Does ramping encourage movement?

[Lohman446]

Ok... Yes I have started to use a ramping mode were legal. Frankly if I beleived any number of paintballs in the air was remotely dangerous I would not step on the field. I understand there is a risk with any activity, but I have found ramping to be an acceptable risk.

I have no intent of arguing if ramping is right or wrong in this thread.

I found when I played this weekend that I would cover my own moves, run and gun far more, and use ramping to actually encourage my own movement. I moved as more using a ramping marker, and made longer runs, then I normally do. Granted there were factors beyond ramping but I found ramping helped my movement.

I think there is a valid argument that, rather than just "locking" down the field, ramping allows more movement. Thoughts?

[shartley]

Ok... Yes I have started to use a ramping mode were legal. Frankly if I beleived any number of paintballs in the air was remotely dangerous I would not step on the field. I understand there is a risk with any activity, but I have found ramping to be an acceptable risk.

I have no intent of arguing if ramping is right or wrong in this thread.

I found when I played this weekend that I would cover my own moves, run and gun far more, and use ramping to actually encourage my own movement. I moved as more using a ramping marker, and made longer runs, then I normally do. Granted there were factors beyond ramping but I found ramping helped my movement.

I think there is a valid argument that, rather than just "locking" down the field, ramping allows more movement. Thoughts?
I think the answer is… that depends.

I think it all depends on what the other players are using and how they are using it. So in some situations the answer could be yes, it allows for more movement. And in others it could very well lock down the field.

[warbeak2099]

I think it certainly encourages a lot more focus on the problem of movement under fire. It's a lot harder to move now with ramping. You've got to use your head a lot more now and make smarter decisions about where you're moving to. Using your bunker as a "house", as a recent APG article put it, is more important. I've noticed that I need to use some new techniques. I used to have a real bad habit of hugging up against my bunker. I don't do that anymore.

[geekwarrior]

first question, was everyone else ramping?

if not, than I'm sure it helped. If so, it may have made you feel more confident, and probably does increase your change of hitting someone on the run. Maybe its more intimidating for the guy on the other end for that much paint caoming back at him and he plays a little tighter? I played with my Angel for the first time (normally shoot a mag), and having that extra speed made me more aggressive. But I alos could lock the field down better to.

That being said I dont think it counters entirely the arguement that it locks down the field. If someone is shooting ropes, it doesnt matter if you are shooting faster running or not, you won't make it through that lane.

An interesting arguement at any rate :shooting:

[Lohman446]

first question, was everyone else ramping?

if not, than I'm sure it helped. If so, it may have made you feel more confident, and probably does increase your change of hitting someone on the run. Maybe its more intimidating for the guy on the other end for that much paint caoming back at him and he plays a little tighter? I played with my Angel for the first time (normally shoot a mag), and having that extra speed made me more aggressive. But I alos could lock the field down better to.

That being said I dont think it counters entirely the arguement that it locks down the field. If someone is shooting ropes, it doesnt matter if you are shooting faster running or not, you won't make it through that lane.

An interesting arguement at any rate :shooting:

Everyone was allowed to ramp, I don't know that many other teams had five ramping markers on the field. The point is, I only need a half second of getting you in to break down a tape, keeping a stream on you, and finding a new bunker. Without ramping this is not as readily done.

It was likely not related to my level of aggressiveness - which my team often refers to at the level of stupid :D

[geekwarrior]

Everyone was allowed to ramp, I don't know that many other teams had five ramping markers on the field. The point is, I only need a half second of getting you in to break down a tape, keeping a stream on you, and finding a new bunker. Without ramping this is not as readily done.

It was likely not related to my level of aggressiveness - which my team often refers to at the level of stupid :D


sounds like you locked the field down while moving :D

[stop whining buy a mag]

I'm a little more hesitant to run and gun off the break while trying to make it to a tombstone on the 30. I did it every single game last week and made it there perfectly fine.

I think the whole thing about having a "fast shooting backman" is gone. Your frontman can dump out just as much paint if he has the opportunity.

I think it just gives people the confidence to move. They figure, if I can shoot as fast as the other guy shooting me, I've got a pretty good chance of keeping him in and making it to my bunker opposed to the normal rookie player still learning the running and gunning skills in semi.

[REDRT]

I find myself moving much more playing where ramping is allowed. I kinda have to now. It is alot easier to pin a guy down, but I don't like being that guy pinned.

[BD_Paintball]

i really dont think it has a very big effect on movement. i do belive that it makes teams play alot smarter. also bad teams that can get away with bad moves when not ramping will not do very good when they are playing with ramping. i believe that ramping helps good teams and hurts bad teams but does not have an effect on movement

[68magOwner]

i have been saying this shince you were making your criminal neglagence threads. When playing with ramping, you find yourself doing alot less gunfighting, and alot more moving and playing angles.

[NoForts4Me]

Why would playing with ramping encourage movement?

Does semi only discourage movement? How about pump or stock class?

I think what it does (from the perspective of movement) is make it easier to run and shoot, or hold down someone while moving. Of course, this is from observation, as I've never played with a gun on ramping. I don't know that that actually encourages movement, but it can make it easier.

I think movement is more about the players or teams. While watching the NPPL on ESPN, I've noticed some teams move a lot, others don't.

I'm actually more interested in why you, Mr. Lohman446, have decided to ramp? W/O going back and looking at a bunch of threads, I seem to remember you being against it (I'm old, though, so my memory could be bad :tard: ).

[RRfireblade]

The only real place that I see ramping making a noticable difference is in bunkering and run throughs.

It used to be that it took alot of shooting skill to maintain a stream of fire while making a bunker move or a run through. No it seems everyone is 'capable' of it.

Oh the other hand, since I still refuse to ramp against the ramper I typically have an easier time outshooting most others during snap shooting and it's easier to catch people on the reload since they relaod more often now.

So....I'm digging it. :D

For ther record , my local field regulary has pro and semi pro teams practicing there. I feel pretty good about being able to hang with that crowd. It's quite a different ball game against walk ons. :p

[Lohman446]

I'm actually more interested in why you, Mr. Lohman446, have decided to ramp? W/O going back and looking at a bunch of threads, I seem to remember you being against it (I'm old, though, so my memory could be bad :tard: ).

My major concerns with ramping had to do with negligence, and they still do. Either I feel the atmosphere has changed, or I'm playing the odds that nothing bad will happen. I like to think I am more responsible, and am not going to be involved in a close range lighting up of someone. Even my arguments than were concerned with the legal aftermath more than the risk of injury

If I thought that having paintballs in the air represented an unacceptable risk I would not play... No, thats wrong, I would play even if the risks were severe. The point is I do not beleive that paintball as it is played now is too dangerous. I do not think that the amount of balls in the air change the danger factor. So I have accepted that while there is a distinct legal problem with the amount of balls in the air, the risk of severe injury is so remote that I am likely safe from the aftermath.

Beemer would call it the stupid paintball player syndrome, stick your head in the dirt and ignore the risks. Its not that simplistic.

On the face, its a drastic change of my views. Its not really. I still hold the same baseviews, I have just become less risk adverse in regards to those views.

[Z-man]

What I have found.

At
5bps- I shoot but don't move
10bps- I shoot but don't move
15bps- I shoot but don't move
20bps- I shoot but don't move
25bps- I shoot but don't move
30bps- I shoot but don't move

I'm estimating that if I reach 35bps I'll shoot but not move.

[dahoeb]

no, i don't think rate of fire promotes movement.
i see a lot more movement in pump games than i do in tournies.

[RRfireblade]

no, i don't think rate of fire promotes movement.
i see a lot more movement in pump games than i do in tournies.

Oh heck yeah.

[Lohman446]

i see a lot more movement in pump games than i do in tournies.

Agreed... but I dont think in this case the ultra extreme example really works.

[Z-man]

How did the old Saying go, Zak?
'Because it is my duty to shoot nine pods and a hopper.'


:D yep! that was from my old Team ESP section. I love playing a backman. I honestly just want to stand there and shoot at stuff even if there is nothing to shoot at. I learned it from TV!

DRINK BLAZING ELECTRIC DEATH!!!!

http://www.zakvetter.com/paintball_videos/z-man_paintball.mov

I aspyre to that... honestly. :D (except the ending part... I would win because i carry more ammo)

[peewee]

Oh heck yeah.

:D oh yea. :bounce: Much more movement when playing pump. semi guys get locked up way to easy.

[68magOwner]

:D oh yea. :bounce: Much more movement when playing pump. semi guys get locked up way to easy.

ok, be resonable, sure, when you can run in the wide open and actually dodge the 1 shot that comes at you, then yes, you will move (because, thats what i do when i play pump, i literally dont play a bunker, just play dodgeball with oncommming paint, because, its that easy in comparison to avoiding a constant 15bps) But, obviously, thats not what is being discussed here, i believe lohman is comparing tournament style play, with and without ramping.

And, from my personal experiences, people get alot more caught up in gunfights when playing semi, and then with ramping, they move more.

Also, for the "i like ramping because i bunker people when theyre reloading comment"- you claim to be playing with a pro and semi pro crowd, if that is really the case, then i know those guys can/do shoot while loading, that is a skill easily attainable by your average rookie tournament player who is using ramping, heck, its not that tough to shoot while reloading in semi either. SO, i dont see that being a valid point at all.

[NoForts4Me]

:rofl: at Z-Man!

You remind me of a buddy I've played with for years. His saying is "I don't need cover. I'll create my own cover!"

While I have yet to play with ramping, it does not bother me at all to play against ramping markers. I don't feel unsafe, and have not felt out-gunned yet. I have not been playing with an electronic marker for very long, and want to master "walking" the trigger. Plus, I'm too cheap to drop $100+ for something to feed paintballs to my marker!

[RRfireblade]

Also, for the "i like ramping because i bunker people when theyre reloading comment"- you claim to be playing with a pro and semi pro crowd, if that is really the case, then i know those guys can/do shoot while loading, that is a skill easily attainable by your average rookie tournament player who is using ramping, heck, its not that tough to shoot while reloading in semi either. SO, i dont see that being a valid point at all.

Funny how you decieded to just make up a quote from a random assortment of words. ;) Next time do us a favor and check out the proper use for that type of punctuation. ;) While your there also look into 'Paraphrasing' and why you shouldn't do it with out an understanding of said statement. :ninja:


Fact is there is more reloading when there is more shooting. I don't know about you and your 'master' skills but the vast majority of the paintball world is somewhat vulernable when they have a marker in one hand , shooting with one finger and their other hand either behind their back or fist full 'o tube. ;)

Now with that all cleared up.....

Carry on. :cheers:

[Beemer]

I found when I played this weekend that I would cover my own moves, run and gun far more, and use ramping to actually encourage my own movement

Go back and review and tell me what is fundamentally wrong here.


The point is, I only need a half second of getting you in to break down a tape, keeping a stream on you, and finding a new bunker. Without ramping this is not as readily done.

Maybe for an unskilled player. I would argue I could do it with out ramping. :ninja:


It was likely not related to my level of aggressiveness - which my team often refers to at the level of stupid

Theres that word. :argh:


Oh the other hand, since I still refuse to ramp against the ramper

Ya me too :cheers: The Force was not strong enough in young Lu I mean Lohman. :nono: :spit_take


I'm playing the odds that nothing bad will happen. I like to think I am more responsible,

All of Paintball is playing the odds. Only two people got killed in a year[from a known risk] in the last fifteen and one that is open for debate in the UK. So ya those are good odds I suppose. The question you have to ask is, do you know what the known risks are?

Ya I could trust YOU on the field but what about the other guy? :nono:


Beemer would call it the stupid paintball player syndrome, stick your head in the dirt and ignore the risks. Its not that simplistic.

Got a link where I said that? :spit_take If I recall I said I.A.D.S.P.B.P.[I'm a dumb sh paint ball player] Ya it used to be two words and ya I have my patch to prove I belong. :clap:

Paintball at the level I used to play is stupid now. We had it headed down the right road but it took a wrong turn when the dollars mattered more then the Game.


I typically have an easier time outshooting most others during snap shooting

Shh, dont tell them they have to have a skill, it wont sell.

Z-man...... posts like yours keeps me off the meds. :cheers:


Peace Out
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