For All Of You Who Like The Angel Opti Trigger But Have An E-mag...

[magman007]

There is a solution, I was playin arround and takin my trigger when i realized, i dont need the trigger! all i need is to sew a magnet into my glove! needless to say i did and it worked! i still use my trigger, but it is pretty cool. all you gotta do is wave your finger over the hall sensor spot. Its cool!!! it is fun to try, and you dont need your return magnets any more, so swe wm into your glove.

[Mossman]

Its against the rules on most fields and tourneys, and the idea has been around for a long time, ever since magnet triggers originated. I think ive heard of a finger triggered emag, bushy, and impulse. Anyhoo, I'd still kill for an emag to try this on :)

Thats kool bro, you shuold see if ytou can shoot it faster one way or the other

[magman007]

hmmmm, why is that idea illegal, yet the opti trigger is not? that does not register, it is one fire per pull

[HoppysMag]

probibly saftey reasons... cause you could accidentaly shoot or sumthin...

[irbodden]

Its safer, no one can fire with out your glove.

Its still illegal since there is no 'trigger pull' someone from the Wise Guy's started this one of their Bushys.

[magman007]

ok ok, then can some one please explain to my how the angel opti trigger works? and how it is then legal? i would like to kno. also, i agree, it is safer in the hands of others, no one can fre it with uog your glove, and think of how safe the staging area could grow, all you do is take off the glove and it wont fire

[RT_Luver]

I never thought of that, but DUDE....thats awesome. I wanna try

[dansim]

HELLO the opti trigger is still a trigger the removed the micro switch, and replaced that with a infared beam not the whole trigger

[magman007]

:eek: OHHHHHHH dont i feel stupid!!!:o sorry, my bad! it speaks of a beam of light, so i thought it was a little beam in which your finger fluttered through, im sorry, i really am! but hey, who says we cant still do my idea? lol

[kemikos]

One reason "glove" triggers aren't generally allowed is that you have to be able to let the officials test your marker if they suspect you're using illegal modes or modifications.

Without your glove, the ref can't fire the marker to test it. You could hand over the glove too, but why complicate the rules more than they already are?

Another issue is that passing any magnet near the sensor will fire the marker. You could conceivably accidentally discharge the marker if you tried disassembling it with a magnetized screwdriver, for example...

The idea's been hashed over many times in different forums for almost as long as there have been electronically-triggered markers. It's a cool trick, but not likely to be allowed since it complicates things too much.

[SGT FURY]

why would you disassemble a marker that is still gassed up and as for mags there is no use for a screwdriver on a mag.
:D
kasey

[kemikos]

OK, wiseguy, you got me. :rolleyes:

I was just making a point. Any magnet that gets close to the grip frame on the marker could cause it to fire.

And like I said, I've had this discussion with other markers than 'Mags, so a screwdriver could make sense.

Jeez, tough crowd... ;)

[Pand0ra]

Kemikos, the risk is there even if you've still the trigger installed. If you put a magnet close to the sensor, the marker will fire.

I do like the idea of a glove acting as a trigger.
It could be very cool, but I doubt it'll be allowed one day in the NPPL or the Millennium.

@++

[magman007]

well, im glad some people atleast like my idea, now i was thinking, we could even make an opti trigger for an e-mag! same way as the angel, just drill a small hole in the hall sensor stpt, cut the hall sensor off, and wire in an optical sensor like the one on angels, and modify the board a bit!

[AngelBoy]

Its a good idea. You can still use it when ur just messin around with friends.

[dansim]

too bad its patented

[magman007]

always the party pooper arent you dansim? lol but al agd has to do to avoid the patent is change it a lil bit, or if i were to make it all i would have to do is change it a lil bit, and i could use it and market it. Heck, im sure dye has their stickies patented, yet people still make sticky grips that are just a lil different. same with dyes muzzle break, it si pattented, but if i wanted to use the same design and add another hole i could, and i could sell it and use it by avoiding the pattent

[manike]

Originally posted by magman007
always the party pooper arent you dansim? lol but al agd has to do to avoid the patent is change it a lil bit, or if i were to make it all i would have to do is change it a lil bit, and i could use it and market it. Heck, im sure dye has their stickies patented, yet people still make sticky grips that are just a lil different. same with dyes muzzle break, it si pattented, but if i wanted to use the same design and add another hole i could, and i could sell it and use it by avoiding the pattent

I think you need to learn a little more about Patent law. Even if you change something or 'improve it' if it still works on the basic concept covered by someone elses patent then you need to 'pay up or shut up' :) It depends on the patents.

Dye have an ornamental patent on their barrel tips, but I do not believe they have one on their sticky grips.

manike

[Pand0ra]

Are you sure this thing is patented? I see often "patend pending", but it doesn't mean anything. Anybody could put this on his product.
It's almost sure the name Optotrigger is protected, but for the rest I've some doubts.

Those kind of sensors are very old, and are used everywhere.

@++

[dansim]

yes the optitriggger is patented do you think wdp would let there stuff out without it being? i mean in a world of copycatsharks its just not wise to do so without, anyway ive heard somewear that dye actually makes those grips for compainies such as 32*, extreme rage,smarts parts and sells them to them for x amount then the sell theres for xamount more if not the product then definetly the mold

[Pand0ra]

Originally posted by dansim
yes the optitriggger is patented do you think wdp would let there stuff out without it being? i mean in a world of copycatsharks its just not wise to do so without, anyway ive heard somewear that dye actually makes those grips for compainies such as 32*, extreme rage,smarts parts and sells them to them for x amount then the sell theres for xamount more if not the product then definetly the mold

Go there: http://gb.espacenet.com/ , put NPF Limited as the company name, and you'll get all the patents comming from WDP. I don't see anywhere an optotrigger, or something like that...

Of course it could come in a year or two, but right now there's no patent, just the mention "patent pending", as usual ;) .
The patent could also comes from someone else, but again I've doubts, as the Angel, AIR, and the electronic board are patented under this name.

@++

[kemikos]

Originally posted by Pand0ra
...but right now there's no patent, just the mention "patent pending", as usual...


Someone with more experience in patent law than I have can correct me, but I believe that "patent pending" is some protection in itself. If they've actually filed for a patent, (which they have to do in order to label their product "patent pending"), it will cover all products from the date they filed their patent, not just the date it's granted.

So if you built an optical trigger that fell under the patent that they say is pending, then once their patent is granted, you will be in violation even though you started selling them before they actually had a patent. It's the filing date that counts.

[magman007]

hmmm, ok, i see. Well, i think i would pay up, but what if it is used in a completely different product? How does the ace eye work for smartparts, of bobby had em in ist timmy first? (just using as a example) My question is, if i made an opti trigger for the mag and sold it would i get sued to wazoo? or what would happen if i made it then somd it to dye? or some one like that??

[manike]

Originally posted by kemikos
Someone with more experience in patent law than I have can correct me, but I believe that "patent pending" is some protection in itself. If they've actually filed for a patent, (which they have to do in order to label their product "patent pending"), it will cover all products from the date they filed their patent, not just the date it's granted.

Patent Pending is no protection at all. It just warns people that there may be a patent. and MAY is the operative word. It does not mean there WILL be a patent. And if there is no eventual Patent, then the pending part is no cover.

The priority date is the important part :D and it gives you precedence but it doesn't give you any cover unless the patent reaches grant.

I could put in a patent specification which covers every single paintball innovation out there and get a 'pending status' on some part of it and brag about what I had in 'pending' but it doesn't mean anything at all until it reaches grant. At which point if the Patent Office have any sense :rolleyes: it should be stripped down to only the innovative points.

Pending doesn't mean that much. It's grant that counts.

Nowadays (and in the USA) you can't usually get revenues back to when you filed for your patent. It's more likely to start from a date after you have grant and have informed potential infringers of the infringement.

Often people will build a product while a patent by another company is pending and then stop after the patent gets grant. That way they get to make revenues during the pending stage but don't have to pay up after grant. It all depends on the market and what is happening.

magman if you made an opti trigger I don't think anyone would hassle you :) If you made loads and sold them you would only need to worry if a patent did achieve grant and at that point you may need to stop. At that point it all gets complicated!!! depending on the circumstances you may not need to stop.

The trouble with many patents in paintball is that the items were in common use way before they were patented by the paintball companies. The PO don't know this and grant the patents but to be honest if they ever got challenged the company holding the patents would not be in such a good position.

This is kinda like with SmartParts who claimed to have a patent over ALL electronic markers. I think that one has been pretty much thrown out now, due to prio art.

manike