Perhaps I am looking at it the wrong way?

[punkncat]

I dunno. I saw this linked thread in a post here that got closed. Not concerned about the closure specifically but the linked thread did casue me some concern.

http://forum.specialopspaintball.com/index.php?showtopic=146882

Am I reading it wrong?

I will not reiterate what I posted there. Please feel free to look for yourself. Tell me, am I way off base? Perhaps I am reading between lines that do not exist? Read it, form your own opinion and let me know what you think.

[halB]

I think it's true. I myself had a turning point after which I DID start enjoying the game again. Instead of killing myself, trying to run every game I could, I just now relax, eat, drink, smoke, and be merry in between games, and if I only get to play 4 or even 3 games a day, well, I'm plum happy.

Although, I must suspect that the guy who wrote the article isn't a good ref. When I was reffing, there were people who wiped and those who didn't. If he thinks everyone's wiping, or not, merely because the accusations are put to both sides, then he's pulling a FDR, thinking that two clearly unequal sides are the same.* Some people really ARE wiping, and if he's not putting the screws to them, then he's making the game miserable for everyone. No wonder people are complaining to him!


*anyone wanna know what that means?

[maniacmechanic]

I was the one that linked the thread
What I read into the 1st post by the author was this ;

" I am not going to continue with all of the various forms of complaints that I get on a daily basis. But what I have found is this….it isn’t the new player. Yes, they have problems remembering to keep their masks and barrel covers on. But they remember the Game. It is the experienced and seasoned players that don’t. They are like preschoolers pointing fingers at each other. The politics are ridiculous. The he said she said. So and so didn’t or did do that. Listen to yourselves. Do you even enjoy it anymore? Do you go to the paintball field and decide that you are going to be miserable, or who you don’t get along with or who is going to TINKLE you off before you even get there? Remember the Game!!!! "

basiclly the fact HE SAYS he has more problems with whining EXPERENCED PLAYERS than the noobs
i think he is saying what i've allways said " when I quit having fun i'll sell my gear & quit
That is the biggest reason I almost only play Outlaw ball with low #'s of players & why i am picky about the Scenarios i go to now , no more 500 plus player scenario's for me , the last Blanding game I went to IMHO was a complete farce & it was put on by a great producer
After reading your post on SO I have to agree with your comments YOU ARE COMPLETLY RIGHT , he & the other refs , owners & even the players have let it get to the point it is at now

[chafnerjr]

Now I might be wrong because I've not played with anyone from AO specifically yet, but... 'Round here I've heard these sorts of stories before and almost everyone here seems to agree. Play to have fun, or don't play. Hell, that's why I have been hanging out here for the last few months. I'm an ol' woodsballer that's been playing fields for the past bit and there are just those people who are going to get pissed about all sorts of things... I just don't play with them. Thankfully the reffing core at OSG where I sometimes play does "remember the game" even when some of the players don't.

[punkncat]

Well apparently I stepped off into a very touchy situation. I have become less than popular for having a not so great first impression about that "open letter" and about the field from which that person comes from.

There is obviously much more to that story than I am privy to. Many people there know many others and apparently they are all buddies. Ah well, I guess I couldn't stay being a good boy for long. :argh:

[Elemental]

I wonder why Snake Eyes dragged Billy and LCP into that.

[punkncat]

I wonder why Snake Eyes dragged Billy and LCP into that.

I had wondered that as well. The feeling that I get is that he figured this since we are in the same state he guessed that we must have some relationship. What his thoughts were beyond that I can only speculate.

[Beemer]

Hey Punk I read that thread. You were fine. Looks like someone has a complex for some reason or nother.

[jenarelJAM]

I read the thread.

I have a great deal of respect for you for handling that situation the way you did. You didn't give in to their attack on you. You stayed calm (or so it sounded, regardless of how you felt at your computer seat ;) ) and professional, and stood behind what you said.

After reading the thread, I feel like the original post had no less merit, but I feel like I understand the situation for what it was. Refs have a responsibility to control their field. I've been to several fields where the refs were there to stand around and get paid, not to prevent wiping or keep things safe or anything (they stood on the outside of the netted field...).

In general. You were not out of line in any way.

And I have no idea what snake_eyes was thinking. I think he came from pbn...

[Stingrayman42]

You kept your cool. Good job. It is always interesting when questions posed are responded to with personal attacks. Not that it matters, but Jamlink was incorrect when he stated no insured field has ever had someone lose an eye. I work at one, the person was being fired at, panicked, took off their mask, and that was all she wrote.

[Chris Nearchos]

All I can say is wow....in a very bad way. Don’t get me wrong, not towards you but rather them and such....(loss of words).

From what I understood of the thread, you were alright and had every right to say what you wanted. The person that originally started the thread opened it up by stating his connection with the field. And on top of that, I can't see him having any right to complain about the players till he complains and fixes his field of play first.

My experiences have taught me that crappy fields, crappy stores, and crappy owners attract crappy players. This in turn leads to a very horrible day at the field.

Not to continue onto bashing fields and their owners, but honestly I have ran into the exact same kind of field you’re talking about near my home town. The fields were just trashed. No one really cared about safety except the ones currently playing a match. Owner allowed regulars to create their own rules as they desired (like dead man walking), even in the middle of the match. And so on with a list longer than one would desire to read. So I have been there and had to deal with a very poor representation of the sport of paintball.

Though my story gets happy. After putting up with that crap for 2 years, I got to watch the field and its owner crumble. I know that is a horrible thing to say, but oh was it sweet.

But back to your post. They were fair and very well legit. So don’t take anything to heart of what they say. They can have rays of happiness raining down on their field today....but it will not make up for their past and who/what they truly are. And if they are ashamed of their past and the memory’s you have of their field, then that’s their issue. They have no right to tell you to shut up and try to play you off as somebody who doesn’t know what they are talking about.

Okay, enough of my rant. That thread just brought bake many bad memories of an old field in which I was forced to play at to keep playing the sport when I started out. And I apologize if any of my typing doesn’t make sense. Did it in a bit of a hurry.
-Chris

[lather]

Sad that the OP didnt answer your question what actions he was taking to improve the situation he was just ponitficating about. Him and his cronies just circled the wagons and didnt even attempt to answer a legitimate question based on first hand observances.

Much easier to preach on the virtues of fair play and fun than to actually put words into actions I guess. :rolleyes:

[athomas]

Hmm....All they had to do was mention that things had changed since then. There are fields around here that have fanboys all over the place. If you question anything about the field, it gets personal. Its too bad. Acceptance of criticism allows bad things to be corrected rather than defended.

[wimag]

Read it, form your own opinion and let me know what you think.

I think you should have kept your mouth shut. If you felt it as necessary at the time i really dont see the need for you to run back here for sympathy and acceptance.

[Beemer]

I think you should have kept your mouth shut. If you felt it as necessary at the time i really dont see the need for you to run back here for sympathy and acceptance.

Hmm, then what is the point of any forum? He came back here to see if maybe he did screw up and was wrong. If he was he knew we would tell him. He asked us to tell him what we thought just in case he was reading it wrong.

Anyway good job Punk a little class and style goes a long way. :cheers:

Just went and saw the last posts over there. Oh ya nice job on the twinkie. Now just let it die.
Those arent the Droids you are looking for. There is nothing else for you to see there. Move along.

[wimag]

Hmm, then what is the point of any forum? He came back here to see if maybe he did screw up and was wrong. If he was he knew we would tell him. He asked us to tell him what we thought just in case he was reading it wrong.



hmmm exactly. he asked for opinions i gave him mine. As you gave him yours, other people expressed their thoughts as well. Works pretty well. I thought he was wrong both in class and tact, but that is my opinion on the matter
Did i break some rule by not agreeing with your thoughts ?, sorry if i wasnt swinging off his nuts like you are but he asked, he got.

[punkncat]

hmmm exactly. he asked for opinions i gave him mine. As you gave him yours, other people expressed their thoughts as well. Works pretty well. I thought he was wrong both in class and tact, but that is my opinion on the matter
Did i break some rule by not agreeing with your thoughts ?, sorry if i wasnt swinging off his nuts like you are but he asked, he got.

Dang bro...no need to be harsh. I can handle it. I value your input just as much whether I agree or not.

I am just a little bit curious as to why you choose to be so well not sure the word I am looking for...so upfront, blatent (?) in the way you offered your opinion.
Did what I have to say about it offend you as well?

I am not looking to argue with you about it, just satifying my curiousity.



Oh and thanks Beemer.

[wimag]

Dang bro...no need to be harsh. I can handle it. I value your input just as much whether I agree or not.

I am just a little bit curious as to why you choose to be so well not sure the word I am looking for...so upfront, blatent (?) in the way you offered your opinion.
Did what I have to say about it offend you as well?

I am not looking to argue with you about it, just satifying my curiousity.



Oh and thanks Beemer.

you do not want my reasoning on why i came acorss so blatant. It would take to long to write, lead to a ban for me..... but if you are really that intersted ask Beemer to ask me at Paintball Sams in a couple weeks and he can take notes on it and relay the info back to you.

[Beemer]

hmmm exactly. he asked for opinions i gave him mine. As you gave him yours, other people expressed their thoughts as well. Works pretty well. I thought he was wrong both in class and tact, but that is my opinion on the matter
Did i break some rule by not agreeing with your thoughts ?, sorry if i wasnt swinging off his nuts like you are but he asked, he got.

Hmmmmm, I see what you did there. You are right, works pretty well. I think you are wrong both in class and tact in the last part of your post. Unless I read that wrong, I would say you just dissed me. Are you trolling? Rule number one as a Mod is to not engage. Sometimes that is a very hard rule to follow as we are a part of the community also. Now if you wish to engage you can take it to PMs but I doubt that will go well and I really dont think you will anyway.

And just for the record, I swing off NO ONEs nuts but my own. Go post in that other forum, you will do well there.

Punk might be a putz, :spit_take :argh: but he IS a respected contributing member of this FORUM. Who are you again?

[punkncat]

Punk might be a putz, :spit_take :argh:

Hey that just.....it is.....you.......are right. ;)

[Beemer]

you do not want my reasoning on why i came acorss so blatant. It would take to long to write, lead to a ban for me..... but if you are really that intersted ask Beemer to ask me at Paintball Sams in a couple weeks and he can take notes on it and relay the info back to you.

What you cant post with pride, honor and respect with out worrying about a Ban? Whats that about. Nobody has to ask me to ask anybody. See My last post I dont swing. Take notes and relay. You must be kidding me. :spit_take Post it up here.

I will be at Sams on Saturday.[Big game] If you have an issue you can find me since I dont know who you are and EVERYBODY knows who I am there. I take responsibility for all my actions, good, bad, right or wrong. :cheers:

[ThePixelGuru]

I... I think I agree with Beemer. Oh god I need help! :cry:
:rofl::rofl::rofl: kidding...

Concerning the thread at SpecOps and wimag's posts here, it's a shame some people can't figure out how to express their opinions civilly. Tact is the art of saying what people don't want to hear without pissing them off; looks like it's becoming a lost art. I've held some fairly unpopular and heated opinions here, and I've managed to express all of them without getting banned. It's really not that hard.

[Chris Nearchos]

Mr. "ThePixelGuru", I commend you for your well placed thought on that thread. It just goes to show how one sided people are (them of their "field").

I still stand by the fact that they are the ones that opend the field up to the discussion with bringing their feild into the picture. So no matter what they believe should/shouldnt be said, Punk has every right to talk about that field from when he was there. and I will go on thinking that if they (the field and its runners) want to complain about the sport or its players, they first must judge themselves first. Once they are perfect (or even close to perfect), THEN they can judge others.

but i guess thats just my two cents....wether anyone wants to hear it or not.

Punkncat--> keep standing by your statement and experience. Maybe you will actually have them questioning themselves for once. If nothing else, you are unfolding their true colors of their attitude and ways on that thread. Good warning for anyone who even thinking about trying that field.

-Chris

[SR_matt]

PC, i skimmed through and tried to read your posts, you didnt seem off base at all. when i was reffing for 50 bucks of store credit for 8 hours (6.25/hour for those to lazy to do the math) we were expected to do that, we slacked off after a while but we still keep things safe and did pretty decent.

if i was getting paid 13 bucks an hour i would be sliding into bunkers, taking bonus balls for players, and bending over backwards. i was making 8 bucks an hour as a lifeguard last summer (just graduated highschool and was entering college) and that was the 2nd year i worked for them with great reviews and i think the lady thought i was on my 3rd year. and if i slacked off people could have literally died. i can see a 30 year old with a degree or that has been in their trade/field for a long time not wanting to work for 13 an hour but a teen ager/ college student making 13 is great pay.

if they are paying 10 refs which at that many people is putting it at 25:1, which is insane still, they are spending half of the income from field fees.

if people are jumping on you that bad they have issues. if a field is that good or has improved that much, people would not jump on your posts, they would have responded with "ya we used to have issues but now we fixed it this way and that way yada yada yada"

i think you were fine, the others were the ones that freaked out and frankly acted like children... not to mention the whole pulling the PBN "you joined this year your stupid" bs

-matt

[Enemy]

"you sir have know honor!" :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:.... would have had more meaning if he knew how to spell no!

punkncat... and one person on here its spelled experienced

other than that you were fine and i totally agree with what you said. I used to volunteer at a field i know what its like to deal with complaints and i always addressed them sternly.

now as a player at certain fields if the cheating is out of hand i simply sit out one game and ref. when i ref its right on top of the 3 closest players and i dont miss much.. and that seems to work.

Now i see his side and see what he means but ive also seen how his shortcomings could be the root cause of the complaints he hates so much.

edited cause i get off on tangents

[Beemer]

I... I think I agree with Beemer. Oh god I need help! :cry:
:rofl::rofl::rofl: kidding...

Concerning the thread at SpecOps and wimag's posts here, it's a shame some people can't figure out how to express their opinions civilly. Tact is the art of saying what people don't want to hear without pissing them off; looks like it's becoming a lost art. I've held some fairly unpopular and heated opinions here, and I've managed to express all of them without getting banned. It's really not that hard.

Cry yi you do need help. :argh: It is a lost ART. What, I didnt ban you? :tard:

Ah so grasshopper, your teacher has taught you well but can you teach others is your test. :ninja: :cheers:

[ThePixelGuru]

Cry yi you do need help. :argh: It is a lost ART. What, I didnt ban you? :tard:
Nah, you got me once, but not for that. I'm over it. ;)


Ah so grasshopper, your teacher has taught you well but can you teach others is your test. :ninja: :cheers:
Heh. Are you gonna start posting "wax off" when you hit people with the ban stick? :rofl:

:cheers:

[punkncat]

I am going to be in Tampa this week. I may try to drop in "incognito" this weekend to see if anything has actually changed at this place. I am not going to be able to play as I have no gear or the cash to actually play, but think I may wander out there on Saturday to just watch a little bit.
I really would like to give the place another chance to make a better impression on me than my first. We will see.

[wimag]

What you cant post with pride, honor and respect with out worrying about a Ban? Whats that about. Nobody has to ask me to ask anybody. See My last post I dont swing. Take notes and relay. You must be kidding me. :spit_take Post it up here.

I will be at Sams on Saturday.[Big game] If you have an issue you can find me since I dont know who you are and EVERYBODY knows who I am there. I take responsibility for all my actions, good, bad, right or wrong. :cheers:

I will be there Saturday as well. I may have seen you around before but i will try to make some time in the staging area so we can have a proper introduction.

[nmib]

i stopped half way threw the first post. totally lame, just like alot of threads on there. he is complaining about complainers? whatever. pansy.

:tard:

[AO Moderation Team]

Edit......Doh, Post misread. Edit to remove comment.

[questionful]

I'll read the whole thread later, but I just skimmed through what was posted since the last time I checked it out, and it just reminded me of all the reasons I left that place. Mainly, it's full of biased 12yr-olds. What can you do? 12yr-olds have to be retarded somewhere, better there than here.