electropnuematic

[FARMER00]

ok i have a question on how to a electro pnuematic works, is it the same as a pnuematic gun (like a pnuemag) but instead of the 3 way (like the MSV-1) it has a solenoid to controll the valve that lets the air go to the actuator to trip the sear? or how does it work.

i had an ion but it didnt work the way i thought it would, so now im in a slump and dont know

[Zneaky]

ok i have a question on how to a electro pnuematic works, is it the same as a pnuematic gun (like a pnuemag) but instead of the 3 way (like the MSV-1) it has a solenoid to controll the valve that lets the air go to the actuator to trip the sear? or how does it work.

i had an ion but it didnt work the way i thought it would, so now im in a slump and dont know


Ok same as a pnuemag, but a couple changes.

On mine, I have an MPA-3 with a QEV attached directly then a hose to a solenoid and the other end to the LPR. I have a electric trigger switch and an ion board stripped. The board is powerd by a 9 volt. The switch tells the board it has been pulled, and the board powers the solenoid to put a burst of air to the qev, the air goes through the qev to the mpa-3 and the mpa-3 hits the sear and fires the gun. Now the board only opened the solenoid for less than a second, as soon as the solenoid began to vent, the qev (mechanicly) saw the drop in pressure and vented as well, ready for the next shot. All this can happen, as fast as, 17 times in once second.

I hope that makes sense to you.

To answer your question, a solenoid and an electric switch take the place of the msv- (1 or 2).

Z

[FARMER00]

Ok same as a pnuemag, but a couple changes.

On mine, I have an MPA-3 with a QEV attached directly then a hose to a solenoid and the other end to the LPR. I have a electric trigger switch and an ion board stripped. The board is powerd by a 9 volt. The switch tells the board it has been pulled, and the board powers the solenoid to put a burst of air to the qev, the air goes through the qev to the mpa-3 and the mpa-3 hits the sear and fires the gun. Now the board only opened the solenoid for less than a second, as soon as the solenoid began to vent, the qev (mechanicly) saw the drop in pressure and vented as well, ready for the next shot. All this can happen, as fast as, 17 times in once second.

I hope that makes sense to you.

To answer your question, a solenoid and an electric switch take the place of the msv- (1 or 2).

Z
ok thats what i thought, what if i used no board? and connected the switch driect to the solenoid? that your mean as long as the switch was open the solenoid would be letting air through? would it work well without a board?

[Pneumagger]

ok thats what i thought, what if i used no board? and connected the switch driect to the solenoid? that your mean as long as the switch was open the solenoid would be letting air through? would it work well without a board?

You are correct. But why do that? A mech Pneumag has a 50g-100g mid length pull weight at the lightest. IT IS ELECRTO LIGHT.

The whole reason for going electro is for the modes and eyes. Other than that, it's way more expensive than a mech pneumag with more to potentially go wrong.

[p8ntbal4me]

ok thats what i thought, what if i used no board? and connected the switch driect to the solenoid? that your mean as long as the switch was open the solenoid would be letting air through? would it work well without a board?


You COULD do this, but like Pneumagger said, "Why?"

So let me answer you question with a yes you can and how you can as well.

You need to realise you are using a battery that carries 9VDC on it. That will not be going into a board that can regulate the voltage to something more common like 5-6VDC which is what 90% of the EP noids out there use today to work without eating all your power and still keeping a high cycle time.

I see what your saying to keep it low budget if thats what your going for.

But look at it from what (besides all the modes of fire) the board will give you.

1) Power,Dwell, or voltage modification (depending on the board and your setup)
2) Built in voltage regulator
3) We know the board works with AT LEAST 1 EP noid for the gun it was made to run.
4) Power, trigger switch, LEDs, etc. can all be added or deleted simply by pulling pigtails from the header of the harness (if it uses a harness)

I went with a 2mm 12 pin connector on my boards because is popular, small, it works, and people are going to mess with the board at some point,... why not make it easy for them in the future?

Wash away TAG/Predator, Virtute, Taedo, etc... anyone that uses "tourney hype" to sell a $35 board for $150 just because "XYZ" so so player can ramp with it,....
Look at APE, Scenario Dreams,... their boards do the exact same thing, written in different languages,... but they all cycle the gun.

I dont care what code is on my board. You want different code, void the warrenty and install it yourself. Its your board.

You can find boards for dirt cheap and they will do more for you than you would need anyways. All the parts on a controller board now adays is a nice way to prevent other problems with your design from popping up.

[Zneaky]

Now you are hearing from the experts. Guys thanks for the breakthroughs you have made in this area.

I chose the ion board, because it has ramping, dwell, and few modes. I picked them up for $18-$30 depending on who I bought it from. This price was important, because, in total, I bought 5 ion boards and I have only one working gun. (I have improved greatly in my soldering skills :D ). I mainly choose this board because Scott H was using it, and I had no clue about any other choices.

I agree if you decide with no board, then go MSV-2 and get as much out of that lever as possible. It is the same, and you don't have to fit the largest object in the frame: THE BATTERY. Nor will you ever have to change it. (batteries go dead)

Z

[p8ntbal4me]

Now you are hearing from the experts. Guys thanks for the breakthroughs you have made in this area.

I chose the ion board, because it has ramping, dwell, and few modes. I picked them up for $18-$30 depending on who I bought it from. This price was important, because, in total, I bought 5 ion boards and I have only one working gun. (I have improved greatly in my soldering skills :D ). I mainly choose this board because Scott H was using it, and I had no clue about any other choices.

I agree if you decide with no board, then go MSV-2 and get as much out of that lever as possible. It is the same, and you don't have to fit the largest object in the frame: THE BATTERY. Nor will you ever have to change it. (batteries go dead)

Z


He he,...

Best not to put my name in the same catagory as "Pneumagger" or the word expert.

I have a factor of zero for an IQ so it might bring theirs down quite a bit when Im included!! :)

I received alot of my knowledge from BE, Pneu, The E~, Coolhand, etc. They talked, the did, I paid attention.

Im still in school,... they are the 32 year olds standing around the keg at the High School party with the football jackets on from Class of 1995 :p

Im working on my jacket. ;)

[FARMER00]

i was just trying to learn and see how everything works

if i do anything im just going to try and make my own rocking trigger, but with no board or anything, i need another grip first though (which i think im gettinf from a friend

[Zneaky]

I actually graduated in then.

HAHA

Z

[p8ntbal4me]

i was just trying to learn and see how everything works

if i do anything im just going to try and make my own rocking trigger, but with no board or anything, i need another grip first though (which i think im gettinf from a friend

More than half my results from my boards, rams, etc were done and found by buying parts that I had absolutely NO idea would work.

I will say that it has been expensive, and rather heartbreaking to have a bunch of pooly drilled MPA3s, missing springs, 4 un-usable solenoids, etc.

Good news is that I have made progress and its starting to come together.

"You gotta spend money to make money" is a term I rather focused this project on.

Was I willing to commit my hard days work funding to put into this project and will it pay off?

I did my homework, I made the choice, now I need to finish it.

[Zneaky]

More than half my results from my boards, rams, etc were done and found by buying parts that I had absolutely NO idea would work.

I will say that it has been expensive, and rather heartbreaking to have a bunch of pooly drilled MPA3s, missing springs, 4 un-usable solenoids, etc.

Good news is that I have made progress and its starting to come together.

"You gotta spend money to make money" is a term I rather focused this project on.

Was I willing to commit my hard days work funding to put into this project and will it pay off?

I did my homework, I made the choice, now I need to finish it.

I don't know if you have seen the eyes that come with an Ion board, but my next idea is to remove them from the eyesboard and put them in my ULE. Lots-o-research ahead!!! I'm gonna look at how others have done this with different kinds of eyes and how it is done on other types of guns.

Z

[Ydna]

Jsut one quick note....you could in theory hook up a trigger switch to activate the solenoid directly, but the problem with that is it would only work for a short time. The more the solenoid is energized, the less its lifespan will be. If you hooked a solenoid up to a voltage supply for 5 seconds it'd burn itself out (or it would be severely weakened)

That's why a board is strongly suggested. (lol)

[p8ntbal4me]

I don't know if you have seen the eyes that come with an Ion board, but my next idea is to remove them from the eyesboard and put them in my ULE. Lots-o-research ahead!!! I'm gonna look at how others have done this with different kinds of eyes and how it is done on other types of guns.

Z


I actually found a sensor that can be used to drop in and replace the ACE and board all together.

Funny thing is, it came from a cocker! (imagine that!)

My board will not support the ACE right off, you will need a harness and MAYBE 1 other item to run it.

But in the long run, the main board will sport soooo many features and special cases between the E-Mag,X-Mag, hyper frame, boo-yaah, etc that the price will never out weigh the user friendliness of the board.

My board does support eyes,.. I will say that! But I wanted to do the first suported eye systems for twist lock bodies as well as a replacement for the ACE in the X-Mag.

Just 2 goals of mine.

[magpump]

Jsut one quick note....you could in theory hook up a trigger switch to activate the solenoid directly, but the problem with that is it would only work for a short time. The more the solenoid is energized, the less its lifespan will be. If you hooked a solenoid up to a voltage supply for 5 seconds it'd burn itself out.

That's why a board is strongly suggested. (lol)

actually you can run the battery to something ( i forgot the name :)) that will put out a certaion voltage depending on whats needed. and actually 25g is the stock ion board which is VERY easy to pull. it makes a pneumag look like a regular mag and the ion board look like a pneumag... lol. anyways...

[Ydna]

You're thinking of a voltage regulator. That would work, and would make it so the solenoid was "less" damaged, but it's still not good to engage the solenoid for more than, say 1/4 of a second at a time. PB guns only activate it for 10-20 miliseconds which is plenty to get well over a million cycles, but if you activated it over and over for longer than that you'd run into problems.

Basically the solenoid coil is just that..a thin wire wrapped around and around the solenoid magnet. When the solenoid is energized it's essentially the same as taking a long wire and touching both ends to a 9v battery. The longer you do that, the more hot the wire gets, and eventually it'd melt.
That's not exactly what happens with a pneumatic solenoid, but it's close...lol