so, we are gonna try this again. asking for donations

[cockerpunk]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xgEjkDaebTs

army said we can open another thread, so here it is.

if you guys are interested in the testing we do, and learning the things we test, then please contribute.

if you want to keep paintball stupid, if you want to keep paintball uneducated and about nothing other than marketing to 14 year old kids, then don't.

if you want to flame, it only makes you look more stupid.

[cockerpunk]

Just as a word of advice,

I can appreciate where you are coming from, and the obvious frustration you are feeling; however, when posting a thread soliciting people for donations I would strongly suggest you go about things a little differently.

1. Use correct capitalization, spelling, grammar, and punctuation. Particularly if you are going to call, or insinuate anyone is stupid.

2. Don't call, or insinuate anyone is stupid.

3. Don't make your post at all inflammatory - it doesn't encourage people to donate to your cause.

I don't mean this as a flame. I am a new paintball consumer, and consider myself articulate and reasonably well-off financially... While I have the ability to contribute to causes I find worthwhile I have no interest in clicking your link or in contributing to your testing because you come off as ignorant.

My advice is, in the future, when making a thread like this.. make it thorough, describe what you do and how it benefits the community and then talk about the expense you shoulder to provide this service to the community. After you describe what you do and its benefits respectfully ask people to donate whatever they can.

Not everyone who uses or benefits from your testing will be able to donate - this does not make those people stupid or immature, nor does it suggest they are contributing to the ignorance of the paintballing community; some people just are more financially able to support your cause than others.

Mike

thank you.

we have been posting videos here, PBN, MCB, SCP, and everywhere else for about the last 3 months, and have grown a fairly sizable fan base. we are known pretty well in the online paintball community, and so this short little video was to inform our fans than we are looking for money to pay for some upcoming very large and expensive tests. it is not a general advertising video, or a video asking for sponsorships or anything like that. simply us asking from the poeple who like our videos, if they would like to help pay, they can. it is not a stand alone video.

if you take a look at our videos, our testing and such then decide if you wish to contribute.

as a new paintball consumer, you might like our video on paint to barrel match the best.

[cockerpunk]

give the guy's a break , they got all this " advice " in the last thread , I asume thats why they started a new one with Admin's ok to do it
this is what they want to see ;
Cockerpunk PM me with the PPal i'll throw you a bone

thanks!

the PP is in the info box of the video, otherwise it is gerglmuff@yahoo.com

[cockerpunk]

put it this way AO -

you have me and bryce, or you have nothing.


we have good science, and poor professionalism.

everyone else has no science and poor professionalism.



do you want the truth, or do you want a ****in song and dance?

[brycelarson]

Hi guys, my name is Bryce Larson (blue chunk :D ).

I'm 30, I'm a professional sound and lighting technician and theatrical designer located in Minneapolis. I've been playing paintball for about 10 years.

About a year ago I met a college student named Gordon (CockerPunk) at a random draw, 10-ball, three man paintball tourney. We drew the same team. We killed in the early rounds and totally flamed out in the finals.

During the winter CockerPunk (in full troll mode) started his then latest offensive against Smart Parts. This was the time that Billy G. decided that dipping his toes into the sludge-infested pool that is PBN was a good idea. There were some silly claims made and lots of people looked really unintelligent. Sean from SP jumped in on his white horse to save the day and offered CockerPunk some entries to the Living Legends game at CPX. I took one. On the 8 hour drive down we discussed some claims that have been made in paintball (low pressure guns shoot further, porting effects ball trajectory, SP invented the electro etc.)

This spring a good opportunity came up to test a claim directly - Sean from SP claimed that at the introduction of the flatline barrel there was a shocker that was able to match the low-arc performance of the new Tippmann product. This sounded unlikely, so CockerPunk and I got our hands on a shocker. I provided a good chrono and we shot the shocker side by side with a pile of other guns. Of course, there was no difference in trajectory between the cocker, the mag, the cyborg and the shocker.

Along with the distance test I threw in a quick barrel to paint match test. I, like many other players, chose my barrel bore size by performing the blow-through test. However, I wondered whether that would actually give me the best results.

The first test wasn't of large enough sample, so we did a second one - using CP's emag and a pile of cocker barrels and this is what we came up with:
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pp1UimQwRsMngwmAygIkHfQ (barrel to paint match test v2.0)

It's the first actual statistical analysis of which insert to choose for which paint that I've seen, and has changed how I approach setting up for a day of play.

After this we decided to investigate backspin bolts. We were curious about whether the Cooper-T actually did anything. I won't bore you with the details, but we've now got a testing rig with an indoor location, a target with 1" resolution and some great ideas for future tests.

Some thing we would like to investigate:

effects of bore size to barrel break frequency
low vs high pressure marker operation - is there a performance difference?
maximum range of a paintball fired from a standard vs a backspin system (flatline, apex, etc)

Past tests have used a few case of paint, required mostly equipment that we already had and were pretty easy to set up. Some of our conversations will involve fairly major expenses - both for paint and equipment. This thread is an attempt to ask for small donations in order to allow us to continue to do these tests for the good of paintball as a whole.

It's becoming very clear that CP's years of trolling the forums has repercussions. Hopefully you'll be able to see past that and look at our testing for what it is - a real effort to explore the science behind the game we love in an effort to improve paintball technology for everyone.

On a side note - the response to the other thread was disappointing. I don't usually expect that kind of thing outside of the 'Nation. Thanks to the admins who closed it and let us repost this one.

-Bryce

[brycelarson]

Oh, and I'll admit, our production values are atrocious. I'll rectify that in the near future. We're currently shooting the videos on digital cameras set to video mode. Hence the need for donations....

-Bryce

[belligerentruth]

Excellent post Bryce,

I've deleted my previous messages in the interest of keeping your thread on point. I hope you drum up a lot of support. I leave for 3 weeks tomorrow but when I get back I'll take a closer look at your videos and definitely chip in if I'm able.

Have a great summer!

[brycelarson]

Excellent post Bryce,

I've deleted my previous messages in the interest of keeping your thread on point. I hope you drum up a lot of support. I leave for 3 weeks tomorrow but when I get back I'll take a closer look at your videos and definitely chip in if I'm able.

Have a great summer!


thank you, it's appreciated.

[Hexis]

I don't have dollars to lend in support, but if you guys could use some high quality still photography let me know.

[brycelarson]

I don't have dollars to lend in support, but if you guys could use some high quality still photography let me know.

cool, thanks. I've gotten a few more offers of assistance from other people on other forums. I'll chat with CP on Wed - but yeah, I'm sure some help would be appreciated.

If we keep getting offers we may even sort of ask people to take on portions of bigger tests.

thanks,

-Bryce

[questionful]

If you guys need super hero costumes, I know a guy. . .


:rofl:

[cockerpunk]

If you guys need super hero costumes, I know a guy. . .


:rofl:

oh god ...

YES!!!!!!!

this is a round about way of achieveing the goal we have been looking for - a community of paintball tinkers and scientists. the more people interested in actually lending a hand, to the point where we have enough poeple to run tests independent of me and bryce ... thats FAR better than money alone.

we will be in touch for sure.

[ThePixelGuru]

oh god ...

YES!!!!!!!

this is a round about way of achieveing the goal we have been looking for - a community of paintball tinkers and scientists. the more people interested in actually lending a hand, to the point where we have enough poeple to run tests independent of me and bryce ... thats FAR better than money alone.

we will be in touch for sure.
If you guys start running around in superhero costumes debunking SP marketing hype I think you'll win the internet harder than anyone ever has during the entire history of winning stuff.

[Maghog]

If you guys start running around in superhero costumes debunking SP marketing hype I think you'll win the internet harder than anyone ever has during the entire history of winning stuff.

You might not have to go that far, but you'd definitely be striking a theme by showing up in the same clothing, continually using the same phrases, and giving yourselves hero and villain names, like, "Trevor Truth" and "Dr. Dare."
You could fight each other at an intellectual level and collectively solve paintballs most arguous myths. Capture the imagination.
Dan@Triggernomics

[B-Pow]

put it this way AO -

you have me and bryce, or you have nothing.


we have good science, and poor professionalism.

everyone else has no science and poor professionalism.



do you want the truth, or do you want a ****in song and dance?


how much does the song and dance cost?

But in all reality if PayPal wil llet me (I've had issues with it in the past) I'll send a few dollars your way. At least you are trying to make a diffrence.

[brycelarson]

how much does the song and dance cost?

But in all reality if PayPal wil llet me (I've had issues with it in the past) I'll send a few dollars your way. At least you are trying to make a diffrence.

We're still doing further testing to determine how much the song and dance will cost.... :D

But on a serious note - thanks. We're excited to keep this ball rolling. We've got a ton of good suggestions for future testing and we've got plenty of ideas of our own.

We've gotten several offers of help from other local people. I think that if this keeps growing as quickly as it seems to be it won't be long until CP and I aren't the ones doing the majority of the testing - which would be really cool.

We both would love to see a day where we provide a place to publish testing for conversation, for criticism and to inform the general public, but don't necessarily produce all of it.

We'll keep doing our tests - but optimally, there would be other people doing other valid, scientific tests all over the place. There are certainly questions that I have that I don't have the background or equipment to test. If we pool the resources of the several thousand members of the online community with access to skills and equipment we can certainly produce some credible and fascinating results.

And yes, we are trying to make a difference.

[cockerpunk]

well said! and thank you to anyone who has donated!

you can tell that bryce makes a living talking to poeple, not crunching numbers with other number crunchers ... :( it takes all kinds!

he is talking about some very exciting stuff, mainly our upcomming forum section on the new TechPB.com forums. yes, i got the idea orginally from "deep blue" right here on AO. the goal is the same, to understand the physics of paintball and to take a critical stance and apply some science to the claims made by manufaturers everwhere.

however, the metthod is goign to be rather different. instead of simply begging TOm to post more sweet stuff from the exciting AGD filing cabinet (no joke, im sure i could spend weeks digging though it), the goal is to get a community of players who are interested to do tests, discuss results, fomulate new test ideas, and with a community of players, all contributing expertice, experince, equipment, or finacially, we can really get somewhere.

pipe dreams ... yes, probably.

but we are putting our butts on the line for it :shooting:

[questionful]

I hope this really goes somewhere, it's a great idea.

[snoopay700]

As soon as i get some money in the bank i'll send whatever meager amount i can your way.