Bring your own paint?

[punkncat]

I think that fields should allow you to bring your own paint to tournaments and scenarios especially.Allow a discounted entry price to those who buy field paint, but make a choice available.
I know that many times I have gone to scenarios and the field paint was some overpriced junk that normally wouldn't see the inside of my hopper.It actually has been so bad that I would gladly pay the field the extra money per case they lost on me bringing my own paint.
It also is an advantage to the player in that he can match the paint to the barrel bore and use something that will work better for the setup.I see a lot of flatlines shooting muck from trying to fire some brittle shelled out of round crap being pawned off on people for 60$ a case.
This idea of being forcefed paint and air at a field you have already payed to play on is very much like the cost of a tub of popcorn at the movies.Youv'e already payed your money to get in , then you get scalped for getting a snack and a coke.
I think the paintball fields around would see a lot larger turnouts in their scenario games and "open" tournaments if the costs were brought down.The easiest way to do that is to allow players to bring their own paint.

[Ultimator]

A lot of times BYOP is a saftey concern. A lot of people locally will go to Sports Academy and buy $25 a case seconds Zap that is as hard as marbles. Think if someone was shooting hot with that stuff.

Also another factor is that the only thing fields really make significant money off of is the paint.

[adam shannon]

open a field, lease or buy a few dozen acres of land...or a big building in a metro area, equip it with tanks and compressors, but a few hundred rental guns, then call an insurance company and inquire about insuring a business where people shoot projectiles at one another.....then preach about byop.

not jumping on your back...but the costs associated with running a PB field are huge. insurance and rent alone will make your head spin. a field has to make $ somewhere..and unfortunately paint is the one commodity that they can make up for everything else by upping the price exponentially.

some fields charge a byop tax and let you bring non-field paint...but usually the fee equals what you would pay to buy a case of field paint.

[punkncat]

Originally posted by Ultimator
A lot of times BYOP is a saftey concern. A lot of people locally will go to Sports Academy and buy $25 a case seconds Zap that is as hard as marbles. Think if someone was shooting hot with that stuff.

Also another factor is that the only thing fields really make significant money off of is the paint.

Well first off if safety is as it should be you wouldn't be seeing people shooting hot on the field.
Next . If you have ever been sold Hot Shot (Nelson), All Stars(RPS),or Zap on the field as I have , there is nothing more marble than that.Thats the kind of paint that you don't shoot people hoping to break you shoot them over and over till they just give....

The markup on a case of paint is generally between the 15-25$ mark (vs. the local paint shop)and in many cases I would have gladly payed an extra 25$ to be able to use something worth shooting.
Its no good using paint that cost 60$ and wouldn't hit the broad side of a barn from 30 feet.

[adam shannon]

$60 a case is darn good. i would be glad to pay that for any field paint...around here we pay between $80-$100 for RP field grade paint. so before you think you got it bad ask around what the rest of us are stuck dealing with...and i remember a guy from long island saying his fields paint is around $120 a case!

[punkncat]

Originally posted by adam shannon
open a field, lease or buy a few dozen acres of land...or a big building in a metro area, equip it with tanks and compressors, but a few hundred rental guns, then call an insurance company and inquire about insuring a business where people shoot projectiles at one another.....then preach about byop.

not jumping on your back...but the costs associated with running a PB field are huge. insurance and rent alone will make your head spin. a field has to make $ somewhere..and unfortunately paint is the one commodity that they can make up for everything else by upping the price exponentially.

some fields charge a byop tax and let you bring non-field paint...but usually the fee equals what you would pay to buy a case of field paint.

I am certainly not trying to discount the costs involved in running a paintball field.I understand there has to be a reasonable profit margin to make it worth being in buisiness.
But when you are already charging 50-100$ per person for entry to an event there is no way you can tell me there is no profit involved.Take into further account that in many fields the "employees" are just paintballers looking to cover field fees the next time they want to play....less overhead right there.
Then take into account that with volume comes profit.If lowering the price of the game draws more players to your even then you can make more profit through sheer numbers.
Air prices at most fields are also well within a profit range.I mean lets consider.
It costs less than 30$ to fill the standard CO2 tank that the field fills from at a bit less than .30$ an oz.
The HPA tanks that are generally used cost from 5-10$ to fill and they charge that to fill a single 68ci.If they have their own compressor then all days fills for "X" $$$ is straight profit.

[adam shannon]

have you ever worked in a management position or owned a business?

do you know how much a hpa compressor, power booster and a dozen tanks for a cascade system cost? just because you own a compressor and all the works is just the beginning....wear and tear...the equipment doesnt last forever it will eventually need to be replaced or re-built, maintenance costs, plus making a profit from your investment.

until you see the big picture you will never get the costs associated with running any business. not every field is challenge park. my local field scrapes by. they may move 30 cases a weekend for open play and private games, and tournaments may get 15 3 man teams. they may move 50 cases that tourney day...but with 15+ refs and employees that day for $7-$10 an hour for 10 hours ($1300)they dont make squat in the long run given every other expense.

[punkncat]

Yes as a matter if fact I have.

I am not trying to suggest that there should be no profit , but once again , with entry fee and air fee there is certainly enough money to be made that better paint could be made available.And if you are so cheap and tight that you can't get good paint , then allow me to pay for your loss in order to better my experiance through decent paint.

And MOST CERTAINLY not every field is challenge park and therefore I should not have to pay a premium for the lack of premium field and services.As far as local cost differances are concerned , I should think it reasonable to expect a field on Long Island to charge a helluva lot more that a field off in the country in Georgia somewhere.Thats simple economics.
If there are good prizes to be expected then I can see the price being higher.If the field is better than what else is around I can see it being higher , but bud I ain't prepared to pay 170someodd dollars to play paintball in the woods somewhere and be given some crap for paint that leaves my 1300$ marker firing like a Brass Eagle Avenger.

[Ultimator]

Originally posted by punkncat
Well first off if safety is as it should be you wouldn't be seeing people shooting hot on the field.
Next . If you have ever been sold Hot Shot (Nelson), All Stars(RPS),or Zap on the field as I have , there is nothing more marble than that.Thats the kind of paint that you don't shoot people hoping to break you shoot them over and over till they just give....Co2 warms up and velocity increases. I guess I assumed you would know that. And on the paint comment ... didn't you just prove my point? BTW All Stars from RPS are really high end stuff.


Originally posted by punkncat
The markup on a case of paint is generally between the 15-25$ mark (vs. the local paint shop)and in many cases I would have gladly payed an extra 25$ to be able to use something worth shooting.
Its no good using paint that cost 60$ and wouldn't hit the broad side of a barn from 30 feet. Another reason paint is so expensive, is that opposed to making it themselves, they have to buy from a paint manufacturer. So the paint goes through two price markups before it gets into your hands (wallet). I think I remember that even the highest end paint only costs from $5-$15 a case to manufacturer, then the paint manufaturer boosts it to around $20-$30 a case, then of course the paintball shop also has to make a markup for profit.

Heck if you're complaining about prices now, go back 10, even 5 years ago when people were paying $120+ a case for the same "junk" you're shooting now.

[IcantBelieveit]

I personally don't have a problem with field paint only. If you break it down. They really are not making that much money off of the paint. I think a buddy and i borke it down and they were making like $8 off of paint (that certain paint anyhow) Anyways i don't have a problem with it.

[Gman63]

One of the problems associated with letting people pay a tax or extra so they don't have to shoot field paint would be how do you police it? When you are running a secnario or torny with hundreds of people how do you know who paid the tax and who didn't. By keeping a common paint the colors that show and by looking at hoppers, pods... lets the field owners keep a handle on this. I agree with other people and have been involved in business wher you need to rely on that income to keep your doors open. If you think this idea would revolutionize paintball, layout the cash open your facility and give it a try. Then let us all know how it turns out.

[V-Viper]

How about $160 for a case? (http://www.onlinepaintball.com/pbhvinfo.htm)

[punkncat]

The same way you know who has paid for all day air at a field.WIth a zip tie of a certain color around your guage.

Anyone who is using CO2 on the field should be regularly run through the chrono to make sure that the temp increase hasn't caused them to become unsafe.If you get a punch on your card for shooting hot , the ref doesn't care if you weren't aware enough to re-chrono your own marker cause it got hotter.

As far as RPS is concerned , it is a good round paint that flies well , but I have watched that stuff bouce off hyperball barricades , no joke.

[jdev]

I was waiting for someone to mention pbh.

yes the 158 was right at one time. recently the field has dropped their prices down to $110 a case. for proball paint.

pbh in general, prices suck. they recently got shut down, one reason being, (i think) is becasue they were charging too mucn, resulting in loss of customers and revenue which im sure effected their landlords decision to boot them out.

[IcantBelieveit]

$158 for proball?? is proball even made anymore? I used to buy cases of that all day for $45. Eh.::mental note:: Do not g ot Mass. to play paintball /::mental note::

[V-Viper]

I wonder what pbh going to do with their "$250,000" Ghost Town.

Found new place to go Fox 4 (www.fox4paintball.com) site is pretty cool, and its BYOP!! Haven't been there yet, this Saturday hopefully first time.

[logamus]

in reference to the movie theater scenario mentioned earlier, where do you think they make their profits? it not from ticket sales. theaters keep less than 5% of ticket sales in the first 10 weeks of release. they make up the difference in the $4 cokes and $6 tubs of corn. same goes with fields. im lucky in that my local field will allow you to bring paint purchased at their store (much wider selection) as long as you have the recipt. it might help to chat with the owner of the field to see if more brands can be offered for field paint. you might be supriesed how accomidating most field owners are.

[Daroy99]

My field is $12 for free Nitro, Co2, and free BYOP.

[RetroEclipseMan]

I'm lucky enough that in Washington most fields don't charge extra if you BYOP. There's only a couple fields that I know of that are BYOP at least on rec days. I think what is in question is not so much that fields are over charging so much on their paint but that when they have FPO events that the paint isn't very good. If a field is going to have a FPO rule and charge a good amount for their paint then they better have a decent selection and it better be decent paint.

I've been to one field that was FPO and they only had RPS Premiums and it was $70 a case and it was the worst paint that'd I'd ever shot. This stuff was so bad that it was bouncing off of hyper tubes from less than 6 inches away. And you couldn't even say that some balls were out of round, some were egg-shaped to almost flat.

So what I'm trying to say if fields expect their customers to come back when it's FPO then they need to have decent paint that's worth the price that's put on it.

[Lopy-slopy]

For recball there isn't realy any other way for them to make a good profet than to make you buy paint. I mean, at the feild near me it's $5 entry(CND) and they almost never charge you for fills. Think about it. If they only got $5 from everybody that came in they would be bankrupt. But they realy do rape you on the paint $240 a case!!! I know it's canadian but here minimum wage is about the same as in the US but everything PB related ends up costing twise as much as it does in the US (check out a canadain site)Link (http://www.paintballgear.ca) . You guy's think you got it tough, try having to save up 1000+ just to get a nice 68 Mag setup.