce settings, eyes. Maybe some of the other misc. features of a nice board too.

Adjustability- With most higher end markers, well, first you don't need to replace anything, they come pretty good stock, but also, you can adjust them exactly how you like them. Like... adjusting the trigger so it's light, activates when you want it to, returns to where you want it to... etc.


Also... for $500, check the used markers out. $500 will get you last year's $900 marker.

[Rudz]

Gas efficiency- Depends on the marker. My emag gets the same efficiency as a spyder, but my viking gets half again as much.


so your emag is more efficient than your viking..hmm so the emag gets more than a case off a 68 now?? man no one even told me..im gonna ask my emag..