View Full Version : AGD invented power feed, is it still considered better?
Is the power feed still considered better as far as performance goes. AGD invented it and said it had better performance as far as blow back and other various reasons. I'm a fan of it (both my mags are powerfeed), but I'm wondering if AGD has changed its opinion of powerfeed, being that all the new AGD guns, and most hype recently is center feed.
FrAuStY
10-07-2002, 12:32 PM
I believe the powerfed models of guns can feed faster under high ROF, since the design utilizes the extra little bit of gas (normally blowback) to "suck" the nest ball into the chamber. With some center feed guns.. the blowback gas goes right up the feed tube causing the balls in the stack to bobble a littl ebit. This will slow the feed rates at high ROf since there will be more of this gas going up while the balls are trying to come down. I believe Angels had a cobra feed or something where the exhaust gas was directed through a hose and back to the centerfeed but it was angeld down.. to push the ball stack down instead of up. I'm no expert.. but I believe the powerfeed is still the best feed system for guns not using sometype of FORCED feed system I.e. Halo, Warp, EvlutionII.
So do you think most new mags with center feed are geared toward force feed hoppers. That seems to make sense, but doesn't that leave out the rest of the hoppers. I'm just trying to figure out why AGD has gone to center feed.
Kevmaster
10-07-2002, 01:06 PM
economics. the same reason Lapco started making 14" barrels. is it better? prolly not. will it sell more? prolly so.
most players now(even those with revvies, etc) want vertical feeds. they BELIEVE it is better. most players dont know the technical data and that with a revvie a powerfeed will feed fsater. they just see all high end markers ONLY offer the Vert, so they assume its better. AGD knows that it may be better with a PF, however sales will increase with a Vert. they have to adapt or they will die.
HoppysMag
10-07-2002, 01:07 PM
they are geared toward who will buy them and right now center feed seams to be the fad.
I don't wanna step on any toes here. Assuming thats the reason, Doesn't that suck? Isn't AGD based on quality, and good design. I can't despute a company needs to consider what sells, but at what cost? Poor quality, but it looks good? Again, this is all assumption, but I'd hate to see AGD cater to fads, only to back peddle later.
HoppysMag
10-07-2002, 01:44 PM
well they gotta make sales, and people want vert feeds now adays so thats what AGD has to give them.
Allen
10-07-2002, 01:50 PM
Centerfeed is for balance and a tighter profile last time I checked. Play with one- you'll understand. Plus, I don't want something sticking farther out of the bunker than is has to, like a hopper on a powerfeed. Every inch counts.
HoppysMag
10-07-2002, 01:58 PM
right;) and i have played with vert feed, and all i can say is i like my powerfeed.
I have a vert feed cocker. I agree that the center feed feels better. It keeps the hopper in closer. I'm not interested in personal opinion though. I'm questioning if AGD has changed their opinion. And if so thats fine. I mean if after all these years AGD decided "Because QUANTITY always shoots straight." wouldn't you question the motive behind the change? I hope some one sees my point and I'm not just beating a dead horse.
ogre55
10-07-2002, 02:22 PM
Yes AGD sells centerfeed for most of it's markers (I am not sure about 'Mag Clasic packages) however, just because they sell it, does not mean that they have abandoned quality.
The big difference between AGD and many other high end manufacterurs is that, for the most part, the other guys offer markers with ONLY centerfeed, while AGD gives the buyer the option of CF or PF right or left. Hell, the extreme incorporates a modular body that allows one to change their feed depending on taste.
Ogre
Yes, modular bodies, but no power feed option! None of the new design ideas incorporate a power feed.
JohnTzu
10-07-2002, 03:07 PM
This is just speculation on my part, so please, bear with me.
I think AGD doesn't offer a powerfeed option on the extreme, because of the idea that technology has progressed to the point where we no longer have to rely on gravity to push balls into the breech. The Extreme is a high end, high tech marker, and it's being pointed squarely at the high end tournament player market. In order to take full advantage of the Extreme, or the E-mag for that matter, is to utilize a force feed system, like the Warp Feed, which pretty much makes the power feed obsolete on the higher end models.
It's still a viable option for the Classics, Minis, and even Retros, because there are'nt many mid level players or beginners that can outshoot gravity on a mechanical trigger.
Once again, I'd like to stress that this is just my opinion, and I by no means profess to be an expert on anything.
JohnTzu
FrAuStY
10-07-2002, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by Allen
Centerfeed is for balance and a tighter profile last time I checked. Play with one- you'll understand. Plus, I don't want something sticking farther out of the bunker than is has to, like a hopper on a powerfeed. Every inch counts.
I agree in every aspect. This especially holds true for those players who are ambidexterous (shoot righty or lefty) It allows the horizontal profile to shrink. Also if you lean a center feed gun on its side at about a 30* angle.. your hopper almost never comes out. Unless of course you come out the top of a bunker then it's right there. I say.. you want a small profile.. go WARP FEED.. never have a hopper hit again. But like I said..I agree with ya :)
Originally posted by JohnTzu
This is just speculation on my part, so please, bear with me.
I think AGD doesn't offer a powerfeed option on the extreme, because of the idea that technology has progressed to the point where we no longer have to rely on gravity to push balls into the breech. The Extreme is a high end, high tech marker, and it's being pointed squarely at the high end tournament player market. In order to take full advantage of the Extreme, or the E-mag for that matter, is to utilize a force feed system, like the Warp Feed, which pretty much makes the power feed obsolete on the higher end models.
It's still a viable option for the Classics, Minis, and even Retros, because there are'nt many mid level players or beginners that can outshoot gravity on a mechanical trigger.
Once again, I'd like to stress that this is just my opinion, and I by no means profess to be an expert on anything.
JohnTzu
I also agree with you, you may not be an expert but you have something called common knowledge (commone sense ;)) If you're going to buy a gun for 1500$ that can fire 20 bps.. why rely on old loaders, and old feed technology, when theres better feed systems out there (warp, halo) It's kinda like buying a Corvette Z06 and buying 87 octane fuel. Granted the car will still run.. but it won't run correctly.
If you're gonna spend the money... SPEND THE MONEY!
Edited to remove sig.
personman
10-07-2002, 04:06 PM
Originally posted by FrAuStY
FORCED feed system I.e. Halo, Warp, EvlutionII.
Dont mean to be an arse or anything, but the Eggy 2 is not a force feed hopper.
TRIAD
10-07-2002, 04:27 PM
I was just going to say that. The evvolution 2 is by no means a force-feed hopper. The only TRUE force feed systems are the HALO B and the Warp Feed. The rest rely on gravity to make them work.
rhetor22
10-07-2002, 04:35 PM
agd sorta went cheap. Vertical feed and alluminum valves... what a shame.
You gotta do what you gotta do tho i guess. :(
Spray Painter
10-07-2002, 05:20 PM
I think it costs more to make powerfeed bodys too...
Aliens-8-MyDad
10-07-2002, 05:36 PM
whats wrong with aluminum valves? i mean they are lighter and can now match your gun! mags will be smaller lighter and more coloerfull than other guns! they will soon be on top of every other gun once the word gets out...
JohnTzu, I think you hit the nail on the head actually. Thats an answer I'm comfortable with. I think the center feed works perfectly with a force feed system. I guess AGD goes with the idea that the design is geared towards "higher end" performance and assumes a person will buy I higher end loader. Middle range performance is still covered with the rest of their line up. The extreme has the potential to be the next best gun, so why sacrifice performance just to cater to power feed preferring people. I guess looking at it that way makes sense. Evolve.
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