the proto rail

[mag_lover05]

protos new gun. the "rail"

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/6859/pmrou3.jpg

Proto's new mid end gun. $350 ~ price range. Expected to drop just like the ion did.

UL frames will be availible.

No lpr.

[etjoyride]

frame looks off, other than that it doesn't look to be to different (eye covers and some other little things i guess.

[CKY_Alliance]

Great gun for the price...or seems to be specially when its spose to be 400 plus a 200-300 dollar ul frame and some upgrades and you have a pm7 for like half the price...my PM6 is officially worth nothing...owell it shoots to good to get rid of..

This gun will deffinetley be a big competitor..and coming from dye you know its quality (unless your username is the name of some mexican food or some dumb **** like that then you will think otherwise before even seeing the gun, but who nees a spool valve when you can walk a spyder and shoot 28 BPS...). I think the lack of LPR will make it shoot with a little more kick, more like a shocker...one less thing to worry about but they lpr just makes some things more convenient at times...specially with things like season changes..

but for the price im sure its worth every penny (acutally could prolly sell it for around the etek price...) we will see maybe i will get one as a back up, all though i can say i havnt needed a back up in a long time.

[BD_Paintball]

looks very nice. i dont like the idea of no lpr but i guess they had to do that to keep the price down. i also like the style of eye cover. like CKY_Alliance said it will drive the price of PM's down but that sure does not make them shoot any worse so i will be keepng my PM. thumbs up to proto!!

edit: dave youngblood said it will sell for 399.99 on matrix owners

[Lenny]

Hmm. It looks... just like thier other guns...

Talk about original...

I would like to know how these work.

[etjoyride]

ugh....please not another ion. there alright with the right stuff, but one is ENOUGH!

[CaptainNeeda]

I recall SP, DYE, and WDP making a three-way agreement a number of months ago. The details nobody knows, but Id find it interesting if it became West Coast/DYE and East Coast/SP power push with WDP covering the overseas market.


I cant belive I'm saying this:

Sounds to me like an "Axis of Evil".

-Or it's Dye, Sp, and WDP agreeing not to litigate the crud out of each other. Especially since Sp and Dye have scarry similar spool valve designs.

[coreyander]

trigger sucks, but I can assure you even if it is designed like an Ion, it wont be that bad. Ions dont kick much at all even w/o an LPR. But the proto comes w/ better eyes, clamping feedneck, better reg, better bolt system (easy access), a better barrel, and a nicer body.......so it will be nothing like the IOn.

I might have to pick one of these up when they hit the shelves. Aside from that trigger. .me likes.

[BigEvil]

Low end, high performance guns: The Future is Upon Us!!!

Didnt someone say that the $1300 marker was going the way of the dinosour?

[mobsterboy]

Low end, high performance guns: The Future is Upon Us!!!

Didnt someone say that the $1300 marker was going the way of the dinosour?

No, just the way of the Sponsored-only...

[White_Noise]

probably picking one of these up after christmas to back up my pm6. looks like it is deffinately worth the price.

[don miguel]

Everything looks nice but the trigger. It's got some rubber type thing going on. I don't know if I'd like that. But just like the ion, good deal for the money (not after countless trips to the proshop for fixing the cheap parts just struggling to be high-end it isn't) when you first but it you feel like you saved a lot. :ninja:

[Hexis]

I like the side effect of driving prices on used Proto and Dye matricies down further. Makes picking up a PM6 or DM6 a lot easier to get approved by the wife.

[d4m4don3]

Most of todays new markers look almost all the same now. I guess most of the difference is in the features or material its made out aside from preference of company who made it.

[Toll]

Cocker threaded. <3.

[SCpoloRicker]

*waves at this new, improved thread*

[coreyander]

all trixes after the DM4 are cocker threaded.

[glickstue]

Weren't they all anyways? I know you could buy different breaches for them but I thought all the old matrix's back to the Diablo days were cocker threaded.



Edit: Yes they were -> http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/paintguns/directory/index4.shtml#eMatrix

[don miguel]

Just thought of something, since all guns seem to look the same these days, and all they are getting is smaller and smaller. Mabe some company should make a carbon fiber gunbody, trigger frame, barell, bolt, and complete internals. It would be like the DMCF (dye matrix carbon fiber) or PMCF. Carbon fiber is strong, and light. The marker would be expensive but I think it would be a cool concept. Or mabe a carbon fiber ULE mainbody. That's one for you Tom. :cheers:

[Toll]

CF is relatively strong, how ever it's not particularly durable to friction against metal parts (so I've been told) as well as it's no particularly easy to get your hands on in mass amounts like aluminum.

[don miguel]

CF is relatively strong, how ever it's not particularly durable to friction against metal parts (so I've been told) as well as it's no particularly easy to get your hands on in mass amounts like aluminum.

That's why it would be a relitively expensive marker. I got the bolt idea from here:
LADIES AN GENTLEMEN I GIVE YOU THE STIFFI BOLT! made of carbon fiber. It had me puzzled the first time I saw it. It is designed for autocockers.
http://www.fuzionpaintball.com/prodimages/Bolt-Pin-small_lrg.jpg

[CKY_Alliance]

theres carbon fiber bolts for just about all high end guns...Orange makes them http://www.orange-paintball.com/orange_paintball.htm

I can see like in a spool..bc its just the bolt and u dont need to lube it(jus o-rgins), but replacing a delrin bolt with a carbon fiber one..do you have to oil it? The friction would be so bad...unless they put a couple o-rings on it to lube..but i know they have them for timmes i think egos and apprently autocockers...hmm..ne way off topic...


Instead of picking one of these up and UL it im just gonna buy a dm6 when the price drops..

[MicroMiniMe]

So is the body made from all the blems that dont pass for a DM7 or whatnot?
/just keep bead blasting

[coreyander]

no....you still need to lube the carbon fiber on orange bolts in trixes.

[SCpoloRicker]

*waves at this new, improved thread*

Hitler. Hitler. Hitler.

[Lohman446]

But.. but... it doesn't have an LPR. It must suck.... :rolleyes:

[CKY_Alliance]

no....you still need to lube the carbon fiber on orange bolts in trixes.


I know that but i was wondering in like timmies and egos that have delrin (self lubricating) bolts...but i went and looked at the orange timy bolt the part that makes contact with the body is delrin and has orings...so ye..like i thought there would be too much friction with a just plain carbon fiber bolt like the one above.

Even in trixes your still just lubing the o-rings...you put very little on the actual bolt its self..and its jus in the areas close to the o-rings.

[Lenny]

Hitler. Hitler. Hitler.
Sieg heil! Sieg heil!

[Hexis]

Godwin does not apply if intentional.

[coreyander]

I know that but i was wondering in like timmies and egos that have delrin (self lubricating) bolts...but i went and looked at the orange timy bolt the part that makes contact with the body is delrin and has orings...so ye..like i thought there would be too much friction with a just plain carbon fiber bolt like the one above.

Even in trixes your still just lubing the o-rings...you put very little on the actual bolt its self..and its jus in the areas close to the o-rings.


no actually on trixes you do lube the bolt itself. You lube the front, the orings, the stem and the tail. The only part you really dont lube is the skinny part on the stem.

And it needs to be lubed quite a bit compared to other guns.

Delrin is not "self" lubricating although that is a popular term w/ it......it just doesnt require lubing. They run dry. I still lube my delrin bolts anyway.

[CKY_Alliance]

no actually on trixes you do lube the bolt itself. You lube the front, the orings, the stem and the tail. The only part you really dont lube is the skinny part on the stem.

And it needs to be lubed quite a bit compared to other guns.

Delrin is not "self" lubricating although that is a popular term w/ it......it just doesnt require lubing. They run dry. I still lube my delrin bolts anyway.


Actually trixes dont need much at all you put some on all the orings..and some on the metel right around the orings...now when putting it around the orings on the bolt stem ye you do cover it bc theres 2 orings and not that much metal...i just read the little sticky on pbn and appearntly they do recommend lubing the bolt lightly...i dont see the point i guess to lube top hot and such...o well i will continue to do it my way..

[don miguel]

Back to the point, does anyone think a full CF gun would be cool as a concept. How about a complete carbon fiber mag. It could have a carbon fiber shelled xvalve, carbonfiber emag lowers, a carbon fiber ule bodykit, and obviously a carbon fiber barell. Can anyone with photoshop make a pic of one for show, Idont have photoshop. THE GUN WOULD BE SWEET AND LIGHT. Hey Mr.Kaye do you think it could work? if you could respond that would be good :dance: .

[CKY_Alliance]

Back to the point, does anyone think a full CF gun would be cool as a concept. How about a complete carbon fiber mag. It could have a carbon fiber shelled xvalve, carbonfiber emag lowers, a carbon fiber ule bodykit, and obviously a carbon fiber barell. Can anyone with photoshop make a pic of one for show, Idont have photoshop. THE GUN WOULD BE SWEET AND LIGHT. Hey Mr.Kay do you think it could work? if you could respond that would be good :dance: .



Its been talked about before and im pretty sure that the conclusion is the carbon fiber would wear too fast and too much friction..atleast for the body...and its not cost effective..if you weant a carbon fiber gun go get car decals and put them on yours..

[mag_lover05]

back on topic anyone??

[Pneumagger]

Hey Mr.Kay do you think it could work? if you could respond that would be good :dance: .
I'd help if you spelled his name right ;)

I don't plan on getting a PMR.

what really amazes me is the PM&'s $999 retail. My shop pwner showed me one. It's the same basically as the PM6. God knows how much the DM7 will cost.
After thinking for a few seconds... I don't believe the paintball market observes the law of supply and demand.

[AGDRetro]

After thinking for a few seconds... I don't believe the paintball market observes the law of supply and demand.

In total agreement, but working in retail has opened my eyes to the fact that many large companies either don't get it or don't care. We as a society overproduce nearly everything, and waste even more. But when something really good does come out, it seems we never have enough of it...

I am however curious as to what the Rail may do to the Ion's retail price... how much lower can it go?

[don miguel]

2007 (not too far future)

ion= $20

ion upgrades=$400

spending time at you local proshop waiting for you ion to be fixed every week, and gazing at the new proto rail= priceless.

[kenndogg]

I am however curious as to what the Rail may do to the Ion's retail price... how much lower can it go?

Honestly I don't think it'll do much since 350.00 is still significantly higher than the current price of the ion(179.00). I think price of the ion is as low as it can go. Maybe within a year of the rail's release when its price dips some where below 250.00 than it might change. But than again SP will flood the market with something else(the pbnation kiddies are talking about the so called epiphany).





2007 (not too far future)

ion= $20

ion upgrades=$400

spending time at you local proshop waiting for you ion to be fixed every week, and gazing at the new proto rail= priceless.

and you wonder why your getting flamed so much? I'm sure like in your thread bashing egos and dm5s you never owned or used an ion but perceived it to be junk since you heard stories about them huh? There are already numerous post about ions so I'll won't waste the time to rant and just consider this another idoitic post by don miguel.

[don miguel]

Honestly I don't think it'll do much since 350.00 is still significantly higher than the current price of the ion(179.00). I think price of the ion is as low as it can go. Maybe within a year of the rail's release when its price dips some where below 250.00 than it might change. But than again SP will flood the market with something else(the pbnation kiddies are talking about the so called epiphany).





and you wonder why your getting flamed so much? I'm sure like in your thread bashing egos and dm5s you never owned or used an ion but perceived it to be junk since you heard stories about them huh? There are already numerous post about ions so I'll won't waste the time to rant and just consider this another idoitic post by don miguel.

My teammate conor owns one, I have shot it, used it, taken it apart. I don't like it that much. It's good for the price and shoots fast. And how would you know if I have ever owned an Ion or not anyways? I could own a thousand Ions for all you know.

[CKY_Alliance]

My teammate conor owns one, I have shot it, used it, taken it apart. I don't like it that much. It's good for the price and shoots fast. And how would you know if I have ever owned an Ion or not anyways? I could own a thousand Ions for all you know.


Wait, you took a gun apart...o my, does it still work? No wonder your preception of ions are bad your using one a moron worked on...

[don miguel]

Wait, you took a gun apart...o my, does it still work? No wonder your preception of ions are bad your using one a moron worked on...

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?

[SCpoloRicker]

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?

Good lord. Just.... wow....

[AGDRetro]

Good lord. Just.... wow....

I find myself once again in total agreement :cheers:

[mag_lover05]

what can you expect from the "flammin burito"...

[CKY_Alliance]

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?


Hahah, o man..oh, oh my...just wow..


and they aren't hard to fix at all really..there isn't much to them..but i dont expect much more from a moron...

[mag_lover05]

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?


youve been here for maybe 1 month and you post count is at 350 something.... and your calling people that have been here (cky alliance) for a year a moron?



QFT. please.

[paintballfiend]

I think I've seen an advertisement for the PMR in a paintball mag with a different trigger. Looks a lot better then the rubber looking one they had on it.

[iambored]

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?

Well your title does say noob :rofl:

[eric_503]

are you calling my teammate conor a moron? excuse me? I had trouble taking an Ion apart, he showed me how to do it. Why are you saying he is a moron? Ion's aren't the grateast markers in the world, they are hard to fix if you are don't know what you are doing like me, but he knows how to fix it. The gun works just fine. Why are you calling him a moron? What is your problem?


first comment ive ever made on you and i know someone may of said this but.....

Quoted:Wait, you took a gun apart...o my, does it still work? No wonder your preception of ions are bad your using one a moron worked on...

(remember that now think of this)

you took it apart your dumbass worked on it there for you are the moron that worked on it

bingo! yahtzee! umm......... :dance: hoorah!

do we get it now?

why havent you been banned yet good lord........

[CKY_Alliance]

first comment ive ever made on you and i know someone may of said this but.....

Quoted:Wait, you took a gun apart...o my, does it still work? No wonder your preception of ions are bad your using one a moron worked on...

(remember that now think of this)

you took it apart your dumbass worked on it there for you are the moron that worked on it

bingo! yahtzee! umm......... :dance: hoorah!

do we get it now?

why havent you been banned yet good lord........


Ding Ding Ding we have a winner...what do we have for him today jhonny?

ehh thanks for breaking it down for him but im sure he will still have problems comprehending it.

[eric_503]

haha i cant help it (this is good fun;) )

this ones for you don :)

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/660/43cumg5ll9.gif (http://imageshack.us)