Pneumag Troubles

[jrod]

I had my pneumag (actually my son's) out for the first time today. Overall, it worked great. However, after the third game out we had a problem. It seems like the lpr (tickler) drifted and I wasn't getting any air to the pneumatics. There were no leaks in the air lines, and everything worked fine when it worked. I skipped a game and cranked up the lpr and it seems to have fixed the problem.

Does it sound reasonable that the lpr drifted? I originally had it set to deliver just enough air to operate the ram. Are there better lpr's? How good is the tickler?

[cyberave68]

Ok a question for you. I have had a f ew ticklers that the knob turned really easy an unscrewed it self a lot. Does yours turn really easy.

Another could be the orings and how they seal. Does it need some oil? or new orings?

As for the quality of the tickler thats is up in the air. Some people dont like them, some hate them, some dont care, and some think they are fine. To hard to tell from all the different people in here. me i've only have problems with the ones that were easy to turn/adjust...

As for how much pressure to use. I start out with alomost nothing going out. Then turn it slowly till it shoots. then turn it about a quarter turn more just so you know your gonna get enuff air to fire all the time...

Hope this helps,
Cy

[jrod]

The tickler doesn't turn too easily. I originally only gave it enough air to power the ram. So maybe that's the problem. Give it just enough and then give it a little bit more.

As far as lpr's go, would a palmer's micro rock fit into a chimera frame?

[Dirge]

And if it's cold, give it a bit more than that.

[rawbutter]

The tickler doesn't turn too easily. I originally only gave it enough air to power the ram. So maybe that's the problem. Give it just enough and then give it a little bit more.

As far as lpr's go, would a palmer's micro rock fit into a chimera frame?

Use tephlon tape or blue locktite (the better of the two) to keep the tickler from drifting.

And you could fit a micro-rock inside a chimera, but your current set-up is probably fine. Try the locktite, and if it fails again in another game, maybe try a different LPR.

[flyingpootang]

The tickler doesn't turn too easily. I originally only gave it enough air to power the ram. So maybe that's the problem. Give it just enough and then give it a little bit more.

As far as lpr's go, would a palmer's micro rock fit into a chimera frame?
Pm mann he'd know. Did you ever fix the problem?

[jrod]

I think it's fixed. Won't really be able to tell until we play again. I think I just had it set too low. Hopefully we will be able to play on Saturday. There's snow on the ground right now (in Chicagoland). What happened to global warming????

[flyingpootang]

What happened to global warming????
I'll PM Al Gore and ask him.... ;)

[Dend78]

I'll PM Al Gore and ask him.... ;)

it was Manbearpig that brought the snow, im serial people :spit_take

[Spider-TW]

Use some nail polish (or something else) to mark your lpr body and adjuster. Put matching marks on them where you usually run and make a ladder or some other marks so you can tell if the adjuster is rotated past a full turn each direction or not. I marked mine (with small scratches :argh: ) and found that it doesn't move at all, but I do have to turn it up after playing for a while.

It is either the top on/off oring losing lube or the tickler sticking. I'm going to change up the on/off orings first, because the behavior reminds me of when we used to use teflon orings on back bottles and the orings would creep into shape over minutes.

[jrod]

Use some nail polish (or something else) to mark your lpr body and adjuster. Put matching marks on them where you usually run and make a ladder or some other marks so you can tell if the adjuster is rotated past a full turn each direction or not. I marked mine (with small scratches :argh: ) and found that it doesn't move at all, but I do have to turn it up after playing for a while.

It is either the top on/off oring losing lube or the tickler sticking. I'm going to change up the on/off orings first, because the behavior reminds me of when we used to use teflon orings on back bottles and the orings would creep into shape over minutes.

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll give those a try.

[Spider-TW]

I took some measurements of the on/off cavity and the top orings (urethane and teflon). There's about a total of 0.020 crush on the teflon oring that starts out at an ID of about 0.116 to fit over the 0.118 pin top. Both orings are standard 0.070 thickness and the cavity is 0.375 ID, so you're squeezing 0.023 out of the two orings.

I think the problem is that teflon orings are viscoelastic and they don't change shape immediately after the forces on them change. They are immune to CO2 and cause no trouble in a finger actuated mag, but they change tension in the on/off slowly, which messes with pneumags. This was more obvious to me when I made my old pneu into an EP mag.

This explains why my pneu often seemed to work right out of the box (where it was stored with the on/off pin inside the orings) and then went down hill while aired up but not shooting (and the pin stays out of the orings while the sear is latched). I knew that quad orings were used in emags for less tension on the on/off pin, but not that there were other consistency issues with the teflon.

The rate of recovery on teflon is also temperature dependent. Way back, we left a micro CA on a marker and in the trunk of a car on a cold night. In the morning we put a 12 gram in it and the adapter oring leaked like it wasn't there. When we pulled it off, the sides of the teflon oring were flat where it had sat in the asa and set up. When we pulled the oring off, it kept the shape that we pulled into it, but later in the day (hours) it went back to normal.

The point of this is that I put a quad oring and shorter pin back in my on/off on my classic valved ep mag because the quad oring has the same inner and outer sealing diameters, but the grooved sides let it sit inside the urethane oring without as much crush and tension. Also, the nitrile material doesn't creep like teflon. You just can't use CO2 on it, but that's not a problem for most pneus.