Didnt Agd Patent This????

[magman007]

yea i noticed some people speaking of infringing on agd's patent, but didnt agd patent this idea? ti fore a paintball marker using magnets and a hall effect sensor? heres the link.... found it over at intimidator-owners.com any ways... discuss http://www.intimidator-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=439

[Jonno06]

you have to be a member, can u copy paste or whatever? thanx

[magman007]

yea hold on, il post the most influencial posts

[magman007]

here we go


Here is the long awaited complete magnetic trigger kit for the Bob Long Intimidator. Included in this kit is a Hall Effect magnetic sensor with accompanying wiring, the necessary amount of magnets, and a five page detailed process (with step-by-step photos and documentation) for the installation. This will also work with other markers, but the instructions and photos included are just for the Intimidator. This is a very worthwhile mod.

This kit noticeably increased my rate of fire, and I absolutely love the unique feel of it. This used in conjunction with the WAS Equalizer board is a marvel to see. The photos in the instructions are of a Classic Intimidator, but a similar method is used to install this kit in a clamshell frame. Please specify if this kit will be used in a Classic or Clamshell frame when ordering. By using the existing setscrews in the trigger, you will be able to adjust the strength of the magnetic trigger return along with how far into the trigger pull before the magnetic switch activates.

Total time of installation: <30 minutes.

This entire kit is available now at a special introductory cost of $10.

Feel free to email me with any questions at
PaintballTech2003@Yahoo.com




Did you check to make sure you didn't step onto AGD's patent on Hall Effect Triggers? Its the one thing that kept me from selling the kit I did myself in its current form.

If you built your kit off of my information and my pictures on PBNation, then you are infringing on AGD's patent. I am currently changing my design to not infringe on their patent.









That would be from me

Check out the first posting in this thread, but I'll recap. It's a kit that has the necessary wiring, magnets (for both the clamshell and/or classic), and a detailed step-by-step procedure on how to do it. You will have to solder the three wires to the existing 14 point harness, then glue the included magnets to two of the setscrews (and one on the spring return post) and tweak! I'm still waiting on feedback on some prototype brackets, but the hall effect sensor unit screw in via the two screw holes where the stock microswitch was. The kit is still selling for only $10+shipping.

PaintballTech2003@yahoo.com




You still haven't answered CounterMeasure, i HIGHLY suggest u look into infringin on AGD's patents. and since you seem to ignore the issue of infringin on AGD's patents, it seems that you are irresponsible to yourself and others who will purchase the kit from you.





for waht he's selling it for, i highly doubt that AGD even cares or has heard of it. Plus the fact that AGD doesn't make a damn thing for anything other than automags. Why can't he produce a simple hall effect sensor for a timmy, which he's really not making money on (maybe $2-3 per set) and if he sells 100 sets, he has probably sold all he will and only made $300 tops. It's not the end of the world and it's not something that AGD would even bother with. With all they have on their plate right now, i think you'd have to flat out copy one of their products to get them to come after you.
What about the Zgrip? That's theirs, it's patented, people still make them for OTHER GUNS. And when i say people, i mean NOT AGD. They aren't getting sued. AGD doesn't want to make them becuase it's not a feasible project for them between cost, repairs, etc. All in all, I think the way Tom would look at it as flattery, someone likes his idea enough that he's trying to bring it to timmy users(and not get rich off of it).




and the last post by me


first off, z grip is pattented, agd just licences its right out to other users. any thing ahead of a 90* grip, is pattented by agd, and its a strong pattent, with little to no previous art to show the idea. I havnt seen any hand gun made with a z grip have you? nor any rifle, there fore agd holds the patent for the z.


Also, i think tom would be angry about this, and i let him know over on AO. it is stepping on his idea, and one of the main selling points of his marker. Personally, i think, if you want that trigger, why not go get an e-mag? i mean thats how it should be.

[Vendetta]

I'm not a lawyer, but I do have some experience with patents and copywrites. It is my understanding that if you have one, and do not try to enforce it, you can lose it.

[cledford]

Jim Drew at one point decided he was going to produce a HES based trigger system for the Timmy. This was in fact his first run in with the AO army. He claimed (even tho at the time the Emag had been out for over a year) that he had no idea that Tom had been the first to use a HES for a trigger system - he actually tried to take credit as the first guy to try bring the HES to paintball. I came here to ask if AGD had patented it and seem to recall that they had not - I COULD BE WRONG. Jim stopped his production for certain (although I'd bet if he got wind of this post he'd imediately state that he still plans of producing it - it's just on the back burner - like the corksrew, hee-hee...) Anyhow, maybe he stopped because AGD does have a patent - but I doubt it. I've looked at the AGD patents and don't remember seeing one for a HES based trigger. FWIW, the Impulse and Eblade have magnet based triggers - I'm not sure if they use a HES. Also FWIW, the navy did patent a HES based trigger system back in like the '60s or '70s - although not for PB guns :)

-Calvin

[steveg]

England mid 30's

[steveg]

A Hall effect sensor is just a switch, good for Tom
for figuring out that it would make a good trigger switch
for a paintball marker BUT it's still just a switch
you might as well try to patent the use of o-rings in a
marker

[raehl]

You can lose rights to a TRADEMARK if you fail to enforce it. Copyrighs and patents are yours for the duration regardless.

- Chris

[Vendetta]

Thanks for the info.

[cphilip]

Originally posted by steveg
A Hall effect sensor is just a switch, good for Tom
for figuring out that it would make a good trigger switch
for a paintball marker BUT it's still just a switch
you might as well try to patent the use of o-rings in a
marker


And so is the Break beam switch in the BE revy but they managed to patent that... :rolleyes:

[steveg]

First I wonder how long that patent would last if someone
actually challenged it

Second the electric trigger allready exists and has any number of switches in use,
of which a HES is just one of
(unlike the revy which was a whole new idea and concept)

Third and most important does AGD even have a patent:cool:

[Muzikman]

And so is the idea of an LCD display screen in the grip frame, but some how WDP got the patent on that;)

[steveg]

my hyperframe has an LCD

[Muzikman]

http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-bool.html&r=4&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=PG01&s1=LCD&s2=Paintball&OS=LCD+AND+Paintball&RS=LCD+AND+Paintball

[WARPED1]

Originally posted by steveg
A Hall effect sensor is just a switch, good for Tom
for figuring out that it would make a good trigger switch
for a paintball marker BUT it's still just a switch
you might as well try to patent the use of o-rings in a
marker SP would try tp patent Orings.............

[raehl]

You wouldn't patent a switch. You'd patent using a HES as the triggering device for a paintball marker. Not the same thing.

- Chris

[bornl33t]

that's all nice ang good, but what cracks me up is " a totally unique trigger feel" bah, Maggers are years ahead of the rest of you guys. we are L33t!

[cphilip]

Well thats just it Chris. The idea of a HES to control a trigger isn't new...just the Paintball application. Now we have seen that this is all it takes for someone to get a new patent but that is just plain rediculous realy. Just taking old technology and sticking Paintball in it somewhere should not a Patent make... In my opinion. But it seems it does...:rolleyes: :eek: :confused: :(

[raehl]

I ain't saying that's the way it should be, just the way it is. The US Patent system is ripe for some fixing (cough software patents cough).

But I digress.

- Chris

[magman007]

Well, id like to see toms response on this... maybe he will come in and let us know

[spydervenom]

probably if the way its setup is different then it can't be infringing. but i'm just guessin b/c i dunno.

AGD sure has pulled off some good patents...like any frame less than a 45...thats great.

[cphilip]

Originally posted by raehl
I ain't saying that's the way it should be, just the way it is. The US Patent system is ripe for some fixing (cough software patents cough).

But I digress.

- Chris


Yea Sorry I didn't mean to imply that you were Chris. I knew you weren't. I guess I was just voicing some of my frustration with this sort of thing. I mean this kind of frivilous patenting is not good for the whole of the paintball industry realy. If simple technology cannot be applied to all the things then it stiffles the whole progression. I just think its bad for the business.

[TNS2k2]

A Hall effect sensor is just a switch, good for Tom
for figuring out that it would make a good trigger switch
for a paintball marker BUT it's still just a switch
you might as well try to patent the use of o-rings in a
marker

well didnt WDP patent their IR trigger for their new mem6 boards? i believe they did, oh so i guess you can patent a switch for for firing a paintball marker...

[WARPED1]

Originally posted by spydervenom


AGD sure has pulled off some good patents...like any frame less than a 45...thats great. Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm, no. AGD wasn't even the first one to use 45.

[raehl]

Not a 45 grip frame, he means at an angle less than 45 degrees to the marker - although I believe he is incorrect, and the AGD patent actually covers any grip where the angle from the barrel to the grip is less than NINETY degrees.

I'm sure someone with a little more time on their hands will be happy to go find and reference the actual patent.

- Chris

[AGD]

Our patent is still processing through the patent office. Until it issues anyone can do anything they want.

AGD

[puckmaster]

what happens in this situation when it does go through?

[Lone Brain Cell]

Originally posted by Muzikman
And so is the idea of an LCD display screen in the grip frame, but some how WDP got the patent on that;)
The thing is, when someone releases an item and they state that this item has a patent that doesnt mean that that full item has a patent on it. it probably is only on 1 tiny part in that item. But you would have to wait until u could have a look in the patents office, and read the patent in question to figure out just which part has a patent. I garantee that just puting a patent on a grip frame wont get a patent. because a lcd & a gripframe have already been invented. just by puting those 2 togeather wont give ya anything & even if u do manage to miraculously "get one" it could be challenged big time.

[raehl]

You most certainly can patent putting together two things that have already been invented. You could patent a new variation on one thing that's already been invented.

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2Fsearch-bool.html&r=0&f=S&l=50&TERM1=golf+ball&FIELD1=TTL&co1=AND&TERM2=&FIELD2=&d=ptxt

1,962 patents JUST on golf balls.

- Chris

[nicad]

I patented a closed bolt spyder kit.. useing about 60% already made parts.

Tom, do yall have a patent pending #?

[askman]

Once you file for a patent, you can put a patent pending on the item. This give some protection for limited time (I believe 2 years, but need to look it up) this establishe an official invention date. It cost a lot of money to file for a patent, so it better be worth its while. Just about anything can be patent, but if it can be proven to have prior claim, ti can just as easily be annulled. New application of old idea can be patentable. The trick to writing a patent is to write it broad enough to cover a lot without being too broad. It is easy to get it annulled if it is too general(because it is easy to prove prior claim) write it fairly specifically, but broad enough to cover your industry and keep the competition from using it.

I am not a patent lawyer, but I stayed at holiday inn express last night. ;) so don't quote me.

I do have patent application in on something I did at work, so I do have some experience with it.

[TheBigRaguPB4L]

Originally posted by askman


I am not a patent lawyer, but I stayed at holiday inn express last night. ;) so don't quote me.




HAHAHAHHAHAAHHAHA, oh my side.