scuba/scba tanks

[kcombs9]

was looking at getting a scuba/scba tank for TK's mini compressor and I wanted to know what they mean by 30-45min. I assume that's how long it will supply air but how do I figure the cu inch. Or how many times a 4500 45min scba tank will fill my 88/4500.

thanks

[RossT]

http://www.scubatoys.com/paintball/scubafills2.asp

What I did was buy a luxfer 106 and a regular 80 cu ft scuba and I fill the paintball tanks off the 80cu ft scuba 1st then top them off from the 106 which is a 300 bar tank. I think I can usually fill about 10 tanks before my 106 tank drops below 3,000. It would be better to have a couple of the 106's but they are $400 each and the 80's are like 150.

[kcombs9]

what I have in mind is a 45min 4500psi scott scba tank.

[RossT]

I think a 45 minute tank is only about 60 cubic feet iirc so it would drop pressure a lot faster than a larger scuba. I believe SCBA tanks also have a different connection than scubas, which have either a DIN or yolk connector on them. Most of the paintball fill stations you buy fit the yolk connector but there is a DIN to yolk adapter for $40 that you put on the 300 Bar cylinders.
http://www.divesports.com/XS-Scuba-300-Bar-DIN-Filler-Adapter-p/xs-ac-375.htm

To fill a Scuba off the mini compressor all you need is a hose with 1 male end like a paintball tank that hooks into the fill station and the other end a female to hook to the compressor. I have a feeling that rigging something to SCBA would be harder unless it is a yolk connector on the top of those bottles.

[RehKal]

what I have in mind is a 45min 4500psi scott scba tank.


I'm by far not an expert on the subject. But I've never seen a scba tank that holds more than 3k psi. I would imagine there is, but I've never seen it.

[Ando]

http://www.scuba.com/scuba-gear-200/043201/XS-Scuba-106-Cubic-Foot-Aluminum-Hoop-Wrap-Tank.html

[rawbutter]

You can find used SCBA tanks for pretty cheap. Fire fighting stations are always selling old models that you can pick up if you watch eBay patiently. For the price, they're pretty comparable to SCUBA tanks. A small SCBA tank costs more than a larger SCUBA tank, but since you can fill it with more psi, they even out for the most part.

The biggest factor for SCBA tanks is actually the fittings. You can't just use normal SCUBA fittings because they're not rated for 4500 psi. You need to get something like this.

<a href="http://www.hamcontact.com/airgun/HoseAssembly/Male%20Foster-SCBA.jpg"><img src="http://www.hamcontact.com/airgun/HoseAssembly/Male%20Foster-SCBA.jpg" width="600" height="250"></img></a>

I found this on this website (http://www.hamcontact.com/airgun/HoseAssembly/) about halfway down the page. It costs $80.

Now, that fitting will only allow you to fill the SCBA tank from Tom's new super compressor. To get the air out of the SCBA into your paintball tank, you'll need one of these.

<a href="http://www.hamcontact.com/airgun/HoseAssembly/hoseassembly.jpg"><img src="http://www.hamcontact.com/airgun/HoseAssembly/hoseassembly.jpg" width="600" height="350"></img></a>

That sucker costs about $180.

So, even if you find a nice used SCBA tank on eBay for about $100 (which is hard to do), you're going to spend another $200 on fittings. :mad:

And that's why I bought a SCUBA tank. ;)

Edit: And if you buy a 4500 psi SCUBA tank (not SCBA), the problem is still the same. Standard SCUBA fittings are rated for 3000 psi, not 4500, and that extra 1500 psi about triples the cost of any fitting.

[kcombs9]

I'm by far not an expert on the subject. But I've never seen a scba tank that holds more than 3k psi. I would imagine there is, but I've never seen it.

http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/store/Scott-4500psi-45min-SCBA-Bottle-Composite-Cylinder_200409927506.html

[Big'n slo]

I use 4.5k SCBA bottle for fills, rawbutter is dead on with the cost of the fittings and adapters.

If you can find one in hydro (remember to check the date, most companies will only get rid of them if they don't pass hydro or completely change makes) and cheap enough they are great,otherwise 3k SCUBA will be much easier to use, maintain and adapt.

[kcombs9]

my contact has 7 45min 4500psi tanks with 08 hydro stickers. 50$ each +shipping

But again how many fills will it give I'm sure its less then a big scuba tank, but if I am going to get a tank and the compressor I don't want to replace my 88/4500 tank for a 3000 or only fill it to 3000. Iv had enough of that from my local field. I want a Full fill :shooting:

the only other advantage with the 3000 scuba tanks is then I can fill my friends 3000 tanks and mine up to 3000... Grrr...

[Big'n slo]

my contact has 7 45min 4500psi tanks with 08 hydro stickers. 50$ each +shipping

But again how many fills will it give I'm sure its less then a big scuba tank, but if I am going to get a tank and the compressor I don't want to replace my 88/4500 tank for a 3000 or only fill it to 3000. Iv had enough of that from my local field. I want a Full fill :shooting:

the only other advantage with the 3000 scuba tanks is then I can fill my friends 3000 tanks and mine up to 3000... Grrr...


I never really kept track of my fills.
I'd say I get 4 to 5 68ci fills above 3k then another 4 till I'm below 2k.
My SCBA is never filled to 4.5k, I usually get around 4.1k

Remember, just estimates.

[rawbutter]

my contact has 7 45min 4500psi tanks with 08 hydro stickers. 50$ each +shipping

But again how many fills will it give I'm sure its less then a big scuba tank, but if I am going to get a tank and the compressor I don't want to replace my 88/4500 tank for a 3000 or only fill it to 3000. Iv had enough of that from my local field. I want a Full fill :shooting:


That's a nice price for those 45min tanks... IF they're in hydro. If they're not in hydro, it's going to cost you another $30 to get that done. And you're going to have to ship it to the place to get it hydro'd. (And remember... you still have to pay shipping to get it from your contact, and that is probably going to be $30 or $40.)

As for the number of fills... If I remember correctly, those 45 minute tanks will get you about 15-20 decent fills, depending on the size of your tank. If you're using a 68/4500, you can probably expect about 15 nice fills. After that, you can't get your little tank much above 2000psi, and you'll be spending more time walking back and forth to the fill station that actually playing.

[rawbutter]

By the way, I ended up giving up on SCBA tanks when I found this.
http://cgi.ebay.com/HP-100-Scuba-Diving-Tank-Cylinder-3442psi-w-Valve_W0QQitemZ200432694934QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_D efaultDomain_0?hash=item2eaab83696

It's a 3500psi SCUBA tank. (I found one on eBay for only $150.) You can use all the cheap, normal SCUBA fittings and get it filled at any dive shop, but it holds a LOT more air than a standard 80 cubic feet SCUBA tank. I have one, and I share the air with three friends who all have 68/4500 tanks, and we can play for two afternoons before it runs too low. Granted, on that second afternoon we may need to fill up twice or three times, but it's managable.

[DoubleDutch]

I am using my wife's old SCUBA tanks, and while they are only 3K psi, she has DIN valves (as opposed to yoke) on them because she used to do a lot of technical diving. So, I could not use regular yoke-style fill adapters. Then I found these on eBay for $25, much better than $80 or $180.

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-SCUBA-PAINTBALL-DIN-VALVE-FILL-ADAPTER_W0QQitemZ280446630144QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_0?hash=item414bebf900

This fill adapter is rated to 4500 psi, it has a gauge, and it has a push button purge.

From what I understand, any SCUBA tanks that are over 3K psi will have DIN valves because Yoke valves are are only rated for 3000 psi. I had been wondering about SCBA tanks, what valves they use, but it sounds like from this thread that they use DIN valves too? So I could conceivably get a SCBA tank and use this fill adapter. My local paintball place filled my SCUBA tanks through this fill adapter, they had a male-male QD adapter that they used to hook up to their fill station.

[kcombs9]

^^^

Awesome info.

Now if I wanted to fill a 3000 tank from the 4500 scba is that going to be a problem?

I would probably only do it once the scba is below 3000 psi

[DoubleDutch]

I would think that would be ok, especially if the SCBA is under 3K. Even if it is over 3K, you could crack the valve slowly and watch the gauge on you tank to make sure you don't go over 3K, I think that is how PB places do 3K bottles anyway?

[RehKal]

I've been considering buying a scuba tank and setting it up to feed air directly into my markers via quick change adaptor. This wouldn't be for play, just for testing/tweaking the markers at home. My nearest paintball shop/scuba shop is at least 45 minutes away. So I'm going to guess that a scuba shop would have everything I need to be able to hook one up to the quick change adaptor? Regulator, hose and adaptors?

[RossT]

I've been considering buying a scuba tank and setting it up to feed air directly into my markers via quick change adaptor. This wouldn't be for play, just for testing/tweaking the markers at home. My nearest paintball shop/scuba shop is at least 45 minutes away. So I'm going to guess that a scuba shop would have everything I need to be able to hook one up to the quick change adaptor? Regulator, hose and adaptors?

http://paintballgateway.com/niscyofist.html just buy that it's a lot cheaper than buying a reg and hose and adapters.

[DoubleDutch]

http://paintballgateway.com/niscyofist.html just buy that it's a lot cheaper than buying a reg and hose and adapters.

This would be unregulated though, so you'd be feeding potentially 3000 psi into your marker. Mags can handle it I guess, but you might have some crazy RT :) And your hose would need to handle it too.

To connect a marker straight to a tank, you could have a fill adapter, connected to a hp hose with a male qd on one side and a female on the other (like a Ninja Whip), that is connected to a regular PB tank's fill nipple, that is screwed into the marker. That way you are using the tank's regulator, but it is being constantly replenished from the SCUBA tank.

[RehKal]

This would be unregulated though, so you'd be feeding potentially 3000 psi into your marker. Mags can handle it I guess, but you might have some crazy RT :) And your hose would need to handle it too.

To connect a marker straight to a tank, you could have a fill adapter, connected to a hp hose with a male qd on one side and a female on the other (like a Ninja Whip), that is connected to a regular PB tank's fill nipple, that is screwed into the marker. That way you are using the tank's regulator, but it is being constantly replenished from the SCUBA tank.


Took me a minute to figure out what you meant. I think I'd rather just get a regulator of some kind... I'll have to look at prices an such and a steel braid remote. I want to play with the pressure and RT effect but I don't want the full 3k psi going into my marker.

[DoubleDutch]

Upon further googling it seems that SCBA tanks do not have DIN threads as I might have suggested earlier, but rather CGA 347 threads. So, you would need the $180 fill adapter rawbutter posted above, as opposed to the one I have.

The highest PSI SCUBA tank I found was the Luxfer 106, it goes to 4350 PSI, but it costs about $400, has a 3 year hydro, and a 15 year life. You could still use the DIN fill adapter that I have. There was also something called a Heiser 190 at 4400 PSI, but it weights 87 lbs empty. Good thing is that it is steel so it should have a 5 year hydro and no expiration.

If you have $695 laying around, you could get this thing, I bet TK's mini compressor could fill this in 4 days or so: http://www.pyramydair.com/s/a/Carbon_Fiber_Tank_4500_psi_88_cu_ft/350

[RossT]

This would be unregulated though, so you'd be feeding potentially 3000 psi into your marker. Mags can handle it I guess, but you might have some crazy RT :) And your hose would need to handle it too.

To connect a marker straight to a tank, you could have a fill adapter, connected to a hp hose with a male qd on one side and a female on the other (like a Ninja Whip), that is connected to a regular PB tank's fill nipple, that is screwed into the marker. That way you are using the tank's regulator, but it is being constantly replenished from the SCUBA tank.

I mean't just to just fill your tank off the scuba and then put the tank on the gun like it was supposed to be done. Rigging HPA is never a good idea.