I never knew that.....

[Ruler_Mark]

http://www.pbreview.com/paintball-videos/playVideo.php?v=paintball-beginners-gun-descriptions
@ 2:00


EMags are electro-pnuematic paintball guns? lol. I hope this guy knowes his mistake.

[Lenny]

A: (EDIT: Just watched the video, and he did say EP. Wierd. I would've expected better out of Tyger)

B: E-Mags are not electro pneumatic. They are indeed sear-trippers.

[Ruler_Mark]

A: (EDIT: Just watched the video, and he did say EP. Wierd. I would've expected better out of Tyger)

B: E-Mags are not electro pneumatic. They are indeed sear-trippers.


what i meant,, edited first post to emphasize sarcasm.

[cyrus-the-virus]

That's also not a true stockclass marker, It's modified stockclass. The other is open class.

I don't agree with a lot of things tyger say's or a lot of those video's on pbreview. But to each their own I guess.

[Lohman446]

Its air powered - hence its pneumatic.

It uses electricity - hence its electro.

Well it may indeed be a sear tripper what keeps it from being classified as electro-pneumatic? What defines electro-pneumatic? Some SP classification system?

[Dark Side]

As found in Websters online Dictionary.

pneumatic
One entry found.

pneumatic



Main Entry: pneu·mat·ic
Pronunciation: \nu̇-ˈma-tik, nyu̇-\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin pneumaticus, from Greek pneumatikos, from pneumat-, pneuma air, breath, spirit, from pnein to breathe — more at sneeze
Date: 1659
1: of, relating to, or using gas (as air or wind): a: moved or worked by air pressure b (1): adapted for holding or inflated with compressed air (2): having air-filled cavities
2: of or relating to the pneuma : spiritual
3: having a well-proportioned feminine figure; especially : having a full bust
— pneu·mat·i·cal·ly \-ti-k(ə-)lē\ adverb
— pneu·ma·tic·i·ty \ˌnü-mə-ˈti-sə-tē, ˌnyü-\ noun

So I guess he is somewhat correct.

[B-Pow]

I'm pretty certian that Tyger knows it's not really /true/

However he says himself his vids are "paintball for idiots" and if you start to talk semantics of the E-mag is an electro sear tripper and a intimidator is an electropnumatic...it is getting on the range of too complicated/too much information for someone who needs the viedos (ie people who it's their first season out on the field).

I can't watch the vid from here (I'm at work, steaming media is banned as is pbreview...bastards) but I'm going to guess the "stock class" gun you are refering to is his phantom? That phantom has so many parts to switch around it can be true stock class he just might have a diffrent set of parts on it.

The guy basically just grabbed a few guns threw them in his trunk and hit the field in the morning in the middle of the week to make vids for people who haven't been playing much, or ever before. I want to say that perticular vid is in his set on expert village with a title like "so you are new to paintball...here's what you might want to know"

[Lohman446]

However he says himself his vids are "paintball for idiots" and if you start to talk semantics of the E-mag is an electro sear tripper and a intimidator is an electropnumatic...it is getting on the range of too complicated/too much information for someone who needs the viedos (ie people who it's their first season out on the field).

Why? Electro-pneumatic implies that it uses both electricity and pneumatics to function. The E-mag qualifies (while in e-mode). While others may qualify differently the E-mag clearly qualifies.

[B-Pow]

Why? Electro-pneumatic implies that it uses both electricity and pneumatics to function. The E-mag qualifies (while in e-mode). While others may qualify differently the E-mag clearly qualifies.

The (common) definition that the thread starts with is that an electro-pnumatic has a solinoid that works directly with air pressure (ie: intimidator, ego, quest, matrix...blah blah blah) where as a electro-mechanical has a solinoid that actuates a sear (E-spider, E-tippy, E-mag). This is the definition that /most/ paintball players use and I'm not here to debate the semantics of this definition or that definition. I'm only trying to give a diffrent opinion of why saying that a E-mag is electro-pnumatic (which the "common paintball definition" would disagree with) would not be a bad thing to say in the case of the viedos.

Honestly I don't really like that split definition of electronic guns, because it fuels the pissing match as to the "better gun". That and it leaves the e-cockers somewhere in the middle unowned by eather camp (well unless it has an MQ).

But ignoring cockers the easy way people use to disgungish between electro-pnumatic and electro-mechanical is that if the gun has a "sibling" gun of the same platform that can function without a battery it is electro-mechanical.

Now that I've said all that...I honestly don't care...an E-gun is an E-gun and they all serve the same basic purpace no matter what the solinoid acts on directly...does it really matter so long as it throws paint with speed and short light trigger pulls? :shooting:

[punkncat]

Well...would it help with any kind of prior art case?
If so, I say we all agree......:shifty:

[Ruler_Mark]

what a discussion i have spurred :ninja:

[thejere]

Whoa... Does this an eblade cocker is both electromechanical and electroneumatic?

[Hilltop Customs]

electro cockers use a pneu-noid to opperate as the 3 way and a mechanical noid to opperate the sear.(mq valve excluded)

emags use an mechanical noid to move the sear which in turn opperates the on/off valve, so IMO it could be considered electro pneumatic since it uses a noid to opperate a valve, but the catch is the sear that is being actuated by the noid also releases the bolt.

spyders just use a mechanical noid to release the hammer/bolt...if someone were to replace the hammer spring with a ram and the mechanical noid with a pneu noid it would be electro pneumatic.....and you could call it a bko, bushmaster, timmy.....list goes on.

difference between pneu noid and a regular noid=pneu noid is a regular noid that is used to opperate some type of air valve. Really every electro gun is a electropneumatic since every electro uses some type of noid to release air pressure down the barrel....they may have a different sequence of events leading from one to the other, but the first and last steps in the sequence are the same.

[DevilMan]

And wouldn't any 'lectro gun then become "Electro Pneumatic"?

I mean they ALLL use AIR in some fashion. Woot Woot!!! My Spyder Imagine just moved up the food chain!!! Gonna raise the price accordingly....

DM

[questionful]

Whoa... Does this an eblade cocker is both electromechanical and electroneumatic?

it means cockers are scum that were only put on this earth for mags to spit on.

jk. but in my opinion electrocockers take the fun out of cockers! I want a cocker some day, and it's going to be pre 98 FULLY MECHANICAL and a sliding single trigger. And stainless pneumatics. . . :rolleyes: A man can dream!

[halB]

it means cockers are scum that were only put on this earth for mags to spit on.

jk. but in my opinion electrocockers take the fun out of cockers! I want a cocker some day, and it's going to be pre 98 FULLY MECHANICAL and a sliding single trigger. And stainless pneumatics. . . :rolleyes: A man can dream!


True dat. What's the point of getting an e-cocker? Get a gun that's designed for electronics!

Man, doesn't anyone else remember that HUGE argument I had with a couple of fools just a month back - over this very same issue?

[Hilltop Customs]

True dat. What's the point of getting an e-cocker? Get a gun that's designed for electronics!

I guess then you wouldnt want an emag either then??? :p



Man, doesn't anyone else remember that HUGE argument I had with a couple of fools just a month back - over this very same issue?

link??? I love me an internets e-battle

[halB]

I guess then you wouldnt want an emag either then??? :p



link??? I love me an internets e-battle


Don't know the link. My life is full of these pointless battles. Le Sigh (ok, take le nap*) And I would looooooove an emag, because I'm a gun whore. I probably wouldn't shoot it. I'm VERY hesitant to get an RT valve for my mag because I already love the feel of the gun as it is. I was VERY hesitant to even consider changing the on/off pin. But I'll soon be doing that as I've been assured it doesn't change the feel. So, I wouldn't really WANT an e-mag, aside from it being a very sound investment.

//Nothing like the tactile feedback of that on/off
*can anyone tell me what this obscure reference is from?

[Army]

Elf tripper...


:dance:

[SN toter]

Man, doesn't anyone else remember that HUGE argument I had with a couple of fools just a month back - over this very same issue?

Found it (http://automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=227388)

Here we go again... :tard:

[cyrus-the-virus]

True dat. What's the point of getting an e-cocker? Get a gun that's designed for electronics!

Man, doesn't anyone else remember that HUGE argument I had with a couple of fools just a month back - over this very same issue?

Yeah, your still wrong, and it wasen't even a month ago.

[Hilltop Customs]

Found it (http://automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=227388)

Here we go again... :tard:

Wow what a flame fest....I saw the start of that thread and decided not to post in it on account of the first post. Claiming that any marker "cant cut it" is just an opinion.....and arguing about opinions has no point.

halB, you need to stop going around bashing other people and calling them fools and descriminating because someone doesnt happen to live in the same country as you. Even if a couple users started the name calling in a previous thread it doesnt give you the right to act that way. And your going around basically bragging about it?

I had a huge reply typed out disputing every comment you made and showing how many times you contradicted yourself in that thread, but I think I'll just leave it alone. Seeing that you did not listen to a single reply you recieved previously, why would you start now?




As for the original topic, I'll stick by my original post in this thread.

[questionful]

Well, I would love to have a mechanical cocker cause they are cool machines, but you have to admit mech cockers are outdated. And while electro cockers still shoot paintballs, their mechanism is a polished turd. It's a complicated way to go around a problem. The whole "closed bolt" thing just makes it so you have to do more things with the mechanism, and all for what? Do we still believe closed bolt markers are more accurate? I'm not saying cockers suck, I'm just saying they don't make sense. They're still cool. And I still want a mech cocker. But you have to admit they don't make sense.

[Hilltop Customs]

Well, I would love to have a mechanical cocker cause they are cool machines, but you have to admit mech cockers are outdated. And while electro cockers still shoot paintballs, their mechanism is a polished turd. It's a complicated way to go around a problem. The whole "closed bolt" thing just makes it so you have to do more things with the mechanism, and all for what? Do we still believe closed bolt markers are more accurate? I'm not saying cockers suck, I'm just saying they don't make sense. They're still cool. And I still want a mech cocker. But you have to admit they don't make sense.

Cockers eveolved the way they did because they started from something extremely simple. Look at the sniper pump, the only thing pulling the trigger does is drop the sear and release the hammer, the act of pumping opens the chamber and closes the chamber while resetting the hammer to ready position held in place by the sear. The adaptation of the pump into the semi had the biproduct of having a closed bolt.....and just like anything else it became a means of creating hype.


Give me a concrete reason why the cocker is an outdated marker.....and dont say they are too complicated because that has no effect of their performance and is in no way a limitation(if it is, then it is only a user limitation). The truth is just about every marker out the is on the same performance plane because we are limited by the rules of the game. No marker can shoot farther than another because of the velocity limitation and no marker can shoot faster than another because of BPS limitations set in the rules of the game. I could build an electro stingray if I wanted to and it would be on the same performance level as a 1500ego.(ok maybe the stingray would get shootdown and inconsistant velocity at high bps....but you should get my point)


edit....before anyone brings up effiency, unless your playing a rouge game where the only source of compressed air is a scuba tank and the nearest place to get it filled is a 100miles away, your effiency claims mean just about squat.

[Empyreal Rogue]

i was just going to make this same topic a few months back when I first saw that video (PBR use to be my homepage), but never got around to it. Then I took PBR off as my homepage and completely forgot.

*shakes fist at Mark*