In copyright infringement news

[edweird]

If Alberto Gonzales gets his way with congress, expect "attempted IP piracy" among other insane "thought crime-esque" laws added to the books.

http://news.com.com/8301-10784_3-9719339-7.html

[AirAssault]

Yeah, this coming from the guy that says its ok to torture, and LIES to members of Congress. Sure, we need to support this jack off, guy needs to be in jail.

[Lohman446]

Yeah, this coming from the guy that says its ok to torture, and LIES to members of Congress. Sure, we need to support this jack off, guy needs to be in jail.

So, your position is that all of those who commit perjury should be jailed?

[going_home]

So, your position is that all of those who commit perjury should be jailed?

HAHA I know where you're going with this one ! LOL
;)

[edweird]

off topic already... grr.



Criminalize "attempting" to infringe copyright. Federal law currently punishes not-for-profit copyright infringement with between 1 and 10 years in prison, but there has to be actual infringement that takes place. The IPPA would eliminate that requirement. (The Justice Department's summary of the legislation says: "It is a general tenet of the criminal law that those who attempt to commit a crime but do not complete it are as morally culpable as those who succeed in doing so."

1 to 10 years for screwing up burning a mixed CD for a friend, which you are NOT PROFITING FROM! Where the hell is the victim in failing to make(or for that point in actually making) a mixed tape for a friend?

/thought crime much?

If you had any doubt who helped Mr. Gonzales with his homework on this agenda...

Require Homeland Security to alert the Recording Industry Association of America. That would happen when CDs with "unauthorized fixations of the sounds, or sounds and images, of a live musical performance" are attempted to be imported. Neither the Motion Picture Association of America nor the Business Software Alliance (nor any other copyright holder, such as photographers, playwrights or news organizations, for that matter) would qualify for this kind of special treatment.

Why the RIAA you ask? well lets have a lookie at this other recent ballsy move by the RIAA’s collection body, SoundExchange:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/4/24/141326/870

RIAA has secured the right to collect royalties on all songs regardless of who controls the copyright.

//as a side note this mostly came from the digging I did cause im pissed about this other flexing that the RIAA pulled recently that affects my local used CD store... http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?alias=new-laws-create-second-ha

[rkjunior303]

So, your position is that all of those who commit perjury should be jailed?

Perjury IS a crime...

[edweird]

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/business/la-fi-radio21may21,1,1028211.story?coll=la-headlines-business-enter

more RIAA evil, seems they want to overturn a 70 year old congressional exemption of radio to pay royalties because radio by its very nature sells music for the RIAA as a byproduct

[SCpoloRicker]

Lohman, less than three hours? ;)

[Lohman446]

Lohman, less than three hours? ;)

Hmmm... I'll take the over on that one :)

[SCpoloRicker]

I meant that you pulled the Bu-bu-bu-but out a little early. But if you'll take the over, I'll leave that bait alone and take the under.

[Lohman446]

I meant that you pulled the Bu-bu-bu-but out a little early. But if you'll take the over, I'll leave that bait alone and take the under.

I only asked a question :cool: :D

My new goal is going to be pointing out the stupidity, and hypocrisy of both sides. It should be fun. And easy

[FactsOfLife]

So, your position is that all of those who commit perjury should be jailed?

he won't answer, his narrow view of the world won't let him.

especially when it'll incriminate his Savior BC.


liberal pussy!

[SCpoloRicker]

And by 5 minutes, I am teh Internets Champion!!

/suck it Lohman

[bornl33t]

There are some guys at work that have been disgussing where the goverment is currently headed. Some of them think we might be heading to an all out police state. Some of the laws that are being drafted now are unconstitutional and fullfill a desire to convict a person incase there is nothing they can hold against the person.
Anyway, some of the guys at work speculate that we may be facing another civil war in our not so distant future. I'm not putting my 2 cent on that but I would like to know what everone else thinks....

[Lohman446]

There are some guys at work that have been disgussing where the goverment is currently headed. Some of them think we might be heading to an all out police state. Some of the laws that are being drafted now are unconstitutional and fullfill a desire to convict a person incase there is nothing they can hold against the person.
Anyway, some of the guys at work speculate that we may be facing another civil war in our not so distant future. I'm not putting my 2 cent on that but I would like to know what everone else thinks....

Concrete example of said law?

[billybob_81067]

There are some guys at work that have been disgussing where the goverment is currently headed. Some of them think we might be heading to an all out police state. Some of the laws that are being drafted now are unconstitutional and fullfill a desire to convict a person incase there is nothing they can hold against the person.
Anyway, some of the guys at work speculate that we may be facing another civil war in our not so distant future. I'm not putting my 2 cent on that but I would like to know what everone else thinks....

I believe there will be a revolution in the works soon... things are starting to get ridiculous in this country. I've talked to quite a few people who agree that it's not going to be much longer before people stop taking all this crap from the government. They're trying to regulate everything under the sun. The only thing that's free anymore is air to breathe and I'm sure they're in the process of taxing it somehow. :nono:

[SCpoloRicker]

Guys, the civil war isn't until 2012. Yeesh.

/I work for Jon Titor, so I'm really getting a kick out of a lot of these replies... :)

[going_home]

Guys, the civil war isn't until 2012. Yeesh.

/I work for Jon Titor, so I'm really getting a kick out of a lot of these replies... :)

I disagree. Where its headed is a police state, but it cant go there until the citizens are disarmed. Thats the next step. The government fears an armed population. Hire Rudy Giuliani for president and he will show you how its done. Under his watch in NYC the number of concealed weapons permits dropped substantially. In other words many of those that posessed concealed weapons permits had the permits revoked.
He is one of the "R" elite-ists ( as opposed to "D" elite-ist...same thing different letter) .
Its ok for the elite to pack heat but not the "stupid" general population. If anyone could come up with a way to murder Charleton Heston and disarm the citizens its ole Rudy. :tard:

http://www.ninehundred.com/~equalccw/newsday.html

[SCpoloRicker]

I love how people suppose that a fringe group of armed militias are going to stand up to the US government.

I mean, that's how it's going to happen according to Titor, sure.

/also curious about comparisons to the insurgency in Iraq...

[Lohman446]

I have to agree with Ricker. And a question... if I have to fear the Republicans are taking my guns do I vote democrat?

The concept of citizens effectively standing up to (not harassing, but making a stand) against US troops is ridiculous. If there is any revolt it would have to come from within the military, and why do you think they are as divided as they are?

[CaptaiN_JacK]

Guys, the civil war isn't until 2012. Yeesh.

/I work for Jon Titor, so I'm really getting a kick out of a lot of these replies... :)


I thought the civil war was going to be in 2005?

[iambored]

<b>Where's Frank Zappa to save the day??!!? Quick! Send for Gene Simmons!!!!</b>

[SCpoloRicker]

I thought the civil war was going to be in 2005?

I actually went and checked. :)

Most accounts have Titor claiming that Civil War seems more and more likely beginning in late 04/early 05. Fun stuff doesn't start until '08. Some accounts have him mentioning 2012 as when the Russkies nuke everyone.

[Aggravated Assault]

<b>Where's Frank Zappa to save the day??!!?


This is the CENTRAL SCRUTINIZER...it is my responsibility to enforce all the laws that haven't been passed yet. It is also my responsibility to alert each and every one of you to the potential consequences of various ordinary everyday activities you might be performing which could eventually lead to *The Death Penalty* (or affect your parents' credit rating). Our criminal institutions are full of little creeps like you who do wrong things...and many of them were driven to these crimes by a horrible force called MUSIC!

Our studies have shown that this horrible force is so dangerous to society at large that laws are being drawn up at this very moment to stop it forever! Cruel and inhuman punishments are being carefully described in tiny paragraphs so they won't conflict with the Constitution (which, itself, is being modified in order to accommodate THE FUTURE).



If you can load or unload, go to the white zone.

You'll love it. :D

[going_home]

I have to agree with Ricker. And a question... if I have to fear the Republicans are taking my guns do I vote democrat?

The concept of citizens effectively standing up to (not harassing, but making a stand) against US troops is ridiculous. If there is any revolt it would have to come from within the military, and why do you think they are as divided as they are?

They are the same boys, they are the same. The so called elite are the same, no matter what party affiliation they have. That was one of the points. I read it again and it was plain to me anyways. Your vote will get the same results no matter which party candidate gets in.

Read what they are doing in China with the families that are breaking the family size laws.
Its the local governments that are burning houses and forcing women to have abortions.
They dont fear the peasants because they know they wont get their head blown off.

So you are dead wrong about the elite fearing an armed population.
Dead wrong. They will go house to house searching residences for firearms just like the did
in Brittain and Australia. When that is acomplished we will see the Stalinist elite in action.
Or I should say the people affected will see it. The press is part of the elite so they wont report the atrocities.

I never vote for anybody, I always vote against.
W. C. Fields

[robnix]

So you are dead wrong about the elite fearing an armed population.


They're more in fear of an INFORMED population.

[bleachit]

They're more in fear of an INFORMED population.


All Hail our savior, teh intarnets!!!!111111111


we are all going to stay informed because of it!!!


Thank You Al Gore!

[edweird]

All Hail our savior, teh intarnets!!!!111111111

we are all going to stay informed because of it!!!


It is certainly better than getting your filtered and prespun "truthiness" from the FNC and CNN.

[bornl33t]

It is certainly better than getting your filtered and prespun "truthiness" from the FNC and CNN.

or ABC, CBS/NBC, CSpan, and the list goes on....the problem is, that news is only good for the facts. There's nothing wrong with watching the news, however when you take what they feed you at face value then your no better then the guy who doesn't vote at all. And the guys who claim to be independant thinkers.... well, don't listen to them either, cause they usually aren't.

[edweird]

to be honest I watch FNC and CNN in semi equal shares, BBC from time to time, and the others you mentioned when they are covering something I deem worth setting the DVR for.

as for internet news sources and blogs, the list would be vastly longer, and without the massive bias to protect the interests of the megacorp advert VP's you see on broadcast news.

You are right that there is nothing wrong with watching the news however with less than 3% of citizens reading non-fiction books, less than 15% reading newspapers(if only for the sports section), who vastly know nothing that was not beamed to them via the TV, it is without doubt that you have to worry about what is being peddled as "truth" by the likes of Viacom(CBS/Comedy Central/WestwoodONE/MTV,VH1,CMT,BET/Paramount), News Corp(FOX/SKY/NYPost/Myspace/TV Guide), Disney(ABC/ESPN), and GE/Vivendi(NBC/Universal).

Regardless, we need to keep an eye on our rights... for there are megacorps and special interests with large pockets turning our representives against us for some part of the money grab. Or you all could just go on getting raped for your rights and getting milked like good consumer sheeple.

/wake up and communicate

[going_home]

They're more in fear of an INFORMED population.

The Chinese government certainly is afraid of that.
Well, no they arent either. They dont care how informed they are. :tard:
They still will get the population to do their will because they cant defend themselves.

[edweird]

If China did not care about their citizens being informed, they wouldnt be so concerned with bloggers or editing history.

re(bloggers): http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?alias=china-to-back-down-from-r&chanID=sa003&modsrc=reuters

re(history edit): http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/columnists/article1805832.ece


/yall really need to figure out how to stay on topic.
//RIAA is trying to rewrite copyright law and already have cleared legal way to collect royalties for media they dont even have rights to.

[Aggravated Assault]

/yall really need to figure out how to stay on topic.


Some of them can't help themselves.

All you have to do is say a magic word.

It only took 15 posts to get to armed rebellion after that.

[edweird]

agreed, silly easily lead atomitons with 20 second attention spans.

for review, this thread is about Ashcroft being hand lead by the RIAA into revising copyright law in a manner that could change the very way we communicate each other.

possession and attempted use of blank cd's or bittorrent program = 1-10 years in prison
using burned "pirated software" of windows 98 = life in prison

[Lohman446]

agreed, silly easily lead atomitons with 20 second attention spans.

for review, this thread is about Ashcroft being hand lead by the RIAA into revising copyright law in a manner that could change the very way we communicate each other.

possession and attempted use of blank cd's or bittorrent program = 1-10 years in prison
using burned "pirated software" of windows 98 = life in prison


So, at the base is there a beleif that we should not protect copyrighted material? Or that current protections are working? John Ashcroft is being led? How? You do realize he is not part of the current federal administration right?

[edweird]

So, at the base is there a beleif that we should not protect copyrighted material?
I feel it is up to the responsible party to protect their own copyright, the RIAA and occasionally the MPAA are initating sweeping changes that are going to cripple how we communicate using technology. Might I suggest that you read some of the news storys I have already posted, and put the peices together to see the scary ends that this rabbit hole leads to.

Or that current protections are working?
The current protections are in place, and available for use, to modify them to meet infringe on our rights further in the manner asked for is simply reckless and frankly is quite scary imho.

John Ashcroft is being led? How?
First of all, Oops... I typed Ashcroft, but intended to say Alberto Gonzales instead. Consider the point that the recommendation appears to have been written to specifically notify the RIAA of infractions. The RIAA is a private org, and IMHO it is clear that via this policy push they are trying to establish themselves as government org to handle all copyright infractions.

You do realize he is not part of the current federal administration right?
moot per my above mention that it was a typo.

[geekwarrior]

agreed, silly easily lead atomitons with 20 second attention spans.

for review, this thread is about Ashcroft being hand lead by the RIAA into revising copyright law in a manner that could change the very way we communicate each other.

possession and attempted use of blank cd's or bittorrent program = 1-10 years in prison
using burned "pirated software" of windows 98 = life in prison

jeez...what about those of us who use cd's and bittorrent for legal things, like storing pictures, and downloading beta programs like pr 0.6? or legally downloading music and putting it on a cd to play in your car?

:mad: @stupid politicians who are able to be bought

[bleachit]

crazy people can make all the laws in the world that they want.


there is only one tiny little problem. It's called the Supreme Court.

[Lohman446]

[B]Or that current protections are working?
The current protections are in place, and available for use, to modify them to meet infringe on our rights further in the manner asked for is simply reckless and frankly is quite scary imho.


I understand they are in place, but are they currently effective at protecting intellectual property? Not to say the new plan is without flaws, but I think it hard to find an argument that the current system does not have some serious issues in it as well, and is basically impotent when it comes to what it is supposed to do.

[Aggravated Assault]

On one certain point, as a musician, I do feel there is a problem when someone's "intellectual property", ie. songs, can be downloaded and passed around for free.

How are the current laws working? Fine a bunch of college boys for illegal downloads? That's supposed to scare the rest into paying for their music?

[bornl33t]

Truth be told, at the current rate that music costs I can be REALLY selective about what I listen to. I might be one of a few but I don't need cable TV to survive, I don't need CD's, and I don't need DVD's. I admit when something strikes me I will pay for it but there just isn't enough time in the day to justify what is being charged. The RIAA is bigger then the courts, it has been for some time. To complain about it is like whining about gas.

If you don't like it, start a revolution cause a boycott will not work.

Not what you wanted to hear, but I'm not going to work myself up over something you or I can't change.

How's that for being on topic?

[robnix]

The movie and recording industries need to take a hard look at the way they generate revenue. It's not the fifties anymore, DVD sales are bigger than theater sales now, digital music and ringtones are now more than making up for the drop off in CD sales. The opportunities for smaller artists are so much greater due to the ease of distribution and the audience provided by the internet.

The internet and other forms of technology have made piracy a more efficient and convienient enterprise. Big business needs to rework their models to take advantage of these resources in the same way that the criminals have.

[ScatterPlot]

agreed, silly easily lead atomitons with 20 second attention spans.

for review, this thread is about Ashcroft being hand lead by the RIAA into revising copyright law in a manner that could change the very way we communicate each other.

possession and attempted use of blank cd's or bittorrent program = 1-10 years in prison
using burned "pirated software" of windows 98 = life in prison


Murder = 1 year sometimes



:mad: @ family friend gets killed by poor pitiful wife in cold blood

[Lohman446]

The movie and recording industries need to take a hard look at the way they generate revenue. It's not the fifties anymore, DVD sales are bigger than theater sales now, digital music and ringtones are now more than making up for the drop off in CD sales. The opportunities for smaller artists are so much greater due to the ease of distribution and the audience provided by the internet.

The internet and other forms of technology have made piracy a more efficient and convienient enterprise. Big business needs to rework their models to take advantage of these resources in the same way that the criminals have.

The problem is copy protection. Put it on things and people complain it does not work with what they have. Use I-tunes and you basically pay for what you could get for free just to be legal (the way I do it). So the recording industry has to learn, work on the new technology, and convince people to pay for something they could get for free, just to be legal. Thats a task.

At least with tapes recording was a pain, and for many people it was easier to just buy it then to record from there friends. The problem now, it is about the same "work" to do it legally or not, the difference being if you pay.

It is not surprise the recording industry is looking for new protections.

[wjr]

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/6133/getabrainmoransgs9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[robnix]

The problem is copy protection. Put it on things and people complain it does not work with what they have. Use I-tunes and you basically pay for what you could get for free just to be legal (the way I do it). So the recording industry has to learn, work on the new technology, and convince people to pay for something they could get for free, just to be legal. Thats a task.

At least with tapes recording was a pain, and for many people it was easier to just buy it then to record from there friends. The problem now, it is about the same "work" to do it legally or not, the difference being if you pay.

It is not surprise the recording industry is looking for new protections.

No, you misunderstand my point.

Let's take a look at some copy protection schemes that have been broken:

Changing Address Marks
Hardware Dongles - Remember those?
Macrovision
SecureRom
XCP - The Sony Rootkit
SafeDisc
StarForce - The one that killed some DVD-RW's
CSS
AACS - So powerful, that once the first key was discovered, new keys are useless before they even get released.
Steam
WPA
FairPlay


None have worked, some have actually been destructive, some have kept average consumers from using legally purchased media. If you combine these new proposals with the DMCA, I could go to Federal Prison for installing software on my computer that copies my 4 year olds DVD's to DVD+R for backups. This would constitute both 'intent' and 'circumventing a copy protection scheme'.

So instead of looking at the failures, and the draconian nature of some of these propsals, the entertainment cartels stay in the dark ages by giving money to Congress to pass new laws. Money that's wasted, since real piracy isn't at home, it's in other countries where groups make bit for bit copies of software, music, games etc...and dump them around the world cheap. The ironic part of these copies is that most of them contain the same copy protection that the cartels put on the disc in the first place.

For the cartels to slow down piracy at home, they need to change their entire attitude towards the consumer buying digital media.

Music that only plays in itunes or an ipod? Music that I need WMP11 or a Zune to play? Online movies that only work in WMP10-11 or in some special player? Why would I strangle myself and my purchases that way? How much more music do you think would be sold at 50 cents a song? Or full movies at $4.99 a download? Music and movies that could be downloaded, and copied to cd's or dvd's that would play in any mp3 player, cd player, dvd player, or on any operating system with any media player? Why would I buy music or movies through itunes, when I can get the CD or DVD for approx. the same price, and play them in any format I want, anywhere I want?

Instead of being concerned with how to get the product sold, they're more concerned with how to make it hard to use and copy. Instead of looking at the lower cost of the delivery mechanism, digital vs. retail store, and the profit margin, they look at how much could potentially be lost by piracy. None of these download services offer any advantage over buying a hard copy, and that's where they fail.

[bornl33t]

No, you misunderstand my point.

Let's take a look at some copy protection schemes that have been broken:

Changing Address Marks
Hardware Dongles - Remember those?
Macrovision
SecureRom
XCP - The Sony Rootkit
SafeDisc
StarForce - The one that killed some DVD-RW's
CSS
AACS - So powerful, that once the first key was discovered, new keys are useless before they even get released.
Steam
WPA
FairPlay


None have worked, some have actually been destructive, some have kept average consumers from using legally purchased media. If you combine these new proposals with the DMCA, I could go to Federal Prison for installing software on my computer that copies my 4 year olds DVD's to DVD+R for backups. This would constitute both 'intent' and 'circumventing a copy protection scheme'.

So instead of looking at the failures, and the draconian nature of some of these propsals, the entertainment cartels stay in the dark ages by giving money to Congress to pass new laws. Money that's wasted, since real piracy isn't at home, it's in other countries where groups make bit for bit copies of software, music, games etc...and dump them around the world cheap. The ironic part of these copies is that most of them contain the same copy protection that the cartels put on the disc in the first place.

For the cartels to slow down piracy at home, they need to change their entire attitude towards the consumer buying digital media.

Music that only plays in itunes or an ipod? Music that I need WMP11 or a Zune to play? Online movies that only work in WMP10-11 or in some special player? Why would I strangle myself and my purchases that way? How much more music do you think would be sold at 50 cents a song? Or full movies at $4.99 a download? Music and movies that could be downloaded, and copied to cd's or dvd's that would play in any mp3 player, cd player, dvd player, or on any operating system with any media player? Why would I buy music or movies through itunes, when I can get the CD or DVD for approx. the same price, and play them in any format I want, anywhere I want?

Instead of being concerned with how to get the product sold, they're more concerned with how to make it hard to use and copy. Instead of looking at the lower cost of the delivery mechanism, digital vs. retail store, and the profit margin, they look at how much could potentially be lost by piracy. None of these download services offer any advantage over buying a hard copy, and that's where they fail.

You nailed it.

[Lohman446]

I tunes can be burned to disc and played in any CD player

[robnix]

I tunes can be burned to disc and played in any CD player

There's a limit on the number of times you can do that. Yes, it's 7 times per playlist which should be sufficient for anyone, and there are workarounds, but those workarounds would most likely be a violation of the DMCA.