Prone To Problems?

[Ebbed]

Well gentleman I have a very “noobish” question here, please bare with me. One of my paintball mentors I lost contact with made mention to me today that over 15 years ago he owned a Automag, and he told me that in his opinion the auto cocker was a far superior marker. He claims the Automag was “over engineered and prone to problematic operation” I hate to buy into talk like this but I always notice people posting problems on the forum, and I recall two mags that were dropped off at the pro shop in my home town and left there out of frustration. I know it seems silly to ask people to say bad things about THEIR markers, and especially on an Automag forum. I just always thought these were one of the most reliable markers on the market. So what’s your opinion guys? What problems should I expect. Tell me with all honesty what this Tac One (I’m planning to order on the first) will cost me in ‘down time’.
Thanks for your help again guys.

[Watcher]

The only problems people have with 'mags is one of ignorance. A lot of times a leak here or low velocity there or an issue of some kind can be difficult to pin-point.

However, problems can be solved 99% of the time by replacing an o-ring, really the only moving parts to worry about are the sear and on/off pin and the rest are seals and springs.

That being said, I have an old RT classic that wouldn't even hold air when I got it. A complete o-ring swap out, a few new springs, and it is shooting as well as it did probably out of the box!


I would trust my 'mags to be more reliable than my old tippmann 98. If the Tippmanns are the AK-47s of paintball, the automags are old russian battle tanks!


To further attest to their reliability, it even says in the automag manual to clean it out by dunking it in a bucket of water... :rofl:

There are even people who go years on the same set of o-rings, provided you maintain the gun regularly.


In my experience, Autocockers are more prone to breaking. However, it is very easy to find where they break :rolleyes:

[SkinnyHare]

cost in down time.... probably how ever long it takes you to squeeze a couple drops of oil into your ASA before gassing it up.

i've yet to have any trouble with a mag, of any sort, original 68, minimag, original RT, or Emag that took more than 10 minutes and a new o-ring to diagnose and fix. it's a rare occurrence when i even have to do that much.

[Geronimo7]

most "newbish" problems seem to come from the level 10 bolt system....you will be getting one new. after a few hundred shots you will most likely get a leak down the barrel. just go to the next size smaller carrier using the same oring inside the carrier. after that it's just a matter of oil before play :headbang:

[Beemer]

Tell me with all honesty what this Tac One (I’m planning to order on the first) will cost me in ‘down time’.
Thanks for your help again guys.

Eight days and counting. You still trying to talk yourself into, justify or rationalize owning a Mag? In all honesty if you are educated and informed which you seem to be getting, it wont cost you anything or down time. My EMag is my main and I havent changed or replaced a ring in it in over five years.[level 7] I have had issues with paint and or operator error in the past with some of my mags. IE shortstroking but never have been off the field cause I couldnt tech my gun or it got BROKE. It aint broke I dont fix it.

There is a curve with level 10 and tech but that depends on how edjucated and informed you are.

All the tech you could possibly want is HERE. You saw the tech Forum. Read some more and ask some more. It is here.

Just some more FYI incase you missed it.

Read the stickies in tech. http://www.automags.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=4

See this page. http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/Techinfo.shtml

From above link. http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/manual.shtml

Pay attention and read there is suff here you have not seen. :D

Aww hell dont buy no stinking Mag they suck. ALL their stuff sucks. AGD has been out of, going out of business for over ten years now. There is NO support from the factory or the owners group forum that is A.O. Pay no attention to the links I posted. I could be wrong. :spit_take :cheers:

Oh ya since AGD sucks so bad you shoud get a three inch cd with the LVL 10 with your Tac.
if you dont it is here. http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/xmag/html/lvl10.html

This one is fun and I still go here http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/xmag/html/xtras2.html

Some of it wont apply cause the tac aint an E but still LOTS of GOOD stuff. :clap:

Mags suck. They dont want to TELL you nothing about their product. Everything is a secret. Now dont tell no one else. :ninja:

[secretweaponevan]

I hated my mag when I used CO2 in less than 60 degree weather. I sold it and bought a Typhoon. This was back in '93 or so.

Fast forward 15 years to when an HPA tank isn't $500. I love my mags now.

HPA makes a mag 99.9% trouble free.

[jrod]

The Tac One I bought new several years ago was problem free from day one. I've since built 3 more mags from the ground up with used parts. There were problems here and there with leaks, but a few o-rings and some help from this forum were all that was needed to fix things up.

I think once you get it dialed in and keep it clean and oiled, you will rarely experience any down time.

Remember, forums are where people go to when there are problems. Users generally don't post how well their markers are working (although you do see it on this forum).

[chafnerjr]

Since your looking at buying one new... you're going to have a break in period of about 1000 rounds or so. The sear will be a little rough at first and the carriers and o-rings are going to need to break in... once you get past the initial break in period you probably won't have any issues for the next decade if you use the proper oil. Like everyone else said tuning the level 10 isn't hard... it's just that you have to learn how to do it. The links already posted will do fine but if you look on the main page for this site the first thing you will notice is the lvl10 guide. Read this and you will be the "Mag Guy" in your area in no time flat. People will bring these stories to you about some guy who had their mag for a month and couldn't fix it... to which you pick it up, slap an o-ring or an extra carrier in and fix it in about 2 min, with no tools! :cheers:

[xero28]

I'll admit, I've have problems and down time with my X-valve. This is due though to my inexperience with them. I grew up with a classic valve and could tech that in a heartbeat, though I usually never had to do more than drop some oil in it. I recently got a used X-Valve in a trade. There have been some small issues with it that have frustrated me when I couldn't get it fixed at the field. Like I said though, I wasn't experienced enough at the time to tech it there. With help from the great people here on AO everything is now working just fine. Read up on all of the tech articles like others have said. Know the gun, learn what every part does and why, know this will help you greatly if you ever have issues.

[punkncat]

Get a cocker and mess with the timing, then talk to me about prone to problems....

Lol, really it's all about what you know. Either marker will work out fine. The key is, get it working and leave it alone.

Personally the main advantage to a cocker is that it will operate lower into the tank and will also use CO2. The advantage to the mag is that there is simply nothing to break or mess up timing on.
I use a cocker as my mech marker nowdays, just my current preference. I still think that mech mags are the best, fastest, mech on the market.

[deathbypaint1213]

Both Autocockers and Automags are reliable. You just need to go the extra mile(timing and sweet spotting) when it comes to getting an autococker reliable. I have had problems with getting lvl 10 tuned on my classic valved mag, but it really is not that hard to diagnose problems after a while. I have not had any experience with an x valve yet, but the most you probably would have to worry about is the lvl 10. If you buy the tac 1 and if you have problems you cannot diagnose, we are here to help. :headbang:

[Konigballer]

I'll just repost what I already said in a previous thread just like this one:


I would just say, to add to what others have already said, that AGD markers were designed and manufactured to function with very tight tolerances. This is not like a Tippmann whose design and manfacture is so bone simple, that it can function within very wide factory tolerances. It's like comparing a HK G3 assault rifle to an AK-47, they both function very reliably, but within VERY different design tolerances.

Especially when talking about the LV10 bolt, and RT & X valves, even the tiny differences in o-ring batches MIGHT require you to troubleshoot small leaks if your replacing old o-rings and what not. You might only have to dry fire your mag a couple hundred times to get all the o-rings seated and sealed properly, or you might only have to dry fire it twenty times, every valve is a little different. Once you learn the valve's design, you can usually easily isolate the source of the leak and then fix it. I think thats part of the fun with mags is learning how your mag's individual valve functions.

Also, because of tight design tolerances, if any of your mag's parts are out of factory specs for whatever reason, they will probably cause a problem and need to be replaced. Some used mags have had previous owners who thought they were marker techs simply because they owned a dremel tool... errant drilling, shaving, and God only knows what by the previous owner might not be immediatly apparent until you gas it up and find that it won't shoot right. Thats when you come on AO!

That being said, the design of the CLassic Valve in particular is VERY easy to troubleshoot and maintain. Here is a link to the old AGD maintanance video clips on YouTube. This came out well before the LV10 bolt, but it will help you totally understand how the classic valve works, and how to troubleshoot it:
http://forum.specialopspaintball.co...howtopic=153817

Here is a link to all the online owners manuals:
http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/manual.shtml

[Konigballer]

Also, if your buying a new Tac-1 from AGD just be sure to totally field strip and re-lube EVERYTHING before gassing up and shooting! There have been a few stories on here of people getting basically 'dry' markers, little or no lube on the o-rings, directly from AGD and then wandering why they don't work. Mag owners all know Mag's LOVE oil. I don't want to speak for AGD, but chances are some of these guns have sat around their warehouse for a couple of years, or more, before being shipped. Mag sales haven't been spectacular or anything...

Just something to watch out for! :)

[rx2]

I will say that I still have my Mag from around 94, and I have had three problems with it. One is that I had a batch of on/off o-rings that just did not want to completely seal with my on/off pin, resulting in a miniscule, and intermittent leak. This was shortly after I bought the thing, and I haven't had the problem since.

The second problem is that CO2 would freeze the o-rings in cooler weather. As such, I switched to HPA, and solved the problem.

My third, and final problem, was when I got some dirty air, and it impaired the regulator. Every few shots would spike in velocity by a margin of 100FPS. I ran some oil through it, and it went back to normal.

I did upgrade to Lvl. 10 (without a hitch). Other than that, and the on/off o-ring I replaced, everything is factory original, and it still fires like new.

[JAM]

well, the cocker will shoot flatter and further. ;)

seriously, I was shooting a 'mag back in '91... never had major maintenance issues. Other than using a lot of air, they are always great.

Cockers are pretty easy to deal with too. Once you wrap your head around the concept of timing. Once you start tinkering with them you can get into trouble- lots of aftermarket parts never worked quite right (other than belsales)


I find mech markers easier to maintain than any of the spool markers.

PS- oh yeah, generally shooting HPA is easier on the gun than using CO2 (no freezing or liquid issues)

[Beemer]

Mag owners all know Mag's LOVE oil. I don't want to speak for AGD,

LOTS of oil in a Mag is over rated. A little dap will do ya. We used to and you can run them dry. And you shouldnt speak for AGD since you dont know what you say. :tard:

[thegrayghost]

i am going on my third year on using my classic mag...buying it used, i have not changed any o-rings, or anything yet...it has been a very reliable marker, oil up and play....thru the years i have seen cockers go down all the time....if its not broke, leave it alone....

[Loco_AEXY]

The key is, get it working and leave it alone.


This is the best advice I can give!!! With my wife's RT-ULE I had a heck of a time getting it to work reliably with the level 10 when I first got it. It also seemed that the marker was VERY touchy when it came to how tight the gripe frame and thumb screws were and the bolt would sometimes fail to reset all the way. But after a couple of full days of play it has been flawless ever since. Just needed to get past the break in period.

And don't go swapping out o-rings that don't need to be just because it's been a long time or something. I have caused a perfectly working mag to stop working and need to be "re-broken in" because I changed o-rings that were fine! If it ain't broke, DON'T fix it! :nono:

Good luck with the new TAC ONE (when you get it)

[Ebbed]

Well I have been talked out of my cold feet, i even went as far as telling my friend to read the link to my post. I need one more thing form you guys, I live in a city where there is no pro shops, and only one field 40 min away that has no goods either. If someone can link me to a place to get these "carriers", o- rings and colored springs BEFORE the marker gets here that would be GREAT!

[Looper]

Well I have been talked out of my cold feet, i even went as far as telling my friend to read the link to my post. I need one more thing form you guys, I live in a city where there is no pro shops, and only one field 40 min away that has no goods either. If someone can link me to a place to get these "carriers", o- rings and colored springs BEFORE the marker gets here that would be GREAT!
If you are getting this from AGD, the parts you mention should be included.

On a side note, what are you doing for a source of HPA. I recommend you look into SCUBA tanks for your fills.

[BigEvil]

If your pal thinks mags are problematic, go check out some of the cocker specific forums. :wow: (Or download the 85 page Ebade manual) :rofl:

[Whee McGee]

Well I have been talked out of my cold feet, i even went as far as telling my friend to read the link to my post. I need one more thing form you guys, I live in a city where there is no pro shops, and only one field 40 min away that has no goods either. If someone can link me to a place to get these "carriers", o- rings and colored springs BEFORE the marker gets here that would be GREAT!
AGD online store (http://store.airgundesignsusa.com/)
The Mag Smith (http://www.themagsmith.com/store/)
Tunamart (http://www.tunamart.com/)

Also feel free to check out:
BigEvilonline BST
PBLegion BST
AO BST
MCarterBrown BST

They generally have a good swapmeet of Mag parts.

[Ravenneon]

I've owned my Minimag for near 10 years now-It was purchased back when the Minimag was like 450 bucks--I have never had any problems to this date--never replaced any o-rings, seals, springs,etc. I just make sure shes oiled. Now shes my trusty back up to my Tac-one warp left that was purchased in Feb 08. Not a single problem with her or the warp feed setup--actually I take that back, the prongs that the 9 volt battery plug into had the wires seperate so i had to replace that---but thats it-just an amazing line up of markers all around. TOM KAYE FOR PRESIDENT!

[SCpoloRicker]

well, the cocker will shoot flatter and further. ;)

Dangit, I came here for this.