Matrix LCD/all matrices

[minimag187]

How efficient on air are the latest matrices with a bolt kit? I am considering getting one.

[darklord]

which kind of bolt kit? No other mods? with what kind of tank?

[No sKiLLz]

Not that bad, but not that great. If you get a trix, get the Leethal mod for the bolt/back plug. It's supposed to increase efficiency, but I don't have it yet. Maybe darklord can help with that. If you're going to get a trix, I suggest the NYXtreme. It comes with dipswitch for anti bolt stick, an ACE, and some kickin milling. I have #16 and I may never go back. www.nyxtremematrix.com (http://www.nyxtremematrix.com)

[darklord]

Well an image/TMC/aardvark bolt kit will get you over 1,000 shots I think off of a 68/4500, no other mods. The Leethal mod may increase efficiency (not sure), but I know for a fact that it allows you to dip further into your tank (some ppl running preset tanks w/ inline regs can't shoot their gun after the tank psi reaches 500 or so), down to like 100-0 psi.

However there is a Freeflow bolt out now (made by the same guys who make FF cockers and matrixes :D) that gets 2,000 or so shots off of a 68/4500. Top hat mods will increase efficiency as well (these include the ghetto tape mod, shocktech delrin sleeve, Evolve top hat, kapp adjustable, etc.), but will require a slightly higher input pressure than normal. Leethal is making his own bolt as well, supposedly getting 1,800 or so off of a 68/3000, but it hasn't been released yet.

Keep in mind most of these tests are done with LPRs on the matrix. If you don't have one, get one. It allows you to turn down the pressure of the bolt, and if you set it right, you can pinch paint.

And if you didn't know, almost all Matrixes sold these days come with bolt kits and LPRs (LCDs come stock, the TMC matrix has bolt kit and LPR)... and if you have a high budget, and want an awesome marker out of the box, get a Freeflow (aka Trauma) Matrix. Free upgrades, meaning, you get a free ACE, freeflow bolt, etc. The NYX is a good marker too, the only matrix available right now with an ACE, but if you want any upgrades for it, you're paying for them out of your pocket.

[No sKiLLz]

Freeflow (aka Trauma) Matrix. Free upgrades, meaning, you get a free ACE, freeflow bolt, etc. The NYX is a good marker too, the only matrix available right now with an ACE,

The Trauma does, or does not come with ACE?

And also, since I'm new with the whole trix thing (I selected the NYX because of the eye and ABS vs. getting the Kapp, Tequila, or Iron Men) what upgrades work and what upgrades are a waste? In all honesty, I wasn't sure the Trix could fire any better than it does now. :D

[oneshot]

Traumas don't come with aces, yet,

they are still working on them, but when Ethan is done , if you have a FF trix it will be a free upgrade.

[Rmarks]

www.matrixowner.com

there is a lot of good info on the site.

[darklord]

Originally posted by Rmarks
www.matrixowner.com

there is a lot of good info on the site. Well played, that is an awesome site for Matrix info.

Worthy upgrades (currently available) IMO include: a good inline reg (or good tank reg if you're running a gas-thru), good LPR, any bolt kit, leethal mod, oracle or g-force bolt stop, and the freeflow bolt. I'd add on an Evolve 90º frame too, but that's just preference (if you like the .45 style frame go with Aardvark).

As for good inline regs, the AKA sidewinder is the undisputable champion.

As for a good LPR, they are pretty much all the same, although AKA is making one soon (called the soda can), which looks awesome.

Bolt kits.... most are the same. However Leethal is making a bolt kit that seems to be worth waiting for. Aardvark has a 2nd bolt in the works as well, with good efficiency. Freeflow already has a bolt out, but you need an existing bolt kit for it to work. Evolve also has a bolt kit, but again you need an existing bolt kit for it to work (it replaces a lot of parts like the top hat, front wall, beercan, back wall and plug...).

Upgrades that are purely cosmetic and are highly based on preference, I'd say would be triggers, snatch grips, breeches (for the most part), breech knobs, backplates, ASAs...well, you get the picture.


And yes the Trauma currently does NOT have an ACE, but you get it for free when it is released, same with any other FF part, like the bolt. Don't get me wrong, I love the NYX. It's just that if you want any upgrades (leethal bolt kit, clamping feedneck, aftermarket frame, bolt parts, inline reg) you're paying for them yourself. To me the only thing worthy on the NYX is the custom board+ACE, and the milling. They don't come with Works regs or works feednecks, or dye ultralights. If I had an NYX, I'd definitely have: leethal mod, oracle, evolve 90º frame, sidewinder, and a works/ccm no-rise. I'd be waiting for the leethal bolt and soda can :D. But that's just me.

[No sKiLLz]

I have been sifting through stuff on Matrixowner but I'm having trouble narrowing things down. I don't want to have to go through the crappy process I went through with my mag and cocker of buying stuff just to see if it works (Anus (ANS) Phase II was the biggest waste of $$$ for my mag).

I am very pleased with the NYX, but ignorance is bliss. I don't know how to make it shoot better so I appreciate all the suggestions. I like the idea of a 90' frame, but will NYX's custom board fit in the grip? And also, where can I get a 15' asa?

[minimag187]

Im looking towards getting one of the cheaper matrices, such as the LCD Matrix. Is there really anything better on the Trauma Matrix compared to the LCD? What are some other good matrices that cost lower than $1000.

[minimag187]

Oh BTW should I wait for the new shocker (Coming this month June 30th) or get a matrix LCD.

[beefstew]

ok well i have a few matrices right now and..

No-Skillz- Thematrixcenter.com has 15* asa's as well as lots of other cool upgrades.

minimag-If you care more about preformance, i would look at a TMC (the matrix center) edition matrix. Comes with all of the Nessisary upgrades like the LPR, bolt kit and costs less than buying a stock LED and all the parts. That is also at thematrixcenter.com

Phil

[minimag187]

So on average how many fills do you get a day, and how much paint do you use? How much more efficient do you think my ir3 is?

[yeahthatsme]

my suggestion: get a TMC led or a stock lcd matrix and put a freeflow bolt in it. people that properly set up their freeflow bolts are getting around 2000 shots off of a 68/4500. i'm shootin a matrix with a newly aquired freeflow bolt(will be testing this weekend, i'll post results) its a great set up! the matrix absolutely rips and with the right settings its amazingly consistant(+ - 1) not to mention fast, i'm hittin 13bps with ease! i love my matrix, wouldnt take anything else.

[darklord]

Originally posted by minimag187
Im looking towards getting one of the cheaper matrices, such as the LCD Matrix. Is there really anything better on the Trauma Matrix compared to the LCD? What are some other good matrices that cost lower than $1000. The trauma has a magnetic frame and the freeflow bolt as of now, later you can get the ACE.

And No Skillz- if the NYX board can fit any frame without modification, then yes, the 90º evolve frame will fit without a problem.

Minimag187-DO NOT bother with the new shocker. Smart Parts has had a few follies in the past regarding first-time products, and it is basically a wannabe e-mag (open bolt blow forward). Get a matrix, you won't be disappointed. As for matrixes under $1,000, all I can think of is the TMC edition matrix (LED with bolt kit and LPR) or an LCD.

[minimag187]

Im thinking between an LCD Matrix $999 or a TMC Matrix $845, which is better for the money? The LCD Matrix has something called Anti Bolt Stick software, is it worth paying around $145 for ABS and the LCD? Also, is the efficiency from the bolt kit coming with either of them good?

[darklord]

Originally posted by minimag187
Im thinking between an LCD Matrix $999 or a TMC Matrix $845, which is better for the money? The LCD Matrix has something called Anti Bolt Stick software, is it worth paying around $145 for ABS and the LCD? Also, is the efficiency from the bolt kit coming with either of them good? Don't bother with the LCD, go with the TMC. Both bolt kits are the TMC/Image kits, so they are identical. The efficiency isn't the best available to date, but it's pretty good. You can get ABS installed on the TMC too.

[minimag187]

Or I can pay $50 more ($895) and get a demon matrix, which is the same as the TMC except it has some cool milling and im guessing a better resale value, so should I get that? The only problem im encountering is the demon doesnt say if it comes with the gun20 chip.

[darklord]

Originally posted by minimag187
Or I can pay $50 more ($895) and get a demon matrix, which is the same as the TMC except it has some cool milling and im guessing a better resale value, so should I get that? The only problem im encountering is the demon doesnt say if it comes with the gun20 chip. Comes with a BL torpedo, too, that's a damn good deal. Go with the Demon gun. The gun 20chip if u don't have it u can buy seperately at TMC (http://www.thematrixcenter.com/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=30&idproduct=176), but all bolt kits come with a chip of some sort. When I 1st opened up the grip panels on my LED I was like "wtf, no gun20?" But I found out it was the aardvark chip, basically the same thing.

[bunkermaster10]

I have shot a few matrixs. And WOW those things can really rip! I swear they have no kick at all. I have no bad comments about this gun. Its also pretty lite.

[nippinout]

Originally posted by darklord
Leethal is making his own bolt as well, supposedly getting 1,800 or so off of a 68/3000, but it hasn't been released yet.

The AKALMP Vikings get 1000 off of a 68/3000. And these are pretty damn efficient. AKALMP makes some of the best stuff efficiency-wise.

I doubt the Matrix can get that much efficiency.

A 68ci 3000psi tank has 204,000 in-lb of energy.

A 3gram paintball going 300fps has 111.00526 in-lb of energy.

If there is 100% efficiency, the tank could fire 1837 paintballs at full velocity. That's about 97.9% efficiency out of that Matrix. Sure is one hell of a magic bolt. :)

Check my math please.

Math:
3gram = .003kg
300ft = 91.44m

Paintball kinetic energy:
= .5 * (.003kg) * (91.44m/s)^2
= 12.5419104J
= 111.00526in-lb

Tank potential energy:
= 68in^3 * 3000lb/(in^2)
= 204,000in-lb

Max paintballs at 100% efficiency:
=(204,000in-lb)/[(111.00526in-lb)/(paintball)]
=1837.7507516

BTW, I dislike sig-figs. I keep all the decmials I can. :D

You'll notice that on the paintball energy I went from english to metric to english. I didn't want to bother with converting (lb-ft^2)/(s^2) to in-lb. I'm backwards like that. www.onlineconversion.com is my friend.

[steveg]

While I'm cynical about the FF bolt (as well as others)
claims of amazing shot counts, It would be wrong to assume
that AKA has hit the maximum shot wall.
(not that I think that IS what you are implying :))

It's unfortunate that the Matrix was inflicted with an
avoidable and completely undeserved reputation as a gashog

According to Greg Duncan (Aardvark), he had advised (Then)
AirTech of the bolt design flaw and how to correct it
(the "bolt kit" ) before the matrix was even produced.

It will be interesting to see were Matrix efficiency does end up

[nippinout]

Oh no way AKALMP has hit the wall of efficiency.

Among out-of-the-box straight-from-the-factory guns are concerenced, AKALMP does one of the best jobs of efficiency.

But a finely tuned cocker is just as efficient.

The claims for these bolts is enormous.

The Viking and Excalibur get around 55% efficiency. 98% is pushing straight out lies.

My RT Pro gets a max of around 38% efficiency. Considered mid-range in efficiency, I think it's poopy.

The fact that the bolts have these extravagant claims is hurting more than they are helping the Matrix's reputation as a gas hog. It would be nice if they came stock with a better bolt kit.

[minimag187]

Im probably going for a Demon Matrix, and getting the leethal mods to add on to the image bolt kit. BTW You can put your finger in the breech with no problems right?

[Toxic Dave]

We are getting roughly 1100-1200 shot from a 68/ 4500 psi tank on a LCD. The LCD board offers a bunch more features that the LED doesn't, most importantly more accurate bolt timing(thus better efficency)

dave/ generation-e sports

[minimag187]

Now im thinking about a Freeflow Matrix, they said the batch is coming out this month so it looks like ill be getting one. Magnetic double or Regular Double trigger?

[minimag187]

?

[yeahthatsme]

i'd say regular, but its really preference! i'd suggest going regular frame and if you want you can always switch to a magnetic later.


as for efficiency on the matrixes, i'll be testing the freeflow bolt this weekend.


the freeflow is a great choice! its a great marker out of the box, and freeflow will send you all upgrades that they develop for free! that means that you'll get the ACE for free! i say go freeflow!

[Rmarks]

Originally posted by yeahthatsme
as for efficiency on the matrixes, i'll be testing the freeflow bolt this weekend.

hurry up already!



the freeflow is a great choice! its a great marker out of the box, and freeflow will send you all upgrades that they develop for free! that means that you'll get the ACE for free! i say go freeflow!

If you bought a Freeflow LED from them you have to pay for the ACE and new board. Otherwise, the LCD guys get all the free upgrades.

[darklord]

Nippinout, that was an error on my behalf. Lee himself says "Finally,we got the bolt into testing phase,this is the first shot count test wev'e done. The setup is, stock lcd set at 22 bps,stock barrel,low grade paint with loose bore match,(we like to test under average to low conditions)gun set at 290 fps,LPR output psi at 75 psi. Using a 68/3000 preset, we got 1025 shots,no blow back and no broken balls", straight from http://forums.matrixowner.com/viewtopic.php?t=400&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 . My bad :o Still 1025 is pretty damn good for a 68/3k.... that's almost what I get off of my 88/45 currently!

[minimag187]

The waiting time to get a freeflow trix is 4-6 weeks, should I sell my ir3+2k3 evolution for one of these babes? Im sure its worth the wait. I will be ordering one tomorrow most likely. Do they come with a matching freak tip?

[No sKiLLz]

Well, someone chastise me if I'm wrong here, but it seems to me that freeflow concentrates on air while NYX was tinkering with the electronics. I would think with the new Leethal bolt coming out soon, I would lean more towards the NYX than the freeflow, because (silly me) Lee, I think, knows more about the Matrix than the Free Flow guyz (He's one of three patent holders on the Trix). NYX did a great job with the eye and board which are both faster than any of us could ever use, but I didn't see anything about Free Flow putting out any custom chips or boards. If I were to choose good electronics over good air efficiency, I would go with the one that's harder to upgrade; electronics. Just my opinion, maybe I'm wrong.:confused:

[WiseGuyMag]

This is Minimag187, I am trying to post on it buy I cant. It says I am not valid and asks me if I am trying to edit someones post when I click on Post Reply. Anyways I just ordered my Black/Red Acid Wash Trauma LCD Freeflow Matrix, :cool: :D :D Im getting a centerflag reg with it, mainly because I dont see the point to pay $20 more for a Sidewinder unless you think its worth it.

[darklord]

If it's only $20 more for a sidewinder, do it. They are by far the best reg for a matrix....consistant as all hell. Make sure it is a centerflag though, not the clone, cause the clone sucks, and isn't consistant at all! No Skillz, good point on teh NYX, but FF is also giving you an eye, and with a gun20 chip, I sincerely doubt you're going to be shooting over 20bps. And unless teh NYX board has a memory or something, I doubt it allows you to shoot faster.

[WiseGuyMag]

K just changed my order and got a matching sidewinder with it instead of a centerflag.

[oneshot]

get the sidewinder, no ff don't come with a matching freak tip .

FF did not need to invent any new boards because the boards out are working just fine, they will have there own board or a wicked board for there eye when it comes out.

[No sKiLLz]

K, maybe these guyz r biased, but...

http://forums.matrixowner.com/viewtopic.php?p=11403#11403

[DutchNut]

jsut by a trix a TOXIC BABY they own but the trix has got the be the most accurate gun i have ever shot

this is the gun u should get...

[DutchNut]

1

[DutchNut]

2

[DutchNut]

3

[Grey_Goose]

Love these guns, just picked up an LED w/ a bolt kit for $450 :D

[yeahthatsme]

congrats on the purchase!


and the FF, imo, is the better of the 2, the only reason the NYX has custom electronics is for the eye, the freeflow will have custom electronics too when they finish their ACE. not to mention freeflow gives all its upgrades free to FF matrix owners. they, if i remember correctly, will be coming out with an optical trigger switch(like the ir3's) soon. and others. the FF is by far the best choice!

[WiseGuyMag]

Yes I am very excited and anxious to recieve it, in one month for the June batch. BTW I got a full freak annoed to match it :D :D

[Curly]

Originally posted by WiseGuyMag
This is Minimag187, I am trying to post on it buy I cant. It says I am not valid and asks me if I am trying to edit someones post when I click on Post Reply. Anyways I just ordered my Black/Red Acid Wash Trauma LCD Freeflow Matrix, :cool: :D :D Im getting a centerflag reg with it, mainly because I dont see the point to pay $20 more for a Sidewinder unless you think its worth it.

dude... I just ordered a black/red acid wash trauma today too. They told me it should ship monday. And 20 dollars for a sidewinder is an awesome deal. :D

[minimag187]

They told me I had to wait a month....are you sure you heard them correctly? Did you have to put down a $500 downpayment? Anyways congrats on the Trauma as well :D :D

[minimag187]

Oh btw, did you get a freak barrel annoed to match, I did and that may be why I have to wait a month.

[Curly]

Nah... I just bought one that they had in stock. They had like 5 in stock when I called yesterday.

[minimag187]

What time did you call eastern time? I called around 11-12

[minimag187]

So should I call them up and ask? What did your order consist of? I need it sooner than a month.

[Curly]

Just ask them what trauma matrixes they have in stock. I called about 6pm eastern time yesterday.

[minimag187]

K they said my red/black would ship on monday.

[cockermatt]

I ordered my Trauma Matrix on Tuesday, and I got it yesterday(Thursday). I got the last one they had in stock on Tuesday, and I called at 11:01 am. :) Dust black baby!

[minimag187]

Let me see a pic =) Where do you live and do they charge the extra money after they ship it if you did a downpayment of $500? What kind of shipping do they send it, and do they call you when they ship it?

[cockermatt]

I would have had pics yesterday, but I left the cam in the car from last weekend, and my mom decided to drive it today and yesterday. I will have pics of it later tonight.
I live in Virginia. They charged me about $7-8 for shipping, those were the only extra charges. It was $1199 for the gun. They use UPS ground. I did not have to put a down payment down. I paid in full on Tuesday when I ordered it. They did not call me. I called the next day and got a tracking number. If you call and ask for a tracking number they will give it to you.

[No sKiLLz]

What am I missing here? Has anyone here even picked up the NYX? I admittedly haven't picked up the Trauma, but I posted a link to some people who have, and they seem to consider it a back-up marker. Well, whatever. I'm sure the NYX guyz will be switching to Trauma trixes in the next few months.:rolleyes:

[Toxic Dave]

Why would NYX switch to Freeflow guns?? There is no logic whatsoever in that statement. NYX is using NYX Matrix's and are quite happy. As for people not getting the NYX guns, we've assembled and shipped a whole bunch of guns to the team, whatever they do with them from there isn't up to us, they could just be hoarding them.

dave/ generation-e

[No sKiLLz]

Hey Toxic Dave. I was being sarcastic about NYX switching to FF, that's why I put the :rolleyes: face next to that statement. I have an NYX and I wouldn't trade it for a Ferrari at this point cuz I think the NYX is faster. I was just wondering why all these people were hell bent on Free Flow. I think there IS a big difference in the board and electronics, otherwise NYX wouldn't have changed it. As far as the FF internals go, Leethal is coming out with his own bolt pretty soon. If I were to choose between a FF bolt and a bolt made by one of three patent holders on the Trix...

But Dave, while your here, I had a concern. The selenoid on the NYX is a standard Gen-E one, right? If I were to burn it out and need a replacement, who should I call and how long would it take to get one?

[minimag187]

What is the NYX board set to? I thought they all had 20 bps and the freeflow will soon have an eye also, so the nyx board doesnt seem any better.... Also do NYXs have lifetime warrantys, I assume they do. They cost $100-$200 more.

[darklord]

Originally posted by minimag187
What is the NYX board set to? I thought they all had 20 bps and the freeflow will soon have an eye also, so the nyx board doesnt seem any better.... Also do NYXs have lifetime warrantys, I assume they do. They cost $100-$200 more. The board is capped at like 23-25 I think, not a significant difference...

[cockermatt]

My Trauma.

[cockermatt]

More

[cockermatt]

2 more

[cockermatt]

Last one.

[FeelTheRT]

he just bought it a few days ago... lookin good

[minimag187]

eye candy.

[yeahthatsme]

they had to change the board to accomadate the eye, they didnt change it to make it "better". the FF's board will change soon as well, when their ACE comes out.

[cockermatt]

Baltimore

[cockermatt]

j

[minimag187]

So do Halo B's have any problems on Matrixes like Angels? Im probably going to get a black one. Anywhere that has a BLack Halo B instock?

[minimag187]

BTW thanks for the pics cockermatt.

[yeahthatsme]

my halo b was great on my trix.

[minimag187]

Is there any good videos of the trix shooting other than the diablo one or the nyx one?

[cockermatt]

minimag187 when you get yours...Let me know if you have the x on the side of yours like I do. Every other FF I ahev seen only has one bar on the side. Let me know if yours says Baltimore on the top too. Mine is the only one Ihave seen like it. With the x and Baltimore.

And actually I can make a video tomorrow sometime. I don't have a place to host it though, so if you were to catch me on AIM tomorrow I could hook you up with it. :)

[Toxic Dave]

The rate of fire on Matrix boards isn't capped at all. Theoretically the board will cycle at 1ms forward and back, giving you like 500 balls per second, obviously the bolt will not cycle that fast, we estimate that the gun will fully cycle With paint feeding at 44 bps. Of course we can't feed a gun that fast to find out the real #, but the 25-28 bps that people are getting in game situations is fast enough to make us happy.

The solenoid/ 4way is the same one we use in all of our markers. Contact us if you ever burn yours out.

dave/ gen-e

[JEDI]

So do most Custom Matrix People plan on having their guns fitted with eyes by the IAO... And ready for sale?

[Toxic Dave]

We're shooting for Am Open, for them to be displayed, etc. We're not sure what the plan is yet. We should have final prototypes here early next week, and we'll see what happens after that.

Dave/ gen-e/ toxic

[No sKiLLz]

The solenoid/ 4way is the same one we use in all of our markers. Contact us if you ever burn yours out.

Thanks Dave. BTW, do you cover the selenoid under a Gen-E warranty? Curious because NYX has a special board so I was wondering if there might be a conflict there in case the noid burns out.

[mykroft]

get the lowrise if you are going to run a halo.

Halo B + Matrix is a match made in heaven, with a properly set up stock trigger, the things just rip.

[Toxic Dave]

The Entire NYX gun as well as the Ironmen, Free-Flow and Toxic Matrix's are covered by the Gen-E Warantee. All of the parts used in these guns are of our origin, or are approved by us to be used, and we do the assembly on all of them, thus we take a great deal of responsibilty if there is an issue. Keep an eye out for the Ironmen Matrix, there are pictures floating around the 'net and they came out really nice.

dave/ gen-e/ toxic

[No sKiLLz]

Thanks again, Dave. I think it'z very cool of Gen-E to stand behind aftermarket upgrades like that.

I know some people talking about the Halo with the Trix. If you feed the Matrix with anything BUT a Halo, you are doing it an injustice. And also, Odyssey, who makes the Halo, is an awesome company. I burned out motors on my halo, and my friends halo. Totally my fault for using black shelled paint, and they fixed it for me at no cost. Try a rip drive to.

[minimag187]

Ok I am canceling it, now they are saying I have to wait a month and a half, and by that time summer will be almost over, I am now thinking about waiting until october or so when they release the mini-freeflow matrix or just buying a 03 shocker. That really frustrated me. So do Toxics have lifetime warranties, and how available are they?

[Toxic Dave]

We have a handful of Toxic Matrix's in stock, check out toxicperformance.com for pix. All of our markers are covered by a lifetime warantee.

dave/ toxic/ gen-e

[minimag187]

Do those come with a matching freak? BTW What kind of lifetime warranty do you have on them?

[Toxic Dave]

Yes to the matching Freaks and Lifetime, meaning if something breaks, we'll fix it for free unless the gun is third hand used and it's something obiously user-fault. Like jamming a big stick down the feed and firing the gun. Or just something rediculous, and even then we take care of the person for the most part, you either have have done something insane to your gun or be a complete jerk to the tech to get charged for a repair around here.

Dave/ Gen-E/ Toxic

[minimag187]

Nm, they Ethan left a message and told me it was shipping tuesday, he said there was just some confusion if they had any freeflow bolt kits left.

[No sKiLLz]

Das ist meine uber Matrix...(only pictures I have right now:o )

http://www.rob2k.com/pics/paintball/peter5.jpg

[cockermatt]

Maybe if it didnt have the huge drop. :rolleyes:

[No sKiLLz]

Some people like to play tight. There's no recoil on the NYX so I don't need leverage to stabilize it, but in a pinch, I can press right up against the bunker instead of getting my pack or my a$$ shot off.

[cockermatt]

Newest pic...