Customer cut lose by a company and dont know what do do - help!!!

[StygShore]

OK..

short story

I had work done by a paintball company, I am not happy with the work they did, i informed them of this and bruised their egos. I offerred to pay for the work that needed to be redone to make me happy. They state they put too many hours into the work already and are refusing to do any work for me as a customer.

So,I am out $400.00+ dollars and have a product I am not happy with - Do I have any recourse of action to get things made right? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks


Styg

[Lohman446]

Depends, how specific was the work discussed? I mean, was quality, tolerences, exact work etc. discussed? Sadly, probably not - though you could file a credit card dispute.

[kosmo]

Bbb

[Warwitch]

Bbb


Slow. Your credit card company will act quicker. Was the work you received of less quality than what you had seen from them before? And Im not saying you should flame them but if this is how a pb company responds to problems Im sure we would like to know who they are. Most of us are too poor to go getting things redone :(

[Lohman446]

Just for the record, the BBB in most states has very near zero authority and a good share of businesses scoff at it. It only achieves results by encouraging negotiation and communication.

[StygShore]

About 2 minutes of research will probably clue you in on who I am talking about but not going to mention names right now until I get some things resolved.

I paid via Paypal in multilple payments over the last 5-6 months, last payment probably 2-3 months ago, so it has been too long to file a claim with them. However, the Paypal account is secured by my debit card to my bank account, so would I be able to fight the payments at all in that manner?

Some quality issues were discussed, and understood, but some of the work that was done is not an exact science ( some refer to it as an art form ) The quality of work that was delivered I dont belive was on par wiht some of their other work, or the work of others that perform the same service in the industry.

The problem I have, is some of the work - that I had no problem with and was willing to pay to have done again is relatively proprietary, so even taking money out of my pocket, I can not get the situation corrected, because they are refusing to do anything for me as a customer.

Apparently I have become the type of customer they don't like to deal with because I didnt like the results and I am too demanding.


Styg

[Warwitch]

It shouldnt suck to have high standards.

[Lohman446]

If a company realizes it cannot meet a customers standards, it is not a bad idea for the company to turn down further work. However, that leaves the problem of past work.

[ZapTheMad]

It shouldnt suck to have high standards.

QFT!!!

I'm a perfectionist in a hack job world. It really does suck! People just don't care anymore. They do things for money as quick as possible. Nobody does it for the love anymore. Capitolism at its best!

[StygShore]

If a company realizes it cannot meet a customers standards, it is not a bad idea for the company to turn down further work. However, that leaves the problem of past work.


Exactly... and the fact I was willing to PAY for the work to be done again


Styg

[Warwitch]

QFT!!!

I'm a perfectionist in a hack job world. It really does suck! People just don't care anymore. They do things for money as quick as possible. Nobody does it for the love anymore. Capitolism at its best!


Exactly. I dont mind paying for a top notch job. But thats what I expect. There are a lot of cut rate companies charging the same as those of much better quality. Ano has got to be one of the worst areas too. Most really good ano shops need ungodly time for turnaround and many are too impatient to wait for their gear :rolleyes: so they go to whoever can get it done quickest.

[brokenleg]

Exactly... and the fact I was willing to PAY for the work to be done again


Styg

the design:
http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/oddpb/finalishnetsize.jpg

done:
http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/oddpb/bone1.jpg
http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/oddpb/bone3.jpg

[StygShore]

Problem is - that was attempt one of the gun, before the anodize or sealer failed and Jay had to send it back to be redone

attempt 2, the body does not look as good as those original pictures - this picture quality has been shrunk, will have a more detailed picture later.

http://home.comcast.net/~stygshore/Bone2.JPG

[brokenleg]

Problem is - that was attempt one of the gun, before the anodize or sealer failed and Jay had to send it back to be redone

attempt 2, the body does not look as good as those original pictures - this picture quality has been shrunk, will have a more detailed picture later.

http://home.comcast.net/~stygshore/Bone2.JPG
still looks pretty hot, man. free up for a hot gun.

[StygShore]

The laser and the grips look good I'll admit that

Just don't know why you wont redo my laser for me


Styg

[Ole Unka Phil]

....However, the Paypal account is secured by my debit card to my bank account, so would I be able to fight the payments at all in that manner....

No... a Debit card is not a Credit card in that way. It may look like one and act like one but that is the place that it stops. It has no further backing of any kind. No buyers insurance. Always use a real Credit Card to get that service. And then be sure it covers any sorts of internet purchases. Some do not.

[StygShore]

Have to ask him - he does incredible laser work, I just wasn't happy with the anodizing.



Styg

[StygShore]

You were happy with the laser work. So there were no complaints with it, and he wont do it for you again if you paid for it?

Heck at this point he has had practice doing it twice, he can probably just about do it with his eyes shut :rolleyes:


Styg

[ahellers]

http://home.comcast.net/~stygshore/Bone2.JPG

the letters between the breach and the body not lining up right would bug the crap out of me. :(
t

[StygShore]

yes, they work together for the ODDpb.com creations - The Plaid Ego, Taxi Driver Ego, Punisher Borg, Full Metal Matrix, etc


Styg

[Lohman446]

So, it sounds like the issue is with the ano, not the lasering.

You are going to have the ano done by someone else? but want ODD to laser it again?! And he wont? Even if you pay him?

Thats odd(no pun inteded). Why wouldnt ODD do the laser again if you are willing to pay him?

It may seem odd but its common to decide some customers are not worth it. If for whatever reason I continually cannot meet a customer's expection (a particular customer, not the base as a whole) it is better for me to not have him as a customer than to have him as an upset customer. That being said, there are issues here that need dealt with and its not ok for them to just turn you away without some consideration - be it in redoing of the work to the $400 value expected, or refunding all or part..

[PrecisionPB]

Nevermind that the finish is durable, and overall the marker looks great - and that the pictures simply do not do the piece justice.

My unwillingness to redo this project stems from your conduct. The way you have spoken to and about me is simply unacceptable. I'll leave it at that.

[StygShore]

Useful posts can be increased by 1


It may seem odd but its common to decide some customers are not worth it. If for whatever reason I continually cannot meet a customer's expection (a particular customer, not the base as a whole) it is better for me to not have him as a customer than to have him as an upset customer. That being said, there are issues here that need dealt with and its not ok for them to just turn you away without some consideration - be it in redoing of the work to the $400 value expected, or refunding all or part..

[Lohman446]

Nevermind that the finish is durable, and overall the marker looks great - and that the pictures simply do not do the piece justice.

My unwillingness to redo this project stems from your conduct. The way you have spoken to and about me is simply unacceptable. I'm not going to do business with a person that can't conduct himself like the grown man that he is. Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

See, the dangers of such a customer. They bait you into making comments about them on a public forum that just make you look unproffessional :D

Told you there is a good reason to simply say no

/Thanks for the illustration

[PrecisionPB]

See, the dangers of such a customer. They bait you into making comments about them on a public forum that just make you look unproffessional :D

Told you there is a good reason to simply say no

/Thanks for the illustration

Would you like some more illustration? Like some cut and pasted emails? Assuming the swear filter catches it all, I think its suitable for posting.

[etjoyride]

Not a good call on his part all.

[StygShore]

Actually the piece looks better in pictures than it does in person.

Patience only lasts so long, and i had legitimate issues in the email sent to ODD. and I believe the statement has been made that I was simply not happy with your work. If you would like to discuss the email sent to ODD, that would be best taken care of privately as opposed to over the forums.

And I'm pretty sure I kept that email pretty darned clean, however, I was rather angry/upset at the time.


Styg




Nevermind that the finish is durable, and overall the marker looks great - and that the pictures simply do not do the piece justice.

My unwillingness to redo this project stems from your conduct. The way you have spoken to and about me is simply unacceptable. I'm not going to do business with a person that can't conduct himself like the grown man that he is. Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

[Lohman446]

Would you like some more illustration? Like some cut and pasted emails? Assuming the swear filter catches it all, I think its suitable for posting.

I don't doubt customers get verbally abusive. I once had a customer in front of me so abusive that the detective who happened to be there offered to arrest her. That being said you can never win a public "trashing" contest with a customer, frankly because they have nothing to lose and you have, well other customers to lose.

Sometimes a customer becomes so much of a problem in the past that you simply say no to future projects - its a great idea and sometimes needs to be done. Its actually pretty commendable, cause in theory it prevents you from having this exact problem you are having. Somehow it seems to me though your losing both ways right this moment. You don't have this customer in the future, and there publically criticizing you. Add to it your own problem, that taking part in it, well there are very few people who can do so and come out looking at all professional

/hint - its not looking like you are
//engaging a third party, never a good idea

[Pacifist_Farmer]

Every manufacturer, tradesmen, or shop of any sort should have every right to deny a person services based on the customers requirements and the monetary benefits of doing sed work.

While I'm sure the gun isn't up to Styg's standards, perhaps what he got was $400 worth of work, and that is that. That is an awful lot of laser engraving on some odd surfaces.

I'm going to side with the guys at ODD due to the fact that they shouldn't be taking work which they don't make money off, or get customer headaches from.

On the flip side, I'm sorry the gun isn't what you hopped it would be Styg, I think it looks really good.

[behemoth]

Every manufacturer, tradesmen, or shop of any sort should have every right to deny a person services based on the customers requirements and the monetary benefits of doing sed work.

While I'm sure the gun isn't up to Styg's standards, perhaps what he got was $400 worth of work, and that is that. That is an awful lot of laser engraving on some odd surfaces.

I'm going to side with the guys at ODD due to the fact that they shouldn't be taking work which they don't make money off, or get customer headaches from.

On the flip side, I'm sorry the gun isn't what you hopped it would be Styg, I think it looks really good.

No, you dont get it.

The marker was anno'd by Precision PB, who botched the job, had it lasered by ODD anyways.

Upon receiving the marker, the lasering was AMAZING, but the anno... not so much.it was sent back to ODD/PPB.

It was done a second time, anno still failed, laser still maintained awesomeness.

Now, after all these headaches, Styg is STILL left with a beautiful laser job on an ugly anno.

He's willing to PAY to have the job done again, but right. They said no. Then he said "Well, i'll get the anno elsewhere, but i still need the laser" and ODD refused.

ODD/PPB = buttbuddies.

[Kyle.Kimber]

About 2 minutes of research will probably clue you in on who I am talking about but not going to mention names right now until I get some things resolved.

I paid via Paypal in multilple payments over the last 5-6 months, last payment probably 2-3 months ago, so it has been too long to file a claim with them. However, the Paypal account is secured by my debit card to my bank account, so would I be able to fight the payments at all in that manner?

Some quality issues were discussed, and understood, but some of the work that was done is not an exact science ( some refer to it as an art form ) The quality of work that was delivered I dont belive was on par wiht some of their other work, or the work of others that perform the same service in the industry.

The problem I have, is some of the work - that I had no problem with and was willing to pay to have done again is relatively proprietary, so even taking money out of my pocket, I can not get the situation corrected, because they are refusing to do anything for me as a customer.

Apparently I have become the type of customer they don't like to deal with because I didnt like the results and I am too demanding.


Styg

Dude, tell me I don't wanna get screwed over. You don't owe them any favors just tell us who you went through... PLEASE...

Oh yeah, smaill claims court is probably a last resort... It takes way to long... Its not at all like that episode of DIFFERENT STROKES. You know the one with the model train and the ***hole hobbyshop owner.

[bentothejam1n]

Dude, tell me I don't wanna get screwed over. You don't owe them any favors just tell us who you went through... PLEASE...
ODD/PBB

[Steelrat]

Nevermind that the finish is durable, and overall the marker looks great - and that the pictures simply do not do the piece justice.




I suspect that durable finish and "overall" looks were not what the customer was looking for. If you sent a substandard anno to get lasered, then shame on you. And doing it again is even more unacceptable. If your company messed up the anno on my marker twice, chances are that I would get a bit heated up.

[bornl33t]

My unwillingness to redo this project stems from your conduct. The way you have spoken to and about me is simply unacceptable. I'll leave it at that.

Sounds good to me. I don't tollerate that either.


If you're willing to PAY to have it redone, why not go to a different place and see if they can't screw it up a couple times too? Sounds kinda obvious to me but maybe there's something I'm missing?

[StygShore]

I have NEVER spoken to Rick rudely or unprofessionally. Apparently I hurt his feelings in being honest about how I felt about his work to his business partner?

My "mouth" that Rick refers to is a HUGE exageration! The email contains 2 swear words, neither directed AT him or his work.

As far as going somewhere else, I do have another place that is willing to do the anodize and have even found someone that can do the laser work.

Bottom line, I'm stuck with a gun I paid for and I am not happy with. I have decided to not spend more money on this project nor promote the work of PPB/ODD anymore. My mistake as a customer was paying for all the work before I saw the finished product. If anything, the gun will be stripped back to a matte black finish and I'll be done with it.


Styg


And nice editing the original post to clean up your attitude.



Sounds good to me. I don't tollerate that either.


If you're willing to PAY to have it redone, why not go to a different place and see if they can't screw it up a couple times too? Sounds kinda obvious to me but maybe there's something I'm missing?

"My unwillingness to redo this project stems from your conduct. The way you have spoken to and about me is simply unacceptable. I'm not going to do business with a person that can't conduct himself like the grown man that he is. Do you kiss your mother with that mouth? " - RICK

[acecl22]

PBB, you're making yourself look like a genuine first-class jack***. the first rule of any business is that the customer is always right. the business that you run is a service to your customers, and if you can't provide satisfaction to the customer's needs, then you aren't going anywhere in the world of business.

some more advice. as someone previously mentioned, engaging in this argument in a public forum was probably the most stupid act possible, congratulations. not only are you losing business from countless paintballers, you are also losing respect as an artist/business man/person. you have the means to satisfy your customer, and the customer is willing to pay extra in order to be satisfied, just because he demands a certain level of professionalism does not give you any reason to refuse his service.

the more satisfied customers you have, the more the word gets spread that you run good business, once you start to deny customers, a worse word is spread about you, incompetence. i'll leave it at that.

[Kyle.Kimber]

ODD/PBB

Thanks

[punkncat]

I have to agree with Lohman on this one.

This guy does custom work. With two attempts he was unable to get exactly what Styg wanted. Styg voiced his opinion in such a way that offended Precision which resulted in the shops decision to bow out of further pursuit of the job. A good idea considering that its hard to do good work for someone you are pissed at.

Custom work is difficult because you have to take the vision of a person who has no (or little) experiance in what they are trying to have done....if they did they would do it themselves, right? ....and expect the final product to be exactly what they invisioned regardless of the rigors of the process.

I personally think the marker is exceptional. There are MINOR imperfections that are the result of the HUMAN factor. There certainly is not another marker like it anywhere. It is a one off custom and a piece you should be proud of Styg.

[Nick E]

Deffinitely. It isn't worth the shops time, and honestly styg, I don't think you needed to bring it out on a public forum, but you as well PBB, you shouldn't have made stupid comments like that. That was probably fairly bad for odd/pbb's buisness, weather they deserve it or not. I really like the marker, and really don't see what your problem is. It's really a special peice and if you wanted it beter you may as well just do it yourself. however, you can of course just sell it to me for $200 if you feel it's sucked up enough of your money :D

[93civiccpe]

Deffinitely. It isn't worth the shops time, and honestly styg, I don't think you needed to bring it out on a public forum, but you as well PBB, you shouldn't have made stupid comments like that. That was probably fairly bad for odd/pbb's buisness, weather they deserve it or not. I really like the marker, and really don't see what your problem is. It's really a special peice and if you wanted it beter you may as well just do it yourself. however, you can of course just sell it to me for $200 if you feel it's sucked up enough of your money :D

Wow.. So many ignorant comments in this post. He gave a specific request, they said they could do it. He paid for it. The laser was great but the anno came out looking crappy. He has offered to pay for them to redo it, or just the laser work. It's not his fault they keep screwing up the anno.

And yes, I'm sure he's going to sell you an x-mag for $200. We've all been waiting for the "ignorant 2006'er post". Thanks for filling the quota.

[Lohman446]

Wow.. So many ignorant comments in this post. He gave a specific request, they said they could do it. He paid for it. The laser was great but the anno came out looking crappy. He has offered to pay for them to redo it, or just the laser work. It's not his fault they keep screwing up the anno.

And yes, I'm sure he's going to sell you an x-mag for $200. We've all been waiting for the "ignorant 2006'er post". Thanks for filling the quota.


Speaking of ignoranat. I think that big :D indicates at least that part of it is a joke.

There position has to be this - if he is a paying customer they want nothing more to do wtih him, cannot make him happy. I still think there is an issue on the work already done not being satisfactory, but that is another issue from saying no more work in the future.