98's shoot faster than a mag?

[GhillieGuy]

Some people at pbnation are saying that tippy 98's are faster than mags. Check out the link... http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1934983#post1934983

[shartley]

Why even bother? If they think fields use Tippmans because they can “use more paint” and shoot faster to keep up with folks that own their own equipment, they are idiots. They will never get it.

Tippmans are GREAT markers. They are also VERY durable. They are in my opinion the best rental marker on the market. They are also very cost effective and priced well for that market.

But it isn’t because they shoot faster than other markers thus allowing fields to sell more paint. LOL If THAT was the case, folks would not own Angels, E-Mags, or any other High End Marker…. They would shoot Tippman 98s! And in fact, Tippman 98s would be the chosen marker for tournament teams (unless they were sponsored by another manufacturer).

Again……. Why even bother with them?

[BajaBoy]

heh i put my .02 $ in:D

[TheBigRaguPB4L]

Originally posted by shartley
Why even bother? If they think fields use Tippmans because they can “use more paint” and shoot faster to keep up with folks that own their own equipment, they are idiots. They will never get it.



Well actually Mr. Hartley, he made that comment on reference to why the fields rent out impulses, angels, ect.

In this case i really think it's the user. I knew someone that could shoot pretty fast with a stock single trigger on his model 98. I think he might have been able to shoot faster than i oculd on my 2x frame mag. It was close, he just couldn't shoot mags for anything. Both guns could keep up with the user. I think it's just wheter the user could keep up with the gun.

[maglover52]

maybe if you are using a broken mag.

[GhillieGuy]

Like shartly said, tipmans are excelent rental guns becouse they are unbreakeable(so is a mag but it still has more maintenance) but why would somewone say that they are better than mags? Well i guess everyone has their own opinion and i will recpect that, and it is very true that somewone could shoot faster with a tippy, they might just be more used to it... I think

[Lopy-slopy]

Some of them are idiots. Mags are better than tippy's plain ans simple. One guy said that tippy's are good beause team timppman effect uses them. That makes no scence. They have to use them no matter how bad they are becuase tippman sponsors them. Most of their guns are upgraded so much, ie ebolt, RT, HPA conversion(in other words made into like $2000 guns) and they use A5's mostly. I know there are some teams that don't use their sponsors guns, but I can't see why the company still pays them. Probably just to have them ware their jerseys. It's just a matter of pride. People love their guns and think theirs is the best. their are talon owners groups and they think that they have great markers! LOL.

[Surreal]

Originally posted by Lopy-slopy
That makes no scence.

...neither does that :)

[Crimson_Turkey]

My A-5 is definitly tourney grade. With a 10" ultralite, e-grip, intruder x-chamber (it sure is long now, huh?) and the ungodly cyclone feed, it kicks butt. I'd say the cyclone is better than a HALO B. The thing feeds a little above 20bps and has no batteries.

As for the 98, with an e-bolt it can out shoot ALOT of guns. I will take an e-bolt 98 over a lot of popular electros. The thing is sexy.

[GhillieGuy]

I'd say the cyclone is better than a HALO B. The thing feeds a little above 20bps and has no batteries.
Yeah, like that is even close to being true...
Why would you spend that much cash on a tippy?

[circus5]

A little respect here. First off, I shoot a mag, always have, always will. But you have to respect the tippman m98. the gun is incredible for its price. I can, and have, shot a m98 just as fast as a standard mag. With the m98 reactive trigger installed and cranked up, NOTHING can compare to that rof with so much consistency. I can also rock an e98 just as fast as an angel.
Another point, tippmans customer service is great, i mean rivaling AGD great. when the 98 first came out and went to feilds it didnt have all the bugs worked out, in fact they broke left and right. the feild i now work for got one of the first batches, and they were really bad. tippman said, ok, we'll send someone to take care of it. A few days later a truck rolls up, they TOOK the old (new) guns and SWAPPED THEM for new ones from the factory. And to this day tippman often fixes guns sent to them by customers for free, even if the warranty is expired,
But what tippman has done id kind of scary. Now any 12yr old can have a crazy rof, without convincing mommy to buy him an angel or the like. This has really increased the number of kids with more gun than they know how to use. i really hate being shot in the back by the kid on my own team, way in the back, with a flatline and rt trigger. 15 rds a sec is not pleasant on the back of your head....

[shartley]

Originally posted by TheBigRaguPB4L


Well actually Mr. Hartley, he made that comment on reference to why the fields rent out impulses, angels, ect.

I stand corrected. :) I must have just skimmed over that. Sorry.

Originally posted by Crimson_Turkey
My A-5 is definitly tourney grade. With a 10" ultralite, e-grip, intruder x-chamber (it sure is long now, huh?) and the ungodly cyclone feed, it kicks butt. I'd say the cyclone is better than a HALO B. The thing feeds a little above 20bps and has no batteries.

As for the 98, with an e-bolt it can out shoot ALOT of guns. I will take an e-bolt 98 over a lot of popular electros. The thing is sexy.
The argument was bone stock. And it was not the A-5 either. Please stay on topic. ;)

Originally posted by circus5
A little respect here. First off, I shoot a mag, always have, always will. But you have to respect the tippman m98. the gun is incredible for its price. I can, and have, shot a m98 just as fast as a standard mag. With the m98 reactive trigger installed and cranked up, NOTHING can compare to that rof with so much consistency. I can also rock an e98 just as fast as an angel.
Another point, tippmans customer service is great, i mean rivaling AGD great. when the 98 first came out and went to feilds it didnt have all the bugs worked out, in fact they broke left and right. the feild i now work for got one of the first batches, and they were really bad. tippman said, ok, we'll send someone to take care of it. A few days later a truck rolls up, they TOOK the old (new) guns and SWAPPED THEM for new ones from the factory. And to this day tippman often fixes guns sent to them by customers for free, even if the warranty is expired,
But what tippman has done id kind of scary. Now any 12yr old can have a crazy rof, without convincing mommy to buy him an angel or the like. This has really increased the number of kids with more gun than they know how to use. i really hate being shot in the back by the kid on my own team, way in the back, with a flatline and rt trigger. 15 rds a sec is not pleasant on the back of your head....
I respect the Tippy… always have. But it is not a Mag. Sorry. I also respect the Spyder, my household has two of them. But they are also not Mags.

And again… the argument was not taking an M98 with reactive trigger and cranking it up. It was bone stock. When you get into these types of arguments you see the same types of responses as with the “ricer” arguments. “But I can take my (insert favorite Asian market import) and do (insert favorite list of upgrades ranging from $10-20K) and it will blow the doors off of any domestic muscle car off the dealer’s lot!” ;)

As for the statement about the Tippy RT being faster than ANY marker out there with so much consistency…. LOL I take it you have not seen the Mag Family running full auto? Markers now days will all pretty much shoot the same general speeds provided you can feed them fast enough. But anyone who thinks any other marker can show the same consistency as Mags is fooling themselves or is just not informed.

ROF now days is a dead issue to me. Once you get past 15 BPS it is only bragging rights and not much else in my book. Folks think BPS increases the size of their manhood or something…. LOL Pumps baby! Now THAT says you are a man! :D;)

[GhillieGuy]

Another point, i too respect the spyder. Thats what we all started out with in our famly and the things are pretty durable. Iv'e had an old spyder compact for 0ver 5 years or so and it still works fine.
Ok, back to topic i do have respect for tippys just becouse they've been around for a long time and like comewone mensioned, there service is great. And they might shoot faster than a mag with an rt. But if you would compare it to that than you'll have to compare it to an rt mag which in my opinion is faster.

[JAM]

I have always liked tippmanns... my first semi was a 68 Special- that was an AWESOME gun. from there I moved to a ProAM and that was an awesome gun too. I can only assume that the newer models are even better. But, then I got a mag and haven't looked back. Now, to the issue of triggers- I've always felt that mag triggers were a little sloppy- they need a light spring or something to hold them against the trigger rod- tippmanns have always had pretty stiff return springs which give the impression of a trigger that has less "slop". I have always wished for someting to steady a mag trigger- even on the intelliframe, that's why i love the trigger on an EMag.
As for quality/reliability/value... well, it's subjective, but think about it, you could buy 3 tippmann 98's for the cost of a decent mag... Tom's said it before- the tippmann is probably the best gun for the money out there.
And they can really shoot well. Does it suck to get shot out by a 12 year old with a $125 gun? Yes, and it's embarrassing too because I'm a 27 year old with a $1000 gun. :) But, what are we gonna do? well-shooting cheaper guns are very good for the sport. I just don't think we should put down other guns to save face- I will never sell my guns and get a spyder, but that's partly 'cause I like the technology and partly 'cause i have bought into the hype. Oh well, enough rambling, to each their own.
If some guy wants to talk about how his splatmaster could outshoot my angel, well, on a certain day maybe he is right, or at least he has the right to believe he's correct. just play and have fun.

[JAM]

oh, and Shartley, what are doing up and typing at 5:30 in the morn? ;)

[MinimagRockin']

Originally posted by shartley

When you get into these types of arguments you see the same types of responses as with the “ricer” arguments. “But I can take my (insert favorite Asian market import) and do (insert favorite list of upgrades ranging from $10-20K) and it will blow the doors off of any domestic muscle car off the dealer’s lot!” ;)



LOL, not to get off topic but I know exactly what you mean. People are like I could twin turbo my 300zx and it would smoke a corvette. It's like yeah sure it could, why don't you throw a twin turbo on the vette and see what happens.

[xen_100]

Originally posted by Crimson_Turkey
My A-5 is definitly tourney grade. With a 10" ultralite, e-grip, intruder x-chamber (it sure is long now, huh?) and the ungodly cyclone feed, it kicks butt. I'd say the cyclone is better than a HALO B. The thing feeds a little above 20bps and has no batteries.

As for the 98, with an e-bolt it can out shoot ALOT of guns. I will take an e-bolt 98 over a lot of popular electros. The thing is sexy.

the problem with the cyclone feed, that I have seen. it doesn't handle brittle paint very well. because when you shoot it advances the next ball. but unlike the halo that is a nice slow push, the A-5 kinda wacks the paint really hard from the very quick action that the ram causes. if hte paint gets pinched a little, it gets crushed in the A-5, the halo will just stop.

[shartley]

Originally posted by JAM
oh, and Shartley, what are doing up and typing at 5:30 in the morn? ;)
I was sick. I will not get into it, but sometimes you can't "do your business" and then go back to bed because it comes in cycles... ;) I will leave it at that.

So... I had to fill up the time while my body "settled". THUS AO!!! WooHoo! :D

(Added: I never DID get back to bed though. grrrr I normally get up and start work about 6 anyways and was up at 4. Then I had to bring my car to the glass company to replace the windshield and both door windows. And I JUST got back. What a nightmare!!!! And a wasted day.)

[Fatjon]

I think i could shoot a stock tippmann faster than a stock classic mag anyday. Sorry but stock mags are SLOW

[xen_100]

just takes a little practice....... I could do abuot 10 BPS on a stock AGD mag single trigger frame. M98s jump around like a 5 y/o that has been eating sugar. very hard to keep them on target.

[aaron_mag]

Originally posted by shartley
I was sick. I will not get into it, but sometimes you can't "do your business" and then go back to bed because it comes in cycles... ;) I will leave it at that.


Good because that was too much information already!!:D I agree with Shartley and won't bother follwing the link to fight it out with them. I have a 98 which is a good marker and is really good to loan to friends that want to try out paintball when they come to the field with me. I hate, however, taking that thing apart. My brother has the A-5 with response trigger and that really is a pretty darn cool marker (that feed system is great). It all comes down, however, to feel. Mag maintenance is so simple and I like the feel of the way it shoots.

[yeahthatsme]

"How many tourny players do you see with tippys?... None"


thats the dumbest comment i've ever seen! ever heard of tippman effect?

[MinimagRockin']

An espyder is faster than a mag too but which one would you rather have?

[GT]

AIR valve > Tippmann CVX(or whatever it is called)

that should be reason enough.

jb

[GhillieGuy]

Who's team tippmann effect? And who you callin dumb?:mad:

[Crimson_Turkey]

Tippmann effect is the Tippmann sponsored team. They placed 9th at skyball. Pretty damn good team.

[PzYcO]

Truthfully, Tippman 98customs shoot faster than a STOCK MAG (Not Retro)

[GT]

Originally posted by PzYcO
Truthfully, Tippman 98customs shoot faster than a STOCK MAG (Not Retro)

really, I would love to see that,
maybe you ment 98 RT's

[PzYcO]

Originally posted by gtrsi


really, I would love to see that,
maybe you ment 98 RT's

nope. I ment a stock m98custom shoots faster than a stock 68 automag.

[impostal22]

not to get flamed, but i wonder why everyone has a mag if they can shoot just as fast or even faster with a $100 m98. not that i don't have a mag, or think i should get a m98...i'm just wondering what's the point in sinking $xxx dollars in upgrading your mag when you can shoot faster stock on a m98. the biggest thing the mag has going for it, i think, would be the LX, and that isn't stock. again, i love my mag. just wanted to know everyone's opinion.

[PzYcO]

consistency
LEGAL upgrade path
capable of high rof

etc.. ;)

[GT]

Originally posted by impostal22
not to get flamed, but i wonder why everyone has a mag if they can shoot just as fast or even faster with a $100 m98. not that i don't have a mag, or think i should get a m98...i'm just wondering what's the point in sinking $xxx dollars in upgrading your mag when you can shoot faster stock on a m98. the biggest thing the mag has going for it, i think, would be the LX, and that isn't stock. again, i love my mag. just wanted to know everyone's opinion.

Because a mag is internally regulated, via AIR. the CVX on a 98 is a joke. 2nd even the RT 98's are dam reactive, I wonder how long that is going to be legal? Sure it can be adjusted but they are dam near full auto out of the box.

PzYcO,
Like I said I want to see it to believe it. Even the rock hard stock single trigger I can get moving pretty fast, the stock 98 is kinda benchmarkish. Saying one is faster w/o quantifing data is pretty ballsy.

jb

[GhillieGuy]

Well, iv'e shoten a 98 before bu iv'e never owned one. But i know i can say this, when you buy a 98 stock there isn't much you can do with it. How many stock mags have you seen on ao? I havent seen any. But you commonly see stock 98's, so thats why alot of people prefer mags...

[PzYcO]

Originally posted by gtrsi
[B]2nd even the RT 98's are dam reactive, I wonder how long that is going to be legal?

PzYcO,
Like I said I want to see it to believe it. Even the rock hard stock single trigger I can get moving pretty fast, the stock 98 is kinda benchmarkish. Saying one is faster w/o quantifing data is pretty ballsy.B]

I have no physical proof. Take a stock 98 and a [b]STOCK[b] 68 automag, try it for your self, you shall see.


---

Tippman98 RT IS ILLEGAL

[impostal22]

dumb question by why is the tippmann RT illegal and the automag RT gun not?

[GhillieGuy]

I think becouse the tippmann rt is installed in the trigger, and the mag rt is a valve..

[GT]

Originally posted by PzYcO


I have no physical proof. Take a stock 98 and a [b]STOCK[b] 68 automag, try it for your self, you shall see.


---

Tippman98 RT IS ILLEGAL

I have both, sorry but just saying that one is better than the other w/o proof is silly


I havnt read anywhere where it is illegal, just turn down the reactiviness.

jb

[MinimagRockin']

Originally posted by impostal22
dumb question by why is the tippmann RT illegal and the automag RT gun not?

RTs (tippman or mag) can both be illegal if you use them wrong. If it goes full auto or "runs away" on you that is illegal. If you have them adjusted properly so that one pull shoots one ball then they are legal.

[RT pRo AuToMaG]

All RT Model 98's are tourney illegal because the reactiveness is adjustable, where on a mag, the only way to adjust it would be to crank the pressure or modify the valve somehow. Runaway mode on RT's are illegal, and you can easliy set a Model 98 to do that.

[Brian68mag]

Originally posted by GhillieGuy
Like shartly said, tipmans are excelent rental guns becouse they are unbreakeable(so is a mag but it still has more maintenance)
Uhh? More matenance, hardly, oil both guns,thats it.

The reason alot fields use 98's is the following.
Cheaper- 100 or under(if u buy in bulk) new, they come with everything you need. Mags are around 250-300 -new- to get a setup thats complete.
They run fine on co2 out of the box, and wont freeze with liquid.
No short stroking,alot of newbies would SS mags left and right.

Newbies like them(98) because they like the looks.
They like the sights.
They like the expandibility for low money.
Everyone says tippmanns are good for newbies, alot say mags suck no matter what.

Its not a bad thing, putting mags back in the main rental scene could turn some newbies away from them.
My first gun was a 98, most of my freinds first gun was too, i loved it when i had it, now i look back and chuckle.

[GT]

Originally posted by RT pRo AuToMaG
All RT Model 98's are tourney illegal because the reactiveness is adjustable, where on a mag, the only way to adjust it would be to crank the pressure or modify the valve somehow. Runaway mode on RT's are illegal, and you can easliy set a Model 98 to do that.

Wrong,
from my understanding of the RT98, is that there is a nut that can be locked down similar to a reg on RT, Ie aint going to change anything on the field w/o tools.

jb

[Angry Man]

The fact is that the trigger pull on a stock mag is no better than the trigger pull on a stock 98 custom....both are around 3-4 pounds (more on some mags I've used) and both single finger. Some people can shoot the tippmann faster, some can shoot a mag faster...the pulls are similar in weight, but feel a little different. Rate of fire isn't everything, though (a 100 dollar e-spyder owns any mag up until an emag, and any cocker besides and e-blade), and I'd take almost any hinged cocker over almost any e-spyder (except my TIMMY!!!!!!)....so it's not big deal if a tippmann is faster (which I believe it is), since people shoot mags because they prefer them to blowbacks, not because they're lightning fast (no mechanical gun that's not reactive is).

[StuDawggie]

I own both, A mag, and a C98. I bought both of them stock and played with both of them stock for the longest of times. What it comes down too is what you like the best. A lot of times, I'm un stoppable with my mag. Otherdays I couldn't hit an elephant from 2 feet away. Other days it's the same with my Tippy. Both are good guns, but when it comes to rof, they're about the same. It really depends on how fast YOU, the player can shoot.

Just thought I'd give my $.02

[Automaggot68]

In totally resent the comment made by Ghillieguy, that one cannot do anything with a stock Model 98. This is not true at all. While there are not as many aftermarket parts for that particular marker, when compared to the market for other markers, you can still do a heck of alot of things to it. I own both a Model 98, and a Mag, and I heartily love both. In my experience with both markers, when I first bought my Mag, I had to break in the trigger, before it lightened up, and maybe others have,but I cannot speak for them, where as with my Model 98, it was significantly lighter than the mag, although not after the Mag's trigger was broken in, or when I upgraded to an Intelliframe. Just like someone said before (cannot remember name, I'll credit you after looking back at previous posts) It doesn't depend on you as a shooter, and whether or not you can keep up with the marker, but if the marker can keep up with you. The CVX valve,and the AIR valve are both very different,and they have alot to dow ith why one marker is a blow foreward,and one is a blow back. I can't believe that this turned form a post highlighting the follishness of PBnation, to comparing twop markers that have revolutionized Paintball as a whole.

[AzNGuNSmokE]

Originally posted by gtrsi


Wrong,
from my understanding of the RT98, is that there is a nut that can be locked down similar to a reg on RT, Ie aint going to change anything on the field w/o tools.

jb

Sorry but the newer Tippmann RT's do not have a lockdown nut. They have a little screw with a small slot, that you can turn with your finger nail or a small screwdriver...

[coolcatpete]

Originally posted by Lopy-slopy
Some of them are idiots. Mags are better than tippy's plain ans simple. One guy said that tippy's are good beause team timppman effect uses them. That makes no scence. They have to use them no matter how bad they are becuase tippman sponsors them. Most of their guns are upgraded so much, ie ebolt, RT, HPA conversion(in other words made into like $2000 guns) and they use A5's mostly. I know there are some teams that don't use their sponsors guns, but I can't see why the company still pays them. Probably just to have them ware their jerseys. It's just a matter of pride. People love their guns and think theirs is the best. their are talon owners groups and they think that they have great markers! LOL.

actually I was was watching tippman effect and 2 use an a5, 2 us an e-bolt, one uses a totally upgraded tippman and the rest use tippman 98s with double trigger and hyper star blot so no they dont come up to $2000 they all come up less then $600.

[Meph]

Originally posted by GhillieGuy
but why would somewone say that they are better than mags?

I dunno. Tippmann beating AGD at IAO?

Nya nya! ;)


No, you're right. Everybody DOES have their opinion. And the kid that gave the 98 faster/whatever than mag opinion was born in 1988. So take a wild guess as how much experience he's actually had before lashing out and unleashing the AO clones.

I personally don't even care what people say. If they say a Spyder is better than a Piranha. Let em, you won't see me blink twice or lose sleep over it. Say a Matrix is low maintanence. First I'll laugh, then ignore them. What have you, let them say what they want. Just make sure that you record it and preserve it in a history log book, so 5 years from now ask them a question relating to that. When they finally learned something in those 5 years, bring back their old newbie self and show them how stupid they sounded. You can tell 'em now, but they won't learn. Gotta let them eat their own words down the road! Feels better, too!

[Will Wood]

I can shoot my tippmann (Double trigger, with some mods to it) a heck of a lot faster then a stock mag, and probably a double trigger mag.

Shoot faster? Nah.. Easier to shoot faster? Yup..

[Meph]

Originally posted by Lopy-slopy
Most of their guns are upgraded so much, ie ebolt, RT, HPA conversion(in other words made into like $2000 guns) and they use A5's mostly.

Not even close. You can probably take one of Dynasty's markers.... and that almost equals the cost of ALL Tippmann Effects'! Not being sarcastic either, dead serious.

The Effect guns are not highly specially one of a kind custom factory specialties. They do not undergo hundreds of hours of in-factory custom tweeking and putting Timmy internals in the Tippy. It's not like that, though everybody who thinks they know what they're talking about (hint hint) assumes so. Think that since they play tournaments, they must be highly special Tippmanns that nobody else can get.

Sorry, but half of them are still mechanical. You can get your own special edition Tippmann Effect style performing Tippmann from me. Send me 2000 dollars (since you think it costs that much) and I'll send you a 98 with a Stabilizer and double trigger. You'll be able to use the same thing they do.

There are e-bolts and e-grips, of course. I'm not about to make it sound like they grab a 98 out of the box and have at it. The guys use what they like and what they're good with. Though one of them is doing good with my E-grip. And now I need one, again! I just got it, too, after my first one got lifted.

Only difference is that these kids know what they're using, know how to use them, have been using them, and are very comfortable using them. So they might be Tippmanns, but last I checked they have a few wins behind their name along with almost always placing.

Also, it's 50/50. Leaning more towards using 98's over A-5s.

[Infratracide]

i liked the part where someone said "mags acctually have a looooooooong trigger pull"
yes thats because you have to pull the trigger a total of 4mm. If he thinks thats long he must have low standards.

[tony3]

Originally posted by Crimson_Turkey
My A-5 is definitly tourney grade. With a 10" ultralite, e-grip, intruder x-chamber (it sure is long now, huh?) and the ungodly cyclone feed, it kicks butt. I'd say the cyclone is better than a HALO B. The thing feeds a little above 20bps and has no batteries.

As for the 98, with an e-bolt it can out shoot ALOT of guns. I will take an e-bolt 98 over a lot of popular electros. The thing is sexy.

No it can't outshoot ALOT of popular electros, I can't think of one electro it can out shoot, maybe an old shocker:confused: Its all in their rams, you cant really get over 13 bps with them

[p8ntballsnowman]

Stock tippmanns are faster than stock mags. The money it would take to get an RTP would give u enough to buy an E bolt which can outshoot an RTP. Put a hyperframe on a mag and their about even. I just like the feel of a tippmann and how they are mad reliable. Thats why i traded my mag for an E bolt tippmann. No regrets.

[Pvt.Opium]

a

[SKIRAT]

i have both, my mag (WHEN IT WAS STOCK) was much faster than my Tippman98 stock. Mags are much faster.

[Bad_Dog]

think of it this way...

if you have an expierienced player using a model 98, and a noob using a rental mag, I would hope that the tippy guy would shoot faster, especially if the noob has never played before...

[no_doz]

no way...

[DWill]

I think of Tippmann and Airgun Designs as paraeall(SP I can never spell this darn word) companys. Both of the basic models cost about the same stock. Both have a long tradition of building tough, reliable products, and both give you the option of upgrading your gun by kits or new parts so that it can perform to the best of its ability. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think mag owners can really rip on tippmann owners visa versa.

pbgear.com price for A-5 $239.75
pbgear.com price for 68 classic p/f $239.00
Difference $0.75

[dinger]

simply put:


TIPPS ARE <B>*POOF*</B>. thats why people around here call them the Ritzman 98 and the GAy-5. a-5 is overpriced, and the m98's are just... pieces of crap. i mean my friend spent like 150$ for his <B>*POOF*</B> gun. the thing sounds like a cannon.

ill shut up now because im not wasting my energy on spreading the word how tipps suck :mad:

<B>*Warning: No Cussing*</B> -Miscue

[DWill]

Dinger I would be careful about what you say because a few people would say things along the similar lines about your Piranha Core G3. I personally love tippmanns for their duribilty even though I've never owned one if rented thim out a few times. I haven't had much luck with piranhas myself but this is only my opinion...... :rolleyes:

[dinger]

lol dont worry man!! :D i already am well-aware that my gun is an official bonafide P.O.S. but its better than a tipp :o



at least my gun doesn't need an allen wrench and 1 minute of unscrewing to take it apart :o:D

[Meph]

Sorry, but something that breaks down 5 times before a Tippmann even flinches towards having any need or repair.... that is not better. So like you said, shut up. Flaming noobs have no need to comment. Ever.


For the pbgear.com prices. You're missing 2 things. Difference is more than 75 cents bub. You need to buy a barrel for that Automag! You need to buy a bottomline assembly for it! AND you need a hopper.

It's much more than 75 cents. So money wise for what you get, A-5 is a better deal.

HOWEVER if the person just doesn't like the A-5, it's better for them to save up another 100 dollars to get what they need for the mag. If they like the mag better despite price, then so be it!

[DWill]

True I was just comparing the stock price and showing the similarities between the two markers

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by dinger
simply put:

TIPPS ARE $HIT.



Thank goodness the curse filter works! :rolleyes:


Originally posted by dinger


...thats why people around here call them the Ritzman 98 and the GAy-5.



That funny... I've been here for a while and that's the first time I've hear anyone call them that.:rolleyes:



Originally posted by dinger
...ill shut up now...

If only we could be so lucky!

[Lohman446]

You know, thats funny... I'm just now considering what my next gun will be (I like building collections) - I currently have an X-valved ULE mag and a Smart Mag minimag. I have shortened the list based on quality to the list below for my next gun

X-Mag (probably not, too expensive)

E-mag - strong possibility

Diadem - I once said these were hype... maybe not

Viking - I really like the "feeling" of the owners of this marker - this may not sound important but this is THE REASON I own two mags.

Tippman A-5 - guys, the cyclone feed system (does NOT feed 20BPS guys, Tippman advertises 800 per minute) is just an awesome idea. The flatline barrel (whether it works or not) is innovative, and if anyone makes fun of it it works great as a club too. One of three companies surviving in the paintball industry since the beginning.

You will note that this list is as much about the company behind the product as the product itself, the people who own them - or at least those around here I have seen who own them is the limiting factor on it. Thats not fair to a lot of owners - I know that and Im sorry - but a lot of Tippman owners are too into the militaristic side of woodsball and I had two this weekend just come unglued when there "grand plans" in a big game worked poorly. Not fair, I own a mag (ok two) because of the owners group (as a whole) and the company - I do not buy Smarts Parts because of the company... do I beleive that the mag is a vastly superior product to any other.. no I don't - the mag is a great gun, but it is the owners group / company that make it what it is today.

[QuestionMark?]

In my opinion i think mags are better than tippy's in my opinion. I have played with M98s and i think they are one of the best markers out there for their price range, but we have to look at them stock. The trigger was like pushing a old rusty button (dont ask where that one came from), however the M98 does kick serious A$$ on the field. However several M98 owners brag a little to much about their guns, a few that i know constantly braged and dissed my Automag RT/Pro, i find their comments to be funny:rolleyes:. However i shot my mag when i played with it so much faster and better than the M98, not to say that the M98 is bad, the M98 is a great gun, i just think my mag outproformed it. I think this is a matter of personal preferance in my opinion but I play better with my Mag any day over days i use a Tippmann.

Please dont Flame Me for My Opinion!:(

[Meph]

I don't know who was the genius behind that advertisement, but it's greatly modest. I can tell you it's max. Currently, the Cyclone is capable of 17.6cps.

[Lohman446]

It can feed 12 or it can feed 500 BPS, LOL to me it does not matter cause I can't shoot it. <---- edit - this is not meant to be inflamatory, I do not know more than what I have been told, and gladly concede the feed rate due to lack of knowledge, besides to me it does not matter

The A-5 is an awesome gun, just face it it really really is. Get rid of the RT trigger (don't get the option) and its function is just awesome. So it's kinda ugly (at least for speedball). I mean, I do not like the looks. But, as for the Tippman, I have tremendous respect for the gun, for the company - innovations shared with the rest of the industry. I have respect for those players that have broken the "Tippman" mold and are not too into this. I respect those that are so much more into this that they have the patience to wear camo and wait... I just do not feel that I fit that mold, and a Tippman, well, just is not my style (form over function is idiotic I know I have never claimed to be really intelligent) . Now if I could get rid of the look of one, that cyclone (no battery) feed system is awesome. As for mags being this great indestructible gun - maybe, but I do a lot of maintenance (self induced often enough) on my mag with x-valve and LX. I seldom see anyone do any maintenance to a Tippman.

[superdesk2007]

I've had nothing wrong with my Tippmann, I played through an ice storm with it, still works fine. Tippmans are to long and heavy in my opinion.

[dinger]

no, i will not shut up. all my "opinions" are based upon factual information that has occured around here.

or in laymens terms *ahem* the m98's around here have failed to their so-called "standard" of being such a reliable gun. my gun hasn't broke down once, nothing has gone wrong with it. the m98's... those have just been having problem after problem. ASA's, bottom lines, and even something wrong with the bolt. i'd rather hope those are just manufacturing problems and not due to the fact that the gun is supposed to be that "reliable."

and also, im not a flaming noob. its just that i heavily stand upon my opinion, and i will not change from it. but when i try to make a point, i will say whatever i feel. if you dont like it, tough crap buddy. if you dont like what i say, then just scrol riiight past it.


this thread has brought out the bad side of me ~_~

[RaTfreak]

I am a die hard mag owner but i must agree. a non electro rt 98 custom/a-5 will out shoot a non electro mag any day.

I have seen them shoot 16 bps easy over the chrono.

don't know about the electro models though.

just my .01 worth. ( can't afford .02 ).

[DWill]

Does anyone know the cps on a m98 with ebolt?

[p8ntballsnowman]

Originally posted by dinger
no, i will not shut up. all my "opinions" are based upon factual information that has occured around here.

or in laymens terms *ahem* the m98's around here have failed to their so-called "standard" of being such a reliable gun. my gun hasn't broke down once, nothing has gone wrong with it. the m98's... those have just been having problem after problem. ASA's, bottom lines, and even something wrong with the bolt. i'd rather hope those are just manufacturing problems and not due to the fact that the gun is supposed to be that "reliable."

and also, im not a flaming noob. its just that i heavily stand upon my opinion, and i will not change from it. but when i try to make a point, i will say whatever i feel. if you dont like it, tough crap buddy. if you dont like what i say, then just scrol riiight past it.


this thread has brought out the bad side of me ~_~

I know at least 10 people with 98's and they have NEVER broken down once. Dont know what kind of gun ur using.

[~WarpedRT#2~]

Look, everyone on here is going to say mags are better. Some more than others, and I do mean certain moderators. Mags are ok guns, not the best, but not the worst. Tippmanns are ok too. I'ts personal preference. It only matter what you can shoot faster. Stop being partial, and look around outside the Airgun vault. There is another world.

And leave his Piranha alone. I trust PMI more than any other company.

[spyxtra]

u must be a moron if u think that a POS tippmann can out shoot a mag. teh only way a tippmann would ever shoot that fast would be if u put a RT on it which are ilegal so u couldnt have an advantage in tourny.

[spyxtra]

Originally posted by dinger
no, i will not shut up. all my "opinions" are based upon factual information that has occured around here.

or in laymens terms *ahem* the m98's around here have failed to their so-called "standard" of being such a reliable gun. my gun hasn't broke down once, nothing has gone wrong with it. the m98's... those have just been having problem after problem. ASA's, bottom lines, and even something wrong with the bolt. i'd rather hope those are just manufacturing problems and not due to the fact that the gun is supposed to be that "reliable."

and also, im not a flaming noob. its just that i heavily stand upon my opinion, and i will not change from it. but when i try to make a point, i will say whatever i feel. if you dont like it, tough crap buddy. if you dont like what i say, then just scrol riiight past it.


this thread has brought out the bad side of me ~_~


this has to be the best thing that i have read on this it is all true cause everybody nos tippmanns suck

[Meph]

Remember Spyxtra, flaming noobs have no need to comment. Ever! So quit calling people morons and touting biased garbage like a drugged up monkey. It's not welcomed.

[Z-man]

I'll race any of ya Tippmann guys with either of my mechanical RT's. I'll be at SCP (California) this Saturday.

But that's all in fun. There has always been this anit-Tippmann sentament by people hasn't there? I mean no one wants to give an inch to the company that has refused (even more than AGD) to follow the trend that most companies have taken (flashy milling, bright anodizing and such).

Isn't is also a bit that Tippmann guys (WARNING! GENERALIZATION ABOUT TO BE USED) are more the woodland ball guys? The kind of guys who like senario games, search and destroy games, police force training type games as opposed to the Speedball/hyperball/airball gmes?

Aren't Tippmann people generaly the kind that like to simulate more of the "hunt" aspect of paintball or the "sniper" military kind of play (this is not ment to be derogatary, but what I observe). The kind that go the full camo rout and the camo gun and the guillie suit at times?

Most Tippmann people falling to a greater or lesser degree leaning tward that aspact of paintball. They are not interested in the "shiney" flashy aspect of the sport and it's more of a hunting and sneaking about thing for them (my roommate in college fit this perfectly).

I mean look at them. The guns much more closely resemble real guns than most other markers.

After 7 years of paintball and watching tippmann guys I am drawn to think that "Tippmann guys" repersents this other aspect of paintball. Anyone else notice these sort of things? Any Tippmann guys aggree? I suspect that this is kinda why Tippmann's recieve some of the flack they do. They are different from the guys who buy spyders and Mags and electros.

[dinger]

yea i agree with you meph. and dont ever call me a flaming noob again :)

Spyxtra-

have you ever even shot a stock mag??
try that and then a m98. find a relationship/difference and see which is faster

[BajaBoy]

Z-man, you couldnt have said it any better. Im not a tippmenn guy at all.. i would just never own one, but! they can take one heck of a beeting and still work

[dinger]

Originally posted by Z-man
Isn't is also a bit that Tippmann guys (WARNING! GENERALIZATION ABOUT TO BE USED) are more the woodland ball guys? The kind of guys who like senario games, search and destroy games, police force training type games as opposed to the Speedball/hyperball/airball gmes?

Aren't Tippmann people generaly the kind that like to simulate more of the "hunt" aspect of paintball or the "sniper" military kind of play (this is not ment to be derogatary, but what I observe). The kind that go the full camo rout and the camo gun and the guillie suit at times?



wowzers!! i find that 100% true. the ppl i know that have them hate speedball and are VERY VERY sneaky in woodsball.


those sneaky bass turds

[minnimag]

this is getting stupid. Tippmans are a quality gun. If they can outshoot a mag... um i dunno. Ive shot a stock mag and a stock m98 back to back when i was with my friends and i could def shoot my mag faster but when my friend shot his m98 he definetly shot it faster then i did. Faster tehn i could shoot ... i dunno. Anyways! this flamming is getting stupid if you want a gun vs gun thread go to pbnation!

Edit:

by the way
Originally posted by spyxtra



cause everybody nos tippmanns suck

this constitutes as a flamming n00b if you need an example

[p8ntballsnowman]

Originally posted by Z-man
I'll race any of ya Tippmann guys with either of my mechanical RT's. I'll be at SCP (California) this Saturday.

But that's all in fun. There has always been this anit-Tippmann sentament by people hasn't there? I mean no one wants to give an inch to the company that has refused (even more than AGD) to follow the trend that most companies have taken (flashy milling, bright anodizing and such).

Isn't is also a bit that Tippmann guys (WARNING! GENERALIZATION ABOUT TO BE USED) are more the woodland ball guys? The kind of guys who like senario games, search and destroy games, police force training type games as opposed to the Speedball/hyperball/airball gmes?

Aren't Tippmann people generaly the kind that like to simulate more of the "hunt" aspect of paintball or the "sniper" military kind of play (this is not ment to be derogatary, but what I observe). The kind that go the full camo rout and the camo gun and the guillie suit at times?

Most Tippmann people falling to a greater or lesser degree leaning tward that aspact of paintball. They are not interested in the "shiney" flashy aspect of the sport and it's more of a hunting and sneaking about thing for them (my roommate in college fit this perfectly).

I mean look at them. The guns much more closely resemble real guns than most other markers.

After 7 years of paintball and watching tippmann guys I am drawn to think that "Tippmann guys" repersents this other aspect of paintball. Anyone else notice these sort of things? Any Tippmann guys aggree? I suspect that this is kinda why Tippmann's recieve some of the flack they do. They are different from the guys who buy spyders and Mags and electros.

I bet my e bolt could take ur RT mag if someone fast used it, im just not that fast with any gun. Very true most tippmann people being snipers. Everyone thinks im some noob cause i haev a tippman. They are still great guns, just a lil long.

[Meph]

Sorry snowman. But the e-bolt is capped. RT isn't! If you modify the on/off and tweek it a bit, you can get an RT going faster than an E-bolt board will allow it to cycle.

[Ejp414]

Over the past year or so I have lurked in these forums reading info and interesting threads, but rarely posting. The reason I have continued to read the new topics here every morning is simple, the posts are usually intelligent and as unbiased as you can get for an owner's group forum.

This, though, is pathetic. It's actually kind of ironic to see how you point out a thread to make fun of a forum's stupidity and this is what comes out. This is starting to sound exactly like pbnation or a similar kind of place.

Tippmann Model 98 (custom, we'll just assume, since that is what is being sold nowadays) vs. a stock non-RT mag with no upgrades... As far as RoF goes, it's really not a plain fact as to which shoots faster. If you mean the marker's capable cps, then mag wins without a doubt. But since you mean the RoF that a user is able to achieve, it's really dependent on one thing-- the user. I personally had a hard time moving from a Model 98 trigger to a 'mag trigger. At first it seemed stiff and just plain different. Once I got used to it, I found the shorter but maybe a slightly heavier trigger (trigger spring mods are VERY easy on m98's, any user who would be new enough to the sport to not know this would also shortstroke a mag for sure, giving him some probs) was easier to rip on AFTER SOME TIME. It's completely user preference, just like Cocker vs. Mag trigger.

As far as maitenance goes, they are equal in my book. My Tippmann seemed to hold up better than my minimag, but the minimag was easier to care for and disassemble.

For valve systems... give me a break. Of course a regulated precision system like the Classic valve is going to be more consistent than a spring loaded blowback using unreg'd gas sources.

Just like the trigger, it's all preference. Making fun of someone's gun because it costs less is completely uncalled for. You know how it feels being a 'mag owner because 'mags take some heat sometimes, so don't sink to the level of others. Both are great markers for one reason: they perform well for who they are designed for and are backed up by great companies and quality componants.

[superdesk2007]

I can shoot my stock Tippman faster than I can shoot a stock mag, my brother can shoot a stock mag faster than a stock Tippmann. I think you have to be used to the gun your shooting.

[p8ntballsnowman]

Originally posted by Meph
Sorry snowman. But the e-bolt is capped. RT isn't! If you modify the on/off and tweek it a bit, you can get an RT going faster than an E-bolt board will allow it to cycle.

Well u can also tweek a Tippmann by adding a warlord board which i think uncapps it.

[Meph]

Well, then with the e-bolt what you're going to NEED to do is one of 2 things.

1) Lighten the hammer and stiffen up the return spring so you can keep using the 2-way noid.
2) Start using a 4-way noid for forward and return motion.

Otherwise it won't be able to cycle over 13bps. Currently it barely gets 13. The E-bolt isn't perfect, it has some tweeks that can/should be done to it. But since all I do is PR work and not actual designing or marketing. I can't change it myself.

[Paintballer1833]

When i had my old classic it did shoot slower than my friends tipp but the mag definantly shot better. MOre consistent, less kick, and just nice. Sure a electro spyder can shoot 13 bps but id take mechanical higher end over it anyday.

[zeroack]

Now don't get me wrong I've never shot a mag. I've been playing paintball for two years now. I should say I started playing again only two years ago. I played from 90-94 while I was in college. I shot all sorts of pumps, vm-68's, pgp's, etc. When I got back into paintball I started back with a m98c. I wanted something tough that I could hand down to my kids when they started playing. I soon upgraded to a M3 Dragun(electro spyder clone). It was nice but I still wanted something more. So I sold it. I bought a cocker, used it and just sold it. I hated the feel. Now I'm back again to my trusty m98c. It's a good marker, nice balance, I know just how it's going to shoot and where. It works great on CO2 or hpa. Where I reside it's hard to get hpa fills so we have to us CO2 mostly.

Now don't loose hope for the mag. A buddy of mine who posts here is sending me his to try out. See if I want one. I have a $400-500 budget for my next paintball gun purchace. Depending on how I like the mag I will be either buying a nice mag or an A-5, flatline and E-trigger. I play a lot of scenarios and a-5's and flatlines are king there. If there's any doubters about the flatlines abilities get on the reciveing side of one sometime. It's very frustrating.

Wish me well with the mag....

Zero

[Z-man]

Originally posted by Ejp414
Tippmann Model 98 (custom, we'll just assume, since that is what is being sold nowadays) vs. a stock non-RT mag with no upgrades... As far as RoF goes, it's really not a plain fact as to which shoots faster. If you mean the marker's capable cps, then mag wins without a doubt. But since you mean the RoF that a user is able to achieve, it's really dependent on one thing-- the user. I personally had a hard time moving from a Model 98 trigger to a 'mag trigger......

This is what I started thinking about once I had posted. I would have added it in but my DSL went down RRRRR

Both guns are capable of great speed but how fast can YOU shoot it. I can rip on my RT, wanna race?

[p8ntballsnowman]

Originally posted by Meph
Well, then with the e-bolt what you're going to NEED to do is one of 2 things.

1) Lighten the hammer and stiffen up the return spring so you can keep using the 2-way noid.
2) Start using a 4-way noid for forward and return motion.

Otherwise it won't be able to cycle over 13bps. Currently it barely gets 13. The E-bolt isn't perfect, it has some tweeks that can/should be done to it. But since all I do is PR work and not actual designing or marketing. I can't change it myself.

I see. Dont know that much about the ebolt. Is the A-5 E grip any different? Or is it basically the same thing.

[Meph]

Mucho different. E-bolt is a pneumatic-hammer design. E-grip is a sear-tripping design.

[Marek]

Originally posted by Ejp414
Over the past year or so I have lurked in these forums reading info and interesting threads, but rarely posting. The reason I have continued to read the new topics here every morning is simple, the posts are usually intelligent and as unbiased as you can get for an owner's group forum.

This, though, is pathetic. It's actually kind of ironic to see how you point out a thread to make fun of a forum's stupidity and this is what comes out. This is starting to sound exactly like pbnation or a similar kind of place.

Tippmann Model 98 (custom, we'll just assume, since that is what is being sold nowadays) vs. a stock non-RT mag with no upgrades... As far as RoF goes, it's really not a plain fact as to which shoots faster. If you mean the marker's capable cps, then mag wins without a doubt. But since you mean the RoF that a user is able to achieve, it's really dependent on one thing-- the user. I personally had a hard time moving from a Model 98 trigger to a 'mag trigger. At first it seemed stiff and just plain different. Once I got used to it, I found the shorter but maybe a slightly heavier trigger (trigger spring mods are VERY easy on m98's, any user who would be new enough to the sport to not know this would also shortstroke a mag for sure, giving him some probs) was easier to rip on AFTER SOME TIME. It's completely user preference, just like Cocker vs. Mag trigger.

As far as maitenance goes, they are equal in my book. My Tippmann seemed to hold up better than my minimag, but the minimag was easier to care for and disassemble.

For valve systems... give me a break. Of course a regulated precision system like the Classic valve is going to be more consistent than a spring loaded blowback using unreg'd gas sources.

Just like the trigger, it's all preference. Making fun of someone's gun because it costs less is completely uncalled for. You know how it feels being a 'mag owner because 'mags take some heat sometimes, so don't sink to the level of others. Both are great markers for one reason: they perform well for who they are designed for and are backed up by great companies and quality componants.

Now this is a great post. You should post more often.

Anyway, I have always wondered if Mags have the same rep as Tippmans. Tippmans are built like tanks and reliable, but thats all that Ive heard about them. Not much after that, especially some of the upgrades that ppl are spouting out here in the thread. Are mags perceived as good reliable and sturdy guns and thats it? I know LX and X-mags have brought some into the present day, but not all. Oh well, just curious.

[NeilS300]

Originally posted by Ejp414
Over the past year or so I have lurked in these forums reading info and interesting threads, but rarely posting. The reason I have continued to read the new topics here every morning is simple, the posts are usually intelligent and as unbiased as you can get for an owner's group forum.

This, though, is pathetic. It's actually kind of ironic to see how you point out a thread to make fun of a forum's stupidity and this is what comes out. This is starting to sound exactly like pbnation or a similar kind of place.

Tippmann Model 98 (custom, we'll just assume, since that is what is being sold nowadays) vs. a stock non-RT mag with no upgrades... As far as RoF goes, it's really not a plain fact as to which shoots faster. If you mean the marker's capable cps, then mag wins without a doubt. But since you mean the RoF that a user is able to achieve, it's really dependent on one thing-- the user. I personally had a hard time moving from a Model 98 trigger to a 'mag trigger. At first it seemed stiff and just plain different. Once I got used to it, I found the shorter but maybe a slightly heavier trigger (trigger spring mods are VERY easy on m98's, any user who would be new enough to the sport to not know this would also shortstroke a mag for sure, giving him some probs) was easier to rip on AFTER SOME TIME. It's completely user preference, just like Cocker vs. Mag trigger.

As far as maitenance goes, they are equal in my book. My Tippmann seemed to hold up better than my minimag, but the minimag was easier to care for and disassemble.

For valve systems... give me a break. Of course a regulated precision system like the Classic valve is going to be more consistent than a spring loaded blowback using unreg'd gas sources.

Just like the trigger, it's all preference. Making fun of someone's gun because it costs less is completely uncalled for. You know how it feels being a 'mag owner because 'mags take some heat sometimes, so don't sink to the level of others. Both are great markers for one reason: they perform well for who they are designed for and are backed up by great companies and quality componants.

haha I know that guy!!!

[-=Squid=-]

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/forumfun/misc8.jpg

[Nick O time]

the bottom line is that this thread is pretty dang old.

[Nick O time]

well hmmmm.... i think my point was a little self explanitory.

if you want me to be more specific:
THIS THREAD IS REALLY OLD. look at the date on the first post and you will know.

[Jack & Coke]

what difference does it make if the thread is really old?

If someone wished to discuss a particular subject, would you rather have it fragmented into multiple (duplicate) threads, or consolidated into one thread?

Comments like, "this thread is old", is discouraging in tone to someone who wanted to post about the subject, and will eventually lead to comments like, "Do a search!".

[Automaggot68]

Originally posted by Lopy-slopy
Some of them are idiots. Mags are better than tippy's plain ans simple. One guy said that tippy's are good beause team timppman effect uses them. That makes no scence. They have to use them no matter how bad they are becuase tippman sponsors them. Most of their guns are upgraded so much, ie ebolt, RT, HPA conversion(in other words made into like $2000 guns) and they use A5's mostly. I know there are some teams that don't use their sponsors guns, but I can't see why the company still pays them. Probably just to have them ware their jerseys. It's just a matter of pride. People love their guns and think theirs is the best. their are talon owners groups and they think that they have great markers! LOL.


First off, being in AO, you should already know the argument about how markers aren't better than each other, but for point of fact that it's the user that makes alot of the . Tippmann effect primarily uses Model 98's that I've seen, and heck, for reference order a catalog from Tippmann, it portrays they team in it, most of whom are using 98's. You dont need to convert the M98 to HPA, as it shoots just fine with a screw in preset, most of which the team uses. It doesn't make as big a difference as you might think. It isn't jsut a matter of pride. If it's a matter of pride, why not shoot that companys gun, WITH the adorning of the jersey? THAT doens't make 'scence'.
Of course people love their guns, and think they are the best marker in the world, THATS pride and confidence right there. Why would you go out on the field,and shoot a gun that you despised? (that's excluding the fact that people play for the sheer fun of it) So what if there's a Talon owner's group? I used to own a talon. Those things are if nothing else, really fun to just goof off with. Speaking of, have you ever visited the Talon owner's group site? They've done some really interesting (not to mention cool) things to their markers. "Lol" indeed. :D

[tonybhall]

I have owned both and I don't really think the two are in compitition with each other. They are aimed at two totally different markets within the paintball world.

The funny thing is, Mag owners and Tippmann owners are really a lot alike. Both chose their markers based on almost exactly the same criteria. The following statements could be said and apply to both. They are very reliable, easy to maintain, not overly flashy and tough as nails. Both are made my excellent companies and both offer great customer service.

Here is an observation that I have made. Let's see if anyone agrees. Tippmann and Kingman pretty much own the entry level market. Almost all of us got our start with one or the other. People who got their start with Tippmanns and liked them tend to be the people that upgrade to Mags because they have simular benefits. People who got their start with Spyders tend to upgrade to either a more expensive Spyder or one of the hundreds of clones or a cocker. Just a thought.

Anyway, my first marker was a 98C. I thought it was great. I played with it for about a year. I put some money in it and upgraded it a little but the conclusion that I came to was that no matter how much money I put into it, it was still an entry level marker. That's not a knock on Tippys, it's the trueth. They are the best entry level marker and dollar for dollar, maybe the best marker you can buy.

My second marker was a Classic Mag. Loved it. I was able to shoot it a little faster than my Tippy but that may be just me. It was however a lot more consistant than my Tippy. (no, this is not just an observation. I tested this over a chrono with HPA using the same tank.) It's a fact, the internal reg on the Mag makes it a more consistant marker. This is not even debatable.

My current marker is a RT Pro with X-Valve, ULT and level 10 with a Warp. I would never go back to a Tippy. But I would recommend them to anyone just getting started who was on a tight budget.

Sorry I was so long winded.
Bryan

[punkncat]

It seems like on every forum,about every type of marker,you see this such and such marker is better that the other because of whatever reason.
If I were to buy into the hype....I would currently own a Viking(its the best right now dontchaknow).That is of course after I sold the Timmy that I had cause it used to be the shizzy!Of course I can't forget Mad Propz for my Impy that shot ropes!

C'mon guys.We have all seen this written every which way it could.Every aspect of it has been gone over with a microscope.The simple fact of the matter is that the BEST marker is the one you like and perform with the best.