New RT, Interesting experience...

[Mild 7]

My brother's new RT came in through UPS today. I was more excited than he was. Shortly after it arrived, I drove straight to the nearest paintball store around my area called Cousin Paintball Store, which is also known as advantagepaintball.com.

I needed a few things from them for the RT. Therefore, I approached the clerk and asked:

Me: Hello, I need "this and that" (<--shortened) RT.
Cousins: Sure! (Placed all the items on the table)
Me: (Looked around the marker display and saw 1 E-Mag)
Me: So, you guys don't carry any RT's?
Cousins: No, we try not to sell mags. (Then walked-to another counter)
Me: (I walked over) Why not?
Cousins: Because nobody wants them.
Me: Well, if nobody wants them, why's there an E Mag sitting there?
Cousins: That thing has been sitting on the shelf forever.
Me: (The E-Mag was placed in the far corner of the store)
Well, it might help if you put the E Mag where people can see it?
Cousins: Nobody wants them!
Me: (For some reason, I was a little offended by his attitude) There's got a be a reason why NOBODY wants them, can you tell me why?
Cousins: Well, people today likes high-ended gun. Mag is big in the Midwest but it's probably dying away. Also, people in the northeast of the country have more disposable income, therefore, would spent more on high ended guns.
Me: Yes, I can agree that I've seen more mags in the Midwest than the east coast region coming from Michigan/Chicago. I've also own a cocker as well. However, I personally find mags requires very little maintenance and more reliable than high ended guns, which have more parts to worry about.
Cousins: Yes. But most people here in the east coast have more disposable income, and people likes cockers and angels better.

Here comes the funny part....
2 men walked in, looked around the store, purchase a few items, and on the checkout, they approached the clerk who I was having this conversation and asked..

Men1: Do you have any RTs or RT Pro?
Cousins: No.
Men2: Damn! Those RTs are so cool. I always wanted to get one.
Cousins:.................
Me: Well, that's a pretty big difference in opinion eh?
Cousins: Anything else I can help you with?
Me: Yes, I bought a Redz barrel condom here a few months ago. I can't find anymore of'em on the shelf, are you guys out?
Cousins: We have plenty of barrel condoms.
Me: Yes, I see that. But I would prefer the Redz.
Cousins: (Sarcastically glaze into my eyes and whispers) *they are all the same*. (Then walks away)
Me: You know what, I don't need anything then. Ring me up.
Cousins: Ok...(pause of silence for 2 mins..) So when are you going to play?
Me: Next Saturday. Why? Are you a ref?
Cousins: I don't ref in the winter. Plus, I have a real job.
Me: (Give him the cash) Well, I certainly hope you keep your day job!

This clerk was about 35 years old.

I felt like sharing this experience of mine 'cause I left that store feeling a bit insulted. I felt insulted not solely due to the dialogue of the Mag conversation but one other issue not mentioned. However, his view is almost pretty typical 'cause we hear about and meet these kinds of people more and more on the field and AO.

I am not an advocate for mags. I love my RT long before I joined AO because it rarely gives me any problems. However, I became a loyal customer of AGD after I joined AO and experienced the excellent and personable service provided by AGD (Tom Kaye, Joanne, & Tech Jon) and the helpful team of AO brothers and sisters.

Thanks for listening.

[Kajo]

I am kind of getting sick of posts like the above. Yes, mags are slightly frowned down upon, but it is not ALWAYS the fault of the field, gun techs, and other players. What do you expect from a company that has virtually no advertising and doesn't sponosor many teams? People don't see AGD guns that much and thus people don't buy them, because people don't buy them and their is very little custom market or anyway to customize mags there is very little market in general for mags thus giving them a rather poor resale value. All this adds up to a general mags suck attitude. I don't agree that they are a crappy gun, I owned two and they shot fairly decently, just about as good as any other gun with a mechanical trigger.

I think it would be good for AGD to get a bigger marketing staff, or maybe a bigger staff in general. They should start trying to sponosor teams at all levels, look at how many sponosors WGP and WDP give out, all that stuff trickles down. When more tourney players are shooting mags more people that watch them win tourneys are going to want to go get mags. My last few local tourneys and practices i have not seen ONE single mag, nobody had even heard of the SFL or Extreme E-Mag. Can you call the ignorant for it? No, because up until i stumbled across this board I hadn't heard of them either and I browse all the paintball sites and read a few magazines. I mean, why doesn't AGD take out multiple full colors adds in magazines, I realize they like to spend the money elsewhere, but they need to start thinking about selling guns.

Not patronizing a field is your right, but simply refusing to buy because they hold a view that much of the industry does isn't really helping anything. What might have helped more would have been to grab the parts, go get your gun and let the guy play around with it. I also would have really lowballed him on the e-mag because "No one wants it" :)

Just my view, but I am getting sick of the mag owners blaming all the field owners and resellers for the "mag hatred."

Kajo out-

[AngelBoy]

If you ask me (and u did by posting this here), AGD has excelled in Marketing. You might not see big ads, sponsorships, or all that stuff, but look at how many people do own mags. Now think of all those people, and realize that most of them heard about the mag purely by word of mouth. Just my opinion.

[Mild 7]

You all can look at this experience of mine in many different perspective. The purpose of me sharing this experience wasn't intended to blame the store or whine about the store NOT promoting OR bad mouthing mag. The store never stated that mag is a crappy gun either. However, the particular clerk that was helping me holds mag in a lower-end category, which is quite contradicting to me at the time because the only mag they had on display was the E mag. In addition, 2 customers came in at the time of my presence requesting to see a RT.

Personally, I don't blame any entities, dead or alive, on their preferences. Most businesses out there wants to make a profit. They can say whatever they want in their own best interest. However, they should also be considerate on the words they use. The clerk I dealt with have his own definations of what is high-end & what is not. According to his words, high end means more money in his term, since he expressed that east coast got the disposable income in comparision to other states. So, is it always the case that more money means better? In most cases, I would have to agree. It's just that mags, regardless of electro or mechanical, are not exactly on the cheap side.

Angel boy made a good point. AGD do not have big ads compared to their competitors. They also have a limited upgrades and accessories compared to some of competitors. However, AGD's competetive advantage is their ways of saleing the intangibles, which can be quite lucrative in the long-run. There's also a sizable mag owners out there and I believe majority of them are satisfied with their purchase. I know I was, which I bought it 4 years ago by words of mouth. My brother and my friend, who also bought it by my word of mouth. So no one would buy a mag eh?










:)

[MikeCouves]

Nothing like that around here, everyone loves mags and that's what the stores encourage. No one likes COCKERS! Haha, the irony, and I love it!

[MiCRoFooL]

Yeah, Candians are a whacky bunch! lol

[Phil]

It all started with me at my field. I used a rt and now an e-mag. Now there are 2 rt pro users and a retromag user at my field. I will convert them all eventually (evil grin).

That guy was right about marketing. Word of mouth can be powerful but you have to get some print out there. If I were AGD I would be waiting for the Extreem mags to get into full swing before paying for big adds. The Extreem mags seem to be a much more marketable product given the current environment.

[magman007]

I disagree with the cousins paintball guy. Up here in Pa (north east if you ask me) there are a ton of mags. Out at the ZAP IAO i saw tons of mags. THere was on average one mag per team. It was beautiful. It was nice to hear the ting ting ting of a customized minimag over the clack clack clack of a cocker. I also remember watching one back player with an e-mag and a warp play off against another backplayer with an angel. Guess who won? and guess who wound up with the hopper hit? Mags are every where, you just gotta look for em

[Omicron]

You forgot to thank Marcia Purse! She's the best! :D

[Mantis]

Mild 7, I think you should call the owner/manager of that store and file a complaint. Maybe other people interpreted this differently, but from the text you wrote it seems obvious to me that this guy doesn't consider his job at the paintball store very important ("I have a real job"). And if I was the store manager, I don't think I'd want somebody like that working for me. Completely aside from his opinions on Automags, it seems like you got rather poor service.

[Mild 7]

Mantis, you're right on point. Cousin's are directly affiliated with the paintball field at Coram. They are all owned by the same man or group. I've been to Coram 4 times.
Each time during my visit, I saw cockers & angels more than anything else. I see mags too, but they're certainly in the minority. I couldn't careless if all the players there use cockers or angels. But I think the clerk at Cousin's holds his perception by what he sees on the field at Coram. If that were his view of the paintball world, I would dare to say, it's a pretty narrow view. So be it, to each its own.

The action of contacting their management was in my consideration and you were not the first to suggest. However, from the poor quality of management at Coram and a couple of Cousin's store I visited, I think my 2 cents on this issue would have very little effect. From now on, I'm just going to have to make small purchases online and seek other alternatives for bigger purchases. As matter of fact, I just bought a Redz barrel condom and 2 tank covers from 888paintball. The clerk sarcastically whispered to me in front of others that all barrel plugs/condoms works the same. Well, the main function of a paintball marker is to mark people, right? Then who cares if it's a Talon or any other brands out there?

I think I am spoiled by AGD's kindness in their service and thank you all for the time invested in this discussion.

[AngelBoy]

Originally posted by Phil
That guy was right about marketing. Word of mouth can be powerful

From this moment forward I will be known worldwide as "That guy":D :D

[Predater]

i live in southern IL. mags from what i remember have never ben populer. i baught my first mag 6 years ago and got made fun of for it. it wasnt a cocker. i really didnt care cuz my mag would go without any probs forever. unlike a cocker that you have to work on. i love cockers but dont want one cuz im to lazy for the timing thing. i got an rt and love it. im going to sell my old classic so i can buy another rt. great to have a backup gun identical to your main gun.

now the store guy seamed like a jerk. saying that he has a real job while working there. id report him to his boss.

[AGD]

Mild 7,

Thanks for the feedback but considering the inside polictical view I am not surprised. As stated before the average store owner is not motivated to sell you a product that is not generally accesorized because it doesn't make him money. The owner of Cousins is involved in many aspects of the paintball industry and if you don't help him in his other projects don't expect support at the retail level.

AGD customers are a special breed that don't just take peoples word for it but think things out for themselves. We have a plan and you will watch it execute over the coming months. I can tell you from the reaction here this week in LA and Sacramento that the new body style on the Extreme is going to change peoples minds about mags. Thanks to your help here on AO we have a real winner here. It's even amazing me!

The guys that work in the store here are talking about putting in preorders for them. They are ALL high end Cocker and Angel owners. They were really convinced when they weighed Mannys gun on a scale and it was one oz lighter than a Fly Angel. One of the best comments was "I can get to the front with this!"

So just hang on, like they said, we can get to the front with this!!

AGD

[Kajo]

Originally posted by AGD

So just hang on, like they said, we can get to the front with this!!

AGD

That was a pretty good post... maybe I'll even catch extreme fever when they come out :)

Kajo out-

[Butterfingers]

Yeah I tend to avoid cousins as much as possible. They read stuff directly out of a smart parts catalouge.

If I need somthing I usually shift my patronage towards "Island Paintball Supplies" a mom and pop family business. The definition of your local PB shop. Always friendly always courtious. All the workers are family and the father has been playing since the mid 80's. He's a high school teacher too so hes educated.

I think I have heard the smartest quotes from the owner Mr. P. and his sons.

"You got a nice short barrel picked out there, heres some paint that will work well with it, it will just make it more accurate."

"The best thing you can do for accuracy is use good paint"

"We just got these new RT Pro's in today"

"We just got these warp feeds in today, these things are great."

"Did you see these new inteliframes they are absolutely the best mag frame you can buy"

Kid: "What can I do to get more range"
Worker: "Turn Your Velocity Up" "Aim Higer"

[XPK]

This cousins incident of poor service is an example of how a big business can get out of touch with its customers. Perhaps cousins has gotten so big that it thinks it can treat customers poorly because there are lots of them so who cares about one or two. If incidents like this continue ie if the customer service continues to decline paintball customers will just go elsewhere. Paintball is a luxury activity and there is a growing market and pool of competitors in the industry. If prices are more or less the same why not go to the salesman who treats you better. Cousins should know that the majority of their customers have plenty of disposable income where ever they are (its not a cheap hobby even with a low grade marker), and are experienced consumers who expect a standard of service and courtesy at the point of sale. They possess an elastic spending attitude ie "we ain't stupid and we don't like being treated like an idiot and you just lost a customer." All cars serves the same purpose but i'll take my business elsewhere if I feel like the salesman is making me feel unhappy about MY PURCHASE. Let me emphasize that its MY PURCHASE. Belittling MY PURCHASE = to belittling ME.

Customers know poor service when it slaps them in the face like that. That salesman at cousins should stick to his real job because obviously he sucks at sales. AGD isn't the issue in this case although AGD should be concerned that a dealer has nasty things to say about AGD products. The true issue is that wiseguys should not be put in a position to interact with customers because they are nasty little individuals who think they are so cool and powerful being a ref and holding down multiple jobs at such an age (tsk tsk). Cousins should also be blamed for putting this rectum spelunker in a position to condescend on their valued customers. "Good eye human resource guy." If anyone has the right to be sarcastic its me the paintball consumer who shells out the grand or two to indulge in a luxury sport. Remember cousins i pay top dollar for the product but don't short change me on the smile....or you will die. :)

[Skoad]

if noone wants his emag, you shoulda offered a cheapo price :), ask him how much he wants for it. i mcould take it off his hands

[Butterfingers]

They sell the e-mag for MSRP no wonder they arent selling it.

[Croix71]

I don't know about you all but I got into paintball because my good friends were really into it. Most, if not all were using Mags and it was just convenient to have the same marker. When I had a problem with my Mag I knew someone in my group would know how to fix it. Most of all I trusted their word over the local paintball store. Over the last 8 years I haven't regretted my decision & my gun is still as reliable as ever. :D

Now if I had gotten into the sport on my own, I would've probably ended up with a `Cocker. Just because that's the eye candy that stores display and it's what they'll swear by.