Autocockers shoot farther and more accurately?

[Shail]

Thats the argument Ive always had against my choice in markers, I think mags are the greatest markers out there, and alot of my friends always try to use that comment "title" against me.Could a few of guys give me more to fight back with then "No they're not".

[FordPrefect]

Say this: If you are shooting the same weight paintball at the same velocity, then a Blade will shoot as far as a Talon and as far as an Angel.

If that doesn't work, ask them what part of a cocker makes it shoot farther. Does Punisher's Mag with the pnuematics "shoot as far as an Autococker?" Or is it something else that makes it shoot farther?

Ask them if a Sniper II "shoots as far as an Autococker". Because that is basicly what the Autococker is made from.

[nilloc 93]

The distance a paintball travels is a function of the marker's velocity. Any 2 balls that leave 2 different marker's barrels with the same velocity will travel the same distance. That's just simple physics.
As for accuracy, I've heard this arguement a thousand times and it has still yet to be proved to me that either marker is signifigantly more accurate than the other. Both are great markers, but one just happens to be a 'Mag!

[Cha0tic]

just ask him to open a physics book.

[TheTramp]

NOT AGAIN!!!!

[liigod]

there are MANNY factors to how a paintball flies, its not just closed vs open bolt. but ill tell you now, no one on here will tell u what your friends say. But the truth is, manny people are more acurate with aucockers becuase they kick less when properly setup. Just a though for u.

oh yea, also most people like the layout of the gun too.


i pity the foo who brings up a mag vs cocker debate on AO

[WickeDKlowN]

if you have 2 different guns, with the exact same velocity, the exact same shape/size paintbnall, the exact same type of barrel, in similar conditions, they will shoot exactly the same. try a search, you will find the exact same answer, or something similar, over and over again.

[Jesse_K]

Originally posted by WickeDKlowN
if you have 2 different guns, with the exact same velocity, the exact same shape/size paintbnall, the exact same type of barrel, in similar conditions, they will shoot exactly the same. try a search, you will find the exact same answer, or something similar, over and over again.

comon people,

how many times do we have to go over this stuff. The autococker shoots more accurate at a longer range than almost every gun out there. Plain and simple.

You cannot take a mag, and a autococker out on a field with the same barell, the same paintball's, and at the same velocity ( which they do at indoor fields anyways ) And have the shoot the EXACT same. Its almost impossible. If the mag shot even 1/3 as accurate as an autococker there would be alot more people with mags wouldnt there. nuff said.

[Rooster]

Who let you out of your cage?



Anyways, yes the autococker shoots farther than any gun made including the 16" guns on battleships, with the accuracy of a police sniper rifle. Why? The elves of course.

[Butterfingers]

you got somthing to back that up....

given the same paint to barrel match accuracy of the guns are identical.

the reason why more people use cockers than mags is somthing called marketing...

I guess eveybody uses microsnot windows because it is the "most reliable" OS out there right... right....


http://www.pbstar.com/wgpaut20.html

http://www.pbstar.com/agdautclas.html

you tell me benchmounted which is more accurate...

If you have been around paintball as long as I have you realize everything is a marketing scheme and for the most part most high end guns show identical accuracy benchmounted.

[shartley]

:rolleyes:

[Temo Vryce]

Shail when you get your new mag let me know and I'll back to the field and Do a mexican stand off with anyone of the Cocker boys there and we'll see who is more accurate when it really counts. The only cocker that I have seen that shoots father an a mag everytime is the FlatLine (tm) Cocker.

The big reason that they are tell you that the cocker shoots straighter and father is because they don't want to admit that you have a better marker. It's not the marker that's accurate it's the person holding the marker.

If that advice doesn't shut them up, then tell them that I'll sick Tracey on them if they don't stuff it.


Now as to why this topic keeps coming up. We get new players here everyday, and not all of them have been arround since the Mag vs. Cocker days. So they ask and ask and ask somemore. This is one of those topics that's going to reappear every so often. Now you can be polite and answer thier questions like most of the people here did. Or you can stay quiet and just ignore the thread. Ranting about how often this topic comes just makes you look stupid and makes the person asking feel bad. This is AO, we're better than that.

[CleenSweep]

Well said Super Chicked :D

[giblit]

OMG mags are just as good as cockers but MAGs are cheaper and it doesnt take 700 bucks to trick out a mag unlike the cocker, which are pieces of crap ive owned both guns and i think by far mags are better, i only buy AGD products now im gunna get a emag as soon as i get some cash :D :cool:

[Patron God of Pirates]

Unfortunately the Paintball world spins on the axis of hype, not research. We know it to be untrue that Cockers shoot further and more accurately than any marker firing at the same velocity, with the same paint, and under the same conditions, than any other marker.

This means that there argument is based on a faulty premise. As is the case with most arguments based on faulty premise, the best counter argument is simply "Prove it".

[AcemanPB]

Originally posted by Jesse_K


comon people,

how many times do we have to go over this stuff. The autococker shoots more accurate at a longer range than almost every gun out there. Plain and simple.

You cannot take a mag, and a autococker out on a field with the same barell, the same paintball's, and at the same velocity ( which they do at indoor fields anyways ) And have the shoot the EXACT same. Its almost impossible. If the mag shot even 1/3 as accurate as an autococker there would be alot more people with mags wouldnt there. nuff said.

lol ..... i'm not even going to ask if you have any reasearch cause i'm preety sure i already know the answer

[SteveD]

If you take a Cocker and a Mag and drop them both off of an 10 story building at the same time, the cocker will get to the bottom straighter and faster! ;) I never get tired of this lame argument. I also never get tired of shooting up guys with cockers, angels, etc...

Steve D

[Creative Mayhem]

I also never get tired of shooting up guys with cockers

EXACTLY:D :p

[Spaceman613]

http://www.spaceman613.net/troll.jpg

[gmag]

this should be in the faq section.....

[gmag]

this should be in the faq section.....

[DarkRipper]

While I don't necessarily think the cocker is inherently better than the mag, neither do I think the mag is better than the cocker. They both have flaws and quirks.

Play with both and you decide what you play with better.

If you get a cocker that runs, don't take it apart and don't mess with it.

:)
DR

[magsRus]

cockers and shockers do shoot more accurate at long range because they are a closed bolt design

[echoes]

And how is closed bolt inherently more accurate?

[Army]

Barrel length does not matter, bolt operation does not matter, high or low pressures do not matter, elves do not matter, hopper rate does not matter, Co2 or nitro does not matter, gun operation does not matter, shiny back-blocks do not matter, little or extensive milling does not matter, plastic-steel-aluminum-lead-gold-titanium-wood bolts do not matter...


If a 'Cocker and a 'Mag are shooting identical speeds, let's say 280fps, the balls will land in the same general area no matter the distance. Weight differences of the balls is not enough to change parameters enough at the distances that paintball guns are able to shoot.

Neither is more accurate than the other. THIS IS SIMPLE, BASIC PHYSICS, NOTHING MORE. I'm not a rocket scientist, and I didn't do so hot in math at school, but this is so simple even for me!

[obsolete898]

People would rather belive hype and marketing than physics.

Just like planes fly based on physics not some magical strings held by fairies that at any moment could fail. It's called physics learn it, use it, live it.

PS: If they are more accurate and have longer distance show some proof. That's all we ask.

[nutz]

let the arguement go on...

the only thing that can physicly change a guns performance is velocity, barrel to paint match, and back spin on the ball... only certain things put back spin on a ball. The the paint to barrel match can affect the straightness of the paintballs path but gun to gun no matter what you say they shoot the same accuracy and distance at the same velocity. The reason most people in paintball think one gun can shoot farther than another is because of the way the gun feels when the paint comes out of it. I agree that they all shoot the same accuracy and distance but some guns just feel more accurate. Can this be explained? Asside from my guess on how the gun feels, no.

[i-luv-my-rt]

LOL of course they do!!! ;)

[1105]

cockers only shoot further because the person behind the gun doesnt have the skill to get up close and persional... they just sit in the back and long-ball it across the field :p unlike mag people who have the skill to get close enough to bunker :D

[Bartleby]

cockers and shockers do shoot more accurate at long range because they are a closed bolt design

Here's something you may find interesting...read through it and let us know what you find out :D
http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/paintguns/balistic/closedopen.shtml

[Mav D MagMan]

Thanks for throwin that article in here Bartleby, I was going to noodlesmack him with that one as well...

What makes scientific fact so unbelievable to all these cocker jocks? LOL, I love cockers, but they do have their downsides and none of these super-impossible against the laws of physical qualities they swear exist.

[magking1971]

Yes Jesse_k, Newton had it all wrong.:rolleyes:

[Bartleby]

it's rather amusing though. you get alot of this response,"i don't know how they do it, but cockers shoot farther than mags". and when they really feel like they want people to think they know what they're talking about, then they'll say,"because cockers are closed bolt". Meanwhile taking no consideration as to what the "closed-bolt" means.

For anyone who has not read that article, i strongly reccomend you do. it will clear up a few things for ya :D

[DarkRipper]

Army, how exactly does CO2 not matter when compared to N2? I'd think that everyone would be running a 20oz C02 tank, then... since it's cheaper in the short run.

Don't tell me that compressed air systems are run by elves and that the better consistency and performance from a N2 system is all hype.

:)
DR

[joeyjoe367]

he means as far as range/accuacy goes, it doesn't matter for 1 shot.

If they're both goin' exactly 280 fps, it won't matter if it's shot with Co2 or N2.

Now, N2 just happens to be easier to work with to get to shoot consistantly.

The only thing that matters as far as accuracy goes is barrel/paint match, and a good regulator.

You can buy a good barrel, and the automag has a very good built in regulator.

Can't say the exact same for stock 'cocker reg's, but you sure can toss a good one on there.

[DarkRipper]

But how can you determine consistency and equal range from just one ball?

I'd say that he's incorrect... you have to have a consistent air system and shoot a series of shots to determine range and accuracy, whether or not the gun actually matters.
There are guns out there that just aren't built to the same tolerances as others (mag and cocker don't fall into this category) and you can't expect them to provide the same range or consistency/accuracy as a higher end gun.

Also, I've gotten spikes on my first shot with C02, and every other one as well.

DR

[Zygote]

If you had Superman's lungs you could blow a paintball through a boomstick at 280 fps just as accurately as a cocker. Although the saliva may cause it to hook. So nevermind.

[Shail]

I can't wait to get my emag, and thanks to everyone for the info.I didn't want to cause a debate, I just wanted to know the true facts which cancel out the myths.

[the JoKeR]

Originally posted by SteveD
I never get tired of this lame argument. I also never get tired of shooting up guys with cockers, angels, etc...

Steve D

You're too violent, Steve. ;)

[Magluvr]

Originally posted by magsRus
cockers and shockers do shoot more accurate at long range because they are a closed bolt design

Just out of curiousity how does the closed bolt design aid in accuracy? Some say that its because the gun doesn't jump any before or while shooting the ball. Well I have news for you, believe it or not the lower hammer in the cocker is moving before the paintball has even been fired. Second, the mag won't jump while shooting the paintball because the paintball has already left the barrel before it recocks itself. So the recoil won't affect the mag's accuracy, but the precoil of the cocker will affect its accuracy. So is there any good reason why the closed bolt system is better than the open bolt system?

P.S. Remember that the mags also fire the paintball once it is already completely in the barrel. So when the air actually hits the paintball the paintball is in the same position it is when the air hits the ball in the cocker.