Double Ball Detent Benefits

[D3ath ADder]

Hi guys,
I have bought a Automag Custom RT ULE, it has some other features on it but I am curious about only one thing.

Some other people at my local site have bought mags but they have double ball detents, one each side of the main body. My mag only has one bll detent on the right hand side of the main body (looking down the marker). I was just wondering what the benefits of having twin detents are the only thing I can think of is that if the ball detent puts a small amount of spin on the paintball as it exits the marker then double detents would excert friction on both sides of the paintball instead of only the one side, reducing spin and therefore increasing accuracy.

Am I right or is there more to it? or are there just no benefits?.

Oh and if there are advantages of having twin detents, next question is where can I get my main body adapted? :D

Thanks!

[mostpeople]

www.lukescustoms.com He will drill and tap a body for a 2nd detent.


AFAIK, detents are designed to hold the ball in place when it enters the body from the feedneck. That way it holds it in the proper place to be fired.

[D3ath ADder]

Thanks for the info mostpeople, I know the ball detent is for holding the ball in place I was just wondering why having one each side would be more beneficial than just having a single detent. I've never had a paintball come out of the end of the barrel so the only advantage of having two I would assume is that they would both apply friction to both sides of the paintball as the marker is fired and this may reduce spin slightly.


I should mention I live in the UK but I suppose sending it to the US is an option. I'll drop that guy a mail and see what prices he can offer me.

[Lenny]

I had mine modified because my Halo kept forcing the balls past the detent. With two of them, I don't seem to have a problem with that anymore.

[yaaaowHuggs]

some force feed hoppers feed hard enough to force the ball past a single detent, 2 stops that from happening

[D3ath ADder]

Rogue, I am planning on buying alot of Redz gear to fit onto my mag so I'll be getting another clamping feedneck anyway. As for the second detent fitting the Lukes customs link contact has already got back to me with prices!. I will need to buy a detent and have it shipped to his workshop for it to be fitted as he only taps the second hole I will need to provide the detent and he has agreed to fit it if I get one to him.

As AGD spares are not readily available in the UK it would be cheaper to mail the body to him, have the hole tapped for $15, buy a detent from the US to go to his workshop to be fitted then arrange for it to be shipped back to myself then I can fit my Redz clamping feedneck.

Its alot of effort for another detent, which is why I wanted to know the benefits :p

[D3ath ADder]

My local paintball site is owned by the guy who runs fatbobs and that's who I bought the mag off, it's the Euromag on his site. I will have to ask him if he can get me a special order in but with the detent or dual detent body on the website I was going to look at my options as I await a response from him.

I figured it would be cheaper to get a new hole tapped on the body I wish to keep but as you rightly said the cost would be alot more with shipping and extras added on may as well get a new one.

Also I needed to know if all the cost and effort is worth it :D

[mostpeople]

Yes but rogue, how soon will they be back in stock??

Heheh sorry I had to ask!! I know you're gunna kill me if I keep askin :ninja:

Anyways you can count on me buying one when they come back in! :D

[D3ath ADder]

What sort of body is the priarah anyway? is it like the ULE? sorry I'm pretty clueless. :(

[mostpeople]

The RPG bodies are literally milled AGD ULE bodies. The Pariah is shortened to fit an AM/MM rail, or the dallara rail. And the Exile is shortened, with a small lip at the bottom to be flush with the RT length rails. Toss in a 2nd detent, and a Sub Zero Clamping feedneck and thats that.

Take a look here:

www.tunamart.com
www.themagsmith.com

they are the dealers for RPG (Roge Paintball Gear, i.e. RogueFactor here)

[Russ]

Adding a detent (for a total of 2) will have no effect whatsoever on "spin" imparted on the paintballs.

That said, if you're NOT having double feeding issues, why go through the bother (and cost) of having another detent installed? There certainly must be more important things to spend your money on! Seems like you're looking for a solution to a non-existant problem?!

I have been using a single-detent ULE body along with a HALO ever sine they both first came out. I've never had double feed issues. YMMV :cool:

[ThePixelGuru]

Double detents are mostly to keep balls from double feeding or rolling down the barrel. I really doubt it makes the ball spin - theoretically two position the ball more evenly than one so that when the bolt and air hit it the ball's more centered. Again, I doubt it matters much with proper paint-barrel match.

Basically, if balls don't double feed or fall out of your barrel, I wouldn't bother.

[D3ath ADder]

I only have a weak hopper (Ricochet 2K) at the moment but I'm fitting an Egg 3 soon. I will test it for feed issues which up to now have not been a problem.

So if there are no other benefits then there is no point in me getting a double feed body. I will have to look at my marker more and see if I can fit any different body milling styles. I want to get my mag maxxed out with 'ups' I have the redz pepperstickz barrel kit and the accuracy and reliability of my mag is outstanding, definately a marker to keep. I also want to give it a custom feel and the mag smith website has a few interesting designs on there but it's hard to visiualise what it will look like on my marker from the webiste photos.

[D3ath ADder]

To be honest I'm not even sure what is on this mag. I know I've got a clamping feedneck and an RPG foregrip. I think I've got the ULE Intelli frame with blade trigger. Not sure what main body I've got or the bit below the main body (rail?).

Main Body
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k161/spudgun0/IMG008-1.jpg

Foregrip and clamping feedneck
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k161/spudgun0/IMG006-2.jpg

.45 grip
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k161/spudgun0/IMG004-3.jpg

Top down looking into rail bit below main body.
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k161/spudgun0/IMG003-3.jpg

The whole setup
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k161/spudgun0/IMG001-1.jpg

It's altogether a very light setup, regarding the aftermarket mag bits that I've seen on those links provided what can I buy to make it lighter or make my mag better?. I know this is not going to be easy as I'm not sure what I've got on the mag apart from blade trigger, ULE trigger pull kit and level 10 valve kit.

[D3ath ADder]

I built the Paradigm Pro to be that way.

Am I right in thinking you built this gun up? I got it through fatbobs in the UK and he got it from the mag smith.com. I'm very, very impressed with this marker and last tourney I went to it got alot of questions and attention. I don't use the warp feed because I'm not used to handling it and I've fitted an empire oops instead of the normal steel braided hose and bottom line fitting.

As I said I'm so happy with this marker anything I can do to customize it and make it perform better I am looking into doing. When I bought it I was told the trigger and level 10 valve were tuned so I don't want to mess with that although I am considering getting a double trigger for it.

[D3ath ADder]

All RPG(Rogue Paintball Gear) will ultimately come from me. I build all the markers so that I am familiar with each and every one.

Cool!, well thanks for the marker you've done an exellent job and I could'nt be happier :D


Eventually, the macroline or the fittings will blow. Hopefully it doesnt blow when your face is close. When they do blow, as many do, youll switch back. Its really just a matter of time.

Jesus!, well if and when it does happen I've got the steel braided hose still so I can fit that again. I'm going to keep my face away from that bad boy from now on :(.


As far as performance goes, not really. It has all the performance upgrades already.

Your marker does already have a double trigger(AGD Intelliblade trigger anodized gloss black). Some do upgrade their trigger to the RPG Viperblade Pro bearing trigger, or the RPG Splinter Pro bearing trigger. But remember, at the end of the day, its still a mech marker. It will only be as good as you are. Its performance is limited by your skill.

Yeah my skill is lacking so I need my marker to help me as much as possible. Sure it would be easier to go for a electro but I like the unique feel of the mech mag and as I've said before it's accuracy and performance means super-rapid fire is'nt always required to eliminate people. I have been told to get a viperblade tirgger and a trigger sear mod which makes the trigger pull heavier but reduces chuff. I am happy with how it performs now but am always looking for ways to improve it, both through mods to the marker and through using it more and improving my own skill (if you can call it that).

With your knowledge of the mag, what would you say is the best barrel to buy and use with it? I was told the redz pepperstickz set which I have now, what is your opinion on this? would you recommend another?.

[Cow123]

Two detents help keep the gun from feeding multiple paintballs at the same time(with force feed loaders). If you are not having problems you don't need another one, and if you are, a new detent would probably fix it. You probably don't need to get another detent.

[Badmovies.org]

I have another Rogue-built marker that has been the subject of my AGD Chronicles. They do contain a lot of information of what I have done and why. This is the latest, with links to older posts. Some are all tech and upgrade stuff, others are playing:

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=214981

In my case, a 2007 Powerlyte Scepter kit with 5 inserts has been working really well.

A Vyperblade or Splinter Pro trigger is a nice upgrade. I think you would be amazed what happens if you get an AGD Flatline and crank up the pressure to about 1100 psi or more. I seem to prefer 1100 psi, because I can still control the rate of fire. Past that, I have problems with still shooting a burst when I want to fire a single shot.

The Paradigm Pro comes with a ULT kit. Try tuning that. My experience so far is that six ULT shims (a Lvl 10 shim is equal to two ULT shims) is often what works and gives you a feather trigger.

Get an x-valve replacement parts kit to have on hand.

I definitely agree with putting the steel braided hose back on (with a quick disconnect). I used to run an Automag with macroline, but would replace the macroline every now and then.

Everything I have heard and read about the Paradigm Pro makes it a great deal. When people ask me about buying an AGD marker, I suggest it.

[Russ]

I think you would be amazed what happens if you get an AGD Flatline and crank up the pressure to about 1100 psi or more. I seem to prefer 1100 psi, because I can still control the rate of fire. Past that, I have problems with still shooting a burst when I want to fire a single shot.

I definitely agree with putting the steel braided hose back on (with a quick disconnect). I used to run an Automag with macroline, but would replace the macroline every now and then.



That is precisely why I recently switched my Mags over to steel braided, from macroline. I mess with input pressure, and a macroline failure is inevitable.

Also note that not all macroline is created equal. I had/have line w/a .050" wall thickness, and it's rated @ 1k PSI working pressure. Line w/a .040" thick wall is rated much lower!

[Tao]

A single detent has worked just fine for me

[Russ]

All RPG(Rogue Paintball Gear)

Eventually, the macroline or the fittings will blow. Hopefully it doesnt blow when your face is close. When they do blow, as many do, youll switch back. Its really just a matter of time.



AMEN!

Although I've never had it happen to me, but I always checked & replaced the macroline quite often. Mags like SS braided for safety & reliability.

[D3ath ADder]

Will I have a macroline problem if I have not messed with the marker pressure? I know you have to up the pressure to get better performance but at the moment the marker is out of the box setup apart from the oops and macroline.

[Russ]

Will I have a macroline problem if I have not messed with the marker pressure? I know you have to up the pressure to get better performance but at the moment the marker is out of the box setup apart from the oops and macroline.

Maybe you will...maybe you won't. No one can be sure. Like I said, I've never had a macroline failure in 7 years of paintballing.

What's your input pressure to the marker?

Look at this thread (http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=214957)

[D3ath ADder]

What's your input pressure to the marker?

To be honest I'm not sure but I have not adjusted it since I took it out the box also I know my mag is not as responsive on the trigger as some of the others I've tried out which have been adjusted.

Either way, be sure I will be finding out soon and I'll also check what macroline I've got on the marker (I did not fit it myself) and I'll upgrade it to the thicker macroline.

What are my options in making the macroline more secure? I don't have plans to up the pressure yet, if I do I will probably change back to steel hose for safety now this has been brought to my attention. I have a 1.1L 3000psi crossfire bottle with a red reg standard fitting and a non adjustable empire oops on the marker.

[Russ]

Cut the ends of the macro nice & square, replace the line if it gets scuffed or otherwise leaves any doubt to it's integrity, and don't cut it too short.