Bwaites
06-11-2002, 12:31 AM
Ok,
I've thought about this off and on for three weeks, tell me if my logic is faulty. (Hey my emag is at AGD and I didn't have anything better to do!!) There are only 3 reasons for ball breaks that I can find. (Chops don't count as they are user induced.)
1. There is a fractured or misshaped shell and the combination of movement and/or firing ruptures the ball. This could be a loader or elbow problem. This is not a GUN problem. This applies also to fragile paint, that one or two bounce stuff some tourney players seem to like.
2. The ball is good but it fractures because it is damaged at the breech, this could happen because of a sharp edge on the bolt or other part of the gun, or because it is pinched. It could also happen because the ball gets into the chamber because of a poor ball detent, this usually happens when two balls get in the breech together. This is a GUN problem.
3. The ball is good, the loading/chambering process causes no damage, but the barrel is improperly matched. If the barrel is too small, goo results. If it is too large, the ball detent may not keep a single ball in the chamber and allows another ball in, goo results (usually).
I setup a trial using my old 12 volt Revvie, Post BE, but it seems to work great. (My HALO is at Odyssey for the upgrade. See why I have so much time!!)
I did some testing, using new, Advantage shell, All Star.
Fresh out of a new bag, it measured .685-.688, this fits my CP .689 10 inch perfectly using the tried and true blow test. In my Classic mag at 70 degrees with a rounded long nose non foamie bolt this paint flew straight and true, no breech breaks as fast as I could shoot. 100 shots in bursts. I had one barrel break. Although I had closely inspected each round and measured each, I suspect this was one which was slightly larger. It was well down the barrel.
I switched to my .685 CP 10 inch Professional. I quit after only 20-30 shots. I was breaking at least every other ball, cleaning everything up, and then starting over. Everything seemed to be in the barrel, though a couple times there was paint on the bolt and in the breech, I suspect it was breaking further down, as no shell fragments were left there.
I then switched to my .693 CP 10 inch Professional, No breaks in one hundred shots, the balls tended to almost roll all the way thru the barrel after they were pushed through the detent. Interestingly, I couldn't see a difference in accuracy at the 50 foot range I was using. (I did not check for the difference in air use, and doubt that in one hundred shots it would be detectable.)
I then switched to some old Proball I had from last year. It was originally very small caliber, but I supected it had expanded, it measured .682-.685, obviously still quite small. I shot 50 rounds through the .693 barrel without breaks, I did get a couple of double ball bloops, but it was overall only slightly less accurate than the Allstar, but some of the balls had dimples after sitting so long. I switched to the .685 barrel and shot 50 shots without breaks. In both these tests I shot the first ten balls individually, then bursts of 3-10. I had no chops, which is better than when I am playing and get excited!
Finally, I went back to the Allstar, to a bag which was opened 3 weeks ago. Most of it measured .688-.691. It broke at least 2 out of three balls until I quit, while using the .689 barrel. It shot just fine out of the .693 barrel, 100 rounds, no breaks, no bloops. Essentially the same accuracy as the fresh paint.
OK, my conclusions;
A. Barrel match is more important to breaks than it is to accuracy. At least if the barrel is too big. You can't shoot big paint through a small barrel! Error on the side of too large a barrel is greatly preferable to error on the small side!
B. Breaks caused by the bolt, at least a rounded edge one fired at reasonable speeds, are negligible. I suspect a foamie would be even better.
C. Under test circumstances, chopping is pretty hard!
D. Level 10 will be an interesting addition after these findings.
E. I have revised my thoughts about the perfect barrel for paint, I will tend to use a slightly bigger barrel than I normally would have. It appears that the risk of having that one or two balls per hopper which might cause a break because they are slightly too large for the barrel is higher than the increase in accuracy gained by the perfect match.
F. I think that I have found the cause for most of my break problems in the past, (at least the non-chop ones!) and will continue to monitor the situation.
Bill
I've thought about this off and on for three weeks, tell me if my logic is faulty. (Hey my emag is at AGD and I didn't have anything better to do!!) There are only 3 reasons for ball breaks that I can find. (Chops don't count as they are user induced.)
1. There is a fractured or misshaped shell and the combination of movement and/or firing ruptures the ball. This could be a loader or elbow problem. This is not a GUN problem. This applies also to fragile paint, that one or two bounce stuff some tourney players seem to like.
2. The ball is good but it fractures because it is damaged at the breech, this could happen because of a sharp edge on the bolt or other part of the gun, or because it is pinched. It could also happen because the ball gets into the chamber because of a poor ball detent, this usually happens when two balls get in the breech together. This is a GUN problem.
3. The ball is good, the loading/chambering process causes no damage, but the barrel is improperly matched. If the barrel is too small, goo results. If it is too large, the ball detent may not keep a single ball in the chamber and allows another ball in, goo results (usually).
I setup a trial using my old 12 volt Revvie, Post BE, but it seems to work great. (My HALO is at Odyssey for the upgrade. See why I have so much time!!)
I did some testing, using new, Advantage shell, All Star.
Fresh out of a new bag, it measured .685-.688, this fits my CP .689 10 inch perfectly using the tried and true blow test. In my Classic mag at 70 degrees with a rounded long nose non foamie bolt this paint flew straight and true, no breech breaks as fast as I could shoot. 100 shots in bursts. I had one barrel break. Although I had closely inspected each round and measured each, I suspect this was one which was slightly larger. It was well down the barrel.
I switched to my .685 CP 10 inch Professional. I quit after only 20-30 shots. I was breaking at least every other ball, cleaning everything up, and then starting over. Everything seemed to be in the barrel, though a couple times there was paint on the bolt and in the breech, I suspect it was breaking further down, as no shell fragments were left there.
I then switched to my .693 CP 10 inch Professional, No breaks in one hundred shots, the balls tended to almost roll all the way thru the barrel after they were pushed through the detent. Interestingly, I couldn't see a difference in accuracy at the 50 foot range I was using. (I did not check for the difference in air use, and doubt that in one hundred shots it would be detectable.)
I then switched to some old Proball I had from last year. It was originally very small caliber, but I supected it had expanded, it measured .682-.685, obviously still quite small. I shot 50 rounds through the .693 barrel without breaks, I did get a couple of double ball bloops, but it was overall only slightly less accurate than the Allstar, but some of the balls had dimples after sitting so long. I switched to the .685 barrel and shot 50 shots without breaks. In both these tests I shot the first ten balls individually, then bursts of 3-10. I had no chops, which is better than when I am playing and get excited!
Finally, I went back to the Allstar, to a bag which was opened 3 weeks ago. Most of it measured .688-.691. It broke at least 2 out of three balls until I quit, while using the .689 barrel. It shot just fine out of the .693 barrel, 100 rounds, no breaks, no bloops. Essentially the same accuracy as the fresh paint.
OK, my conclusions;
A. Barrel match is more important to breaks than it is to accuracy. At least if the barrel is too big. You can't shoot big paint through a small barrel! Error on the side of too large a barrel is greatly preferable to error on the small side!
B. Breaks caused by the bolt, at least a rounded edge one fired at reasonable speeds, are negligible. I suspect a foamie would be even better.
C. Under test circumstances, chopping is pretty hard!
D. Level 10 will be an interesting addition after these findings.
E. I have revised my thoughts about the perfect barrel for paint, I will tend to use a slightly bigger barrel than I normally would have. It appears that the risk of having that one or two balls per hopper which might cause a break because they are slightly too large for the barrel is higher than the increase in accuracy gained by the perfect match.
F. I think that I have found the cause for most of my break problems in the past, (at least the non-chop ones!) and will continue to monitor the situation.
Bill