ATTN: all pneumag/electro pneumag builders

[surfbum]

hey guys

im nearing the end of my electro-pneumatic mag project, ive been testing it out and i seem to have one problem, everything works great except im getting a double fire almost everytime i pull the trigger. there is nothing wrong with my x-valve, it worked great when it was mech

do you guys have any ideas of what would be causeing this?

thanks

ill post a thread/pics when its all done

[havocx]

what type of electro is it based off of? Did you change the noid from the one the board is use to? Sounds like your board could be putting out a "pulse" and your noid is reading that as two different activations

Its all a guess on my part

[surfbum]

sorry, probably should have told you the guts

mini-morlock board
SMC SY113A-SG-PM3 solenoid
MPA-3 ram
microrock LPR

im pretty sure the solenoid is only firing once per trigger pull

[y0da900]

How are you sure it isn't the solenoid actually firing twice. If your board debounce settings aren't set up properly, you could be shooting when the board picks up noise from the trigger switch.

[surfbum]

could it be anything else besides the board?
could it be something mechanical?

[FinchMan]

Do you have a ULT? what LPR pressure are you using?

If you're getting a double bounce I think it might be sweet-spotting the RT effect. You might want to try increasing the LPR pressure, increase the trigger debounce, and/or decrease the dwell.

[surfbum]

yeah i have a ULT
lpr pressure is pretty high, i think around 80 psi

unfortunately, my mini morlock did not come with the predator software and it doesnt have a debounce setting

[stonersr26]

Your lpr pressure shouldn't be that high, at that psi it can cause mechanical bounce. I'm pretty sure that the old morlock does have debounce settings, it has been a while since I looked at the manual but I'm almost positive it has it. Also look to be sure that your MPA-3 and ram assembly isn't too close to the sear or it can cause double firing. Hope that helps.

[Zneaky]

Simple test to see whats up...

Remove your mpa-3, air up, hit the trigger. If the mpa-3 fires twice when not in the gun, you have a noid/board problem. If it only fires once, you have a mechanic/RT problem.

You will need to hold your finger over the mpa-3 when it fires, to simulate the resistance of the sear.

Z

[FinchMan]

You will need to hold your finger over the mpa-3 when it fires, to simulate the resistance of the sear.

Z

and to be able to tell if it double-fires. You wouldn't be able to tell by just watching it shoot.

[the electrician]

switch bounce. use an 80 gram switch, minimum.

[Pneumagger]

To test if it is the mechanics (and not electronics) try hitting the solenoid manual test button. If it double fires... this means the problem is mechanical. If it works as intended then the problem lies in the trigger switch/debounce sensing, the board output signal, or the solenoid electonics.

Let us know if the problem is electrical or mechanical... then we'll take it from there ;)

[Joni]

I had the same problem with my mini-morlocked mag (although direct-acting hyperframe noid, not a valve noid), and the problem was mechanical trigger bounce. The debounce setting (which the mini-morlock has, I have the same as you) had to be set really high to resolve this. My solution was to add a better return spring to the trigger, and later two repelling magnets as trigger return.

I'm not sure your problem has the same cause, but if setting the debounce at a high setting helps, its likely.

[Pneumagger]

I had the same problem with my mini-morlocked mag (although direct-acting hyperframe noid, not a valve noid), and the problem was mechanical trigger bounce. The debounce setting (which the mini-morlock has, I have the same as you) had to be set really high to resolve this. My solution was to add a better return spring to the trigger, and later two repelling magnets as trigger return.

I'm not sure your problem has the same cause, but if setting the debounce at a high setting helps, its likely.

were you using a trigger switch with a lever, or a trigger switch being directly pushed?

[surfbum]

To test if it is the mechanics (and not electronics) try hitting the solenoid manual test button. If it double fires... this means the problem is mechanical. If it works as intended then the problem lies in the trigger switch/debounce sensing, the board output signal, or the solenoid electonics.

Let us know if the problem is electrical or mechanical... then we'll take it from there ;)


awesome tip pneumagger

the problem seems to be electronic
i have an 80 g swith (without a lever) and it seems like im getting some trigger bounce

i really dont think my board has a debounce setting, im looking at the manual and i dont see it listed as a register, can someone tell me what register it is?

[wjr]

Are you the guy that's using a gutted hyperframe? If so, where'd you get it from?

[Joni]

Here's the mini-morlock manual:
Morlock-manual (http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~paananen/morlock_manual.doc)

[surfbum]

Are you the guy that's using a gutted hyperframe? If so, where'd you get it from?

yeah i am using a gutted hyperframe

i got it directly from centerflag, i shot them an email asking for a frame with nothing in it and they sold it too me for pretty cheap,

Joni, you are my hero, ive been looking at the regular morlock manual on the manufactuer's website which didnt have a debounce register hopefully this will work

[surfbum]

IT'S ALIVE!! :shooting:

thanks to joni for giving me the mini-morlock manual instead of the regular morlock manual which was on the website, i upped the debounce setting on the board and it now shoots like a dream

thanks to all who offered suggestions, once i get everything perfected ill post a thread

[Joni]

Glad I could help :)

Good luck with it

[BigEvil]

There is a way to keep the debounce low on SEMI and still not get bounce.

(MAGNETS)

On and ramp it is a good idea to set the debounce to at least 10 so it doesnt run away on you anyhow.