Bad Anno jobs

[StygShore]

Based on some recent posts...

I would like to see pics of some of the bad anodize work that people have received back from anodizers.

To be fair to the companies, you don't even have to list their name, I just want to see what type of crap some of the anodizers in the paintball world are passing off as "good" work.



Styg

[don miguel]

this is a good thread im interested to see what happens

[Triangle]

this is a good thread im interested to see what happens

What defines a good thread?

[StygShore]

What defines a good thread?

One where you an Don don't clutter it up insulting one another :)

Styg

[robnix]

One where you an Don don't clutter it up insulting one another :)

Styg

What's the fun in that, Mr. SmellyPants!

[minimag03]

PrecisionPB top notch job...

The frame was very clean when I took the pics, however there was some specs of dust. In the time I have had it, it has been used maybe 3 times. None of the damage came from me. The rest of my mag doesn't even have a mark on it.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/f1.jpg

The scrapes on the edge of the frame came were on it from PrecisionPB.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/f4.jpg

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/f3.jpg

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/f2.jpg

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/minimag03/f5.jpg

I requested that the frame be anno'd very glossy black. When asked for an example I told them like CP's barrels. They said they completely understood. Above is a CP barrel compared to what they did to the frame. The anno is so thin that the trigger pin will not stay in. Coolhand designed the frames to a good anno would keep the pins in fairly tight. Sorry for the big pics.

[SCpoloRicker]

What defines a good thread?

http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/2939/supyk6.jpg

[MoeMag]

I dont have pics but I have had 2 bad anno jobs that I have had come through my shop. To be annoed guns must be stripped to their basic componets, annoed, and reassembled. I usually dont come into the picture until the reassemblely part when kids bring their guns in to be put back together after they brutally tore them apart.

1. Shocker SFT. When annoed the gun still had the air guide rods (the two things that go in the back below and next to the bolt chamber which controll the airflow). They were corroded and beyond repair. Then parts were missing... mainly the bolt spacer. then on the ASA and reg... they spray painted the elbow fittings. As for the gun itself it was supposed to be a clear anno job and thats what they paid for. what they got was a bead blasted raw body.

2. late model timmy of some sort. When the gun was returned it was difficult to re assemble due to tolerance changes on all the threaded parts. It had been warped out of shape to the point that once it was assembled after hours of work the front block or what ever (not too knowledgeable with timmys) that it would not seal up and leaked. On top of that... the sticker emblem on the back... when it was peeled up, had the old anno still under it.

[SR_matt]

just as a reminder, anodizing is more so an art form than a science and also that the oxide layer forms perpendicular to the metal, so on points it is extreamly thin to non exsistant.

-matt

[Pneumagger]

just as a reminder, anodizing is more so an art form than a science and also that the oxide layer forms perpendicular to the metal, so on points it is extreamly thin to non exsistant.

-matt

I don't know if anybody would consider anodizing a piece of aluminum black an artform.

[Hexis]

The requirements of the surface finishing alone qualify it as an art form. It take skill.

The only bad anno I have is stuff I did myself. It ended up kinda like an acid wash, but it was supposed to be a solid color. Oh well, need to try it on more spare parts and get better.

[SR_matt]

I don't know if anybody would consider anodizing a piece of aluminum black an artform.
ask any good anodizer, it is, the amout of playing you have to do with a set up and guestimations to get stuff to come out how you want makes it an art form

and thats just before you try to dye it, the dye adds so many more variables to it

-matt

[Lenny]

PrecisionPB top notch job...

The frame was very clean when I took the pics, however there was some specs of dust. In the time I have had it, it has been used maybe 3 times. None of the damage came from me. The rest of my mag doesn't even have a mark on it.

(pictures)

I requested that the frame be anno'd very glossy black. When asked for an example I told them like CP's barrels. They said they completely understood. Above is a CP barrel compared to what they did to the frame. The anno is so thin that the trigger pin will not stay in. Coolhand designed the frames to a good anno would keep the pins in fairly tight. Sorry for the big pics.
Ouch! Especially on a UMF!

I would only trust Gruntbull to anno my stuff simply because he is the ONLY annodizer I've ever heard 100% good things about.

[CoolHand]

Ok, here we go.

We used to do everything in house, and we occasionally had a crap up, but anything I didn't like, never left the shop until it was right.

Then my ano guy moved to Detroit.

So I switched to MAX Ano in Texas. Things went crappily from the start, super long turn around times, lies upon lies upon lies, and their work wasn't great either.

I had been having trouble with them for months, and then I sent off a few parts of a Mag to be done gloss black. Here's what came back:

http://www.logicpaintball.com/VertFrameDull&ScratchedBlem.jpg

http://www.logicpaintball.com/AlphaScratchBlem.jpg

http://www.logicpaintball.com/BatterPackDullMountBlem.jpg

http://www.logicpaintball.com/BatteryPackDullStripeBlem.jpg

Those pics are what I sent to the owner to explain why I wasn't going to pay him. This marker came back just three weeks after they'd sent back a batch of 50 vert frames with half sort of polished, two or three crappily anodized, and the rest still raw, which they'd had for over three months. The guy took it like a man though, I'll give him that one.

Next I sent that marker to A+ Ano to have them redo the gloss black. This is how it looked when it was done:

http://www.logicpaintball.com/EMagMechDriverSide.jpg

All is well, for a while. After the first couple of batches, they too started to slip. First it was a shocker I sent in for dust silver that came back as a milky white satin/gloss. Then it was this Karta body that was supposed to be red. Body and rail anodized at the same time, body came out pink, rail came out red. Horrible match in person, but they shipped it anyway:

http://www.logicpaintball.com/A+AnoFlubRedPinkKarta.jpg

The last straw with them was a batch of parts that came back in all shades of disrepair. The most notable was this one:

http://www.logicpaintball.com/ArmsonTipStickerBlem.jpg

That's an Armson barrel tip that was black to start with. Note the black ano still under the half polished off sticker. That was not the only part like that in that batch. After those parts came back, I stopped using them. All efforts to gain satisfaction failed.

So I moved on to a new anodizer. NICO Metal Finishers was a big industrial anodizer. They knew their crap, and they guaranteed a two week turn around. Riiiiiight.

Here's one of about 25 bad frames that came back in the first batch of 50 (which actually took over two months to come back):

http://www.logicpaintball.com/NICO-AnoUSF.jpg

They referred me to a smaller branch of their same company to make it right (since I refused to pay them) called AVTECH. They took another batch of 50 frames, plus all the buggered up ones from the first batch, and said they'd be done in no more than three weeks. Four months later they send me back about 15 frames with perfect ano on them (albeit a very thick ano, almost like a hard cote), four or five polished but raw, one utterly destroyed and mangled frame, and then the rest as I sent them. They told me not to pay for anything, and that they just couldn't handle them.

They did this marker's frame:

http://www.logicpaintball.com/images/USF-SmallerFrontPage.jpg

That brings me to the present. I am currently anodizer-less, but on the up side, I'm not having things destroyed on a daily basis anymore either.

The next stuff I send out I think will go to GruntBull. They seem to really have their crap wired straight. The guys in charge are straight shooters (as far as I can tell anyway) too, they want to be sure they can deliver what they promise, BEFORE they make the promise. That's a refreshing change of pace. ;)

[Triangle]

Who's doing my Dallara big guy?
What did you decide as for color?

[CoolHand]

Who's doing my Dallara big guy?
What did you decide as for color?

I dunno.

If PK's was still taking work it'd go there, but alas, they are not.

If GruntBull works out as well as I hope they will, it'll go there.

Mum's the word on the design though, it'll be a better surprise that way. (and yes, I do know what I'm gonna have done, I'm just not saying right now) :ninja:

It'll be sweet, of that you can be sure.

:cheers:

[StygShore]

Let me know how his stuff turns out, I might have some work for him on a pump gun, and some redo on something



Styg

[Triangle]

I dunno.

If PK's was still taking work it'd go there, but alas, they are not.

If GruntBull works out as well as I hope they will, it'll go there.

Mum's the word on the design though, it'll be a better surprise that way. (and yes, I do know what I'm gonna have done, I'm just not saying right now) :ninja:

It'll be sweet, of that you can be sure.

:cheers:

You are made of win.

Remeber. It's gotta match a black barrel, hardware, hopper, etc...

Dont fail.

[CoolHand]

You are made of win.

Remeber. It's gotta match a black barrel, hardware, hopper, etc...

Dont fail.

Roger.

[Triangle]

Roger.
What's our vector Victor?

[Pneumagger]

gruntbull seems to be doing an awesome job. I've had one marker done there, a second is in their possesion, and the third awaits funding. :cheers:

[VFX_Fenix]

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.

Variable can I get a confirmation on that last order?

Confirmation. Alpha Bravo Romeo India Victor. ovr.

[Warwitch]

I picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue.

[geekwarrior]

so is this what your talking about in your other thread?

[minimag03]

The only person I'm trusting now is Rainmann. I have heard great stuff about him. It's worth the price once you see how bad anno's can get.

[don miguel]

The only person I'm trusting now is Rainmann. I have heard great stuff about him. It's worth the price once you see how bad anno's can get.
he dosen't happen to be on blue's crew does he?

[StygShore]

so is this what your talking about in your other thread?


Pics will be posted tonight and people can make their own judgement if they would be happy with it.


Styg

[geekwarrior]

Pics will be posted tonight and people can make their own judgement if they would be happy with it.


Styg


I'm thinking of getting some anno work done, so if you could post or pm me with who you are unhappy with I would appreciate it.

[Xmagterror]

The reason why all these anodizing jobs are so bad now is because of the anno price wars that have been going on with all the shops on the internet. Just pay the money and have PK do it...its well worth it. all these small shops just give you the slam bam thank you mam anno job because they have to to make any money at it. the cost of the materials for anno is just about nothing. the most expensive part of it is stripping the old anno off. the acid and dye is cheap and lasts forever. I would say you can reanodize a gun for about 5 bucks in materials. Its all labor.

I use to anodize guns for teams locally and i did really good quality work but once all the internet price wars started nobody wanted to pay me 275 a gun anymore. I just told them to pay 110 and see what it looks like. The jokes on them. I dont reanodize guns any more because it just takes to much time to strip, polish and then finally do the anno. I only anodize new things now. it comes off my cnc mill.... i do a quick polish and then it goes in the tank...easy.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND SEND IT TO PK!!!!!!!!!!!!! BEST MONEY YOU WILL EVER SPEND ON YOUR GUN.

[StygShore]

Nobody llistens to me around here do they?

PK DOES NOT DO PAINTBALL GUNS ANYMORE - I tried to get mine done there, even tried doing an end around to get it in, and I had 4 people tell me they do not do graphic paintball anodizing anymore. 1 guy said yeah we can do a solid color if its ina batch with other parts - and then his manager nixed that and said no, there isnt anyone here that does that type of work anymore.


Styg




The reason why all these anodizing jobs are so bad now is because of the anno price wars that have been going on with all the shops on the internet. Just pay the money and have PK do it...its well worth it. all these small shops just give you the slam bam thank you mam anno job because they have to to make any money at it. the cost of the materials for anno is just about nothing. the most expensive part of it is stripping the old anno off. the acid and dye is cheap and lasts forever. I would say you can reanodize a gun for about 5 bucks in materials. Its all labor.

I use to anodize guns for teams locally and i did really good quality work but once all the internet price wars started nobody wanted to pay me 275 a gun anymore. I just told them to pay 110 and see what it looks like. The jokes on them. I dont reanodize guns any more because it just takes to much time to strip, polish and then finally do the anno. I only anodize new things now. it comes off my cnc mill.... i do a quick polish and then it goes in the tank...easy.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND SEND IT TO PK!!!!!!!!!!!!! BEST MONEY YOU WILL EVER SPEND ON YOUR GUN.

[Xmagterror]

Nobody llistens to me around here do they?

PK DOES NOT DO PAINTBALL GUNS ANYMORE - I tried to get mine done there, even tried doing an end around to get it in, and I had 4 people tell me they do not do graphic paintball anodizing anymore. 1 guy said yeah we can do a solid color if its ina batch with other parts - and then his manager nixed that and said no, there isnt anyone here that does that type of work anymore.


Styg


Well thats news to me because i just got my XMAG back from there a couple of months ago and damn........its awesome!!!!! Just gotta know the right people in the company i guess! LOL

[StygShore]

Guess so, becasue 5-6 months ago, they told me they dont do it anymore

Styg

[evildead420]

isnt PK in san Jose Ca? i should go have a stop by there if they are, i work in SJ all the friggen time.

oh yea, I call shens. Pics now boy :shooting:

[geekwarrior]

oh yea, I call shens. Pics now boy :shooting:

seconded

[91Foxtrot]

I will second Rainman229. He anno'd my UMF. Now this is the only part I have ever had anno'd, but I was impressed with the outcome and it was a really good price. My experience went something like this:
-We worked out the details.
-I shipped my frame out to him.
-I gave it about 3-4 days before I wrote and asked if he had received it.
-He responds that the anno is done and he put it in the mail the next day.

I think the total time from when I put it in the mail to the time I had it back in my hands was about 7 days.

Of course, I only had 2 pieces (frame and trigger). Might be longer if you are getting an entire marker done.

[Rudz]

poor poor styg..its ok, its still beautiful..

[thefool]

The reason why all these anodizing jobs are so bad now is because of the anno price wars that have been going on with all the shops on the internet. Just pay the money and have PK do it...its well worth it. all these small shops just give you the slam bam thank you mam anno job because they have to to make any money at it. the cost of the materials for anno is just about nothing. the most expensive part of it is stripping the old anno off. the acid and dye is cheap and lasts forever. I would say you can reanodize a gun for about 5 bucks in materials. Its all labor.

I use to anodize guns for teams locally and i did really good quality work but once all the internet price wars started nobody wanted to pay me 275 a gun anymore. I just told them to pay 110 and see what it looks like. The jokes on them. I dont reanodize guns any more because it just takes to much time to strip, polish and then finally do the anno. I only anodize new things now. it comes off my cnc mill.... i do a quick polish and then it goes in the tank...easy.

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND SEND IT TO PK!!!!!!!!!!!!! BEST MONEY YOU WILL EVER SPEND ON YOUR GUN.
While this is true you must also ask yourself how much you value your time as an annodizer and how much time a given order will take. Figure that each part will take 5 min of strip time, 5-40 of polishing/finishing time, 5-10 preanno bath time, 5-40 dyeing time depending on the desired effect (maybe even more), and finally 2-5 post dying sealing, follwed by about 10-15 min of quality contol for the batch.

So now, even if we assume there is no materials cost, the most basic anno will take you at least 30 minutes per part no matter how small. Keep in mind this is for a single color dust part with no surface work other than bead blasting.

so for 10 parts, you will spend at least 5 man hours doing that anno, the accual prossess takes much longer, figure at least an hour in the anno tank, 30 min sealing, 30+ min dying and stripping, the accual process from start to finish will take no less than 7 hours.

The lowest price ive ever seen for a job like this was gruntbulls promotional offer where they charged $55 for it. Im suprized they even started that low. Think about it, $55/7 ~$7.80 an hour.

You could make more working in a chain somewhere and there you wouldn't start in the hole thousands of dollars for equipment.

[paintball-lizard]

Im going to use Slothball in the UK i have heard good things about thier work and i have seen some pieces they have done very sweet indeed.Only because im in the UK.

[StygShore]

OK, this is taking the same pic I posted for MOTM.

I posted the main section of the gun, and pointed out issues that show up in this picture, I did not take this picture to specifically catch the flaws or anything. I can take more detailed pics of specific issues if anyone would like.

I can do the same for the other side, but it is just similar issues

you can make the judgement if you would have been happy with the work or not.

http://home.comcast.net/~stygshore/annoprobs.JPG

[going_home]

I had a thread on this somewhere but here it is again.
I sent 3 complete markers, barrels and all.
2 were to be Xvalve blue, but gloss, (and yes I sent a blue Xvalve)
and 1 was to be gloss black.
They anodized the two Chord bodies and feednecks in 1 batch,
and all the rest of the blue parts in another.
The barrels, rails, trigger frames, DW CF foregrips, all match the Xvalve but the bodies were almost purple. I didnt send the drops and ASA's, they just happened to match.
I emailed them 3 times and never got a response.
Chord V2 UMF:
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b195/going_home/DSC_0001-1.jpg
Chord V1 UMF:
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b195/going_home/a9a9b221.jpg
And heres the obvious screwup, black marker, blue trigger.
Karta UMF:
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b195/going_home/69d418f3.jpg
So stay away from FBM, they dont do too good and wont respond if you are unhappy.
I never in correspondence was ever rude or used bad language.
I dont do that anyways.

[thefool]

OK, this is taking the same pic I posted for MOTM.

I posted the main section of the gun, and pointed out issues that show up in this picture, I did not take this picture to specifically catch the flaws or anything. I can take more detailed pics of specific issues if anyone would like.

I can do the same for the other side, but it is just similar issues

you can make the judgement if you would have been happy with the work or not.


kinda hard tell. From that pic, the work looks well done, exept for the feedneck. On the other hand, remember different alloys work differently and react differently to the same dye so its often difficult to get a good match.

The milky white was probably a spot where he didn't clean the part fully between surface prep and anno.

White around the edges is the same thing.

Sloppy masking is excusable i think because it is very hard to get things to line up 100% and it doesnt look that sloppy to me.

[StygShore]

Yeah, Masking on this side is not as bad as the other, and the laser hits the lines on this side. This was the MOTM pic, so I took the pic from the "good" side.

What I dont understand is I asked for the breach and feed to be redone, was told the breach and feed would be redone, and... the breach and feed were never redone. That would have resolved the majority of problems I have with the gun, and Lornes laser wouldnt have had to look bad from trying to bridge the gap to line the words up ( if you look at the original pics before the re-anno the letters are pretty much dead on )

I have been alternating oiling and buffing trying to get the milky spots out, seems to be in the anodize itself.

As far as different alloys... this is a CCM feedneck - they come from CCM gloss finished ( this one came raw because it was going to be annoed ), and my barrel came from Sanchez Machine black gloss finished, why couldnt they be done in a black gloss finish?

I never complained about the different shades of Red or Black. As it was for this job alone - the battery packs were done 3 or 4 times, frame was done 2 or 3 times, body was done 2 times, Breach was done 1 time, and feed ring was done twice - these parts saw the anno bath and dye so many times, the chance of getting them all to match was slim to none.

Before you say "OH well you got your moneys worth!" - the parts were all redone do to the following problems in no particular order, fade parts were anodized upside down, parts were assembled wrong so the fade didnt match, anodize/sealer failed( after the cool pics were taken ) causing milky spots, fading, white edges.

Styg

[CoolHand]

. . . . . anodize/sealer failed( after the cool pics were taken ) causing milky spots, fading, white edges.

Styg


That right there is the main reason we always used heat to seal our parts. The dippable cold sealers sometimes go to crap on you.

Of all the problems we had with ano, having one go to hell AFTER it had been sealed was never one.

Our biggest buggaboo was always surface prep. We had a lot of trouble with random spots of "something" that wouldn't come off. We used acid etches, quick lye dips, degreasers and soaps of every sort, all to no avail. Sometimes we would just get mystery spots that refused to take dye.

That was really frustrating.

Everything else was cake (though a lot of work), but those unpredictable spots were like a plague. They'd show up one at a time, or hundreds at a time, with no rhyme or reason. For two years we chased them, and never could isolate a single cause. Sometimes they'd go away if you redid the parts, sometimes they'd still be there after five or six strippings. It made no sense at all.

I understand why anodizers have trouble, it's tough as hell, but with all our problems, we never let parts go out the door that I wasn't proud of. Shipping some of the things I've seen here and on PBN to customers is beyond excuse.

[coreyander]

I dont have pictures of it anymore and it probably wouldnt be noticable, but when I bought my emag karta body and rail a long time ago, when I got it from DW, the rail and body had fingerprints in the ano where someone had handled it w/o gloves after desmut/cleaning rinses. I never said anything about it and you had to look at them closely to see. They probably wouldnt show up in pictures because they were black fingerprints on a gloss black body.

I wasnt that happy about it after spending 300+ and waiting a while to get the body.

Ive heard of FBM screwing up a few jobs. Namely the DC emag that was being sold around here, and some guys timmy that got turned into a paperweight and FBM refused to accept responsibility for. The guy ended up not being able to ever use that gun again.

[coreyander]

also to add.

going home...the reason some of those parts couldve turned out a different hue of blue is because of the different series of aluminum used for the parts. I think DW may use 6061, which shouldve matched any other 6061 ran for the same amount of time and the same batch of dye used for the coloring. But....the feedneck and triggers and things of the like can be from a differenct series of aluminum. I know my CCM one is made from 3000 series which doesnt turn the same color as say 6061. I made the anodizer (gruntbull) aware of that, and he got it to match perfectly. They even stripped a type 3 ano part (sidewinder swivel and bottom nut) and reanodized w/ no probs at all.

STygshore.....the milky white spots, bare aluminum showing on the edges are probably the only bad things I would consider. That is a CCM feedneck which is 3000 series aluminum, which is why it looks brown and not red like the body.....6061.

The more I see bad ano jobs, the more I am glad I went w/ gruntbull. :)

[StygShore]

hmmm doesnt look like CCM has a problem with em? :cool:


http://www.chipleymachine.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/feedncks_m.jpg

Heck, that red is almost exact and the gloss is perfect, guess I should have just orderred it from CCM that way :(


Styg



also to add.

going home...the reason some of those parts couldve turned out a different hue of blue is because of the different series of aluminum used for the parts. I think DW may use 6061, which shouldve matched any other 6061 ran for the same amount of time and the same batch of dye used for the coloring. But....the feedneck and triggers and things of the like can be from a differenct series of aluminum. I know my CCM one is made from 3000 series which doesnt turn the same color as say 6061. I made the anodizer (gruntbull) aware of that, and he got it to match perfectly. They even stripped a type 3 ano part (sidewinder swivel and bottom nut) and reanodized w/ no probs at all.

STygshore.....the milky white spots, bare aluminum showing on the edges are probably the only bad things I would consider. That is a CCM feedneck which is 3000 series aluminum, which is why it looks brown and not red like the body.....6061.

The more I see bad ano jobs, the more I am glad I went w/ gruntbull. :)

[Xmagterror]

The reason why your karta body dosent match is because all the sluggo bodies AGD put out the door were made from 7075 aluminum because they need the strength. the rest of the automag is made from 6061. For the most part if you do everything black it wont really show because it soaks in really good. black dye is about 5 times the cost of all the other colors...because it works so well.

[thefool]

nay its more expensive simply becasue it is harder to manufacture a good black. same with fourecent pink. The chemical makeup of the dye is different

[coreyander]

hmmm doesnt look like CCM has a problem with em? :cool:


http://www.chipleymachine.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/feedncks_m.jpg

Heck, that red is almost exact and the gloss is perfect, guess I should have just orderred it from CCM that way :(


Styg

thats not the point. Most anodizers can match the color if they know ahead of time about what series they are dealing iwith. The anodizer didnt know the body was different than the feedneck, therefore, they ran it in the same manner. It didnt turn out right. I was made aware of this at the time I sent my viking in. Before ano, it was red, as was my body, and it didnt match. The CCM neck was a darker red than the body.

If anyone is planning on anodizing, I suggest trying to find out what series different parts may be. Make the anodizer aware of it. They will try to get the closest match as possible.

That xmag still looks great though styg. I think its minor. Contact the anodizer and ask if he will rerun it to match and get a quote. They may do it cheap since its a correction.

[Chaos_Theory!]

Barrels - The dull non glossy finish on the inside of barrels after re anodizing is VERY common. Some anodizers use plugs to retain the stock inner finish on barrels.

CCM Feednecks - Ive been told by multiple anodizers that at least the clamp rings are very hard to anodize and come out a borwn color a lot of the time (if they were originally black).

[SR_matt]

^^ when i sent my stuff in to get anoed rainman told me it didnt matter what color the stuff was originaly casue it was jsut gona get all striped out any way, my feedneck ring came back a slightly more olive color than the rest of my limegreen ano but its not really noticible.

its gota be the alloy which was probably chosen because it has a better springyness to it

-matt

[StygShore]

The anodizer DID know the aluminum series type. I did the legwork ahead of time because I knew anodizers have had problems with matching AGD colors accross bodies, rails, frames etc - He still tried to run them all in one batch - hence I believe the initial problem with the anodize failing ( though now they claim it never failed and they redid it for me "out of the kindness of their hearts" )

The feedneck ring was pretty close red the first time but had a gouge in it, second time it came back brown, and it was raw when they first received it.

The anodizer feels the gun looks great and rather than do any more work has said they are done with me.


Styg



thats not the point. Most anodizers can match the color if they know ahead of time about what series they are dealing iwith. The anodizer didnt know the body was different than the feedneck, therefore, they ran it in the same manner. It didnt turn out right. I was made aware of this at the time I sent my viking in. Before ano, it was red, as was my body, and it didnt match. The CCM neck was a darker red than the body.

If anyone is planning on anodizing, I suggest trying to find out what series different parts may be. Make the anodizer aware of it. They will try to get the closest match as possible.

That xmag still looks great though styg. I think its minor. Contact the anodizer and ask if he will rerun it to match and get a quote. They may do it cheap since its a correction.

[gruntbull]

Hey guys, interesting thread.

We have done some we are not proud of too, usually we catch them and they go out right, recently we had a Green gun go out... The marker didn't leave the shop in the hodgepodge mess it was, but of course the customer got to us and asked about the reason it had issues. This was part of a few factors in ano and after, but of course we offer to do it all again, or upgrade his ano work at no cost.

We told him to send it back, as always we stand behind something we do. If it is something we controlled, and did wrong we take it back and make it right, if it isn't something we can do, we offer to do their marker in a more expensive ano theme at no expense to them. Some opt to do it, some don't.

The fact that all jobs are never the same leads to a lot of the issues I feel personally, on the professional side, I would like to say we can run anything, but there are things that just were never meant to be done, and sadly you don't find out till after you do them.

I think the thing is you want to ensure if you give someone money to do something that it is done how you want, we can't make everyone happy, but we are willing to try.

Also there are some things a finisher can not change. Some pits are there finish work, material issues that can not be resolved by just finishing. To be honest the more different alloys you have in a marker the more difficult it becomes, as now you have to test ano layers to ensure everything comes out as it should, and even then sometimes issues happen.

Slight color variations is not something I view as bad ano, especially with different parts (Dye had different aluminum (same alloy) from 05 to 06, I did my DM5 with a UL frame and a New barrel) well the old 05 parts came out one color, the 06 parts a lighter color (slight but still visable) all pieces went in together, and all had the same dye time. but it still happens.)

There is more to cost than 5 dollars, my line setup while continually growing costs a good amount. Shop rent, electricity, WATER, phone, ect all cost, and unless you do other things out of your shop (we dont currently) it adds up big. The EPA certification, permits, and environment controls cost, Heaters now those things cost, we are still looking for the final answer to heat, as the commercial heaters are rather expensive, and the "basic" ones pop if you look at them with disgust. I think a true Overhead on a job is somewhere in the 27-35% rate until you have become established with the equipment you care to keep a hold of. Then it will drop down, the main cost I would say is SKILLED labor. Anyone can pull a part out of a tank, it takes someone with know how to figure out the setups, the graphics, placement of the cut graphic (remember Custom work means by hand work here), and so on. All while trying to make the cost low so people can afford it. We did 55 and are thinking of going back (not sure if we can with the overhead we have now) but we want to ensure we make what we need to continue, grow, and realize a little from the fruit of the labor, but yet make CHEAP and QUALITY able to be said in the same sentence again.

But even with all that, the best thing about being an anodizer, is when you post a pic on the website and can say, we did that.

-Bull

[Lohman446]

Whoever did work for GADevil on the Devilmags did very very good work from my experience. Alas I don't know who it was though.

Keep in mind also this was me giving them a rough idea of what I wanted. I think my comment was "think fire and brimstone" I mean it was a Devimag, so my expectations were not as precise as some peoples are.

[SR_matt]

i got a job done a few months aago, payed like 80 bucks for my mag (body, rail, uni mount cage, 3 barrel tips, rip drive handle, trigger, feed neck ring) i got it back un under 2 weeks. it had a few blemishes but it was becasue the metal was rough when i sent it in (rain man did smooth it out for me but some places were very hard to smooth out perfectly for the ano to take perfectly). so i have a few blemishes but hey 80 bucks for like 10 pieces and sub 2 week turn around im satisfied.

ano is to protect the metal and just happens to be able to add a flare of color its not an air brush job that is just there to look pretty, its supposed to be functional as well.

-matt

[Swampy]

After seeing this thread kind made wonder about sending My Bro's mag (FireFighter Mag) away to get Anno'd. So I searched locally for a small time/side project shop (i.e. powder coater's, auto shops), but with no luck.

Plus I don't half the grades of material used in its construction. It's got a Benchmark frame with trigger, a Unknown Velocity Knob. a Shocktech foregrip, air fittings.

But hearing nothing but good things come out of Gruntball I decided to go with them to finish the project (which IMO half the work for prep to anno, finding someone trustworthy.) I'm going to end up sending them my work from now on sometime after the holiday's

[Pneumagger]

After seeing this thread kind made wonder about sending My Bro's mag (FireFighter Mag) away to get Anno'd. So I searched locally for a small time/side project shop (i.e. powder coater's, auto shops), but with no luck.

Plus I don't half the grades of material used in its construction. It's got a Benchmark frame with trigger, a Unknown Velocity Knob. a Shocktech foregrip, air fittings.

But hearing nothing but good things come out of Gruntball I decided to go with them to finish the project (which IMO half the work for prep to anno, finding someone trustworthy.) I'm going to end up sending them my work from now on sometime after the holiday's

Gruntbull - all the way. Best pricing out there. Sweet turnaround times. Honest and always easy to get ahold of quickly.

[thefool]

After seeing this thread kind made wonder about sending My Bro's mag (FireFighter Mag) away to get Anno'd. So I searched locally for a small time/side project shop (i.e. powder coater's, auto shops), but with no luck.

Plus I don't half the grades of material used in its construction. It's got a Benchmark frame with trigger, a Unknown Velocity Knob. a Shocktech foregrip, air fittings.

But hearing nothing but good things come out of Gruntball I decided to go with them to finish the project (which IMO half the work for prep to anno, finding someone trustworthy.) I'm going to end up sending them my work from now on sometime after the holiday's
you should worry about sending your stuff away for anno. most anno places that you know of generally produce good work. Defects are bound to happen to any anodizer and its how a place deals with those defects that dictates the quality of the place.

From what i've seen gruntbull and acid have very good quality and customer service. I wouldnt hesitate to use eitehr of them.

I also do a little anno on the side, you can pm or email any annodizer for a quote.