DB Cooper case

[skipdogg]

Saw the DB cooper history channel mini series last night. Of course Tom was on it (for only 5 mins). Thought it was ok.
So, my biggest question is, what is up with the family that found the money? The dad's reaction was so over the top guilty, he HAD to be in on it.
However, I know Tom is upset about that. Tom, if you could explain the family that found the money I would appreciate it. Like i said the way the dad reacted was extreme. I would have put the show in a completely different direction based on that dad. He would have been water boarded immediately until he gave up all the secrets he seemed to have.

[AGD]

This is where the public view of investigations goes wrong. You can't "water board" a guy because he looks guilty. The back story that you don't know:
You heard the FBI con the dad into bringing in the evidence with a reward that was later retracted.
The FBI accused the family of hiding the rest of the 200k
The FBI had people watching them for months after the event.
Even though they had a legal right to get the money back, they had to get a lawyer to sue the FBI and after years they were finally awarded the money.

SO a guy comes along and tells them they are shooting a documentary about DB Cooper and he agrees to be on camera. The investigator springs a testimony on the dad that there is a drug addict from 35 years ago claiming he had a part in the crime. Frankly I am surprised he stayed as calm as he did. I would have walked out.

The questions that were NOT asked, WHY would you plant and then "discover" money? What good would it do? The family brought the money home and tried to clean it off to spend it, why would you do that if it was all a setup? There were many fragments found at the scene, did they plant those too? The rubber bands crumbled off when they picked up the bundles, how did they accomplish that if they were buried earlier that week?

The entire 4 hour show turned out to be a complete bust. The investigators were total amateurs that were sucked into the Cooper Vortex. The FBI is so sick of this stuff they finally closed the case. Can't say I blame them.

[BigEvil]

This is where the public view of investigations goes wrong. You can't "water board" a guy because he looks guilty. The back story that you don't know:
You heard the FBI con the dad into bringing in the evidence with a reward that was later retracted.
The FBI accused the family of hiding the rest of the 200k
The FBI had people watching them for months after the event.
Even though they had a legal right to get the money back, they had to get a lawyer to sue the FBI and after years they were finally awarded the money.

SO a guy comes along and tells them they are shooting a documentary about DB Cooper and he agrees to be on camera. The investigator springs a testimony on the dad that there is a drug addict from 35 years ago claiming he had a part in the crime. Frankly I am surprised he stayed as calm as he did. I would have walked out.

The questions that were NOT asked, WHY would you plant and then "discover" money? What good would it do? The family brought the money home and tried to clean it off to spend it, why would you do that if it was all a setup? There were many fragments found at the scene, did they plant those too? The rubber bands crumbled off when they picked up the bundles, how did they accomplish that if they were buried earlier that week?

The entire 4 hour show turned out to be a complete bust. The investigators were total amateurs that were sucked into the Cooper Vortex. The FBI is so sick of this stuff they finally closed the case. Can't say I blame them.


WOW. That sucks. I guess I can stop watching it and erase it after I see your part :)

[skipdogg]

Thanks for the back story. I knew there was one. I agree, there was no explanation or real motive to discover the money 8 years later. I still say his reaction was weird (and I know you cant just water board people).
So, one more question if I may. I ASSUME the money was never spent? It seems they had the serial numbers. So whoever did it, if they got away with it, it was a complete waste of time because they couldn't have ever spent the money cause the FBI was ready to track it. correct?

[going_home]

So what is the verdict, is DB deceased ?

And did they have dye packs back then ?

[Nobody]

So what is the verdict, is DB deceased ?

Probably


And did they have dye packs back then ?

No, not until the 80s.

[BigEvil]

This case should have been referred to the Punkworks for analysis a long time ago...

[going_home]

Child please. :nono:

[AGD]

So the money is an interesting story. The cash did NOT have sequential serial numbers! Before the crime ever happened the FBI had banks gather random cash and record the random numbers in 500k blocks that were stuck in the vault for ransom situations. When Cooper demanded the cash, they gave him 200k, then looked to see what numbers were left in that 500k block and put out a list of serial numbers. Since they were not sequential, it was VERY difficult to check and see if you had a Cooper $20. There was no automated way to track serial numbers at that time (pre-computer).

AGD

[AGD]

For more details about our extensive research on the case see www.citizensleths.com.

AGD

[BLachance75]

My perspective is that the 2 guys came to a conclusion then got as much half ass evidence that they could to help sustain their conclusion. In true TV fashion History dragged it out for as long as they could to get in as much ad time as possible.

[alpha_q_up23]

So while building a mag and making sure everything is good to go for tomorrow, I have a Netflix show playing on the background and I hear "a team of scientists lead by Tom Kaye" and I look up and sure enough I see Mr. AGD himself on my TV
if anyone is interested in seeing it, it's a show called White Rabbit Project, it's a Netflix Original, Episode 5: Heist! Around 32 minutes in

[Doc Nickel]

For more details about our extensive research on the case see www.citizensleuths.com.

-Forgot the "u". Fixed that for ya. :D

Doc.

[Doc Nickel]

That's the first time I've read anything more than cursory pass at the case. (It all took place just a bit before my time. :) )

I love the detail and attention everyone applied to the case. (Well, except whoever lost those cigarette butts all those years ago. :) )

What details I can provide: That aluminum chip shown on the "particles" section, is almost certainly a lathe turning. A drill chip would be more consistently twisted, and would assume a very small hole. A milling chip wouldn't have the same kind of twist, or would be shorter. Very high probability it's a lathe chip, from a very light finishing cut, and probably hand-fed due to the irregular nature of the curl.

The "bird bath" I'd bet money is a grinding spark. Titanium burns readily and makes a hot, white spark- I have no idea what a "titanium spark ash" looks like, but that particle strongly suggests to me a burned/oxidized/melted look. The crystals inside could be oxides, or even fragments of the grinding wheel- which more likely than not would have been some form of aluminum oxide.

A microscopic examination of the tie might reveal burned fibers (or melted, if there's a percentage of synthetic fibers) and if so, a list of the places that might have been grinding pure titanium for some reason, in 1971, should be pretty short.

The titanium chip- the long, thin one- is puzzling. It doesn't look like a cut chip, or a grinding fragment. I wish I could see the other side- if the opposite side is curled, it's a fine chip from a very close milling operation. If it's solid... well, it's not a chip from any process I can think of. It looks more like a splinter.

Which means what? Cooper may have worked in a destructive testing lab? Titanium technology was still somewhat in it's infancy back then, and I'd imagine more than a few shops were still doing their own empirical testing. Pure Ti is quite malleable, and unlikely to shatter when bent, even forcibly, so... maybe a tensile strength test? When the coupon parts, perhaps a few microscopic particles are sprayed out?

Might explain the stainless/titanium chip too, the stainless being part of some testing fixture?

In my mind, it lends a little credence to the tie itself. The wearer, from the evidence of the metal particles, clearly spent some time around some process that produced the fragments. The fact it was a clip-on tie strongly suggests the wearer spent time around machinery on a fairly regular basis- clip ons being far less likely to pull a wearer in if caught in some sort of rotating mechanism.

No tie at all, would be a shop floor worker. A tie with no particulates means an office worker who rarely or never saw the working parts of the factory. A standard tie with particulates means rare but regular, and probably brief visits to the working areas. A clip-on with particulates means a manager or foreman, or a worker in a 'clean' part of the plant, like a testing lab.

Of course, it may be a sliver from a different process. Perhaps something like using a die-grinder with a rotary file. Not the kind of thing you might see an engineer doing in a suit and tie, though, or even after taking his suit coat off and rolling up his sleeves.

Question: Where there any descriptions at all of his bomb? I gather just the one stewardess saw it, so I'd imagine it could have been anything from a pack of old road flares to the real thing. (If he had the real thing, and made it himself, that might be an alternate explanation of some of the chemicals found, too.)

Not that any of that really helps, I'm sure. But you got my curiosity up, and who knows, some little note might jog somebody's memory and some links might fall into place.

Doc.

[cudamelland]

93309

[river031403]

I liked the DB cooper movie it was very entertaining back in the late 80's

[waycrazy]

I found the money and spent it on Paintball stuff.... There ya go mystery solved. :-)

[Dayspring]

The DB Cooper case (and several articles that mention Tom) are trending on Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/topic/DB-Cooper/115796878436077?source=wtfrt&position=1&trqid=6375703055547352274

[cphilip]

I think Tom might be DB Cooper.... just sayin....

[luke]

I think Tom might be DB Cooper.... just sayin....

https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fcdn.meme.am%2Finstances%2F5383038 3.jpg&f=1

:D

[cphilip]

He clearly knows far too much....

[Doc Nickel]

I think Tom might be DB Cooper.... just sayin....

-So that's where he got the money to found AGD! ... twenty years later. :)

Doc.