The Paintball "Marksman"

[Pballwizz]

DISCLAIMER: Its is 4 AM on the East Coast....I havent been sleeping very well and am coming out of a caffeine high.....keep this all in mind -Thank You

The paintball sniper. How many of us can honestly say the idea has not passed through our minds, and to many, has not been a fantasy of which we have woven tapestries in our minds, of action packed recon missions, glorious long range shots, and unparralled accuracy which would tag an opponent in the goggles from two football fields away.

Well thats utter poo poo!!!

We all know a paintball sniper is impossible, and we have all read the threads, the articles and the countless lamentations of the guys who claim they have taken out whole teams with 10 rounds from 400 yards away with their 20" barrel.

That being said, this is NOT a thread that is going to justify, disprove, or ARGUE about sniping.

CLEAR ALL THOUGHTS OF SNIPING FROM YOUR HEAD!!!!

...

Well kinda...


What I want to bring up today is an idea that I have had. I do not take full credit for it, as Im positive others have discussed it, but perhaps have not made the idea widely know.
What Im talking about is:

THE PAINTBALL MARKSMAN!!!.......Not a sniper.....

We all know that paintballs all travel the same speed

That due to their structure, they are relatively inaccurate

That FOR THE MOST PART all guns are as accurate as the next (PLEASE DO NOT ARGUE THIS!!!)

What I present to you today is this idea:

The paintball marksman, is a role on the field, in a squad based scenario.
They do NOT work as lone wolfs, and have to work as a team just as much as any point, support, or rifleman.

Most "marksman" would be equiped with a "spotter" (if you would) Mainly someone to watch their back from a postion, close by, that will allow them access to firing lines: both to be secured, and opened in case of a retreat.

Even though, we all know paintballs and markers are rather inaccurate in the big scale of things, accuracy should be looked upon:
Good paint to barrel match
Quality Paint
Gun being used (Once again, its all preferance, so please dont argue)

That being said, this is not "One shot, One Kill"...If needed, multiple shots may be fired at a single target until an elimination is achieved. The trick is not reavealing your position...

The "marksman" would act more as am ambusher, actually. Moving ahead, around, or behind the main squad, he would put himself in the position to shoot the opposing players, rather than wait for them. The trick would be, staying hidden, knowing your abilities, and being able to think on your feet.

The "marksman" would have to work in conjunction with his squad (prefferably with a walkie talkie) so he would know the plan:
Is his squad pushing his enemie into the marksman sights?
Is he pushing them enemies into his squads sights?
Are they pinching them?
etc. etc.

The bottomline is, is that he would act as your basic rifleman but would rely more on camoflauge and stealth and would not necesariy be used for eliminations, but moreso in conjunction with his squad: almost as a tool.

Furthermore, these would not be long range shots.
The focus would be on stealth, the causing confusion, thus causing openings of oppurtunity.
Enemies could be engaged at extremely close ranges, or shots could be lobbed merely to mess with them......once again...somewhat like your basic rifleman.

Overall, if done corectly, the "marksman" could be a valuable asset, to any woods/rec/scenario team.

DISCLAIMER: Its is 4 AM on the East Coast....I havent been sleeping very well and am coming out of a caffeine high.....keep this all in mind -Thank You

I will update this as I think more into it and better word my ideas!!!

I apologize if I upset anyone with this.
Furthermore, I often have times wording my ideas correctly through posts. I dont mean to cause ANY SORT OR ARGUMENT with this thread. I DO UNDERSTAND what I am talking about. It is just a tough idea to describe.

Thanks for the read.

-pballwizz

[Lenny]

Wow. You sure you haven't smoked any crack either?

[Marrr]

The best sentence - Moving ahead, around, or behind the main squad, he would put himself in the position to shoot the opposing players, rather than wait for them.

I like it,thanks.

:ninja:

[PBI82]

the times i have snuck around to the oposing teams backs there have been amusing results. once after i got a couple people out they started yelling at me becuase they thought i was on their team :rofl: it took me a few mins to get them to understand that i was on the other team.

[shartley]

There ARE paintball snipers. But it has to do with style of play, not length of shot. And there is a difference between a paintball “marksman” and a paintball “sniper” although their rolls can often times be very similar. Again, it has to do with the style of play, and using limited shots to accomplish the goal.

You are mixing things up to support your opinions and playing semantic games. You describe two different types of players which can have similar objectives and act as if only one exists. The flaw is that you want to act as if when you can’t shoot at extra long ranges it by default removes “sniper” from the playing rolls. This is not true. Again, being a sniper is about MORE than (and does not hinge on) just taking long shots. It has to do with your movement, your objective, your shooting style, and more. Many snipers throughout history have used the very same weapons that the average rifleman has used. It is best to be as far away from your target as you can be, but that does not mean that all snipers are at extremely long distances from their targets. There are many times where this is simply impossible.

And as I said, many of the things you list are seen in both a sniper and a “marksman”. It is not a one or the other issue.

I actually see no real value to these types of threads though. No real “new” knowledge is imparted and they tend to hinge on semantics and opinions opposed to actual facts and true definitions. If folks don’t want to think snipers exist in paintball play, fine. That does not however make it fact. By definition and action snipers do exist as a playing style and position.

So I say go out and play. Call yourself whatever you want. Do your roll on the field and assist your team. In the end it does not matter what you call yourself or what others do.

[Pballwizz]

Meh, to each their own.l

[shartley]

Meh, to each their own.l
BINGO! :D

But with that said, maybe you should have taken that stance before posting what looks to be your “tutorial” to folks about the issue and having some pretty basic flaws in your position. ;)

Now go have fun playing. :) Paintball is FUN!

[turbo chicken]

The best sentence - Moving ahead, around, or behind the main squad, he would put himself in the position to shoot the opposing players, rather than wait for them.

I like it,thanks.

:ninja:


Almost mandatory if you play pump ... to be quite honest ... i don't want to be face to face with a whirlomatic paint slinger against me any my pump in the woods (usually results in me getting tagged)... infact id prefer if they didn't see me at all and to top that i'd prefer to surrender them by tapping their shoulder and calmly and quietly telling them that their out (and yell very loudly if playing speed ball)...

either way ... but i'd have to say that first putting yourself into a position where you know noone will come up behind you and waiting for an ambush is sometimes a good thing if defending an item ... but if you trying to obtain said item ... WTF you waiting for???


i like the idea of the "Marksman" but i think it needs a little more development ...

even still ... i kinda like the specops definition of a paintball "sniper" ... i've got ADHD when it come to anything else but waiting in ambush next to a high traffic area is just calming for some reason ... i get more of a rush holding in my excitement and focusing it into extreme concentration to stay concealed ...

[PumpPlayer]

I'm not a "sniper."

I prefer to think of myself more as a 'designated ninja.' :rolleyes:



The thing with paintball is (and especially in scenario games), speed beats stealth every time.
In an environment where eliminations don't score you any points, he who moves the quickest to his objective will be the victor.

[geekwarrior]

the problem with a sniper or marksman, and pretty much the whole milsim idea is paintball is limited in range. A sniper or marksman generally gets his kills from a distance. Paintball is to limited in its distance to allows this. :(

[iambored]

You sure you weren't suffering caffeine poisoning or misspelled codeine? Sounds weird. and alot like pb snipers already.

[paintballfiend]

Paintball: Serious business. :argh:

[turbo chicken]

Almost mandatory if you play pump ... to be quite honest ... i don't want to be face to face with a whirlomatic paint slinger against me any my pump in the woods (usually results in me getting tagged)... infact id prefer if they didn't see me at all and to top that i'd prefer to surrender them by tapping their shoulder and calmly and quietly telling them that their out (and yell very loudly if playing speed ball)...

either way ... but i'd have to say that first putting yourself into a position where you know noone will come up behind you and waiting for an ambush is sometimes a good thing if defending an item ... but if you trying to obtain said item ... WTF you waiting for???


i like the idea of the "Marksman" but i think it needs a little more development ...

even still ... i kinda like the specops definition of a paintball "sniper" ... i've got ADHD when it come to anything else but waiting in ambush next to a high traffic area is just calming for some reason ... i get more of a rush holding in my excitement and focusing it into extreme concentration to stay concealed ...

of course i enjoy playing the designated idiot just as much ...there's nothing like making a sprint all the way across the field and causing a ruckus and causing a big distraction and wamo ... the rest of the team comes over the other side ...


I'm not a "sniper."

I prefer to think of myself more as a 'designated ninja.' :rolleyes:



The thing with paintball is (and especially in scenario games), speed beats stealth every time.
In an environment where eliminations don't score you any points, he who moves the quickest to his objective will be the victor.

I like the 'Designated Ninja' phrase ....

and lets not forget that sometimes setting up to defend and item or hold a position is an objective at times and keeping people eliminated and off the field as much as possible contributes in the end as well ...

[Tao]

The best sniper shots are when you are shooting at such an increadible distance; gun angled 45degrees into the air and everything, getting the ball almost there, bouncing a few times on the ground and breaking on his shoe :rofl:

I haven't quite seen that extreme, but I have been shot in the shoe so many times after the ball bouncing off of the ground.

The best shot I was ever hit with was when I was in a fort which had 6 foot walls and a tower in the middle with 10 foot walls. One ricochet off the tower wall and hit me in the head. Basically arched over the 6 foot wall for a bank shot head shot :rofl: It didn't break, but since it didn't break it had me wondering around confused for a bit because they hit so hard (especially in the head) when they don't break! :rofl:

[ThePixelGuru]

Yeah, no offense, man, but this has really been done to death. Hiding during games isn't exactly groundbreaking. And as soon as your "marksman" backup, he's just another frontman. Paintball positions are kind of pointless to me. Everyone's got a task to do, just go do it and stop worrying about semantics. I tend to play as sort of a stealthy frontman, sometimes passing up shots in favor of moving to a better angle unnoticed. I feel no need to give it a name, nor do I consider it a position. It's just how I play.

When I had my Tippy 98C with the Flatline I used some sniper-ish tactics, though. Mostly just lie down and spot people moving though my range. The shots often came from so far off they just had no idea where to look. I would shoot at people hidden from me, and they'd get confused and try to relocate and end up walking right into my sights.

Bottom line here is that they can't shoot what they can't see, so why be obvious if you don't have to be?

[mostpeople]

*Walks into thread*

*Laughs histerically and leaves*

[Army]

Sniping, is not the shot.

Sniping, is getting into the position to make the shot.

There is most absolutely sniping in paintball

[Ninjeff]

ive seen the "paintball sniper" used to great effect at the last scenario game i was at up at CPX.

One guy had a full on gillie suit and was lying right in the path of a squad, who apparently, figured there was nothing to be worried about and were just walking to find some prop. We had to defend the prop. As soon as these guys got in range of the "sniper" he rose up outta the ground like some crazy swamp thing and rocked their world.

Was it game winning? I dont know, we did defend the prop and got teh points. But that was a "whole team effort". But damn, it sure was cool.

[ThePixelGuru]

Snipe
verb [intrans.]
To shoot at someone from a hiding place.

There is most absolutely sniping in paintball
True that.

[FiXeL]

Snipe
verb [intrans.]
To shoot at someone from a hiding place.

True that.

Tiger rubin from webdog also covered this particular issue... The idea of paintball snipers is due to range a bit idiotic, but literally speaking we all snipe... When playing woods we ideally want to shoot from a concealed position right? Not always the case, but it gives you a advantage over your opponent.

Dressing up like a sniper with ghillie and gun with idiot length barrel is not for everyone, but if they want to, let them. It's their money and their paintball expierence, if they have a blast playing that role, then let them. A friend of mine plays woods with a stock class pump (phantom) and at first everybody on the field made fun of him because the rest was playing with semi's. Well, after a few months the mockery turned into respect, because he makes kills and even sneaks up on people, tapping them out on the shoulder. :rofl:

It doesnt matter what you play with, all that matters is having fun! :headbang:

[Ninjeff]

It doesnt matter what you play with, all that matters is having fun! :headbang:


Amen.

Ive seen gillie suits used very very well before. Im thinking about getting one because i want to see what its like to play like that.

[ThePixelGuru]

Ive seen gillie suits used very very well before.
You mean like after the game's over and the guy wearing it can shake a whole case of paint out of it? Hah! I kid, I kid...

Seriously though, that's why I find these debates so weird. No one would ever shoot from an open, uncovered position if they could help it, and likewise you'd have to be pretty dumb to make yourself obvious in the woods when you could just as easily hide. And I'm pretty sure most of us focus on actually being able to hit things, too. Semantics and rhetoric isn't an advantage once you get on the field.

/Honestly, I'll let the topic die now.
//Maybe.

[Lenny]

Eh.

Call the guys decked out in ghillie's and camo "snipers" and let them call their guns "rifles". I don't care. It's all paintball. It's like woods vs. speed. Who cares? It's paintball.

[Glickman]

Eh.

Call the guys decked out in ghillie's and camo "snipers" and let them call their guns "rifles". I don't care. It's all paintball. It's like woods vs. speed. Who cares? It's paintball.

i think that might be a little different from woods vs. speed because no one, woods or speed enthusiasts like to be thought of as the stereotypical "gun-happy soldier wannabees"

i dont care enough to argue with those guys at the field, but they will definitely get giggled at quietly by everyone else at the field

[Nish Grout]

There is a xmas tree farm that we sometimes play in around here and something like this works great there.

The guy that owns the property is out of shape and not getting any younger so what he often does is stay back be loud and obnoxious while one of us younger guys moves up off to the side of him, he attracts fire to himself, once you find the guy shooting at him, if you did it right you get your first few shots on a completely unaware victim who is out before he knows what is going on. You then more on to the next unlucky soul. This tactic has helped "the old fat guy" dominate his side on more than one occasion.

[rabidchihauhau]

Sniping as in extreme long range shots - no.

Sneaking around in the woods and firing from concealed positions - yes. In fact, up until about 90-91, that was the way everyone played (if you were any good).

Wearing a ghillie suit - ought to be outlawed. Its called "padding" and its also called 'too great an ability to conceal valid hits'. No, I am not accusing anyone who wears one of cheating. I am saying that its paintball and opportunities to cheat are usually taken advantage of by someone, somewhere. But, if you'd like, take out the second part and concentrate on the padding aspect. Why not allow everyone else to wear three or four layers of clothing? Better yet, just wrap 1/2 foam rubber sheets around your body under your cammo.

The problem with introducing this kind of thing successfully to a paintball game is that your average 'rifleman' is not limited by weight considerations in the amount of ammunition he/she carries, and everyone is armed not with an 'assault rifle' but with a squad automatic weapon that doesn't require a loader nor and greater degree of humping or setup than the standard issue weapon. Snipers work in the real world because the amount of time that it takes a squad to set-up, direct fire and start looking is more than enough time for the sniper to boogey. He takes out (wounds, preferably) one guy and makes the entire squad/platoon deploy. Meanwhile, he's off to the alternate hide. In paintball, as soon as word goes out, response fire ought to be immediate, and there is no need for the squad to 'deploy'; each player has enough fire power to accomoplish that individually. No one needs to or ought to 'go to ground' - just spray the likely locations and keep right on moving.

If you want to add more realistic relationships, you've got to simulate the weapon systems better. For every group of 12 players, you give them one semi-auto with a 100 round box mag and hang 50 lbs of lead off of it. Stick a bi-pod on it and don't allow it to be fired until its on the ground with bi-pod extended. The player humping the weapon is only allowed to carry 1 or 2 reloads; his loader is another player. All the rest of the players get stock pump guns and are allowed to carry say, 200 rounds max.

At that point, a single, 'sniping' player, with good concealment, can begin to play somewhat like a real sniper.

[Pballwizz]

Sniping, is not the shot.

Sniping, is getting into the position to make the shot.

There is most absolutely sniping in paintball

Aw, for a second, I thought you were agreeing with me....:(

haha, anyway, I knew a thread like this was going to draw a lot of criticism and mixed opinions; thats the fun of posting it.

As a lil background: This was just a theory my friend and I at the field were discussing. I have never done this, and....well....just forget it.

I forgot the internet is to be taken seriously :)

That being said, Id rather let this thread die.