Need to select a gun again (EOS, G3, Shocker NXT, Protege)

[ß.C.]

Hey guys, AO helped me a lot selecting my back up, but now I need to replace my main. I've been looking around and doing a little research and narrowed my choices down to these markers:

Lower end -
Smart Parts EOS ruled OUT
Dangerous Power G3
PM series

Higher end -
Shocker NXT ruled OUT
Bob Long Protege
PM series

I already know that the lower ends are very simple and easy to maintain and the higher ends shoot great and are really consistent so what I need to know is:



1) Reliability, hopefully from someone who has put over 50000 paintballs through the gun.

2) Trigger feel and feel in your hand, this is the most important thing I ask of my marker after reliability and performance.
- Is the trigger snappy or very light? (Like Eblade vs angel trigger)
- Does your hand feel cramped or does the design make you have to hold the gun in an awkward position? (poorly placed macroline fittings, small trigger guard etc.)
- How far is the pull?
- Basically I'm looking for an Eblade 2 type trigger or post 06 ego trigger feel, which is magnetic snappy at first pull but light in the follow through with strong return during release.
- Does anyone know if the Rendition kit can accomplish this?
EDIT*
IT WOULD BE AWESOME IF SOMEONE CAN GIVE ME A SNAPPY TRIGGER SCALE OF ALL THE MARKERS! Thanks so much in advance to anyone who can do this!

3) Maintenance, seems like these guns are easy to maintain after use but what about long term? Is it hard to get service/parts?

4) Quality, does it feel flimsy or poorly made? Does it feel like a lot of care went into the marker?

5) Bang for the buck or value

6) Anything else you feel I should know about (operating pressure, efficiency, etc.)



I know reponding to this thread might take some time because I asked for so many specifics, but any information you can give me especially on the trigger feel will be much appreciated.

Thanks AO for always helping me select the right gun for over six years!
ß.C.

[pmstc]

It's not on your list but may I recommend the Etek Ego? I've put over 20000 shots through mine with absolutely no problems. Egos are just as simple as mags to maintain, oil it every few cases and you'll be fine. Customer service is top notch.

As for the trigger: I have an NDZ roller bearing trigger on my gun, as well as the rendition kit. I've gotten it JUST the way I like it. I, too, love the magnetic feel. Unfortunately, you can't get that feel with an etek unless you buy a star frame (basically an ego7/8 trigger frame for the etek) with the OPTI trigger. I don't think you'll get that feel with ANY gun with a microswitch, but a rendition kit surely helps.

It is definitely a solid gun, I feel as if I could bang it around all day. Of course I would never do that, it's my baby. It's very fast, and consistant (more so now that I have purchased the bump pistons upgrade, I'm getting +/- 4 fps and they aren't even broken in!) also, with the Zick kit, the kick is very minimal. The only complaint that I have about the gun, as with all egos, is that they tend to be loud. That may or may not be an issue for you depending on what type of paintball you play.

I would highly recommend getting an Etek, or if you have the money a used Ego 7. The Etek 1 is a great deal, it's essentially an Ego6 without QEVs and a LCD screen. The Etek 2 just has different milling, a different reg, a two piece barrel and maybe a few other minimal changes.

[GoatBoy]

I have a few questions.

You guys seem to be very keen on touchy-feely things like how something "feels".

I've looked at other markers, and a couple of questions seem to always present themselves, having very little to do with "feel".

1. Is the gun a sealed system? If I put the hopper and tank on there, is there any other way for dirt or debris to find their way into the gun? I tend to like my markers to be more or less completely sealed under normal circumstances, mostly due to longevity and maintenance issues. If the gun has one of those visually pleasing moving bolts and pins sticking out, that seems to be an obvious path for dirt to enter the system.

2. Can the gun suffer from FSDO, or FSDO-like issues? Like, if an o-ring or a set of o-rings aren't lubricated to spec, it may cause components to "stick". Sure, you could over-lubricate them, but then that causes...

3. Do the lubrication requirements cause the lubrication to be blown into the barrel where it can cause accuracy problems? Or blown into any other components (e.g. the Ion's path back into the solenoid)?

[ß.C.]

pmstc - I didn't do too much research on Eteks since the tech of my local Boston Paintball store told me they are good but not worth the money. However thanks to your post I decided not to believe everything I hear and will actually do some research before I rule out that possibility. But one question I have specifically for you is does that rendition kit make the etek feel like an 07 or 08 ego stock trigger?

GoatBoy - You bring up some very good aspects of gun selection that I did not consider enough. I just assumed that each gun (besides EOS and G3) would retain to their reputations as Shocker and Intimidators. However I cannot answer those questions since I have never owned or shot either marker. All I know is based on reviews and retold experiences, but it has become clear that I should do some more research on my own.

Although I hold what you have to say about gun research to great value; I still would like to find a gun that compliments the tendencies of my shooting mechanics. My original plan was to find a pool of markers that I have been told to be fast, accurate, and reliable. Beyond that I figured was just preference, and therefore I put a high stress on the feel of the gun.

[pmstc]

I would say that Etek2s are not worth the money. They tend to be around the 650 range, and for that price you might as well get a used Ego7.

It's not the same trigger feel as the Ego7. Are you referring to the optical trigger? It definitely does have the magnet feel, which I prefer to the spring retuned trigger feel. But, the problem is Eteks only have a microswitch board, unless you get the star frame. So yes, it is more magnety than your typical trigger pull, but it is not 'pure' magnet due to the microswitch. The egos have an option to use an optical sensor instead of the microswitch, which makes for a very smooth, emag/ebladesque trigger pull. In fact, it's the same technology that is used in the eblade.

It's kinda hard to explain over the internet... sorry

I'd recommend the rendition kit for any gun you end up getting, though. It's only like 10 bucks.

[ß.C.]

I would say that Etek2s are not worth the money. They tend to be around the 650 range, and for that price you might as well get a used Ego7.

It's not the same trigger feel as the Ego7. Are you referring to the optical trigger? It definitely does have the magnet feel, which I prefer to the spring retuned trigger feel. But, the problem is Eteks only have a microswitch board, unless you get the star frame. So yes, it is more magnety than your typical trigger pull, but it is not 'pure' magnet due to the microswitch. The egos have an option to use an optical sensor instead of the microswitch, which makes for a very smooth, emag/ebladesque trigger pull. In fact, it's the same technology that is used in the eblade.

It's kinda hard to explain over the internet... sorry

I'd recommend the rendition kit for any gun you end up getting, though. It's only like 10 bucks.

Fantastic, that's why I ask around here. People offers valuable information that should bel seriously considered. I will definitely get the rendition kit since they are cheap and even if I don't like it I would not have depleted a significant amount of funds :)

[Enemy]

its not your list either but as far as feel goes, i dont think that you can beat the dms, the UL frames are very comfortable and the trigger guards are more than big enough to move your fingers, wich is my favorite part! the gun has an actual spool valve wich shoots very smoothly and doesnt suffer from the flaws seen in sft shockers--dont know if they fixed alot of the problems with the NXT.

[B-Pow]

I'd stay away from shockers, I've heard and seen so many horror stories that I just avoid them (along with cronic FSDO issues). DM/PM's are nice but I find them unconfortable because the trigger frame is just too close to the HPR and there is no real "fix" for that. EGOs and ETEKs are nice but expensive, and due to their "agg factor" they tend not to drop much in value even when some users specualte over the quality of the post 06 EGOs. I personally really like my intimidator (fast, easy to maintain, low cost). I haven't seen many G3's around but it looks like a cool marker and the "missing back" is kinda cool and it can't really be mistaken for anything else.

Or you could just prove how much of a man you are and get a phantom as your primary. :D

[ß.C.]

Enemy - I'll definitely look into it, I could very well be mistaken but I could have sworn DMs were out of my price range.

B-Pow - Point taken, that's one of the man reasons I'm switching mains. I don't want to deal with a high shoot or miss gun anymore.

[pmstc]

DMs are way out of your price range (based on the other guns you have listed)
but, you should check in to PMs. I have a PM5 as a 'backup' to my Etek (basically I don't ever use it, it's mostly for a loaner and peace of mind) and it shoots great. The PM series is basically the same thing as the DM series.

[ß.C.]

I'll do some research right now, but I think I ruled out the EOS and Shocker.

[Ninjeff]

dp has steller cust service. I have a Fusion, and it treats me great. They are a smaller company, and arent afraid to chit chat with thier buyers.

[GroovYChickeN 2.o]

I have played with Ninjeffs fusion. It is super slick, solid and fast. If money is a factor get a fusion. :cheers:

[ß.C.]

Wait so you guys would take the Fusion over the G3? Is there a particular reason for this?

[B-Pow]

Wait so you guys would take the Fusion over the G3? Is there a particular reason for this?

The fusion's "engine" is really very simple it's an FASOR (forward air spring operated return) stacked tube and the G3 is more of a spool valve design. So it comes down to prefrence on feel and how much love the guns need to continue to sing. Last I saw fusions on sale somewhere (they are still for sale new I just don't look much anymore as my marker needs are met) they are really affordable new.

[GroovYChickeN 2.o]

Wait so you guys would take the Fusion over the G3? Is there a particular reason for this?

I have never used a g3 so I really can't say if I like it over the fusion. If it is made with the same quality and ninjeffs fusion I would expect it to be a slick shooter though.

[punkncat]

I got to shoot a G3 the past weekend. I am not going to say I was impressed or turned off by its performance because it, like so many other markers today is pretty much the same old stuff.
It is light, small, efficent..all that and a box of cookies.

One thing I do like is the extrusion off the back of the tube that fuctions as a snatch grip. Pretty neat little feature. Aside from that I wouldn't sell my Mini to get one, and the teammate who traded his Mini to get this said he personally preffered the Mini to it.

The Proto series seem to be really decent, and to be honest aside from prestige see very few operational differences making the DM series worth buying over one anymore. With resale on everything in the toilet I am buying nothing but used or mid end from this point forward. With the markers I have I will probably not buy anything until they just cannot be repaired anymore.

[ß.C.]

Cool thanks guys, so basically all guns are the same by performance standards, so I'm just going to pick depending on the trigger I like the best. That being said which trigger feels "clicky"? I don't want featherlight so if you guys know if any of these guns are featherlight let me know. So close to knowing what I want, thanks guys!

[Enemy]

DMs are way out of your price range (based on the other guns you have listed)
but, you should check in to PMs. I have a PM5 as a 'backup' to my Etek (basically I don't ever use it, it's mostly for a loaner and peace of mind) and it shoots great. The PM series is basically the same thing as the DM series.

how are Dms out of his price range, thanks large in part to dye releasing one every year the DM 6 wich is the one I would go with as there wasnt that much a difference in size and weight from the 6 to the 8 go for 550 which seems to be right in his price range and the only upgrade i would recomend is a cp rake trigger and a tadao board.

but the dms do run a really light trigger switch so its not clicky at all.

[ElPanda]

get a g3 or a protege

if you dont mind efficiency and want a quieter marker deffinetly go with the g3

if you want great effiency and a little bit louder of a marker go with the protege

I have used both and they can easily keep up with any tournament level marker, both have great customer support. The protege has a bit more backing as far as upgrades are concerned but DP is working on stuff, and upgrades are out there for the g3 if you know where to look.