Automag, suitable for field use?

[RenegadeSniper]

I am opening a new indoor site (not sup-air). I've been given the opertunity to purchase the field mag at a fair price.

1. How suitable is this marker for 20 hours play a week?

2. How often (after how many hours play) are all the seals likely to need replacing?

any other comments pros and cons compare to other rental gun i.e tipmann98 welcomed.

Thanks for help.

[Empyreal Rogue]

The 68 classic is more durable than the M98's, needs less maintenance overall, and should a 68 Classic go down it's easy to fix. I'd recommend it highly. Much more reliable than the M98.

[BlueDragonX]

20 hours of play on a Mag over the course of the week is nothing. Try 20 hours over the course of a single day. And it never missed a beat, ran strong the entire time. Now, if only I could say the same of my Halo B...

I'd say there's no better rental gun than a Classic Mag.

[Stayhuge]

Yea, they are built like tanks. And, the only major maintenance you will need to perform is dropping a few drops of oil in the ASA probably each day. The seals should last quite a long time too. You will know when you need to replace them. There will be leaking fom the valve.

[punkncat]

Are these new field guns or someones old used ones?

Let me put it this way, if they have already seen years of service there are a few things that may need to be done to them, like replacing the spring pack and new rings. You will need to keep in mind to have decent 45* elbows in stock always.

If you are using co2 as your primary air source I have to be honest, the 98C is going to perform better on a day to day basis. Its valve is better designed to handle CO2 with the restricted dump chamber. Classics will run on co2 but I am not going to lie and say they like it. They can and will experiance freeze up and other issues while using it. It will have a lot to do with how they are set up, ie. vert or anti siphon tank, expansion chamber... If you are using HPA they will be golden.

Nice thing about a fleet of field mags, there is nothing to rust, no paint to start flaking off like a bad case of Psoriasis. At the end of the day, leave it aired up and swish it around in a bucket of water. Fire it a few times and shelve it.

I really don't think you would go wrong either way. I would love to see you use mags, but 98c's are great markers as well.

[RenegadeSniper]

I am using hpa. The guns are new.

Nice thing about a fleet of field mags, there is nothing to rust, no paint to start flaking off like a bad case of Psoriasis. At the end of the day, leave it aired up and swish it around in a bucket of water. Fire it a few times and shelve it.

Please explain the above. Do you mean dunk it in the bucket with the tank attached, if so why? Thanks

[B-Pow]

My suggestion if you are seriously considering it is look a field in north-east IL, named Fox River paintball (or Fox Paintball now I think...). Give them a call and see if you can speak to the field owner, his rentals are a fleet of 68 classics. (He also rents out PMR's, Ion's, and A5's as more "preimum" rental packages)

He's a nice guy and will probably tell you why he uses 68 classics, along with the ups and downs of using a fleet as your regular rental marker.

their website is www.foxpaintball.com I would hunt down the number but the site is blocked here at work, but I could still google search for the url.

[Loco_AEXY]

Please explain the above. Do you mean dunk it in the bucket with the tank attached, if so why? Thanks

This is just a very quick way of cleaning a mag. With it aired up there is no way for water to get into any bad places in the marker and as long as you fire it a few times after removing it from the bucket most of the water should be blown out fo the breach/bolt.

For cleaning a fleet of rentals it doesn't get much easier...

[Chronobreak]

mags are great for everything mentioned so far

however, for rental use there are a few negatives

inexperienced users can easily shotroke them.

your gonna need compressed air(not really a negative)

the feednecks are an issue as they break regularly or are too loose.

and the abrrels also rotate too easy for inexpereinced players.

we have 40 rental mags currently so lmk if you have anymore questions

[Smoothice]

mags are great for everything mentioned so far

however, for rental use there are a few negatives

inexperienced users can easily shotroke them.

Even with a single trigger? I don't think I ever short stroked my classic. And I'm semi :tard:

your gonna need compressed air(not really a negative)

If this is an indoor field the temp isn't going to be very cold. Warm air + Co2 + classic valve = :shooting:

the feednecks are an issue as they break regularly or are too loose.

and the abrrels also rotate too easy for inexpereinced players.

You can drill out the twist lock hole in the barrel a LITTLE deeper. This will make it a bit more difficult to unscrew.

we have 40 rental mags currently so lmk if you have anymore questions

My comments/questions above in blue

[Chronobreak]

for most people its hard to shortroke, but alot of people that are the rental players are use to the tippman triggers where you dont have to pull and release and they try to quickly snap the trigger or halfway pull it instead of fully back and fully releasing it.

the barrels can be tightened in with the nubbin, though some are still gonna be loose as the nubbins only tighten so much

the side feed itself wont break, its the elbows that do. ULE's would be the way to go to solve the abrrel and feedneck problems but theyr too pricey for rental equipment.

even in warm temps the valve will freeze up pretty fast 10-15 shots or less, add to the fact people are gonna be holding the guns down alot feeding liquid into the guns.

--we rebuild them all every year with quick inspections or repairs as needed.

[Dryden]

If the barrels are loose and rotate too easily, then remove the twist lock assembly from the rail and tighten the allen screw in the bottom of it, which will apply more tension to the twist lock pin. If you just crank the thing in a half turn and replace the twist lock pin, you can get the fit so tight that you won't be able to remove the barrel without taking out the front frame screw and taking the body off the rail.

[Hook]

inexperienced users can easily shotroke them.


Pardon my ignorance and momentarily derailing the thread for a second. What exactly is shortstroking and what happens to the marker when you do so? This has personally never happened to me.

[ProblemKinder]

Pardon my ignorance and momentarily derailing the thread for a second. What exactly is shortstroking and what happens to the marker when you do so? This has personally never happened to me.

if you dont know what it is, how do you know it's never happened to you?

the trigger has to fully extend back to its resting position before it can be fired again. short stroking is trying to pull the trigger before it reaches it's resting position. i'm pretty sure you just hear a little puff sound until you let go of the trigger, then it will fire fine.

[AGD]

FYI on the field mags we replace the barrel detent with a solid all brass piece. This locks the barrel in place and you have to unscrew the main body from the rail to get the barrel out (or rotate it).

Fox River Games has used the same set of mag field rentals for over a decade. Most other field rentals have to be replaced every couple years.

AGD

[MANN]

FYI on the field mags we replace the barrel detent with a solid all brass piece. This locks the barrel in place and you have to unscrew the main body from the rail to get the barrel out (or rotate it).
AGD

And they work great. one of my loaners has one of these on it.

[Chronobreak]

FYI on the field mags we replace the barrel detent with a solid all brass piece. This locks the barrel in place and you have to unscrew the main body from the rail to get the barrel out (or rotate it).

Fox River Games has used the same set of mag field rentals for over a decade. Most other field rentals have to be replaced every couple years.

AGD

tom, is the brass piece a new setup for the rental mags?

all of ours have and have had as far as i know the adjustable ones.

ide be interested in getting some with our next shipment.

We got ours from Xtreme and are also about 10 years old or more and shoot like new. Wish the other rentals we had held up as well.

Tom,on a sidenote im the manager at Tim's field in STL

[Shane-O-Mac]

Chronobreak:

The fleet that Xtreme had, was a mix of ones with both types of detents. Was confusing at times. And they used Co2 for quite awhile and they really didnt have a problem as long as it was above 50* outside.

[Chronobreak]

Chronobreak:

The fleet that Xtreme had, was a mix of ones with both types of detents. Was confusing at times. And they used Co2 for quite awhile and they really didnt have a problem as long as it was above 50* outside.

i bought one when sal sold some and it came as a vertical front feed, is it safe to assume thats how all were setup?

we have them all on backbottles now and the liquid gets in alot easier.

[WalkingTarget]

Let me put it this way:

i've been considering opening up a field here in ontario, and if i were to do so tomorrow, i'd send an email to AGD to get a quote on a fleet of rental mags.

no way, no how would i ever use an M98 or any tippmann as a rental, it's either Mags or Mokals.

[questionful]

Compared to the unidentifiable stacked tube blowbacks my local indoor field uses as rentals, classic mags would be SO much better. Do "field mags" have foregrips?

[RenegadeSniper]

for most people its hard to shortroke, but alot of people that are the rental players are use to the tippman triggers where you dont have to pull and release and they try to quickly snap the trigger or halfway pull it instead of fully back and fully releasing it.

the barrels can be tightened in with the nubbin, though some are still gonna be loose as the nubbins only tighten so much

the side feed itself wont break, its the elbows that do. ULE's would be the way to go to solve the abrrel and feedneck problems but theyr too pricey for rental equipment.

even in warm temps the valve will freeze up pretty fast 10-15 shots or less, add to the fact people are gonna be holding the guns down alot feeding liquid into the guns.

I am using hps as stated earlier.

--we rebuild them all every year with quick inspections or repairs as needed.

You keep ref

[smilestyler]

Let me put it this way:

i've been considering opening up a field here in ontario, and if i were to do so tomorrow, i'd send an email to AGD to get a quote on a fleet of rental mags.

no way, no how would i ever use an M98 or any tippmann as a rental, it's either Mags or Mokals.

You can't buy "rental" mags anymore from AGD, only the classics that are on their web site. There are fields out there that will sell their old ones to purchase something else (their mistake) if you can find them.

The twist lock pins are not a big issue. I have the solid ones in our rentals and they are a pain to clean if you have a batch of bad paint. I am considering switching them all out for the adjustable ones so that I can clean the barrel properly on the field. If you instuct renters, I can't see them 'twisting the barrel' as a problem.

You can buy better quality elbows, and they work awesome with the standard feed if you hose clamp them on. (no more dumped hoppers or openings for dirt to get in)

Ever look at a rental Tippman after a year of use. They look totally beat. They may work great, but they look aweful. Mags can take a beating and never show (aside from the barrel that can scratch)

[WalkingTarget]

heh, i'd order up 30 classic mags and replace the frikken twistlock pin at that point, mags kick some serious butt and wouldn't consider anything else if i had the option. :headbang: :headbang:

[PhoenixWolf]

Honestly, the Mags are going to save you money in the long run. It's not uncommon to find heavily used Automags working for more than 10 years. People have even bought former rental Mags after the field was done with them and used them for personal use, did a 5-minute valve rebuild, and they were good as new. It's not some gun like a rental Piranha or Spyder where you use it for a year, it's worn out, and you replace it. This is something you keep on using and it keeps on working.

If a Tippmann goes down, it's a 20-30 minute fix at least. You have to remove 8 or 10 screws, open up the clamshells while ensuring springloaded parts don't go flying, and fix whatever's broken. The valve isn't really user-serviceable. And Spyder-type guns are a whole different problem. The stacked blowback action suffers significant extra stress than an inline blowback or blowforward design, and this makes them unsuitable for long-term use. Basically, after a year or so of hard field use the entire gun will be worn out.

If an Automag goes down, it's a 5 minute fix even if you have to refurbish the entire valve. A set of o-ring picks is all you really need. There's really not much that can go wrong with one. And they don't wear out like blowbacks do. They last a LOT longer, and repairs are simpler and easier. They're just better guns. You'll get a LOT more life out of them than anything else.

[angrysasquatch]

Let me put it this way:

i've been considering opening up a field here in ontario, and if i were to do so tomorrow, i'd send an email to AGD to get a quote on a fleet of rental mags.

no way, no how would i ever use an M98 or any tippmann as a rental, it's either Mags or Mokals.

Make the paint cheaper than Wasaga, and I'm there :clap:

[AltogetherAndrews]

Well, roughly what would a fleet of rentals cost? We'll be looking to add to our arsenal in the next year (and likely transfer the current brand for use as remote rentals), but not within the time limits given on the reseller form (90 days, is it?). I assume I won't get an answer here though, but I'd be interested to know roughly what it'd run us.

[Chronobreak]

field pricing wasnt terrible if i recall but i dont have numbers readily available.

i do recall there is also price breaks if you order X amount of markers

[AltogetherAndrews]

Do you know who I should contact that to find this out? Would AGD be likely to give this information out to someone who doesn't actually have a reseller account?

[Chronobreak]

AGD can tell ya.

but i dont know what rules they have as far as selling things, i would assume if you could prove you had a licensed and insured field/facility it wouldnt be a problem.

ive never set an account up with AGD myself so i dont know

[Dark Side]

If you want to set up an account here you go.

http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/DealerApplication2008.pdf

[AltogetherAndrews]

Thanks, I looked at that, but the problem is that we wouldn't be doing this purchase anywhere near within the 90 days. I'm just trying to get an idea of what it'd cost us so that I can relay that to the guy who is in charge of purchases and see if it's something we should consider vs buying a fleet of some other brand. Thanks for the link though.

[matt3]

Another place that used mags a long time ago was Skermish USA in PA. They held up great as far as I know, and I got one for my dad to use when I was trying to get him into playing at the world record games. They might also have some info for you. I dont know if they still use them though I haven't been there in a long time.

Matt

[ManInBlack]

Doesn't All American Paintball in Greensburg also rent Mags?