New Frame Vote - Pick the frame you think we should make!!!

[Pneumagger]

So I have pricing quotes and anodizing quotes and I'm pretty happy with where we stand. At this point, we need to vote on a frame to make.
I'll put the finishing touches on that model, draft it up, an send it out for production.
Before we accept preorders, we are thinking of producing a prototype so everyone can see what thing looks like in RL.
Keep in mind that this pricing quote includes the frame, trigger, and anodizing (polished or flat).
It does not include shipping, grips, or other AGD parts. Anodizing must be a single solid color choice - no 'color mathing', sorry.

Pictured below are the options.There are three styles to choose from that come in two varieties, Standard .45 and Enhanced Eclipse.
I trust that you can deduce the differences. I will only say that no options are "drop-in" ready for pneumatic conversion.
One frame uses a 15 degree integrated ASA, one uses a -5 degree integrated ASA, an the third uses an extension that fits AGD ASAs.

These frames should work with non AGD twistlock bodies. non twistlock bodies will fit the production frame, but there will be no hole for the twistlock assembly.
I suggest using Doc's A/C twistlock adapter if you rally want to use this on a classic/MM body.

Prices are shown as a $25 range because there are always unknowns and hidden costs.
I do think the lower number is more accurate though.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g45/jrm33/V2UMF.jpg
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g45/jrm33/CAD%20Stuff/rail_frame.jpg

[mpsd]

First vote! :clap:

I really liked the 15 degree integrated ASA and that one has my vote. Still, which-ever wins, I'll take it! Have a Chord V1 and a 10 o-clock EMAX valve waiting for it. :ninja:

How about the trigger? Does that price includes it as well? Can you put a pic of would that trigger look when ready?

:cheers:

[Pneumagger]

We need to hit 25-50 frames for this price range.
If we hit 100 frames ( :rolleyes: :rofl: ), we get another small price break.

[Sundown]

Good job man, I never posted on the other thread but I followed and read it.
Great idea and nice work :)

[matteusz]

At this point, we need to vote on a frame to make.
I'll put the finishing touches on that model, draft it up, an send it out for production.
Before we accept preorders, we are thinking of producing a prototype so everyone can see what thing looks like in RL.

It would be really nice if you would do this. I think more people (even the ones who don't vote or vote for other styles) will get on board and order a frame if they can see once completed and assembled and shooting.




Keep in mind that this pricing quote includes the frame, trigger, and anodizing (polished or flat). It does not include shipping, grips, or other AGD parts.

Gloss black annodized is lovely and goes with so many other parts it should be no big deal.

What about grip screws? Will you be including these or at least threading them the same as other AGD frames?




I will only say that no options are "drop-in" ready for pneumatic conversion.


Ok not "drop in" but not needing further mods right? As in there are places for the parts I just need to know what I am doing right?

Such an awesome project. :headbang:

[Pneumagger]

Gloss black annodized is lovely and goes with so many other parts it should be no big deal.
That about grip screws? Will you be including these or at least threading them the same as other AGD frames?
All grip screws will be included. The end user can supply the grip panel they want.
I see no reason why grips should be provided when most people swap them out anyway.
I was referring to the RTP sear assembly.

BTW, Gruntbull will be doing the anodizing - so no worries there.


Ok not "drop in" but not needing further mods right? As in there are places for the parts I just need to know what I am doing right?
Such an awesome project. :headbang:
You'll need a few drill bits/taps and such just as if you were doing a normal pneumag. No more work than a typical intelliframe and no less work.
Just different positioning. The MPA sits vertically, the 3way rod might have to it lower... but it's all basically the same modification.

[DanMan]

enhanced eclipse is an 80 ish degree frame? right?

[Looper]

Ok, Just so I vote for the one I want... I would like to vote for the below frame with a 15 deg integrated ASA (looking for the MPA Pocket, will that be in all versions?) :confused:


http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g45/jrm33/CAD%20Stuff/rail_frame.jpg

[trevorjk]

either im to tired to see it... but what is the difference between standard 45 and enhanced eclipse?

also, with the integrated rail. wouldnt that lower where the trigger rod comes out in the frame since you are essentially lossing the top part of the trigger frame? if im looking at this right, wouldnt this lower the trigger rod in the grip frame? or if the trigger rod comes out in the same place, wouldnt that create a totally different feeling trigger pull because of the angle of the trigger rod?

just a few questions thats all

[sebastianbalogh]

Wow, this is looking really nice! I much prefer the option with the extension for putting differrent foregrips, but all three arrangements are nice. I'm also very pleased with the price range, very reasonable. I'm dying to see the prototype!

[Hilltop Customs]

also, with the integrated rail. wouldnt that lower where the trigger rod comes out in the frame since you are essentially lossing the top part of the trigger frame? if im looking at this right, wouldnt this lower the trigger rod in the grip frame? or if the trigger rod comes out in the same place, wouldnt that create a totally different feeling trigger pull because of the angle of the trigger rod?


yes, compared to the trigger pivot point the trigger rod will be lower. It will make a slightly stiffer, but shorter trigger pull. The amount of change will depend on how much lower the contact point between the trigger and rod will be.(than the stock trigger and rod) It could be a very significant change in pull depending on the location of the contact point. Theres no real way to get around this since it would cause all kinds of problems if the rod was angled upwards from the sear to the trigger.(it would be possible if there was a pocket milled into the back of the trigger, and the rod was always contained in the pocket...)

On the otherhand, a pneumag will still function the exact same.

[Duzzy]

I think that overall you would sell more units if you went with the rail extension and offered the ASA as a side accessory. Or link them to where they can buy both.

Personally, I would not buy a frame with a forward 15 degree ASA because I find it extremely uncomfortable. Some people like them. Give both options and you can sell to both crowds.

Just my two cents.

[sebastianbalogh]

I think that overall you would sell more units if you went with the rail extension and offered the ASA as a side accessory. Or link them to where they can buy both.

Personally, I would not buy a frame with a forward 15 degree ASA because I find it extremely uncomfortable. Some people like them. Give both options and you can sell to both crowds.

Just my two cents.


Well said, Duzzy, I completely agree.

[UberWigget]

I think that overall you would sell more units if you went with the rail extension and offered the ASA as a side accessory. Or link them to where they can buy both.

Personally, I would not buy a frame with a forward 15 degree ASA because I find it extremely uncomfortable. Some people like them. Give both options and you can sell to both crowds.

Just my two cents.
Agreed.

Imo I think you should go with the the Rail extension and the 15*. A lot of people seem to like the 15*, I'm not to big of a fan of them though. But if you made the rail extension as well, there are many more setup possibilities and I think it would attract more buyers as well.

[[NA]WARLORD]

Although I love the frame in row #2, Duzzy does have a point. Also, if you make the 15* adapter, you need to make it were it will mount forwards or backwards in case the customer wants to change it, like a universal adapter.

[sdawg]

Looks awesome. Will it be tapped for a screw to hold in the ram on a pneumag set-up? could it have a hole and pin for triggering the switch, like on an intelliframe? I'm not sure I'm being clear.

[zondo]

I don't think that either design is a deal breaker IMO, although I'd rank them as (2), (3), then (1). Have you figured out how much weight you are saving as a result of integrating the rail and frame?

[Ninjeff]

yea, i hate 15* asa's. The -5* would be a deal maker for me. And absolute deal maker. The 15* one? a deal breaker. I just cant shoot with the fore grip swept out like that.

Rail extension one? I'd buy it. I voted for the -5 one, but i'd buy the rail extension one anyway.

[LFD92]

I like the -5 and 15 degree, but I too am wondering exactly what the "enhanced eclipse" is. Apparently, I'm supposed to know the diference, but I don't.... :confused:

Also, I don't see it mentioned anywhere, nor has anyone asked. Are the -5 and 15 degree frame's VA gas through? I don't see a tapped port, or even a port at all (but I realize it may be on the unshown side. If neither are going to be gas through, I would have to go with the 3rd shown design...

[mr doo doo]

voted for the -5* one, like the feel of a reversed foregrip compared to a 15* foregrip. and also, it seems like it will fit mroe flush with the body. actually, why is it that the 15* wont fit flush with the body?

[spwz99]

voted for 15 degree with eclipse grips, but i pretty much just picked one of the 15 degree options, that's the important feature for me. :clap:

[UberWigget]

Oh so the enhanced eclipse means having holes for ego grips?

[warbeak2099]

That 15* style looks infinitely better than the other options. It looks perfect!

[garbageman705]

Will these be premilled to accept the MSV2 and the ram thingie?

[chafnerjr]

I totally dig the integrated rail! Though I wonder how this will change the feel of the gun? Probably not too much in the grand scheme of things...Weight is a big factor though. The savings would be quite welcome. Now if you could only figure out how to design a frame so that my mag will operate at 400 psi and I'll buy 12 :D

Seriously though, nice work. I voted for the extension because... well let's face it, all of us like to agree to disagree. Everyone is different and likes different things. I would either make BOTH the 15° and the -5° regardless of grip style or go with the extension. I do have to say that you're offerings are a great price!!! 150 to 175 on the high end of your voting is pretty cheap considering your getting a frame, rail, and possibly a CA. I could be building new mags for way cheaper then before.

Keep up the good work man! :cheers:

[Dark Side]

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g45/jrm33/CAD%20Stuff/rail_frame.jpg

I really like this design. Allows the owner to customize as wanted/needed. Looks as though it would also hide the air line if a Pneupack was used.

[Rudz]

15 degree ftw, sorry guys, but actions speak louder than words, apparantly the silent majority prefer 15* asa positions, im sure if the integrated rail version could get 25 or more votes, maybe joe would make both but as of right now, looks like we may have our winner

[chafnerjr]

15 degree ftw, sorry guys, but actions speak louder than words, apparantly the silent majority prefer 15* asa positions, im sure if the integrated rail version could get 25 or more votes, maybe joe would make both but as of right now, looks like we may have our winner

I don't know about that... 34 votes for 15° and 27 votes (currently) for non 15° options. By choosing the integrated CA he'd be loosing out on half (assuming every vote turned into a purchase) of the potential customer base. By using the extension everyone could get what they want. By skipping the integrated CA he would only need to produce one design rather than two. Seems like a better business model that could spawn further design options... One way or the other, I totally dig the idea of the integrated rail! I wish you the very best of luck with this... if you make some before I build my wife's gun (feb/march) I will certainly look at this as an option.

:cheers:

[snoopay700]

Ah dang it, you put them in different orders and i ended up votind for the one i didn't want to

[chafnerjr]

Just had another thought... am I correct to assume that you could not "sleeper" pneu this frame? You'd have to mill out the hump at the bottom where the grip screws in... not a big deal but I'm wondering if someone smarter than I can think of a way to do it. I just had the thought because it looks like it's got more room in it than the intelliframe, more like the UMF, but you all would know better than I.

[Pneumagger]

Answering concern in no particular oder:

True. It's based off the UMF... using actual UMF design files furnished by Coolhand at Logic. (Thanks!)
So it should lots of room inside.

The eclipse grip panel version will actually be flat inside along the bottom, but I doubt an LPR will be able to fit inside the frame anyways.
You lose about 3/4" when you itch the AGD rail, meaning the MPAs and MSV will sit lower as well.
I'd be surprised if even a Ticker LPR fit under all the pneumatics.
Most pneumatic conversion may have to LPR tapped into the fron t of the ASA with slot milled in the top for the hose.
One thing that the Eclipse grip screw pattern allows is generous room for a 9V, board and solenoid ;)
I predict an EP conversion will be easier than a pneumatic conversion.

We can do multiple runs. I'm just going to go in order of demand. This is not a business venture, really. I enjoy designing as a hobby, so I'm going to do what I can for us and try and produce something a affordable as possible. There is virtually no markup on this part, so if the demand exists to make a run happen, I can organize it... but my goal is not total sales/profit by any means.

Eclipse means it will use the Eclipse/Ego screw hole pattern. this provides more internal room.
Enhanced means it has the internal layout to help with conversions... although some modification (drilling/tapping) will still be required.
The frame can be made in any combination of open or enhanced internals with .45 or eclipse panels.

[matteusz]

Answering concern in no particular oder:

True. It's based off the UMF... using actual UMF design files furnished by Coolhand at Logic. (Thanks!)
So it should lots of room inside.

The eclipse grip panel version will actually be flat inside along the bottom, but I doubt an LPR will be able to fit inside the frame anyways.
You lose about 3/4" when you itch the AGD rail, meaning the MPAs and MSV will sit lower as well.
I'd be surprised if even a Ticker LPR fit under all the pneumatics.
Most pneumatic conversion may have to LPR tapped into the fron t of the ASA with slot milled in the top for the hose.
One thing that the Eclipse grip screw pattern allows is generous room for a 9V, board and solenoid ;)
I predict an EP conversion will be easier than a pneumatic conversion.

We can do multiple runs. I'm just going to go in order of demand. This is not a business venture, really. I enjoy designing as a hobby, so I'm going to do what I can for us and try and produce something a affordable as possible. There is virtually no markup on this part, so if the demand exists to make a run happen, I can organize it... but my goal is not total sales/profit by any means.

Eclipse means it will use the Eclipse/Ego screw hole pattern. this provides more internal room.
Enhanced means it has the internal layout to help with conversions... although some modification (drilling/tapping) will still be required.
The frame can be made in any combination of open or enhanced internals with .45 or eclipse panels.

In that case I want to change my vote to 15 degree enhanced eclipse.

For me the big draw to these is two fold. First it allows for a smaller gun. So awesome.

Second (and this is where I get my wallet out) ease of conversion to Pneumatics. The more you can do to make this happen the better.

For example if you were to mill the channel for air hose and tap the front of the asa it would not add significantly to machining costs (as far as I know) but would greatly enhance the utility of the frame. From a design standpoint these should be simple changes (especially the channel for air hose) that would make my day as someone that would be jumping in on the project.

I say once voting is done people need to put money with their votes. Give me something I can drop pneumatic parts into with minimal efforts and I will give you a deposit for my frame.

And thank you for letting us in on the hobby project. These things are definately an item to look forward to.

[Rudz]

We can always use a reg style lpr on the front asa and run lines to the pnuematics like a few pnuemags I've seen, such as mine or joes, I used a cp reg and some nifty fittings, but I think pnuemagger used a palmers fatty with an extra port, so the lp air comes out the top, hp out of the side, and imput thru the bottom right? I just used a t fitting on my reg, works awesome, thanks to practice target/ loguzzz

[mpsd]

So... Can you start the preorder thread already? There are 70 votes, 38 of them asking for the integrated 15* ASA and 23 with the Eclipse grips. As I voted for the 45 grips but would buy it with the Eclipse ones as well, that makes 24 "orders".

I may be wrong but I guess you could easilly sell the needed 25 to run the first batch and, if it doesn't get there, I may be buying more than one in order to complete it.

:cheers:

[Ruler_Mark]

"AGD Rail Extension with Enhanced Eclipse" is my fav but id buy it no matter what.

[matteusz]

So... Can you start the preorder thread already? There are 70 votes, 38 of them asking for the integrated 15* ASA and 23 with the Eclipse grips. As I voted for the 45 grips but would buy it with the Eclipse ones as well, that makes 24 "orders".

I may be wrong but I guess you could easilly sell the needed 25 to run the first batch and, if it doesn't get there, I may be buying more than one in order to complete it.

:cheers:

I think in part there is incentive to take a thing like this slowly so that it can be done in the most affordable way possible. I would rather wait for a greater number and get it cheaper than get it now for more.

Cheap
Fast
Well Done

You can only pick two.

[DanMan]

whatever frame you do, make sure that you do the vertical actuator cut, that is a genius idea and i probably wont buy one w/o it.

[Spider-TW]

Answering concern in no particular oder:

True. It's based off the UMF... using actual UMF design files furnished by Coolhand at Logic. (Thanks!)
So it should lots of room inside.

The eclipse grip panel version will actually be flat inside along the bottom, but I doubt an LPR will be able to fit inside the frame anyways.
You lose about 3/4" when you itch the AGD rail, meaning the MPAs and MSV will sit lower as well.
I'd be surprised if even a Ticker LPR fit under all the pneumatics.
Most pneumatic conversion may have to LPR tapped into the fron t of the ASA with slot milled in the top for the hose.
One thing that the Eclipse grip screw pattern allows is generous room for a 9V, board and solenoid ;)
I predict an EP conversion will be easier than a pneumatic conversion.

We can do multiple runs. I'm just going to go in order of demand. This is not a business venture, really. I enjoy designing as a hobby, so I'm going to do what I can for us and try and produce something a affordable as possible. There is virtually no markup on this part, so if the demand exists to make a run happen, I can organize it... but my goal is not total sales/profit by any means.

Eclipse means it will use the Eclipse/Ego screw hole pattern. this provides more internal room.
Enhanced means it has the internal layout to help with conversions... although some modification (drilling/tapping) will still be required.
The frame can be made in any combination of open or enhanced internals with .45 or eclipse panels.

Doh!

I would move my vote from

15 Degree with Stanard .45

to

15 Degree with Enhanced Eclipse

if I could. :tard:

[Baddad]

I have a Dallara bodied project and have an Airwalk frame for it, I would like to install a Pnuemag kit and a frame that was made to accept that would get my vote(with or without ASA)

[zondo]

NanoMag...

Have you decided on which profile to produce?

[Pneumagger]

The 15 degree with pneu internals seems to be the mob's choice.

I must apologize - i have been busy with holiday shopping, the Gforce LPR parts, and several other firearm related projects. I haven't gotten the finalized prints to the machine shop for production. I have more than a few days off with the holidays coming up... so more than likely i will work to get the models up-to-date, finalized, and printed.

[Ruler_Mark]

The 15 degree with pneu internals seems to be the mob's choice.

I must apologize - i have been busy with holiday shopping, the Gforce LPR parts, and several other firearm related projects. I haven't gotten the finalized prints to the machine shop for production. I have more than a few days off with the holidays coming up... so more than likely i will work to get the models up-to-date, finalized, and printed.


and enhanced ecclipse :clap:

[Redbeard the Pirate]

So... Can I buy one yet? :)

[matteusz]

So... Can I buy one yet? :)


Foolish newb these things take patience.

[Dark Frost17]

is there one with the for grip a little further away ?

[Redbeard the Pirate]

Foolish newb these things take patience.

Thank you oh great master of the interweb!

Sarcasm owns you :p

[matteusz]

Thank you oh great master of the interweb!

Sarcasm owns you :p


Um how can sarcasm own me when you show your newbness in your response. Making frames takes time because of things like machinists schedules. Anyone that has ordered custom paintball parts would know this. But then you wouldn't get that cause you're a NEWBIE.

:dance: Owns you. Newb.

[Redbeard the Pirate]

Um how can sarcasm own me when you show your newbness in your response. Making frames takes time because of things like machinists schedules. Anyone that has ordered custom paintball parts would know this. But then you wouldn't get that cause you're a NEWBIE.

:dance: Owns you. Newb.

Wow... That is all.

[mpsd]

Let's not forget it! Back to the top!!!

[skyless]

This looks great, im not going to vote now because i dont need another double trigger frame. If you ever get around to making a single trigger frame like this I would hop on the band wagon in an instant.

[tbaggin]

im in for the 15*, either stupe is fine with me

[AGDlover]

I like the intagrated 15* but I just cant see any other use other than pnenmag and the loss of the rail.. while it IS a good design... kinda makes a mag look more like an Ion which is something I know I dont want my next mag looking like. just my 2cents

[legolas]

my vote is for the frame with the rail extension. as others have said this gives the most flexibility--people can enjoy whatever degree ASA they choose to put on their frame. personally I will be adding a 0 degree ASA so my qloader will go on straight... What happened to the snatch grip? I envisioned it curving down at the back end, kind of like the snatch grip on an airwalk frame. Any way you slice it, this frame will be sick.

[sebastianbalogh]

my vote is for the frame with the rail extension. as others have said this gives the most flexibility--people can enjoy whatever degree ASA they choose to put on their frame. personally I will be adding a 0 degree ASA so my qloader will go on straight... What happened to the snatch grip? I envisioned it curving down at the back end, kind of like the snatch grip on an airwalk frame. Any way you slice it, this frame will be sick.


That's a good point, Legolas, I forgot about the Qloader. A 0 degree ASA would definitely be better for that.

[mpsd]

Is it dead?

[ElPanda]

I think joe might have got a little busy

either way I want one of these for my mag so get on it :ninja:

[zondo]

:bounce:

Don't lose focus!

[L3MUR]

is there a new thread for this or is progress just going a little slow?

[mpsd]

Unfortunatelly, it's going REALLY slow... :cry:

Come on, Joe, you can't just put the candy in our mouths and then take it away... Let's put this baby to rock!!! :headbang:

[Ruler_Mark]

ugggg i neeed this

[spwz99]

I need this to take until i get my tax return back... :ninja:

[rawbutter]

Any news?

[kwood]

im still p in the air if i like the ones with built in vert asa because they look a lot like ion frames

[SSP REAPER]

any news on this? I am interested in a estimated weight of said frame-rail. Definately will have to get one of these for my newest creation :bounce:

[rawbutter]

anything happening here? :confused:

[UberWigget]

Wow i almost forgot about this frame..

[paintball72]

Whoa, I really did forget about these. I was really excited about it to. Should I be scrounging up some cash Pneumagger?

[paintball72]

Pneumagger?

[beaver_heater]

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g45/jrm33/V2UMF.jpg

I would buy the top one for sure. Looks great man!

[Dark Side]

A Necropost, but I'm wondering if this was still happening.

[mpsd]

A Necropost, but I'm wondering if this was still happening.

Unfortunatelly Pneumagger has vanished leaving us with our mouths full of water and, in my case, he still has a Palmer's reg and a full EP kit that I've sent him to set up my frame.

[PaintballEngineer]

:eek: these frames include rails! Way cool!

[Dark Side]

Unfortunatelly Pneumagger has vanished leaving us with our mouths full of water and, in my case, he still has a Palmer's reg and a full EP kit that I've sent him to set up my frame.

Hmm. That explains it.

[Carnage reigns]

Ttt Bringing it back from the dead.

[Drix]

Damit, I've been trolled, stop necromancing threads!

[magfan]

I actually just had a thought earlier today about the possibility of incorporating a sear pin into an ion frame, thus ridding the need for a rail. I know, it's a Smart Parts product, but still, it'd be cool to see done.