pnue-mag tuning

[BSSJackal]

is there a guide for tuning a pnue-mag? i have a pnue tac1. ive got it up and running , but its not cycling fast enough. when i try to walk it it wont keep up.

thanks for any help

[CaliMagFan]

turn up your lpr pressure for a start.

[BSSJackal]

its the bolt thats not keeping up , not the trigger.

[rawbutter]

Can you be more specific? I'm having a hard time imagining what you mean.

Does it sound/look kinda like this?

http://www.rawbutter.com/images/paintball/butterspneumag.mpg

If so, you have too much slop in the trigger, and the pneumatics are short-stroking. Install some trigger stops so there's less movement. Here are some ideas.

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=225568

There might also be problems with your Level X, but if it was fine before you installed the pneumatics, it should still be fine.

[BSSJackal]

Can you be more specific? I'm having a hard time imagining what you mean.

Does it sound/look kinda like this?

http://www.rawbutter.com/images/paintball/butterspneumag.mpg

If so, you have too much slop in the trigger, and the pneumatics are short-stroking. Install some trigger stops so there's less movement. Here are some ideas.

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=225568

There might also be problems with your Level X, but if it was fine before you installed the pneumatics, it should still be fine.


the raw butter link isnt working. however i do think its short stocking now.

the build was done by cyberave. got it in trade off the B/S/T forums here. ive gotten it working now im just trying to get it working perfectly.

pics of the guts.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z208/jams419/002-6.jpg
http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z208/jams419/003-7.jpg
http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z208/jams419/004-9.jpg

[chafnerjr]

There's not a lot to tune since it's already installed. The most you can do is change the angle of the lever on the 3way, the trigger, and the LPR (oh and the magnets) :cheers:

[chafnerjr]

Actually I take that back... I just noticed that your 3-way had two bolts in it... so you can't tune that either (cyber's good at it so I'd use his settings anyways)...

[BSSJackal]

Actually I take that back... I just noticed that your 3-way had two bolts in it... so you can't tune that either (cyber's good at it so I'd use his settings anyways)...

i just dont want to chop paint. thats why i got rid of the last mag that was pnue'd. if i could just get it to not screw up when i walked it id be VERY happy

[BSSJackal]

could the ULT cause this issue?

[athomas]

its the bolt thats not keeping up , not the trigger.Slight bolt stick will cause slower bolt action. If the bolt is slow getting back, the chamber does not have as much time to recharge and you could get a short stroke condition.

If the ULT is tuned so that it is not fully opening when the sear is engaged, it could slow down the recharge of the front chamber. Adding a shim or two should help this.

[BSSJackal]

ok , after last weekend i got it turned in better. its not quite where i want it yet. the guy that helped me told me that a QEV on the back of the piston would help my probs a great deal. well i picked up an eclipse QEV and now i can figure out how to install it. in order it have it on the back of the piston the intelli frame opening would need to be 3/8" but it is only 3/16". is there another way to mount it or do i need to grind some material out of the frame?

[rawbutter]

ok , after last weekend i got it turned in better. its not quite where i want it yet. the guy that helped me told me that a QEV on the back of the piston would help my probs a great deal. well i picked up an eclipse QEV and now i can figure out how to install it. in order it have it on the back of the piston the intelli frame opening would need to be 3/8" but it is only 3/16". is there another way to mount it or do i need to grind some material out of the frame?

I hate to tell you, but you got some bad advice. :(

A QEV only offers minimal improvement at extreme rates of fire... like 12+ bps. Are you consistently shooting that fast? If not, you don't need a QEV. It doesn't hurt, but it's not really worth your time and money.

If you want to stick it in anyway, then you don't want to screw it into the back of the piston. Instead, you want to drill/tap a hole on the underside of the piston like this.

http://www.imagenerd.com/uploads/rt-w--pneukit-vE2OX.gif
Or... you could just attach it anywhere in there, like this.

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/2562/insidesjj5.jpg

But I still think something is a little off with your Level 10 or ULT. I doubt the pneumatics are to blame, especially if it was built by cyberave, but you never know. An up-close-and-personal video of the problem would help.

[flyingpootang]

What tank are you using? Also try to use a standard RT on/of with a .750 pin

[BSSJackal]

I hate to tell you, but you got some bad advice. :(

A QEV only offers minimal improvement at extreme rates of fire... like 12+ bps. Are you consistently shooting that fast? If not, you don't need a QEV. It doesn't hurt, but it's not really worth your time and money.

If you want to stick it in anyway, then you don't want to screw it into the back of the piston. Instead, you want to drill/tap a hole on the underside of the piston like this.

http://www.imagenerd.com/uploads/rt-w--pneukit-vE2OX.gif
Or... you could just attach it anywhere in there, like this.

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/2562/insidesjj5.jpg

But I still think something is a little off with your Level 10 or ULT. I doubt the pneumatics are to blame, especially if it was built by cyberave, but you never know. An up-close-and-personal video of the problem would help.

actually , yes i do consistently shoot over 12 bps. between constant practice at it and playing lead guitar all my life i can consistently pull 15 bps and peak to 18bps. im actually just about done with the QEV install. we will soon find out if that solves my issues.

wish i had a vid camera to shoot with , but i dont.

[BSSJackal]

What tank are you using? Also try to use a standard RT on/of with a .750 pin

i use a ninja air @ 800 psi for a tank. i did switch to the RT on of over the weekend to get it working. but it wasnt as walkable that way.

[om3n]

i use a ninja air @ 800 psi for a tank. i did switch to the RT on of over the weekend to get it working. but it wasnt as walkable that way.


why was it not as walkable?..

And I think your gonna need more input than 800 psi.

[athomas]

i use a ninja air @ 800 psi for a tank. i did switch to the RT on of over the weekend to get it working. but it wasnt as walkable that way.Most of the walkability should come from the trigger assembly and how light and responsive it is. The on-of will affect your recharge rate and the amount of pressure your actuator needs to supply. If you use a ULT on-off, then your LPR operating pressure can be quite low, so your trigger pull force requirement will also be very low. A retro on-off assembly requires more force so your LPR pressure requirement will be higher resulting in a higher trigger pull force. The retro on-off is a faster responding assembly because it gets more force applied to reset it. The ULT is more critical in its tuning.

The air tank will be fine. 800 psi should operate ok on most mag setups. Many people use higher outputs to get more kickback on their triggers or for even faster recharge, but the guns work fine at anything higher than 750 psi (based on using a red bolt spring).

[Adam45]

Yes 800 psi should theoretically be fine but I found with my pnues that 1000 psi at the bottle was allot more responsive.

I would first double check the output on the bottle and make sure its giving at least 800 psi. I had one reg that was only at 750ish and it made a big difference.

I also had a 90 degree braided hose fitting that when the hose was tightened down would allow the air passage to be partially covered. The air flow was very restricted and the valve would not keep up.

An adjustable bottle reg is a good investment.

[BSSJackal]

Yes 800 psi should theoretically be fine but I found with my pnues that 1000 psi at the bottle was allot more responsive.

I would first double check the output on the bottle and make sure its giving at least 800 psi. I had one reg that was only at 750ish and it made a big difference.

I also had a 90 degree braided hose fitting that when the hose was tightened down would allow the air passage to be partially covered. The air flow was very restricted and the valve would not keep up.

An adjustable bottle reg is a good investment.

unfortunately no one is making an "ASA" tank with 1000 psi output, now that nitro duck has gone out of business . i can get the ninja tank up to 900 , but then i will have a hard time using it with any of my other guns. if it ends up being that much of an issue ill simply trade it for a standard ule mag style mag.