Z-grip/Y-grip pros & cons

[Konigballer]

Hey guys, I wanted to get some opinions from Z-grip/Y-grip users on how they actually feel to play with on the field. Of course they look cool but I have no way of using one without actually buying one so I wanted to comb AO for user experiences. Some AO'ers have probably been using these for a few years now I figure, so that experience will be invaluable.

I'm an agressive 'run and gun' front type player, are these grip frames suitable for this at all, or more for back players?

Is there any wrist strain/discomfort at the end of the day? I know they were designed to be more ergonomic than the standard .45 frame.

Is advisable to use drops with these frames, or is it easier to shoulder without any?

[Fred]

i wouldn't call either a "run and gun" type. They're at their best when tucked up tight.

[kcombs9]

i wouldn't call either a "run and gun" type. They're at their best when tucked up tight.

Agreed I used a "Z" grip for half a year. The hard part is finding a drop to put the tank reg out of the way so you can grip the grip properly.

It turns heads for sure but its not best for aggressive playing IMO

[Phantom_Mag]

Not to mention, your first shots will almost always be low in a run an gun situation, untill you can relearn how to shoot at the reverse angle.

I played front back in the day, got a y-grip, and basically destroyed any fluid motion of run and gun i had going for me.

[flyingpootang]

I have a RT Classic pneumaged Zgrip. While it's not at all comfortable it's more the unique factor....

[luke]

Agreed I used a "Z" grip for half a year. The hard part is finding a drop to put the tank reg out of the way so you can grip the grip properly.

IMO

Really? I guess you never tried this>

http://www.lukescustoms.com/Page27_Misc_Parts_Services/Offset_rail_2.jpg

http://www.lukescustoms.com/page0027.htm

[Walking Stick]

I agree with the others that neither are good when running. It's awkward and the angle just doesn't let you get a strong grip on the marker. The Y is a better choice than the Z in this situation though.

When playing up front and tight, however, both feel great. It's a very comfortable hand posture but you may feel like that arm has been doing an extended military press at the end of the day compared to 45's. Nothing bad, just different. You may also find the bottom of the trigger guard uncomfortable between your middle and ring fingers--this is readily more apparent on the Z. I more or less keep my fingers flared or curled and offset rather than finding a full, solid grip.

The KAPP Drop Zone & Cradle is amazing here. You can position the tank anywhere from 1 to 11 o'clock and move it forward or back so it's a perfect and comfortable fit.

[reckid1986]

i love the feel of the y grip. it lets you tuck you gun in tight. its easier on my wrist when i have to stay tucked close to a bunker and it helps me make faster pop shots. i have also used a z grip. it was nice for the same reasons but it is a little harder to find a setup that suits your needs. lukes kit pictured above wouldv'e helped for sure on the z. my next frame that im going to try is the M-90, but i would recommend the y grip for a back or mid player style. it also helped in the snake when i had to stay low. just my opinion

[Konigballer]

thanks for the info guys! Thats what sucks about being the only magger you know in your general area, you can't try anything different without actually having to buy it.

Good post Walking Stick, I never thought of the trigger guard being uncomfortable. I like to have a solid grip on my trigger frame. I might have to stick to my conventional .45's, the price of a Z-grip would be alot just for a 'unique' gun I could never use comfortably.

[Whee McGee]

I am the kind of guy who runs headlong into battle, and when I got semi, it's almost always my Z-framed Mag. To answer your questions, I have no discomfort at the end of the day, the way my Mag is set up is incredibly comfortable, I find that the way I have mine set up allows me to get up close and personal. :D
I would suggest either a drop or some sort of offsetting rail, as the type of ASA can compete for the space for your wrist.

Here's a shot of how I used to run it with Lukes offset rail. Highly recommended, but limits which hand you use when you play....
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc58/WheeMcGee/Paintball/My%20guns/Automag002.jpg

Here's my current setup, with an Endo cradle...
ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC. The whole setup essentially sits on my shoulder, and ends up being incredibly compact.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc58/WheeMcGee/Paintball/My%20guns/1008081429a.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc58/WheeMcGee/Paintball/My%20guns/PICT1159.jpg

[Ando]

Blasphemy....Your all going to hell!!! :rofl:

I have no clue what these guys are talking about. Different strokes for different folks. The Z-Grip is 100000000% more comfortable then any 45 frame you'll ever shoot. Like you stated, it keeps your wrist in a ergonomically correct state instead of a bent awkward one like you'd get with a compact setup and a 45 frame.

http://i29.tinypic.com/s64sna.jpg

At the end of the day your wrist isn't feeling like it gone through a cheese grater due to the fact that all the weight is supported in the palm of your hand instead of the top part of your thumb in-which all that weight is transferred right over to your wrist. That's the only draw back to a heavy *** mag. Not only that but the webbing between your thumb and index finger isn't all beat to hell by the field strip screw.

Yes, your shots will be off the first couple of games but like anything new to your shooting style, you'll adapt and over come it. The learning curve is minimal at best. I play with my Z setup more then anything I have and will put it against anything out there in a close quarter fount line setup which is where I am 85% of the time. They are not hard to run around with and your run and gun will only get better.

http://i29.tinypic.com/261m691.jpg
http://i26.tinypic.com/3523fxg.jpg

Speaking of setups. That's the #1 thing for a Z-Grip. I have a dog bone similar to what Luke has that off-sets the tank, away from your wrist. That's about the only down side to the Z. I actually have one of Lukes offset rails incoming here pretty soon believe it or not :D but cretin dropforward will work too.

Look through this thread and you'll see plenty of setups.
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=245359&page=1&pp=30&highlight=z-grip
BTW...None of those infidels that posted had any insight in that thread. Should tell you something.

You'll have to experience it for yourself though, if you can find one. :rolleyes:

Like most things this unique, you can't go by what others say but if you don't like it, you could always re-sell it here. Someone will def take it off your hands.

[kcombs9]

Really? I guess you never tried this>

http://www.lukescustoms.com/Page27_Misc_Parts_Services/Offset_rail_2.jpg

http://www.lukescustoms.com/page0027.htm

No cause I knew that wasn't the angle I was looking for.

[chafnerjr]

I wish I had a picture of my brother's z-gripped mag. He loves it... though it's in the middle of a epneu project at the moment so it's in pieces. I've never owned one but I've played on them and I think that they are far more comfortable in an upright shooting position as your wrist and hand don't have to bend in any way to accommodate the frame. It also allows you to keep a very very tight package between the marker the airtank (with a kick back ASA of some sort) and yourself. Very very easy to RT on as well!!!

With that said I don't personally own one and probably won't as I shoot from varying positions and sometimes I even lay prone on the ground... which is very difficult to do with a Z-Grip.

P.S> Try to get to a mag gathering somewhere... you might have to travel but it will be worth it to check out the various items that are out there! :cheers:

[gunangel]

i've had a z grip in one form or another for a few years. definitely the most comfortable way to hold a marker imo. you have to bring the marker up more because of the angle but you can be super tight wherever you play (like snake :)). i can't honestly say i remember the last time i've held the actual frame, i just rest my fingers on the trigger and support the weight on my shoulder and forgrip. for the previous mag i had one of lukes foregrip extenders at 25*, but for my current one he made me a custom one at 45* and the marker is very very very very comfortable to hold.

whee mcgee i hate you for having that drop! can't find one for the life of me...for anyone curious there are two types the 45* and the 30*, the 45* one buts the tank up at an extreme angle, i had my 68 line up with the top of my feedneck....and guess which one is harder to find....

[Konigballer]

Mmm... Ando and Whee McGee have giving me new hope for maye giving the Z-grip a shot as an agressive player. Of course, I can't even fully start this new build project until after I get married in June, but I'm trying to knock out my research early. I just want to clarify a couple things:

1. If I use a am/mm rail, eclipse rail, omega rail, etc, I have to get a Z-grip with wings, correct?

2. If I use a RT, or newer RPG derrived rail I have to use a Z-grip thats 'wingless', correct?

[gunangel]

for a classic rail you need a classic z grip. for a rt rail you need an rt z-grip. however an rt z-grip can be used on a classic rail (you need a rt rail bushing spacer) and you can use a classic on an rt rail (you need the wings milled off.

[athomas]

To get the most benefit from the Y grip or Z grip, use a bottle adapter that is mounted under the grip. This makes a good shoulder stock with the bottle and also allows your wrist to fit comfortably in front of the fat part of the bottle.

I don't have a Y grip, but I shoot a 90 degree frame on my retro mag and my Angel. I love it, but a lot of guys that are used to 45 grips have a hard time to shoot it. Even they unanimously agree that it is comfortable on the wrist.

[RehKal]

I wouldn't say I am an agreesive player but I love my Z-Grip. I don't run with air on marker but some of the pictures above would make good setups for it.

The thing I like about the Z is the lack of stress it places on the wrist. It's important for me due to my suffering through carpel tunnel and rhuematoid arthritis!

Overall setup is 19" long.
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/RehKalMurloq/PaintballStuff/zmag1.jpg

You can see how my hand/wrist orientation in this image pretty well and you can really see how tight the setup it.
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/RehKalMurloq/PaintballStuff/paintballgear2.jpg

[GoatBoy]

Nobody "runs and guns" holding their grips out in front in pistol form the way a pistol grip was designed to be held in the first place, unless they have a giant stock on the back of their gun.

If you keep it tight, then guess what your hand's going to wind up looking like?

Go out and take some video of yourself and watch what you actually do with your grip/gun when you run. All of you.

[Mueller]

**super-necropost acknowledged. I looked at this thread a lot so thought it best to contribute/continue it**

For those who might read above and take away that a z-grip is NOT good for run-and-gun, my experience was "really not too bad".

I'm a fairly aggressive player, a runner. My experience specifically on run & gun was....
••• pistol grip: I run body tilted down, the "dash pose". Shootable -- but there's a huge compromise between aim/speed. You cant keep it tight and really run hard.
••• Z grip with an angle tank adapter: I run more upright. Overall a bit slower - no HARD sprints - but with my head up there's much more field awareness and body control. Even shot one-handed when I needed my left free while running.

It took a day of practice but I felt pretty good run-and-gun, even had multiple refs comment on how well-suited the Z looked when I dashed. On the other hand I wasn't too comfortable kneeling a bunker, esp. left side as the switch felt super clunky. Barrel eye sighting was totally changed too, that's a huge adjustment. Lots of tilting.

Happy shooting!

[going_home]

Nobody "runs and guns" holding their grips out in front in pistol form the way a pistol grip was designed to be held in the first place, unless they have a giant stock on the back of their gun.

If you keep it tight, then guess what your hand's going to wind up looking like?

Go out and take some video of yourself and watch what you actually do with your grip/gun when you run. All of you.



I never run, but then again I dont do Zgrips either....



;)

[blackdeath1k]

I'm aggressive. And I run and gun. I hated the z. Great tucked in. Not so great otherwise. Sharpshooting and quick direction changes or creative marker handling for the shot it just wasn't great. The Y I liked a lot. Finally sold it because someone offered enough money. It was better than the z by far. But still not perfect. Ideally I love a vertical grip. It's not 100% perfect. But it can be very comfortable running n gunning. It can work snap shooting and changing angles. Over all they tend to be the most versatile and still fairly comfortable.

[Loguzzzzzz]

My "go to" gun is my ZX and has been for more years tan I can remember. It is very comfortable but as stated above it is a preference thing. I have a Y grip too but I prefer the Z grip more.

93635

[wetwrks]

Messed with the Y and Z grips. Couldn't stand the Y. Loved the Z.

[Za_hulk]

My "go to" gun is my ZX and has been for more years tan I can remember. It is very comfortable but as stated above it is a preference thing. I have a Y grip too but I prefer the Z grip more.

93635
I've had your ZX-mag as my computer background for years....I love that gun!!

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[Loguzzzzzz]

I've had your ZX-mag as my computer background for years....I love that gun!!

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk:hail:

[Gabehcoud]

Yes same here for you zx mag. Not as a background but definitely as an inspiration for what I want go do to mine

[RehKal]

Must be a good thread to be necroed twice... :)

[Doveday]

My favorite VPN is NordVPN (https://www.sfgate.com/market/article/nordvpn-review-16755629.php) and "go to" gun is my ZX and has been for more years tan I can remember. It is very comfortable but as stated above it is a preference thing. I have a Y grip too but I prefer the Z grip more.

93635

That gun is legendary. I'm with you on the Z grip, I prefer it more as well. Did you have a Z grip on it at some point btw?

[Nobody]

That gun is legendary. I'm with you on the Z grip, I prefer it more as well. Did you have a Z grip on it at some point btw?

Loguzzzo's Z/X mag has a Zgrip, not a Y. Unless you are talking about something else.