Spyders bad?? I thought so until...

[FalconGuy016]

I always thought spyders were crap.

I still think they basically are.

Then I read the reviews for the Flash and the AMG.
Does anyone own an AMG? Do you think I should buy the AMG? (no matter what I am still getting a minimag, but this year I can get something like an AMG, but is it worth it?)

[mike e]

spyders arent crap

one of the guys on the top rated local team had a cocker go down, and he played with a stock spyder with a jandj and he completly would devastate anyone there. its really not the gun at all. AMG's are nice, very adjustable trigger, doesnt seem to suffer quite as much from bolt stick when shell gets in there like some spyders, all and all not a bad gun. i recomend it to noobs who want "electro" dont say any gun is crap ive even seen and built some kickin BE's dont knock stuff just because you dont like it our had a bad experience with it


not a flame

i just regard these one marker is better then another threads as i do the "closed bolt shoots farther" threads

[xmetal2001]

They are good guns. But also they are all the same. Some have electro grips, some have flashy annodization, some have huge expansion chambers, but when it comes down to it they all shoot the same. (Spyders, Piranas, etc.)

[dawump]

Watching people chrono spiders last saturday I was actually pretty impressed. The velocity with CO2 was dead on consistent.. which made me a little jealous.

I took one apart once though and wasn't impressed. It's like taking a cheap ball point pen apart.

Keith

[Automaggin2]

Spyders are very very very good guns for the money. i had one for 2 years and i wish i still had it. they are very consistent, but there are some many rip offs of them now, like Pirhanas, BOSSs....the list goes on

[MagKoko]

i had problems with the quality of the gun... oh well, that's just my problem.

[aaron_mag]

I think Spyders are excellent for the price. Tippmanns are good as well but they are so darn hard to clean.

Now as for them being consistant????? The major problem I see with Spyders and the clones is that they usually shoot hot right out of the factory. You have to either cut the spring or buy a spring kit to get them shooting at a safe velocity.

Still some of my friends play with them and they aren't too bad. I'd be lying if I said I hadn't been marked by them:D .

[TheBigRaguPB4L]

I've never seen a spyder shoot all that consistantly. I think they have such a bad rep because you fill them with liquid co2 and they're pretty much useless. You get a decent nitro tank, polish the internals and a you got a nice gun. I'd rather shoot almost any mag next to a spyder, but that's just me. The best part about having a spyder is playing with the oppositions' heads. No one thinks they're going to be taken out by a spyder.

[rudy]

was this review in a paintball magazine it probably sounded pretty good cause they almost never write anythign bad and when the last month they rated a regular spyder as a awsome gun.... they have to go up some with an electronic version. to be honest you might just want to buy one if you need an electro. but i wont make any garentees. in the years I have serviced guns the kingman markers have always had a few more problems then most others and the tippmanns a few less. as far as consistency with good springs and a good reg most of them will get great consistency, but thats the catch almost none have a good reg if one at all. other wise its all abotu the kick of a gun. and blow backs suffer from quite a bit of kick cause they are sear released and have a striker valve. so it will be a little harder to keep your gun on target then most high end guns

[Dern]

Hey... I have a Pirahnha... PMI EXT PRO G3 :) It does ok for me... but it is only my first (and only gun, but soon I will have me an RT PRO) and it is exactly the same as the spyders. Every part on spyders and PMI's are almost exactly the same (parts kits, barrels, bolts). I think it is because they both get the same parts that are made cheaply in factories in Asia :rolleyes: . Anyway... I consider spyders and piranhas the same since i have used both enough to judge them. I must say if you want to get into paintball get something simple like a spyder or a piranha. They are low cost, easy-to-upgrade, and they will last well until you upgrade to another gun. I'm still using mine, and it works fine for me. Their are a few minor setbacks with quality I think, but overall, I must say companies like Kingman, PMI, 32 degrees, and all the other "low-end," entry-level marker-makers (tongue twister hehe) have done a good job of popularizing paintball to what it is today. If Paintball guns cost 300$ for just the marker, I would not have started playing paintball and I'm sure MANY other people would not have either. YAY FOR CHEAP MARKERS!

[shartley]

I agree.. Spyders are NOT bad markers. They are very good for the position they are designed to fill.

I also agree that taking them apart is like taking apart a cheap pen.. LOL.. But that is also part of what I like about them. :D

But I would not agree about how consistent they are as in volocity. They are okay, but my Mag is better. And I know if I crono in the morning with my Mag, it will stay consistent all day.. Spyders? Hope it does not get warmer. ;) Yes, if you keep the same air temperature and humidity they will remain pretty consistent, but alter those things and you will need to adjust your velocity and replace your springs. To me that is not “consistent”. ;)

However, I will say it again… I like them and they get my recommendation when looking for lower end markers.

[cphilip]

...actualy they are very consistent...On High Pressure Air.

[shartley]

HeeHee.. that is true. And we know how many people use HPA with their Spyders. ;):D

But yes.... you sir are correct. :D

[aaron_mag]

On the subject of kick......

The Spyder has a ton of kick. If you want to see how little kick a mag has play without a motorized hopper. When I play woods I don't like the noise of a motorized hopper. The kick is so light on a mag that the balls will not feed! You have to shake it up to get it to feed a ball. You don't have this problem with a Spyder (not a good thing).

I can't tell you the number of times I've been taken out with my buddies in woodsball because I thought I had some balls in the elbow but I was shooting air.

These sort of quality issues, durability, and ease of maintenance is what puts the mag above the clones (not to start with level 10 and retrovalve!!!)

[kevdupuis]

Another nice thing about the inexpensive blowback. Is that when you relegate it to backup/spare you get to have fun doing weird and nasty things to it and not have to worry about it being up and running right away.
Would you believe that this was originally a 98 green Raptor.
http://www.hunting-pictures.com/members/kevdupuis/Raptor%20018.jpg

I did this for Nitestalker.

[dawump]

That's a funky marker ;-!

One thing the cheap marker manufactures do very well is advertise!

The spider and clones are physically pretty sexy pieces of hardware with a cheap electro option. That's good strategy for the entry level where the marketing is mostly to many who want the "feel-good-factor" of a nice looking marker and might not think too far into the future.. and I bet that there is a VERY high percentage of people who buy markers then barely use them.. so a long life expectancy isn't such an issue.

The ones that DO keep going and eventually buy a different marker at least get into the sport cheaply and end up with a backup ( which they probably won't use if they get a mag ;-). If I hadn't had the money for the mag I would have bought a TL+ probably.

Also true whoever said it about the magazine reviews. I read the same review, and it was, as always, very positive. In this case, no suprise. It would be insane for a magazine to print a bad review about a product by it's major advertising sponsor.

Keith

[nerobro]

There's a lot to be said about a marker that has fewwer moving parts than a mag.

And one that can cycle 30 times a seccond.. if anyone saw the dragun at schatnerball you know what I'm talking about ;-)

[rudy]

nerobro what exactly do you count as moving parts? how many do you say there are in a double stacked blowback. how many in a mag? how many do you say there are in a angel?

[Doobie]

My wife shoots this AMG and I must say I am very impressed! The thing will rock and has not broken paint yet. She has had it for about six months now and loves it. I taught her to take it apart and put it together in 5 min and (most important to her) it looks good!:) I, of course had to approve the purchase first. I am very impressed with the trigger adjustability. Very easy and very short. It runs on HPA and the stock reg works quite well. Right now it is running on 350psi and does not starve out, even on full auto! I will probably always have a 'mag but this is a fun gun to play with. BTW, Bad Company uses these and E99's. Some of theirs have different drops on them and they use Freaks, but other than that they are stock. Bad Company often plays on sunday at NPPL meets and that speaks volumes about the reliability of the marker.
Not bad for a little over $300.00.

[~WarpedRT~]

I would sooner take a Piranha over a Spyder anyday. Spyders are cheaply made. Most of the Spydrs I've seen don't perform that good(thats why I bought a Piranha). If your looking into an electronic blowback, try one of the Piranha E-Forces, or the Pro E's.

[nerobro]

Originally posted by rudy
nerobro what exactly do you count as moving parts? how many do you say there are in a double stacked blowback. how many in a mag? how many do you say there are in a angel?

The hammer and bolt are one peice. the valve is another peice. the sear is another, and so is the trigger. So we have four peices?

A mag has the reg piston, reg pin, on/off pin, bolt, sear, and trigger....

Angel.. the solinoid, the hammer and bolt are one peice as is the ram, the valve, the LPR piston, the reg piston (in whatever brand reg it may be) the trigger, and trigger switch....

I really draw the lines at each simple moving part. the ram in the angel kinda throws things off a lot. it has many possiable failure points. Same goes for the solinoid. it's a wonder angels work as well as they do. IT all depends on how retentitive you want to get.

Last time I counted parts on my spyder it was a grand total of 40. Including o-rings. I counted the same number on the mag.

or you could count points of failure.. the spyder has just a coupple. the hammer o-ring. the sear edge, the trigger sear, and the cupseal.

On a mag, you have the piston o-ring, the reg seat, the on/off top and bottom, the powertube o-ring, the bolt edge itself, the sear at the bolt end, the blowoff valve, the body rail.

The angel... well.. any of the seals in the solinoid, we'll say 3. Any seal on the ram, that we'll call 2. the cupseal, any of the connectors on the gun. Both regs have 3 working seals in them. and then I'd considder the cap on the LPR an issue becuase that needs to be removed to adjust that reg... Then again, I considder the angel a good design ;-) just with crappy regs on it.

[aaron_mag]

Nerobro.......you have too much time on your hands if you are counting the parts.......:D

[nerobro]

Well.. yea, I did at the time. My mind works fast.. and my job moves slowly ;-) and I know the guns well enough to actually count components. But tracking down probable points of failure are easy ;-) Courese this leads to the wonderfull thing about the mag. if it has a problem WHICH point it failed at is blatenly obvious.

[Automaggin2]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT~
I would sooner take a Piranha over a Spyder anyday. Spyders are cheaply made. Most of the Spydrs I've seen don't perform that good(thats why I bought a Piranha). If your looking into an electronic blowback, try one of the Piranha E-Forces, or the Pro E's.

wapred, the spyders are actually made better then pirhanas. spyders have almost all aluminum parts, unlike the pirhana, which has some splastic parts, such as the grip frame. My friend has a Pirhana, and the quaility, especially the anodizing, is not nearly as nice as a spyders. he has the pirhnana EXT pro, and he used to have a Spyder SE. He was much more please with his SE then his pirhana. dont base your decision off cheap wal mart spyders.

[FalconGuy016]

Yes, for the price, and the c02 consitancy, and the overall awesomeness of the AMG ... to me this is like the first good spyder gun I've seen (probably flash and e99's too... but I havent seen them shoot)

I've seen a lot of spyders and this is the first one that has actually made me want to get it.

[SSMercury]

The guns I trust: Mags, Phantoms, and stock Spyders. The kind around before there was even the Spyder Compact. No, not the Spyder Compact A either, the original Spyder Compact. The old, old, old, old, (my two were obtained in 1994) Spyders. They're virtually indestructable. If a Mag can be run over with a car, I think these could be run over with a truck. All this new crap is exactly that. "Java Spyders" and what-have-you. Blech.

(speaking solely about my Spyder now. Plural now since my dad gave me his out of the sports closet finally. Spare parts forever! :))

My one complaint about them is the weight, with all that steel and a brass barrel. They've almost always shot straight and consistently with the stock barrel, except the one time we went to Florida. Field paint was X brand. I've personally half buried mine in the mud, and after a really good hosing down it played...ok, but I quit for awhile and stripped it totally down and cleaned it because I love and cuddle my markers. Anyways. Good marker, cheap (god, probably get one for 60 dollars now. Probably be antiques soon). all around, dependable. Much like any other marker with decent QA testing. Nice, perfect for a recreational player, but I wouldn't use for tournament play (and don't plan to). I'm not going to swear by it's consistency, never really tested it with a chronograph, but it sends paint where I want at 75 feet.

Probably too long a post. Someone needs to flame me for that. I'll never learn

[rudy]

k first of all I count the hammer and bolt as 2 separate parts especailly because there is often bolt jams that are caused by the fact soemthing gets cought in there and the hammer and bolt being 2 separate parts will jam due to play between the 2 where they are joined by the linkage pin. Also I never count the regulators moving parts when comparing guns. because its independant a mag could be designed to run at 800 psi without a reg. and you cant compare a gun with no regulator to one that has one. and on most guns the regs can be swapped out and different regs have different numbers of moving parts. its like measuring a gun with the barrel included in the length its not an accurate measurement unless all guns are measured with the same size barrel and in this case the same reg. I count the actuall working parts and usually not the trigger since they all have a trigger. mag has a sear which could be 2 parts bolt, on off 3 or 4 parts actually work the gun. and 1 spring for a max total of 5. your average double stacked blow back has bolt, hammer, sear, valve. 4 parts and 3 springs total 7 you of cours should probably count in seals and divide them into stationarry vs workign seals other wise the matrix would have like 2 parts, solenoid and bolt. but it has a ton of seals that are working seals and can have many problems.

[Automaggin2]

yeah my spyder was around a....95 i belive. good old bottom line. i got it right as the first introduced the SE

[Spray Painter]

My brothers friend has a E-99 and the first day he used it it choped five balls(that was on full-auto). the next time he played it didn't chop a single ball all day(most of the time it was on full-auto :)

[845]

I would just get the Imagine or spirit and throw on a nice reg and a DF.