Lever on MSV-2 question...

[Loneassassin]

Okay, I've got my Mpa-3 shaved down to fit in my intelliframe, and after looking at where it's going to need to go, my MSV-2 lever is going to hit it. This is really frustrating because I could have milled the frame to set the MSV lower when I was at my dad's house the other day - he lives 150 miles away. I could do it now with a file, but it's going to take awhile. :cuss:

So I got to thinking, how important is it that the trigger pin hits the lever at the very top? Because I could probably cut about 1/4" off the lever and it would work as is. I'm running a ULT on/off if that makes a difference (which may or may not work, lol.) I understand that you want as much leverage as possible, but that lever seems maybe overly long and cumbersome. There's also my theory that a shorter lever will return faster, but that's another deal...

Thanks!

[BigEvil]

Okay, I've got my Mpa-3 shaved down to fit in my intelliframe, and after looking at where it's going to need to go, my MSV-2 lever is going to hit it. This is really frustrating because I could have milled the frame to set the MSV lower when I was at my dad's house the other day - he lives 150 miles away. I could do it now with a file, but it's going to take awhile. :cuss:

So I got to thinking, how important is it that the trigger pin hits the lever at the very top? Because I could probably cut about 1/4" off the lever and it would work as is. I'm running a ULT on/off if that makes a difference (which may or may not work, lol.) I understand that you want as much leverage as possible, but that lever seems maybe overly long and cumbersome. There's also my theory that a shorter lever will return faster, but that's another deal...

Thanks!


You can cut it down as far as you need to. The trigger will be a tad heavier, but not too much.

[flyingpootang]

You can always fabricate a mounting plate, attach it to the stock Intelli holes, and mount the MSV onto the plate.

[Loneassassin]

Thanks for the replies guys. I'll probably just end up filing it to where I want it, because I have a feeling I'm going to eventually need an RT on/off which will make for a stiffer trigger pull. I want all the leverage I can get.

[Loneassassin]

Update: I've got everthing filed down to fit, all I've got to do now is drill and tap for some locking set-screws and get everything locked into place. I tested everything out, and it works, but I have a question about the MSV-2 again.

Is the lever supposed to return on its own? Because the problem I'm having is that I'll pull the trigger, the ram activates the sear, but then the MSV-2 lever doesn't return forward on its own. Granted, I haven't installed my magnet mod yet, but I thought they were supposed to work without a magnet mod, maybe not as well, but still work. I don't think there's any friction keeping it from going forward - it's very easy to actuate back and forth by hand. Maybe it just needs to break in.

It's probably not going to be an issue once I install the magnets, but I was just wondering.

Anyway, I can tell this thing is going to be a machine gun when it's done. The trigger pull is indeed quite walkable... :shooting:

[mag79]

the lever has a weak return, sometimes angling the unit down will help

[Loguzzzzzz]

The lever itself has no return spring, there is a little spring inside the msv-2 to help the pin to seat after actuation, mag79 is correct in the fact that if you can angle the lever slightly downward it will help but the best thing to do is to install the magnet mod to aid in the lever return. sometimes the input pressure will help to return the pin as well. Have you put enough pressure to actuate the valve itself. The slight increase in input pressure may help too.

Please keep us informed as to your progress.

:cheers:

[reckid1986]

also make sure the lever isnt sticking on your mount plate when its screwed down.

On one of my intelliframe setups the lever was bent a little so when it was pushed it would drag on the shelf a little keeping it from returning. the magnets will force it back and if you set them right you can use them as a trigger stop too.

[Adam45]

When you set up the LPR you will turn it down till nothing happens. Then gradually turn it up till the MSV 2 works. Then you will turn it up 1/8 to 1/4 turn more so you are sure it functions on every pull. That is usually enough pressure to return the lever fairly quickly. I run both my Pnue setups without a magnet mod and they are plenty fast.

Make sure the lever isnt rubbing on anything as suggested above. Also check for debris from filing at the hinge pivot point.

[Loneassassin]

Well I got the magnet mod installed and all the set screw holes drilled and tapped - this baby just needs to get put back together and it should be ready to rip! :shooting: :headbang:

The magnet mod definitely solved the problem of returning the lever forward. I actually had to back it off quite a bit because it was forcing the lever away so hard!!! I should have it all back together and tested tonight!!! :cheers:

[Loneassassin]

Got everything tuned pretty well finally. For a long time the MSV-2 was just leaking like crazy, but I finally discovered it was because it wasn't being allowed to open up all the way. So after a little adjustment it's all good.

The only problem, and I expected this - is that my ULT is not keeping up with the rate of fire. So when I really go to town on the trigger, it chuffs pretty badly. This happened before I installed the Pneumag mods if I walked the trigger or just shot pretty fast - probably around 10-11 bps is where it starts chuffing. It could be that I just need more air; my Scuba is only filling about 1200psi right now - but I'd think it would work at least at the start of the fill. I'll also try adding some more magnet tension to make sure the lever is actuating as fast as possible. I wouldn't mind if the pull was a little stiffer anyway - this thing is like an electro right now!

I will try adding another shim to my ULT, but I already have 4 in there. I guess I should get my scuba filled first just to see if that's the problem, then go from there. Everything is lubed really well, so I don't think that's it. If I have to I'll just get an RT on/off.

[smeek]

I bet a lot of the chuffing you are getting is from the 1200 fill. If you like the way it is now I wouldn't adjust much until you can test with a full tank.

I'm using a cheater with a ULT and when my tank gets low I start getting chuffing, but when oiled properly and with a full tank it shoots great.

[Loneassassin]

^^^How many shims do you have installed in your ULT?

[smeek]

Whatever it came with installed from the factory, I believe 4.

[Loneassassin]

Well, I got my scuba "filled" (I only ever get about 2500psi at the local dive shop). And I also tried adding a 5th shim to my ULT. With the 5th shim, the gun leaks down the barrel unless I really tightnen the field strip screw - so I took it out and am back to 4 now.

It seemed a little better with the full fill, but at higher speeds I still get chuffing, and I got about 3 ball breaks. It's not chopping, but I think it's from the chuffing and balls are running into each other in the barrel - because it only happened when I walked the trigger. The breach was squeaky clean.

I can shoot quite fast not walking the trigger without any issues - but as soon as I start walking the trigger that's when I get problems. I might just play with it as is for awhile. But I'm leaning heavily towards getting an RT on/off, because I think that will solve my problems. Trouble is, I'm running out of money for this project - I need to at least have enough money to play!!!

[reckid1986]

sounds like you just need more practice on the trigger. Its a lot different if your used to an electronic trigger, because you dont have all those settings to adjust to smooth out all the trigger hits. it takes a little time but you will get it. :shooting:

[Loneassassin]

sounds like you just need more practice on the trigger. Its a lot different if your used to an electronic trigger, because you dont have all those settings to adjust to smooth out all the trigger hits. it takes a little time but you will get it. :shooting:

I see what you're saying but I'm pretty certain that's not the problem. I've been shooting mech cockers for years which are arguably harder to shoot fast than mags, and I don't have any trouble with short-stroking those, even at 10-11 bps. On my Mag, it happens whether I walk the trigger or not - if I'm doing a fast pull (not-walking), it works fine until about 11 bps, then it starts getting shootdown and ultimately chuffing really bad. It was even worse with only 3 shims in the ULT, but with 4 it's acceptable for now. Apparently I can't run 5 with my setup.

Unfortunately I didn't really get a chance to test it at the field yesterday - I purchased a bag of crappy paint just to work out any kinks with the gun - thinking it would just be innaccurate at the worst.

To make a long story short - if you paid me $40 a case to shoot that paint again, I wouldn't do it.

My Prophecy started breaking balls before they even got into the gun, and unfortunately I shot about 10 times before I figured out that they were broken in the loader as well as everywhere else. Never again. So I just put the gun down and used my pump with a different loader.

[Dirge]

Well, I got my scuba "filled" (I only ever get about 2500psi at the local dive shop). And I also tried adding a 5th shim to my ULT. With the 5th shim, the gun leaks down the barrel unless I really tightnen the field strip screw - so I took it out and am back to 4 now.

It seemed a little better with the full fill, but at higher speeds I still get chuffing, and I got about 3 ball breaks. It's not chopping, but I think it's from the chuffing and balls are running into each other in the barrel - because it only happened when I walked the trigger. The breach was squeaky clean.

I can shoot quite fast not walking the trigger without any issues - but as soon as I start walking the trigger that's when I get problems. I might just play with it as is for awhile. But I'm leaning heavily towards getting an RT on/off, because I think that will solve my problems. Trouble is, I'm running out of money for this project - I need to at least have enough money to play!!!

I had this problem early on. The tank I was using could not feed both regs well. Replaced it with a Crossfire. Tried a Ninja a bit later. High pressure (950psi), poor rechage. Similar outcome. Crossfire ftw.

The other solution is an RT or E-Mag on/off. The trigger runs heavier, but it will be vastly more reliable. All mine run the E-Mag on/off and I can't short stroke them.

Hope my 2 cents helps.