Electronic markers?

[blackdeath1k]

After playing today. I'm starting to consider the idea more and more about buying an electro "tournament" style marker. Something with eyes yada yada yada. I know a handful that use Geo's and egos. But what markers tend to be the most reliable user friendly and cost effective? Yes this is a mag forum. But it appears a lot here use other markers as well. Or are at least around a lot more styles than a guy from southern IL.

[going_home]

2014 Axe.

Upgradable with Inception Designs bodies (a bolt upgrade is not needed).

Reliable, easy to maintain.

Quiet, very air efficient.

Low pressure operation.

And the big one, used ones are fairly inexpensive.

Note: get one with the Redline OLED board, much easier to change settings with a screen.


http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b195/going_home/20151024_125904.jpg (http://s19.photobucket.com/user/going_home/media/20151024_125904.jpg.html)



;)

[blackdeath1k]

Isn't that what you have in the for sale section?

[Cyco-Dude]

axes, egos...pretty standard fare. you can find 08/09 egos for $300 or so.

[blackdeath1k]

HUmmmm. Guess I need to decide if I want to sell/trade my project marker then....

[Laku]

GEO's are good as well, easy to maintain. My personal preference is single tube guns as I'm used to mags so the aiming point doesn't change too much.

[boo]

The big thing I struggle with is finding a decent reliable electro that can be customized, but you won't lose your ass if you sell it.

I understand you'll lose your ass with any customized marker, and I love axes, but damn. $300 for a donor axe, $250 for an inception body, add ano to that and you still have a $300 axe.

Anyone have any insight into building an Evil Ehm to avoid this? It seems like those still fetch a grand on the used market, despite basically being a macdev cyborg and equivalent in design to an etek. Definitely still tournament level for an electro and simple.

[blackdeath1k]

I'm not to concerned with it being all that custom. I won't be getting rid of my old RT. And while not real custom it might as well be since nobody knows what they are since they are older than most players.

It's funny that my limited info had me thinking Geo or axe. And them appear to be 2 of the key options. I like the single tube idea for the same reason laku. I hate dealing with spyders. And the ego reminds me of that with the stacked setup. I lean more toward an axe because I really don't want a huge buy in. And the axe would be a lot closer to the flip value of what I would be getting rid of for the electro to take its place.

[Nobody]

The big thing I struggle with is finding a decent reliable electro that can be customized, but you won't lose your ass if you sell it.

I understand you'll lose your ass with any customized marker, and I love axes, but damn. $300 for a donor axe, $250 for an inception body, add ano to that and you still have a $300 axe.

Anyone have any insight into building an Evil Ehm to avoid this? It seems like those still fetch a grand on the used market, despite basically being a macdev cyborg and equivalent in design to an etek. Definitely still tournament level for an electro and simple.

The days of flipping a gun, especially used for what you paid for or more are long gone unless you find someone who is well, stupid.

The great thing is, you can pick up an axe, use it and unless the old owner did something stupid(Pootie bolt, dicked with all the settings, etc and so forth), the guns will shoot and shoot and shoot. You do not need to do anything with them. You do not need an ID body, or Numech frame, or anything else. Sometimes you can find axes at $150-200. Remember, it just needs to shoot paint and be reliable. You don't need to make it a show piece.

Not a cyborg. More like a B2K(which was the first stack tubed electro design, but i digress), imho. Anyway. An Evil Ehm, is Viking that uses a Merlin extrusion(hence the the phonetic M name) for the body, all Viking internals, a frame of your choice, and total custom milling that you can design or allow DC help you with the choices. It is a total custom gun, not counting anno, that has a following. You generally either buy up someone's project or a completed gun, that people are asking for the money they put into it. So its kinda like having XMT mill a body, then sending it to Tuna to turn it into an Emag. It can get expensive real quick.

[Nobody]

I'm not to concerned with it being all that custom. I won't be getting rid of my old RT. And while not real custom it might as well be since nobody knows what they are since they are older than most players.

It's funny that my limited info had me thinking Geo or axe. And them appear to be 2 of the key options. I like the single tube idea for the same reason laku. I hate dealing with spyders. And the ego reminds me of that with the stacked setup. I lean more toward an axe because I really don't want a huge buy in. And the axe would be a lot closer to the flip value of what I would be getting rid of for the electro to take its place.

Hands down, the axe will suit you more than a geo, in that the axe shoots nearly the same as a Mag. You can buy a used axe for $200, freshen it up, use it for a year, then get $200 back out of it.

[going_home]

Isn't that what you have in the for sale section?

I would have said that anyway.

I sold both LV1's and kept the Axes.

[blackdeath1k]

I would have said that anyway.

I sold both LV1's and kept the Axes.

Sorry. That question was more a question of... Don't you have one of them for sale? I take it you pulled it off the market? I knew anytime electros came up axes and minis were considered sound markers that held there own in a nice price point.

Out of curiosity why do you say the axe suits my needs better than a used Geo? Simple buy in point? Or something else?

[boo]

What about the Bob Long insight and Onslaught? They seem to be an excellent value on the used market if you want something a little different then an Axe (not that Axes are bad, just that everyone has one). Plus the Insight and Onslaught are available in some cool ano's.


Not a cyborg. More like a B2K(which was the first stack tubed electro design, but i digress), .
The Cyborg was a Merlin extrusion as well, so Cyborg frames are popular for the conversion. Basically if you put a 2 liter and somehow retapped the lpr for an SCM the only thing that would differ from an evil ehm would be the cartridge ram of a Viking. Which, as cool as the ehms are, make it hard to justify the price considering Cyborgs go for under $150 these days.

[going_home]

I don't want to get off subject with the Axe I have for sale.

While it's true, for ease of maintenance, the Geo parallels the Axe, but unless you get a geo 3 or above they tend to be somewhat inefficient.

They seem to be a bit louder too depending your barrel.

[blackdeath1k]

Ah! Yah geo3 compared to an axe pro is a small price difference used. Let alone a geo3 compared to a normal axe.

Since I will be shopping used I will be at the mercy of the seller for ano colors. So that isn't a big factor here.

Guess I really need to decide if I want to pull the trigger and post my "finally functional" project marker for sale....

What barrel threading do these markers use. In all my net skimming I guess I've missed that.

[vintage]

i'll stick to my X mags until AGD comes out with something new.

[boo]

Ah! Yah geo3 compared to an axe pro is a small price difference used. Let alone a geo3 compared to a normal axe.

Since I will be shopping used I will be at the mercy of the seller for ano colors. So that isn't a big factor here.

Guess I really need to decide if I want to pull the trigger and post my "finally functional" project marker for sale....

What barrel threading do these markers use. In all my net skimming I guess I've missed that.

They all use autococker threading. Aside from the shocker and luxe that's all the new high end markers use.

[going_home]

i'll stick to my X mags until AGD comes out with something new.

That's the rumor.....

[blackdeath1k]

I cringe to say this......but. Weight is actually also a factor. So an emag is out of the question. Over time I may pneu my old trusty RT. But that's farther down the road. My right rotator cuff is junk and I've been avoiding surgery for almost 10 years. Guess age is making all the abuse I've put my body thru catch up to me. All and all I really think I'm gonna put my above marker on the chopping block and try to flip it for a nice functional electro. My main RT will always be around though.

[going_home]

Resistance bands.

Cheap on ebay.

I tore my left one years ago.

You can bring it back to close to normal using resistance bands.


;)

[Laku]

While it's true, for ease of maintenance, the Geo parallels the Axe, but unless you get a geo 3 or above they tend to be somewhat inefficient.

Both are good reliable guns so either will be excellent choice. With GEO 2 you can alway buy IV core if the efficiency bothers you (probably won't, 68 tank will shoot around hopper and 5-6 pods). IV will bring it pretty much right on par with GEO 3.5 at around hopper and 10-12 pods.

I'm currently using GEO 3.5 as primary and 3.0 as backup for my tournament play.

[Korso]

I have a Geo 3.5 for tournaments, and I love it! I used a Dm13 before I got my Geo. The Geo is light and reliable, very easy to maintain and is my favourite-hands down.

[blackdeath1k]

Eh.... I like the price of the axe. But I know local players with Geo's. Based on some of the abuse they have taken I'm pretty impressed with them..... Decisions decisions. Guess untill I shed my project marker I can't afford to do anything.

I have found a 2.0 Geo package for what appears to be a good price. Guess I need to really look in to the big differences in the different Geo flavors

[Dayspring]

Both are good reliable guns so either will be excellent choice. With GEO 2 you can alway buy IV core if the efficiency bothers you (probably won't, 68 tank will shoot around hopper and 5-6 pods). IV will bring it pretty much right on par with GEO 3.5 at around hopper and 10-12 pods.

I'm currently using GEO 3.5 as primary and 3.0 as backup for my tournament play.

A 2.x Geo with IV Core won't ever reach the efficiency of a 3.x with IV core. The main solenoid works completely differently between the two. Would you see efficiency and shot quality improvements on a Geo 2.x with the IV? Yes. As good as a 3.x with it? No. Jack's even said so and why.

That being said, if you can find a used Geo 3 and toss an IV core in, you have the same gun as the GSL/Geo 3.5 without the fancy milling or quick release back cap. I love my Geo3 just as much as my Axe.

[Laku]

A 2.x Geo with IV Core won't ever reach the efficiency of a 3.x with IV core. The main solenoid works completely differently between the two. Would you see efficiency and shot quality improvements on a Geo 2.x with the IV? Yes. As good as a 3.x with it? No. Jack's even said so and why.


True. I can recall, now that you said it. Some how mixed it in my head with GEO 1.

At any rate the efficiency isn't that bad unless you carry loads of paint on the field.

[capt spank]

if price is an issue then axe or mini gs. ergonomics are crap if you have big hands (I put nummech stuff on my axe). but you can get either for 2-250. smooth, quiet, efficient, fast.

any PE will be reliable and easy to maintain. geo 2's go you can find in the 300-450 range.

do NOT get an insight or onslaught unless you want to spend a good deal of time researching the in's and out's of maintenance and troubleshooting. you WILL have problems and will have to do regreasing/maintenance after every case of paint. also, not the smoothest guns I've ever shot. in my experience of bob long's, the g6r and victories were the best.

[barkingspider]

Love playing with my axe. Many of the same features mentioned above in previous comments. My two cents.......go with the best deal. Sounds like budget is a priority.

[blackdeath1k]

My hands are not large. I used a friend's mini a couple years ago. Nice little marker. Figure I'd prefer the axe over the mini.

Price is an issue in that I don't want to pay 200 extra just for a name. If there is a legit reason I will do it. I like the look of the Geo better. And I know more people that own them than the axe. But really it's a matter of what is the better overall marker per price point. I want a reliable fast marker that is light and easy to break down that will most likely have parts available for quite some time.

[Dayspring]

My hands are not large. I used a friend's mini a couple years ago. Nice little marker. Figure I'd prefer the axe over the mini.

Price is an issue in that I don't want to pay 200 extra just for a name. If there is a legit reason I will do it. I like the look of the Geo better. And I know more people that own them than the axe. But really it's a matter of what is the better overall marker per price point. I want a reliable fast marker that is light and easy to break down that will most likely have parts available for quite some time.

Then both the Axe or Geo will cover that need.

[blackdeath1k]

Well if there is no real reason to go Geo then axe is deff the way to go based off buy in cost. Worst thing bout either of them is having to buy a new hpa tank for lower output pressure.

[ScottyBeans]

Well if there is no real reason to go Geo then axe is deff the way to go based off buy in cost. Worst thing bout either of them is having to buy a new hpa tank for lower output pressure.

I dont think you have to do that. A standard 750-800psi output will work with either marker just fine. The asa on the geo might be a little harder to activate, but that's it

[going_home]

You don't have to use an SLP on an Axe (I do) but Simon Steven's recommends it.

[river031403]

Just get a Luxe they are sexy and they talk to you
http://youtu.be/88ftxLUNryo

[blackdeath1k]

I'm way to cheap for that.

As for a tank. At the least I will most likely order internals from ninja to convert my SL tank.

[vintage]

or buy a slp reg and save the hp for when you want to use the rt once in a while.

[blackdeath1k]

I've got 2 shp regs. Changing one wouldn't be that big of a deal.

[Cyco-Dude]

I'm way to cheap for that.

As for a tank. At the least I will most likely order internals from ninja to convert my SL tank.

standard 800spi output is fine, btw. on the axe / mini, the asa is the hpr.

[boo]

The lower pressure tanks are just to shoot lower into the tank. Probably not a big deal for rec ball.

[Laku]

The lower pressure tanks are just to shoot lower into the tank. Probably not a big deal for rec ball.

Not true. At least with GEO (and should apply to axe as well) you can shoot just as low with 800psi output. It's the internal operating pressure that dictates how low on any tank you can go.

[Laku]

I think the major differences when comparing GEO 2.x and Axe are that with axe you get better efficiency, but GEO is slightly easier to change settings with because of the display (unless you get red line axe). And that in axe (correct me if I'm wrong) the in built regulator isn't meant to be user serviceable, where as in geo it is.

[Nobody]

There are now write ups describing how you can take it apart.

To me, ergonomics is a big thing. I have no problems with my Axe. Though, never shot or even hold a Geo, the frame being pushed all the way to the back of the gun does make things weird to me. But if you are going with the Axe, no problems.

Now, don't listen to Going_Home. He has weird likes and should not be used as a basis. I am weird, but Allen, takes the cake. I say this as a friend of his, yet i shake my head at the things he does. You do not need a Redline. I never understood why people need to constantly change the settings. The axe is great for "Setting & forgetting". Play in a 12.5 rof league, set it. The other board settings are just there to have. Otherwise, the Redline is an expensive piece that adds nothing to the performance(as compared to Xmod to AGD 3.1, for example).

But i will stress that, at least hold one before committing to one. It is similar to a mini, yet being stretched out is a huge difference. To me, the Nummech Frame as nothing to it(just a status symbol or a point to have an upgrade for upgrades sake). The foregrip extenders and ASA relocator is, personal fit.

[capt spank]

hp is fine on an axe or geo. I regularly switch between my mid pressure and high pressure tanks on my axe and my geo (when I had it). I don't think you can add shims to a slp tank reg to make it hp, but I'm not positive.

if you get a geo 2 and throw in a IV core, you will get comparable efficiency.

[blackdeath1k]

Well. I think if I can get a pair of Skates I have sold. And my project mag. I will buy a used Geo 3.0. Otherwise it will be an axe. Since i expect to have this a long time id rather not start with a platform that is too old. For parts sake. As far as settings. I'm not one to really play with that. If I can turn it on and it shoot fast and the eyes work. that's about all I will be critical of.

[mykroft]

The Mini/Axe platform is the Mag of electropneumatics.

They need minor maintenance, are stupendously reliable and perform well.

[going_home]

The Mini/Axe platform is the Mag of electropneumatics.

They need minor maintenance, are stupendously reliable and perform well.

I couldnt have said it better.

If/when I happen to find a CS1 for almost free I'll probably buy it, but I doubt I'll be without an Axe, they always just work.

;)

[blackdeath1k]

Hmmmmmmmm.

[blackdeath1k]

$50 price difference for a used 2015 axe pro or a geo3.0 both used. I'm torn since I don't have any REAL experience with either.

[barkingspider]

No need to get the newer body axe pro, the older style is just a cosmetically different body and cheaper. I see a few with redline board for around $300

[djinnform]

EGO - SL or CSL version.

[djinnform]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160402/c22f2b4b01d0a87a3d943bf47ce06336.jpg

[Nobody]

Don't get the pro. Just a regular axe & be happy. The pro offers nothing over the regular axe.

[blackdeath1k]

My deal on the pro is that it's easier to to dismantle. And honestly I hate the look of the forgrip/trigger guard on the original axe. Currently awaiting a response on a geo3 I found. If I can get a 3 for the right price I think that's what I will do because it appears possible to put a drop forward on it relatively easy. Axe drop forwards are hideous due to the design. If I can't score a clean geo3 for well under 500 it will be an axe for me though.

[BiNumber3]

What if you combine an Axe lowers with a mag? :D Automax?

[Merce]

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?272303-Redlined-Automag-Project-Finished

[nak81783]

blackdeath1k,

This was my similar thread a while back. http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?272243-Help-Me-Choose-My-Next-Marker

Here comes the buzz kill.

I played with it three times, and then I sold it. I couldn't get used to the trigger and recoil (or lack thereof). These are probably what some like about the newer markers, but I'm sticking with my Automags and Autococker. I more recently tried a Gtek and Ego Lv 1.1. Still going to stick with Mags/Cockers.

[blackdeath1k]

You sound a lot like me really. Only guns I've owned for 20+ years are mags. And I've shot my brother in law's 96 cocker in a few games. Idk. I've played with a geo3.5 and a mini on sidelines between games. Both different than my norm. And both lighter. I flipped my project mag for asking price. And since my current tanks will work. I figure if I can score the 3.0 for under 500 to my door I will go that route. If not it will be the axe. I hate the drop forwards they have for axes though. And I don't really have time to design and mill one right now. So for the drop forward side of things the Geo is for sure ahead on that one.

[nak81783]

I only lost about $30 on the Axe Pro. No big deal considering I added a drop forward, got to play with it a few times, and tinker with it a lot. I'm sure you'd be in the same situation if you decide you don't want to keep it. I say go for it, and have fun. Good luck!

[blackdeath1k]

I only lost about $30 on the Axe Pro. No big deal considering I added a drop forward, got to play with it a few times, and tinker with it a lot. I'm sure you'd be in the same situation if you decide you don't want to keep it. I say go for it, and have fun. Good luck!

That's kinda where I've settled as well. Figure if I decide it's not for me sell it and move on.... Or my wife latch on to it. Ha-ha.

[Justus]

You gonna have this new shiny thing ready to show me at the end of the month?

[blackdeath1k]

You gonna have this new shiny thing ready to show me at the end of the month?

Silver/purple geo3. Should have it in my possession by the end of next week. I take it your gonna play at least one game to use it?

It will be staying 100% in semi the whole day as well.

[going_home]

Well if there is no real reason to go Geo then axe is deff the way to go based off buy in cost. Worst thing bout either of them is having to buy a new hpa tank for lower output pressure.

You don't have to.

It possibly would be quieter with an SLP reg.

Why not get one and try it.

You could down the road buy just a reg.

Word of warning, with all the aftermarket stuff available (stock bolt is just fine), they can multiply like mags....


;)

[blackdeath1k]

Eh. Been using mags since the early 90s. So far I've only consistently owned 2.

As for the reg issue. Its looking like I'm gonna need to purchase another bottle. Currently I've got 2 with ninja shp regs set at 950psi each. They are for my mag and my wife's. Due to the output pressure I can't bring myself to put that on a Geo direct. Even if it will work. That high of an input on the gun reg would be hard on it to say the least. And there is no point in putting un needed stress on the marker.

If I decide I like the marker and decide to keep it I will buy an IV core bolt for it. I chose the color I wanted over buying one with the bolt. Figure in the long run it would be easier to get the bolt.

[going_home]

I just hand tighten my regs on, swap a standard Ninja for an SLP when needed.

[blackdeath1k]

I just hand tighten my regs on, swap a standard Ninja for an SLP when needed.

Internals are a direct swap. That's not a big issue. But it makes a split second marker swap impossible. I don't foresee ever getting rid of the 2 mags that I currently have. So having a bottle for each marker is a smart choice. Especially if one was to be loaned out.

[Justus]

Silver/purple geo3. Should have it in my possession by the end of next week. I take it your gonna play at least one game to use it?

It will be staying 100% in semi the whole day as well.

I'm usually able to hit the field in the spring game, so I sure hope so, lol!

[capt spank]

shp also makes the pops asa a pain in the ass to engage. not impossible obviously. but annoying.

that's why I mainly use just hp 8-850 tanks. usable with all my guns, axe, cockers, mags, mini. though I do have a mid pressure tank leftover from when I was rocking some bob long stuff.

[Dayspring]

You'll enjoy the Geo. It's quite a shooter. Add that IV Core in and you have a poor man's 3.5/GSL.

[blackdeath1k]

We will see. My first electro. And my first non mag since back in the prolite days. My only concern is that my wife will use it one game and decide she needs one as well.

[Dayspring]

We will see. My first electro. And my first non mag since back in the prolite days. My only concern is that my wife will use it one game and decide she needs one as well.

Video for maintenance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAY0xBSi_i8

Set it for stock settings - reset to factory settings. No telling what somebody else did to it. If you have any questions, let me know. I love mine.

[blackdeath1k]

I'm surprised they don't use urathane Orings in these markers. And ironically that is the exact one I've purchased.

[Laku]

I'm surprised they don't use urathane Orings in these markers.

No need as the operating pressure is so low. And makes o-rings cheaper. Might also have some other design reasons I'm oblivious about.

Seconded on what Dayspring said, reset to factory settings.

[blackdeath1k]

No need as the operating pressure is so low. And makes o-rings cheaper. Might also have some other design reasons I'm oblivious about.

Seconded on what Dayspring said, reset to factory settings.

I expected urathane due to drag coefficient.

Got a new bolt and sear ordered for my classicRT. Got a SL tank ordered for this marker. And should have marker next week. My game with justice at the end of the month should be fun.

[going_home]

Better buy two cases of paint, one won't be enough.


;)

[blackdeath1k]

Ha-ha. Me and the wife got in a firefight last fall with each other. Think that one fight cost me a case of paint on its own.