Thinking about buying a MAC

[Lohman446]

Seriously, I use it mostly for browsing the internet, some limited (non-online) gaming, and word processing applications. I use it more to run I-tunes than anything else, some printing of photos. Limited running of web-based applications. Taking the cost factor out...

Why?

Why not?

[teufelhunden]

Why take the cost factor out? You can do that for $400 with a new netbook, perhaps less if you get one with a smaller screen or run Linux.

I guess if you take the cost issue out, there's really no reason not to - no reason to really, either PC or Mac will run what you want, and equally well.

[Lohman446]

Frankly because most MAC fanbois have never run a PC. Most PC fanbois have never run a MAC. I just want to see what using one is like for an extended period

[Mechanic79]

Don't forget the intelli mac's can run OS X and Windows XP/vista! so you get the best of both worlds.

Don't be fooled, you get what you pay for! and no need for virus software on a mac. ease of use and less hassle using the computer is worth A LOT OF TIME!

PC= Problems Compatible. :-P
or
PC = Autococker
Mac = Automag

:cheers:

[Hexis]

Call me a mac fanboy, or not. Despite only running Macs in the house I'm perfectly happy to crap all over Apple when they are dumb (and they often are).

I own a Mac Pro, a MacBook Pro, an Powerbook (wife's) and both the wife and I are super happy iPhone users. So yeah, I drank the koolaid totally.

I'm a photo geek (own a studio and pro level gear) for fun and side money. I'm an Information Security Consultant for my full time gig. I know disturbingly bad things about most computer systems. I can break almost anything in fun and interesting ways. I also know how to secure and fix tons of stuff. I was a PC guy for years and started down the Mac path when OSX got useful (around 10.3).

All that is just so you can understand my history and point of view.

I love Macs. The hardware is second to none. The OS is great for many things. The simple summary is that I don't have to fight with my Macs, I just use them with minimal maintenance. Since I fight computers all day for a living, I hate doing it in my spare time. Those factors more than make up for the extra cost for the hardware.

I also run VMWare on my machines with multiple guest OSes running from time to time (XP, Win Servers, Linux builds for Forensics/Security stuff). If you find a need for Windows VMWare on an Intel mac can save you a ton of headache. Just get an XP copy and build a lil virtual instance. It's trivially easy and since you are not doing much with the system, upkeep is a lot easier. I also have bootcamp on both Intel Macs and reboot from time to time into Windows so I can game (gotta kill those Zombies, er "Infected"). Since I got the MBP I have been rebooting that to game instead of the workstation so I don't have to log out all of the users (me, wife, shared photo user, etc...). The combination of VMWare and OSX gives me the ability to run literally anything I need to. OSX software, Windows software, linux software. Some of the classic OSS stuff complies up on OSX, others I can run in a VM instance.

So yeah, long ramble.

Summary:
Macs: good.
PCs: annoying.
Macs: expensive, but may (or may not) be worth it to you.
PCs: more affordable and vastly more hardware configurations.
Macs: 3d Gaming? Ha, not so much without rebooting.
PCs: L4D goodness!

Drink the koolaid, join the cult. :)

[Barsse]

DON'T buy it! Get Linux! Seriously, Linux will eventually eradicate mac and especially windows, might as well start learning it and getting used to it.

Linux Pros:
- FREE!!!
- Software for it is FREE!!!
- no crashes, no viruses, no bugs if you use a stable release and don't create bugs.
- fast, not very hardware sensitive - you don't need to spend $$$$ to run it fast.
- let me say again - secure.
- HUGE support community, you can find anything you want, and I mean - anything.
- tons and tons of great software, analogs to almost all major softwares on other operating systems.
- the whole world is using it - why don't you?

If I were you, I'd download CentOS Linux x64, and you'll be all set. I have it on my laptop, and it runs better than a dream.
That i sunless you want really flashy cutting edge stuff over stability, then get Ubuntu. It may no tbe as robust as centos, but it's shiny and still a linux, very user friendly.

[Lohman446]

I want simple, mindless :)

One of the selling points of a mac is a FAQ I stumbled across

How do I tranfer my files from my PC to my MAC?
Bring it in to an Apple retail store, we'll do it for you.

[Hexis]

Yeah, out of the box OSX can handle all of the Windows filesystems. It's easy to move data over. If you do get a Mac, PM me if you need assistance with something.

[Lohman446]

Ok... let me ask this (and sound stupid)

I get my new computer home.

I want to play Ages of Empires

What do I have to do?

[Hexis]

The easy way: buy the mac version. One of my largest frustrations is that the Mac Versions of Windows Software almost always are a separate purchase.

You could also run it in bootcamp or VMWare, but as those require a XP copy (one will work for both) it will cost more than re-buying a single game. It just becomes a better option if you have a library of games, or have games you want to play that are Windows only (Valve stuff for me).

There is one bit of good news, other than the Mac Mini, every Mac has a good or very good graphics card/chip.

[SCpoloRicker]

Buy a MacBook.

DO IT *SLUR*

/currently running 20" iMac, last gen MacBook Pro, and a HP 15" work machine

[Ebbed]

I may not know everything about the mag I just ordered. But computers I know. A littler back ground is in order: When I moved to the Windsor area 6 years ago I sold all my PB gear thinking “I’ll never play again” with that money I built my first computer. Since then I have built 2 more for myself, and 3 for other people. After building my last computer, the one I’m on right now my younger sister went to college for graphic design they told her she needed a mac, so she bought one. My first impressions were “wow that’s a lot of money for not a lot of performance” sorry mac guys that’s the truth, If I ordered the parts I could build 4 systems for the price she paid for what she got. Next thing I disliked about it was the operating system. Yes it is simplified, but I’m not simple. I think my #1 reason for going PC is this, I play games and all new games require direct X10 and graphics cards that macs just do not have. Even if the games are compatible they just don’t have the power. I like knowing that when what I have in my tower is obsolete I can pop it out and put in the newest and best. Try doing that with a mac.
Yes I will not deny windows has problems, but that’s because it’s the most popular operating system that’s used all over the world. You think your macs won’t ever crash or have viruses? Just give it a couple years more dopey consumers will buy into their aggressive advertising they will gain popularity and the bigger the network gets the more things that are compatible the more problems will arise.

Go PC man!

[Swamp Thing]

I have been a PC User 100% until the cluster that was windows Vista. After crashes and loseing info and just plain pain in the neck I got a Mac and I love it. Have had it since Jan and Have not had one crash, one blue screen of death, one issue at all.

I love the mac.

Only thing is that even though you can bootcamp and have windows I find it to not be 100% like haveing a computer running window as primary OS.

If you do not play game much MAC is a very good option.

Swamp

[Hexis]

I may not know everything about the mag I just ordered. But computers I know. A littler back ground is in order: When I moved to the Windsor area 6 years ago I sold all my PB gear thinking “I’ll never play again” with that money I built my first computer. Since then I have built 2 more for myself, and 3 for other people. After building my last computer, the one I’m on right now my younger sister went to college for graphic design they told her she needed a mac, so she bought one. My first impressions were “wow that’s a lot of money for not a lot of performance” sorry mac guys that’s the truth, If I ordered the parts I could build 4 systems for the price she paid for what she got.

There is a price premium, but it's not 400% When you actually compare the exact same hardware (since it is all Intel gear anyways) the Apple pricing is pretty equivelent to building it yourself. The thing is that you can build a machine that will have 95% of the preformance for significantly less than the similar mac. Take the Mac Pros, they look overpriced when you look at a few details, but when you take the whole machine into account they are pretty similar. Keep in mind that they use Xeon, not Core processors. That makes the chipset, and other things more expensive. It also allows you to have SMP multi-core processors. The base model has 8 cores.


Next thing I disliked about it was the operating system. Yes it is simplified, but I’m not simple. I think my #1 reason for going PC is this, I play games and all new games require direct X10 and graphics cards that macs just do not have.

Tell that to my 9600M GT in my laptop. Of the GT 120 in the iMac, or the 9400M in the Mac mini. Maybe the GT 120 or ATI Radeon HD 4870 in the Mac Pro, oh wait also DX10. So that DX10 cards in every mac. Mac suck for gaming for a lot of reasons, but don't just make things up.


Even if the games are compatible they just don’t have the power. I like knowing that when what I have in my tower is obsolete I can pop it out and put in the newest and best. Try doing that with a mac.

Lack of modularity is a big problem on Macs. I despise the iMac series. I see no reason to replace the monitor just because the rest of the machine needs replacing. Not really an issue with laptops.


Yes I will not deny windows has problems, but that’s because it’s the most popular operating system that’s used all over the world. You think your macs won’t ever crash or have viruses? Just give it a couple years more dopey consumers will buy into their aggressive advertising they will gain popularity and the bigger the network gets the more things that are compatible the more problems will arise.


Thinking that the security issues are completely based on the size of the market-share is a gross over simplification. OSX has a significantly better security model than Windows. Vista and Windows 7 improve the picture from XP a lot. There are still some gaping holes in the Windows security model. One of the major things unix has going for it is sudo, or temporary privilege escalation. Windows still pretty much requires users to have administrative rights, and run in that state all of the time. That alone makes a massive difference.

[teufelhunden]

^ makes a good about Vista. avoid. Windows 7, however, is out.... soonish. Probably October, but any computer that you buy after July will be eligible for a free upgrade to Windows 7. Or, you can run the release candidate now, and it is good. I am running it.

[Hexis]

I hear nothing but good things about Windows 7. It's still Windows tho. :)

[chafnerjr]

Buy what you want. I'm MCSE certified all the way back to NT, but I use Mac's for all of my personal use stuff... both work and at home. My wife has a macbook, I've got a MacBook Pro and two Mac Pro quad Xeon systems on my desk at work where I am the ONLY technician for ~750 Apple computers as well as various Unix, Linux, Mac, and Windows servers. The mac's are all a breeze. With all that said, I make most of my money repairing peoples home Windows systems and it's usually the same old problems over and over and over again. I would never waste that sort of time and effort to cruise the interwebs and play some games... (My 2 yr old Mac laptop ROCKS Crysis!!!)

Now, here's the kicker. At the beginning of the school year (The high school where I work: www.brewsteracademy.org and yes I know the site is aweful, but it's being rebuilt as you read this). I hand out laptops to each and every one of our 360 students... and it's at least week before I see anyone with an issue (which is usually "I slipped and..."). If that doesn't speak volumes then I don't know what will.

P.S. My mac runs 10.5 Leopard... Windows XP SP3 on bootcamp, AND the same bootcamp partition in Parallels 4 as well as the newest RC of Windows 7. My wife runs none of that crap and NEVER has to ask me a single question about it EVER!

P.P.S. for the one who said Linux never crashes has never used it in REAL LIFE. I love Linux... I mean that I really LOVE Linux... but they crash every bit as often (If not more) in personal use situations. Yes Linux can run a specific kernel on a specific piece of hardware while serving a very specif purpose, but even the most basic home can't run on a specific software load for more than a few months before something needs an update (i.e. flash, java, or whatever your trying to use in place of iTunes.). Just some food for thought. :cheers:

OH YEA... UM ***WARNING*** DON"T BUY THE MAC MINI*** everything else is just great! :dance: :dance: :dance:

[Ebbed]

I'm flattered i have never been quoted before. :rofl:

[chafnerjr]

Tell that to my 9600M GT in my laptop. Of the GT 120 in the iMac, or the 9400M in the Mac mini. Maybe the GT 120 or ATI Radeon HD 4870 in the Mac Pro, oh wait also DX10. So that DX10 cards in every mac. Mac suck for gaming for a lot of reasons, but don't just make things up.


Not to step on you here... I agree with everything except that it's the Mac OS itself that doesn't have a lot of gaming support (unless you like Spore, which I do). When running Windows XP in bootcamp It's hands down the best gaming laptop I've ever owned!!! Now, there are great gaming laptops out there, but this MBPro with a highly overclocked 8600 is just sweet! Can't wait to see what my brand new one is like when it get's here next month

[Hexis]

I know, I game on my Unibody MacBook Pro all the time. I just get super annoyed having to reboot. I loves me some zombie killing. The 9600M GT is great.

[TippmannGuy]

MAC FTW

Simple and mindless = MAC
Overcomplicated and painfully complicated = PC

IMO :cheers:
choose what you like

[skife]

windows 7 ftw

[tribalman]

BS on the antivirus. macs have viruses too.

as for the PCs are hard comment. no. i know 6 year olds that are using Unix. are we basing what a computer is defined as by it's operating system? a PC doesn't mean Windows operating system, it means personal computer. with the hardware MACs are on, why is there this stupid MAC/PC issue? should be MAC/WINDOWS/'Nix. it's not like it's hard to just install an operating system on a computer. i have always thought that macs are overpriced. i always keep hearing good things about apples, but everytime i walk into a mac store and look at the prices, i just say no. and as for the software, i always crash it. don't know how. but i do. my Windows and linux computers only mess up if i do something to the operating system.

i've also never bought into the hype that you need to use a MAC to do any type of creative work. i have no issues working in windows on music or pictures. not really into making movies.

also, a quick look over at http://www.macfixit.com/ looks like macs have the same issues as every other operating system..... "Adobe Flash plug-in may cause online videos to freeze" "Possible solution for Mac OS X Leopard 10.5.7 update issue 'mdworker'" oh looky, that isn't fully working. only a possible fix. and my personal favorite "Weekly Utilities Update: Little Snitch, MacCleanse, ClamXav, more...

Staff Pick: ClamXav

There used to be a time when Mac owners could laud the platform's lack of viruses and trojans. These days, however, Mac users are seeing more and more exploits and other malware being developed, and as such keeping ahead of the malware developers is a must.
"

hm...... buy what you feel comfortable using.

[tribalman]

oh, and this too! "MacFixIt provides exclusive troubleshooting content, including renowned special reports on incremental and major Mac OS X releases, e-mail alerts for late breaking items and expert commentary from leading Mac authors. For access to all MacFixIt content, sign up for MacFixIt Pro."

so, windows has windows update, macs have gained updates to their operating systems too. guess that argument is dead for macs too.

[Hexis]

A while back I was talking to my TAM at McAfee (enterprise support contact). We got to talking about photo stuff and got on the subject of OSX. He asked if I ran McAfee on my home Macs (since he could send me copies if I wanted to). I asked how many OSX specific signatures there were, his response "Seven". Yeah 7. This was a while ago, I'll bet there are a good 70 now.

So sure, there is malware that can do bad things to OSX. There is also malware that targets software running on OSX (Flash, Apache, many others). A lot of those exploits can effect Linux and or Windows also. Linux and OSX (and other unix variants) have a significant advantage in that even administrative users run in a unprivileged state for normal operations. Windows still doesn't have a way to elevate privileges and maintain the user environment.

Sure OSX has updates, it is developed by humans after all. The advantage is that with OSX (and unix in general) the OS is a series of tools that work together in a predictable way. Windows is like a massive black box that if you make one change to, you may or may not understand how that change will effect other things. I have found OSX updates to be significantly less problematic than Windows updates.

I think a lot of people who have a dislike for Apple misunderstand the "It just works" statement. In general it does just work. There is still maintenance required. There is still trouble and issues. There is just less maintenance and trouble than on Windows.

The whole creative professionals thing is somewhat true still, just not as much as in years past. OSX still has some advantages over Windows for creative work. Color management is part of the OS, not something you have to add. That's not something most folks care about, but if it's important, it's critical. There is also a good bit of really good software that's only on OSX. Aperture (for me), Final Cut tools, Shake, Pro Tools (Audio). They all end up getting used heavily in a lot of Photo/Video/Audio work. Every single one of those tools is really best of breed. Some have equivalents on other platforms, others don't.

Most of the Mac users I know are IT professionals. These are all folks that know a lot about many platforms. They are all happy Mac users because there is just less to have to deal with to be able to use the system.

[SCpoloRicker]

Incidentally, a somewhat appropriate meme:

I work(ed) for Apple; so I'm really getting a kick out of these replies.

Some of you guys are very good at making it sound like you know what you are talking about.

But trust me.... You don't.

I think you just want to make yourself sound smart, when in reality you dont know what you are talking about.

This is how bad info gets passed around.

If you dont know about the topic....Dont make yourself sound like you do.

Cuz some AOers belive anything they hear.

/my honest opinion is: if you want to customize, get a PC. If you just want to learn one way of getting it done, buy a Mac. If you are working with creative software, get a Mac.
//the Autococker v Automag debate of the late 90s does seem similar

[going_home]

This thread has made me decide to buy a Mac.


http://mentalfloss.cachefly.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/bigmac.jpg



A Big Mac !

Not really, I'm actually thinking of 5 Guys lol.


:wow:

[maxama10]

I think that Hexis pretty much summed it up nicely.

I went from Windows to Mac about 5 years ago and haven't looked back.

I was pleased with my powerbook and I LOVE me some MacBook Pro.

Both have been great and I still use the powerbook now and then.

Edit: I'm probably going to curse myself here but I haven't felt the need to run AV on either of em and have had no problems so far... :ninja:

[SCpoloRicker]

Edit:

Clearly, you are not operating behind 7 proxies; thus my Linux custom-built box with extraneous lighting, curved tower, eighteen fans, and more computing power than existed in 2004 has clearly identified your retinal signature, checked all 4 (oh yes, 4) credit scores, and the financial situation of Kelly. Yes, Kelly, the girl you took to junior prom. You probably owe her an apology about all this.

[bornl33t]

I think MS has their hands in too many projects. I mean they have not designed anything in the last 3 years that isn't still being patched. My xbox just fried and it was a whole 14 months old. The thing was supposed to have the most up to date chipset and be less likely to fry because of that. I play maybe 3-4 hours a week and it still died. I tried windows 7 beta and it lasted a whole 24 hours after multiple BSOD, media center not working, etc I put XP back on, which btw was to fix the monster that was dubbed windows ME. I currently use a i910 with windows mobile 6.1. Out of the box it's slow and unimpressive, thanks to xda, modaco and ppc geeks developers it's far superior to the iphone...but that wasn't MS's doing. In fact MS has been promising windows mobile 6.5 and 7 since 2007? I will never own a mac, but I love the toys Apple keeps making because it spurs the industry and that brings the toys right to the PC.

[Hexis]

I will never own a mac, but I love the toys Apple keeps making because it spurs the industry and that brings the toys right to the PC.

Competition is good for everyone. Innovation FTW.

[going_home]

I currently use a i910 with windows mobile 6.1. Out of the box it's slow and unimpressive, thanks to xda, modaco and ppc geeks developers it's far superior to the iphone...but that wasn't MS's doing. In fact MS has been promising windows mobile 6.5 and 7 since 2007?


Android.......
Coming soon to a phone ( PC ? ) near you !

http://phandroid.com/2009/05/20/dell-does-video-demo-of-their-hacked-android-netbook

I love my G1 phone and the Android OS !

:D

[the_anti-ATF]

I got a mac im looking to get rid of if anyone is interested

iBook G4
Powerbook 6.7
Power PC G4 (1.5)
1 CPUs
1.42 Ghz
L2 Cache (per CPU) 512KB
Memory 512 MB
Bus speed 142 MHz
Boot ROM Version 4.9.3f0

Hard Drive 55.89 GB

200.00 shipped

[Spider-TW]

This thread has made me decide to buy a Mac.


http://mentalfloss.cachefly.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/bigmac.jpg



A Big Mac !

Not really, I'm actually thinking of 5 Guys lol.


:wow:
Being Lohman, I thought it was about a MAC-10. :confused:

[Lohman446]

Being Lohman, I thought it was about a MAC-10. :confused:


Had one :) Wasn't that impressed. If I ever rebuy into that idea its going to be an Uzi

[Spider-TW]

Had one :) Wasn't that impressed. If I ever rebuy into that idea its going to be an Uzi
The only two people I've known to have MAC-10s had them auto-cycle. One got lucky and the other had to get his left hand put back together, which was lucky too since it ran the whole magazine.

My son has a Mac computer that does well, but he runs it in PC mode about half of the time due to software availability. It is relatively powerful, since it does a good job emulating a mid-to-high end PC, which is extra overhead in the first place.

Speaking of Macs, I saw a beautiful Mack flat bed delivery truck on the street the other day. Looked to be late 60s, early 70s. Shiny Mack red with dual chrome stacks, dual rear tires and a brand new bed. Sounded good too. :cool: