Classic RT Aluminum ULE body/ ULE Rail Milling

[Xmagterror]

Im in the process of doing R&D on the classic RT to make it lighter, accept autococker barrels and Angel feednecks/detents.

With a main focus on weight reduction i have made a prototype vert feed classic RT body out of aluminum and made it accept an x valve instead of doing an over the valve design that uses the stock stainless steel RT valve. I HAVE REDUCED THE WEIGHT OF THE GUN BY 1LB 1OZ SO FAR!!!!! The next phase of the R&D project is to develop ULE rail milling to reduce the weight even more.


Is there more interest in doing a body that accepts the stock Classic RT valve? The downside is there is only a 7 ounce weight savings by doing this. The stock valve is heavy.....there are also allot of guns out there that are leaking because the bore in the rail that the banjo bolt goes through is worn out.

Participate in the pole and let me know if you would be interested. I will do a run if we can get 15 units sold.

[BigEvil]

Make them both.. :)



You're killing my wallet btw.

[knownothingmags]

Make them both.. :)



You're killing my wallet btw.
who needs money anyways. :D:D

[BigEvil]

who needs money anyways. :D:D

Apparently I do, if I ever plan on getting laid again. Hookers arent cheap these days.

[knownothingmags]

Apparently I do, if I ever plan on getting laid again. Hookers arent cheap these days.
mmmmhmm hookers.:D

[oldironmudder]

Stock RT valve. If people want it sorter, charge an extra $5 to cut it off or let them do it.

I do want one but the only thing I probably wont like is the feedneck area like on your MM bodies. I understand about the machining but I would pay more for smoother lines.

[RT Lover]

what is the cost?

[TimmyJay]

I would like to see smoother lines and leave the area rounded at the bottom screw. Is there a reason this is cut out? I can't see one and seems like extra machining. I would think AGD did it for a reason on their ULE bodies?

[TwilightG]

I know that I'm probably in the minority, but I'm still voting for a 100% compatible ule body for the classic rt. TL barrel and valve.

There's A LOT of classic rt's out there which have not seen much love in upgrades due to its valve design. A ule body will be a significant upgrade while still retaining its unique and classic design.

Although, I do understand that it caters to a much smaller audience and may not bring the same numbers as the mm body.

[RST]

Stock RT valve. If people want it sorter, charge an extra $5 to cut it off or let them do it.

I do want one but the only thing I probably wont like is the feedneck area like on your MM bodies. I understand about the machining but I would pay more for smoother lines.



Yep.

[Ando]

Is there enough meat on the body to make a screw on back for those that want to keep it original and use the original valves? Those that don't can unscrew the back and convert it for a X or lv 7 valve....

[BigEvil]

I know that I'm probably in the minority, but I'm still voting for a 100% compatible ule body for the classic rt. TL barrel and valve.

There's A LOT of classic rt's out there which have not seen much love in upgrades due to its valve design. A ule body will be a significant upgrade while still retaining its unique and classic design.

Although, I do understand that it caters to a much smaller audience and may not bring the same numbers as the mm body.


There are a lot of Classic RTs out there.

[Lohman446]

I know that I'm probably in the minority, but I'm still voting for a 100% compatible ule body for the classic rt. TL barrel and valve.

There's A LOT of classic rt's out there which have not seen much love in upgrades due to its valve design. A ule body will be a significant upgrade while still retaining its unique and classic design.

Although, I do understand that it caters to a much smaller audience and may not bring the same numbers as the mm body.

Hush.

Before you do this can you let me know so I can buy up all the neglected classic RTs out there? These are the "steal" of the current mag market.

I would like to see it work with the stock valve as well - and keep the air through rail thing.

[splat15k]

I voted for stock valve.

XMT, do you plan on making an entirely new ULE gas-thru rail or are you planning to mill existing rails?

[Xmagterror]

what is the cost?

Not sure on the cost yet...It will be a little more expensive than the ULE minimag body i did....because the classic RT body is longer (more material and exponentially more machining time caused by long boring bars)

[Xmagterror]

I can really only make these vert feed (or warp feed maybe).....power feed would require welding and thats a big no no if you plan to anodize the body.

Keep voting on which version you would like to see made.

I really lean in favor of making the body accept an x valve...because you only save 6 or 7 oz of weight by swapping out the body....with an x valve and ule milling it will be aprox 1lb 4 oz of savings!!!!!!!! Thats huge!!!

[Xmagterror]

I voted for stock valve.

XMT, do you plan on making an entirely new ULE gas-thru rail or are you planning to mill existing rails?


I will offer ULE milling services on your existing rail.

[OPBN]

Just my .02 because I don't have a Classic RT, nor do I plan on buying one. There are a fair amount of options for non-Classic RT valved markers in regards to bodies. There are little to no options for Classic RT valved markers. Either make the body so that it accepts a spacer to fit Classic RT's if you want to make it work for X valves as well or make a run specifically for Classic RT's.

[Xmagterror]

Just my .02 because I don't have a Classic RT, nor do I plan on buying one. There are a fair amount of options for non-Classic RT valved markers in regards to bodies. There are little to no options for Classic RT valved markers. Either make the body so that it accepts a spacer to fit Classic RT's if you want to make it work for X valves as well or make a run specifically for Classic RT's.


The RT is unique in the fact that the sear is aprox .07 off position from an emag or RT pro....so the classic RT body will only work on a classic RT. I might also make some bodies just like the minimag bodies but with the RT holes in the front to fit all other mags. So many projects...so little time!!!LOL

From the looks of it so far more than half would like to use the stock valve...

I will not be making just one length of body and chopping it off to fit an x valve....too much wasted machine time and material. I will do a preorder and people can buy what they want. as always with the mag aftermarket parts business in this age/economy its too hard to predict how to make.

[OPBN]

The RT is unique in the fact that the sear is aprox .07 off position from an emag or RT pro....so the classic RT body will only work on a classic RT. I might also make some bodies just like the minimag bodies but with the RT holes in the front to fit all other mags. So many projects...so little time!!!LOL

From the looks of it so far more than half would like to use the stock valve...

I will not be making just one length of body and chopping it off to fit an x valve....too much wasted machine time and material. I will do a preorder and people can buy what they want. as always with the mag aftermarket parts business in this age/economy its too hard to predict how to make.
Than either I am missing something or don't really see the reason for making body that houses an X valve, but fits Classic RT lowers. You are discarding what makes the Classic RT a Classic RT by getting rid of the valve. The air through rail is neat on the CRT, but would be negated when using an X.

[Xmagterror]

Than either I am missing something or don't really see the reason for making body that houses an X valve, but fits Classic RT lowers. You are discarding what makes the Classic RT a Classic RT by getting rid of the valve. The air through rail is neat on the CRT, but would be negated when using an X.


Its just another option for classic RT owners that want to make their guns lightweight! Chances are i will make the body in both versions

[dboggs79]

Than either I am missing something or don't really see the reason for making body that houses an X valve, but fits Classic RT lowers. You are discarding what makes the Classic RT a Classic RT by getting rid of the valve. The air through rail is neat on the CRT, but would be negated when using an X.

Agree 100%! If this is done to fit an x valve, there will be a bunch of the stock valves with no use. There are already a number of options for the x valve. Lets put the stock valve to use! Any thoughts on making a warp body an option? Also, is the front gonna be like the mm bodies with slots or holes; square end or will it be cut back like the stock body?

[Xmagterror]

Agree 100%! If this is done to fit an x valve, there will be a bunch of the stock valves with no use. There are already a number of options for the x valve. Lets put the stock valve to use! Any thoughts on making a warp body an option? Also, is the front gonna be like the mm bodies with slots or holes; square end or will it be cut back like the stock body?


It will look just like the original classic RT body. I still think there is a demand for those that want to cut over a pound off their RT.

[OPBN]

It will look just like the original classic RT body. I still think there is a demand for those that want to cut over a pound off their RT.
I realize a lot of people have more money than brains, but I can't imagine someone spending $400 ( Xvalve + body) to convert a $200 marker and then get left with a valve and body that are worthless. I can understand someone maybe spending the $200 for the body to convert thair CRT over to a vert feed with AC barrel capabilities and proper detents.

I also think that people may buy a Classic RT styled body to replace their RTPro SS bodies to have a faux CRT.

Again, just my .02.

[dboggs79]

I realize a lot of people have more money than brains, but I can't imagine someone spending $400 ( Xvalve + body) to convert a $200 marker and then get left with a valve and body that are worthless. I can understand someone maybe spending the $200 for the body to convert thair CRT over to a vert feed with AC barrel capabilities and proper detents.

I also think that people may buy a Classic RT styled body to replace their RTPro SS bodies to have a faux CRT.

Again, just my .02.

Agree, again!

[Ando]

My .02.

FYI....

I have dibs on anyone selling their SS vert feed Classic RT body once they buy one of these :D

[going_home]

I couldnt wrap my head around that either.

I'd own a classic RT if it wasnt for the twist lock barrel and powerfeed body, not a fan of either.

But what the point of putting an Xvalve on a classic RT is escaped me.

There are many ULE rail options for RT Pro's, not to mention custom bodies.

But to the contrary, according to the poll looks like there may be a market for it.


:ninja:

[Xmagterror]

Agree, again!

I can see your point....but lots of people have extra x valves..the weight reduction and ditching the banjo bolt
Setup are worth it. Its 10/14 in the pole right now. If i can sell atleast 12 of each style ill do it.
i like giving people options because everyone has their own idea of a perfect setup.

[BigEvil]

I think these should be twist lock. The stock classic RT barrels are awesome. There are also a bunch of those weird annoed cRTs out there... those owners probably wouldnt want a different body unless they could keep the matching barrels.

[RT Lover]

RT CLASSIC!!!! vert would be cool, really never cared 4 the powerfeed. now twist lock or not we want to bring back the classic so it should b twist lock... if anything make some aluminum barrel converters twist lock to cocker! how about just a RT classic slug? that would bring a whole new beast into play!!!

[Xmagterror]

I think these should be twist lock. The stock classic RT barrels are awesome. There are also a bunch of those weird annoed cRTs out there... those owners probably wouldnt want a different body unless they could keep the matching barrels.

I thought of that too. Only problem is the weird annoed barrels are almost always not going to be centerfeed. Maybe they can be machined to work? I have not got that far in my r&d. I was just going to thread the red smear one i have. Im going with an x valve on my red smear rt. The banjo bore in the rail is damaged and it leaks. I suppose i could sleeve the bore or bore it oversize and make a new banjo bolt to fit but i would rather drop the weight.

[RST]

I don't really care for weight reduction and I dont want to upgrade my CRT to a RTPro.

All I want is an all aluminum centerfeed RTC style (front and back) body that fits on my RTC rail and RTC valve.
And it should have Cocker threads... Nothing else. ;)

[Lohman446]

I don't really care for weight reduction and I dont want to upgrade my CRT to a RTPro.

All I want is an all aluminum centerfeed RTC style (front and back) body that fits on my RTC rail and RTC valve.
And it should have Cocker threads... Nothing else. ;)

Either cocker or twist lock. As others have noted though there are not a lot of twist lock center feed barrels out there.

[Ando]

This is suppose to be an upgrade to the original body but at the same time keeping the identity. Only problem i see is people finding centerfeed TL barrels. Any barrel can be easily modded with a few spins of a drill but finding them original is going to be a real problem and for those wanting Cocker threads....find yourself an TL adapter or freak back, both options work awesome and you'll NEVER see the difference.

I still think making the back end of the body twist-off to convert from either or style (X or Classic) would be the next best upgrade for this next to it being made of AL and/or centerfeed. The time saved trying to mill cocker threads in the front and moving that time to the back should nullify any added cost and frankly be a lot easier and less time consuming (that is if there's enough meat for it).

You can always set it up like the carbon fiber body mod and make the back end of the body like a sleeve that just slides over the back breach area or thread the back end of the breach and thread in the different body backs. You'll end up with 2 different backs but again the time savings should balance out since theres no milling time for Cocker threads just material.

Something like that I would buy in a heart beat and solve the X or classic debate.

[BigEvil]

This is suppose to be an upgrade to the original body but at the same time keeping the identity. Only problem i see is people finding CF TL barrels. Any barrel can be easily modded with a few spins of a drill but finding them original is going to be a real problem and for those wanting Cocker threads....find yourself an TL adapter or freak back, both options work awesome and you'll NEVER see the difference.

I still think making the back end of the body twist-off to convert from either or style (X or Classic) would be the best upgrade for this next to it being made of AL and ceterfeed. The cost saved trying to mill cocker threads in the front and moving that time to the back should nullify any added cost and frankly be a lot easier and less time consuming (that is if there's enough meat for it).

You can always set it up like the carbon fiber body mod and make the back end like a sleeve that just slides over the back breach area or thread the back end of the breach and thread in the different body backs. You'll end up with 2 different backs but again the time savings should balance out since theres no milling time for Cocker threads.

Something like that I would buy in a heart beat and solve the X or classic debate.

I could do cf mods. Probably should offer it as a service anyhow.

[rukh013]

I NEED a cf bodied classic, this forum is making me broke. I'm trying to sell stuff I don't use anymore and now this thread :D

[Xmagterror]

Looks like there is enough interest to make both versions of the body.
I will get both prototypes done and ULE mill the rail. Pictures will be posted in the paintball talk section of the site and a pre-order will follow shortly after. I am excited to see how light my gun is after i ULE mill the rail.

[splat15k]

Awesome! :cheers:

Will you be offering a reconditioning service for worn-out/leaky rails?

[knownothingmags]

I could do cf mods. Probably should offer it as a service anyhow.
you should offer a cf mod for the front of the first run of minimag bodies. that would be freaking awsome.

prolly cant be done for many reason but it would be awsome.:D

[bbotts77]

you should offer a cf mod for the front of the first run of minimag bodies. that would be freaking awsome.

prolly cant be done for many reason but it would be awsome.:D
In this context, CF = Center Feed, not Carbon Fiber. ;)

[splat15k]

In this context, CF = Center Feed, not Carbon Fiber. ;)


Actually Ando brought up the carbon fiber mod in his post, so it may have started out as CF = center feed, but it morphed into CF = carbon fiber. :ninja:

[Ando]

Ya if you read my postt again I differentiated the 2 a little better and BE was talking about the barrels



Looks like there is enough interest to make both versions of the body.
I will get both prototypes done and ULE mill the rail. Pictures will be posted in the paintball talk section of the site and a pre-order will follow shortly after. I am excited to see how light my gun is after i ULE mill the rail.
What exactly are you planning on making?

[bbotts77]

Ya if you read my postt again I differentiated the 2 a little better and BE was talking about the barrels
Ah right. Makes me wonder if BE was talking about center feed modding barrels or carbon fiber modding bodies.

[Justus]

This is suppose to be an upgrade to the original body but at the same time keeping the identity.
Is it? Because I thought this all came about when the aluminum Minimag bodies were made, and people (myself included) mentioned that if the same thing could be done except with a front that looks like the classic RT body we'd be more interested. Nothing about upgrading a classic RT, just getting that body working with an AM/MM or X-valve.


... I also think that people may buy a Classic RT styled body to replace their RTPro SS bodies to have a faux CRT.

This ^^ is exactly why it was suggested in the Minimag thread awhile back.

[OPBN]

Is it? Because I thought this all came about when the aluminum Minimag bodies were made, and people (myself included) mentioned that if the same thing could be done except with a front that looks like the classic RT body we'd be more interested. Nothing about upgrading a classic RT, just getting that body working with an AM/MM or X-valve.



This ^^ is exactly why it was suggested in the Minimag thread awhile back.

That's what I think some people are confused about. XMT is talking about making either a CRT body that accepts an X valve, but will only fit on CRT lowers or a CRT replacement body that will utilize a CRT valve and lowers. This isn't a body that is simply styled after the CRT to fit non-CRT lowers.

[knownothingmags]

In this context, CF = Center Feed, not Carbon Fiber. ;)
oh woops. i guess i missunderstood?

[Xmagterror]

My plan is to make centerfeed, cocker threaded bodies to fit the classic rt.....there will be two versions.......x valve and stock rt valve. And later on make a body just like the ule minimag one i did but wth the rt style front...to fit all other automags.

Not really interested in carbon fiber...just adds expense and time to make them.

[Ando]

Not really interested in carbon fiber...just adds expense and time to make them.
Not talking about carbon fiber backs. Just make the backs like the CF mod but in a classic RT and in a regular ULE style in aluminum.

That would kill 2 birds with one stone using one body

[Lohman446]

I'm going to suggest that classic RT owners (at least speaking for myself) are not so concerned about weight savings. I would like to be able to use centerfeed bodies (preferably with common threading for feednecks), autococker threads, and proper detents. I am not so concerned about weight.

[going_home]

I'm going to suggest that classic RT owners (at least speaking for myself) are not so concerned about weight savings. I would like to be able to use centerfeed bodies (preferably with common threading for feednecks), autococker threads, and proper detents. I am not so concerned about weight.

Exactly.
A classic RT with a ULE body (vert feed angel feedneck and detents, cocker threaded).
Old faithful classic RT with RT Pro body upgrades .


:ninja:

[TwilightG]

I think these should be twist lock. The stock classic RT barrels are awesome. There are also a bunch of those weird annoed cRTs out there... those owners probably wouldnt want a different body unless they could keep the matching barrels.
This is exactly the reason why I voted for twist lock. Otherwise, I'd have to find someone willing to cut and thread my matching barrel for AC threads. This easily shortens it by a couple of inches.

Imagine a vertfeed ule RT with a red or blue smear anno AND matching barrel!!
As it's been mentioned TL-AC adapters are certainly an option for those who prefer to use an AC barrel.
As for those who worry about their non-cf tl barrel, as long as it's not stainless, it's VERY easy to drill a small divot for centerfeed. Heck, you can get away with using thicker barrel orings to hold it in place instead. The barrel really won't twist on its own.

Keep this as close to "classic" as possible (minus the weight and vertfeed :D)

... although, it looks like XMT made his decision :(

[splat15k]

I would also choose twist-lock over AC threads.

[Xmagterror]

This is exactly the reason why I voted for twist lock. Otherwise, I'd have to find someone willing to cut and thread my matching barrel for AC threads. This easily shortens it by a couple of inches.

Imagine a vertfeed ule RT with a red or blue smear anno AND matching barrel!!
As it's been mentioned TL-AC adapters are certainly an option for those who prefer to use an AC barrel.
As for those who worry about their non-cf tl barrel, as long as it's not stainless, it's VERY easy to drill a small divot for centerfeed. Heck, you can get away with using thicker barrel orings to hold it in place instead. The barrel really won't twist on its own.

Keep this as close to "classic" as possible (minus the weight and vertfeed :D)

... although, it looks like XMT made his decision :(


I will make whatever you guys want as long as i sell enough of them. I didnt know it was easy as drilling a small do to make the twist lock barrel work. I remember some of the aftermarket barrels would work on different feed angles....does someone have a picture of how they milled the barrel to work?

[1stTarget]

CF, cocker threaded, RT classic. Only question is how much? May need to sell some items.

[Xmagterror]

CF, cocker threaded, RT classic. Only question is how much? May need to sell some items.

Not sure on pricing yet they will be a little more than my ULE minimag bodies.

[RT Lover]

Looks like there is enough interest to make both versions of the body.
I will get both prototypes done and ULE mill the rail. Pictures will be posted in the paintball talk section of the site and a pre-order will follow shortly after. I am excited to see how light my gun is after i ULE mill the rail.


same here man!!! i miss my tank it will b nice to have a lighter one lol!! any idea on cost??

[need4reebs]

wow i never thought the RT classic was very heavy in the first place? it really wouldnt be a classic anymore if it had a X-valve or ULE body? definitely wouldnt be old Skool anymore either? it would make more sense to just make a ULE body look like the RT classic...oh well there is gonna be alot of unused spare parts layin around soon...haha :rolleyes:

[Xmagterror]

I started making the new prototypes. making a vert feed body that accepts the twist lock barrel is not possible with out major mods to the slug....There just simply isnt enough meat for the feedneck threads. so im threading all the bodies with autococker threads....its possible to autococker thread a stock barrel.

I have came up with three aluminum bodies with the RT style front that i plan to produce if demand is high enough.

1. Vert Feed classic automag RT body with autococker threads (uses stock automag RT valve)
2. Vert Feed classic automag RT body with autococker threads (uses X valve)..requires rail milling for valve index pin.
3. Vert Feed body for use on any automag except the automag RT or sydarm (uses classic, or x valve)

I will complete the milling on these in the coming weeks as i find the time.

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x291/bridgemach90/2012-10-31_12-16-40_600.jpg

[RT Lover]

get me a ballpark on option 1!!!

[Xmagterror]

get me a ballpark on option 1!!!

Its too early to say for sure but im shooting for less than, or around $200 for the long over the valve RT bodies.

[BTAutoMag]

ballpark on 3 :confused:

[OPBN]

Just curious, what would be the difference between 2 and 3?

[Xmagterror]

Just curious, what would be the difference between 2 and 3?


some of the dimensions are different

[OPBN]

some of the dimensions are different

So #2 can only be used on RT Classic lowers?

[Xmagterror]

So #2 can only be used on RT Classic lowers?


yes that is correct

[RT Lover]

Its too early to say for sure but im shooting for less than, or around $200 for the long over the valve RT bodies.


im in!

[Xmagterror]

Ive been busy in the shop for a while on other projects. I will finish these prototypes the last week of this month and post pictures. Save your pennies for the pre order!!!!! I will start the preorder on January 1st and it will stay open for 4 weeks or until we get a set amount sold before i start the run.

I will also be having an end of the year sale on here. I have a hoard of parts i was planning on using for my guns but have decided to only keep one emag and my ULE RT mag.