Tom.. You need to save the paintball industry! Your our only hope!!

[Digits]

Tom.. I'm seriouse, go out and patent air tanks.. Either all air tanks or just ones with regulaters like yours, and sue smartparts for a very large sum of money.. PUT THEM OUT OF BUISNESS.. I've started to take a liking to B2K3's and Indian Creek, and it hurts me to see paintball dieing like this because of some greety arshholes that don't think about the industry as a whole, and only think about themselves..

Save us in one way or another :(.. Your our only hope..

God I wish I was friends with Bill Gates.. Then he could buy smart parts and crush them :(.



Thanks for reading.. Don't mock me to much, lol.. I'm just overwhelmingly frustrated.

[Will Wood]

.. Um ok.

So you want Tom do to what SP is doing basically? Getting a patent on something so no one else can use something common?
Am I right?

.. It's different situations, but look at it from the other side.

[Star_Base_CGI]

Tom has stated and I think its a good opinion.

That he doesnt want to do that.

He said thet he feels like if he runs and honest buisiness that will bless AGD. In the end Smart Parts will get what they deserve.

Ive always tried to live my life by the golden rule. DO onto others.

Its not do onto others before others do onto you.

[AGD]

Well unfortunately that is not possible. Once you introduce products into the market you only have one year to apply for the patent. Back in the day it was just me and Budd and we were friends. At that time it didn't seem like something we should have done.

FYI you can not sell a product in two pieces to get around a patent (like sell the grip frame separate from the gun).

Once a patent is issued the government does not back up and undo it because of mistakes etc.

These are a few of the things everyone seems to be confused about.

AGD

[Digits]

The only person he'd even have to inforce the patent on would be smart parts..

And even if they do get what they deserve.. What happens when ICD goes out of buisness? It's not like they'll just bounce back because smart parts is finally done with there cap..

And whos to say SP wont come after AGD.. I'd say atleast patent the tanks and keep it on the downlow.. Then if smartparts tries to pull a biotch move, you can retaliate.

I dunno, I just think it's stupid to sit back and watch companies deteriorate.

[Crimson_Turkey]

"And man turned to pig and pig to man"

George Orwell, Animal Farm


Let not Tom sink to thier level. He could have patented the air tank or the powerfeed long before, yet he didn't because the sport is bigger than his wallet. An eye for an eye just leaves two people half-blind.

He can't legally patent the air tank now. It has been in public for more than a year. I belive this is the chink in Smart Part's armor.

[Digits]

*READ POST BY AGD*

Damnit.. .. GRRR.. I HATE SMART PARTS.. I hate this.. How in the hell can they do that.. The judge/people that passed this patent need to be taken into my basement and tortured..

And what if you released another version of the product? Still not possible?

[Digits]

baah.. Screw it.. I just think that companies should start to patent things they come out with now.. They don't have to enforce the patent, but if things like this happen again, they can help prevent it.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

all i know is if smartparts loses this case, they are going to be screwed because very few people are ever going to buy from them again. But if they win then who knows

[CrazyLad]

Do you see all these anti smart parts signs???Well it would be exactly the same except with AGD if tom did that...

[Digits]

Originally posted by MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata
all i know is if smartparts loses this case, they are going to be screwed because very few people are ever going to buy from them again. But if they win then who knows

If they loose the case I wont wank of for a month.. lol.. MARK MY WORD.. Thats how bad I want these idiots at sp to pay..

BURN I HOPE THEY BURN

[Digits]

Originally posted by Ascreennam3
Do you see all these anti smart parts signs???Well it would be exactly the same except with AGD if tom did that...

But you don't get it.. Do you know how many people want Smart Parts gone? If AGD did that so what.. AGD's not a greedy company and wouldn't use the patent on other companies like SP is. They wouldn't use it just to make some dough, it would be there back door.. Just incase SP tries anything stupid..

They could just ignore the patent with other companies, but with SP they could use it to retaliate..

Hell I dunno.. I probablly don't make much sense i'm just a little angry.. But still.. Mark my word.. I will NEVER EVER buy anything from Smart Parts.. Heh I was even thinking about getting a nice impy or a 2k3 shocker.. But no way now.

[adam shannon]

there is a viable option, unfortunately its not retroactive. i see most manufacturers from now on patenting every idea they come up with. to stop a patent from stifling the innovation of the PB community the patent holder could issue licenses to use the patented idea for $1 a year to honest companies and deny the use to direct competitors or companies who seek to damage the sport...unfortunately this should have been done years ago in the case of powerfeeds, hes's, magno triggers, and regulated hpa.

tom and bud (he never even patented the AC body) deserves all the credit in the world for being standup guys in the old days but unfortunately the winds have changed from guys who love the game and want to further it to guys who love money and want to dominate it.

look at the old days of computers...most of the stuff bill gates now owns is based on freeware ideas that people came up with and deliberately didnt patent so as to further computer use. i love capitalism as much as i love fornication and taco bell...but with it you get people who think like smart parts.

[LaW]

Originally posted by Digits


But you don't get it.. Do you know how many people want Smart Parts gone? If AGD did that so what.. AGD's not a greedy company and wouldn't use the patent on other companies like SP is. They wouldn't use it just to make some dough, it would be there back door.. Just incase SP tries anything stupid..

They could just ignore the patent with other companies, but with SP they could use it to retaliate..

Hell I dunno.. I probablly don't make much sense i'm just a little angry.. But still.. Mark my word.. I will NEVER EVER buy anything from Smart Parts.. Heh I was even thinking about getting a nice impy or a 2k3 shocker.. But no way now.

If agd did that, which we know they cant in the first place, I don't see how much different it would be
then what smartparts is doing. Its not like airgun is the god of all companies, we all know its a pretty good company in the industry. I don't really think you can say smartparts is a horrible company, if you had the position to make some money and save your company from going under you would do the same stuff.

How do you know agd wouldn't do that? I am not saying that AGD would do that but until the situation is presented to AGD you can't really say they would or would not even if the owner (tk) says they would not do it.

Ah well makes sense to me, is it a business decision we agree with? no.... for the most part most of us dont like what sp is doing at all. Just live with it :)

I am tired, i read my words and they sound jumbled :)

[Digits]

^^

(adam) thats exaclly what im thinking.. Good points

[bryceeden]

SP says they are only going after ICD and WDP, so while still bad it isn't that big of a deal. Here is the info strait from SP to my boss.

WPPL Members and Friends,
I just got off the phone with Bill Gardner, Sr. the president of Smart Parts. He was very open about the patent issue.
They are pursuding two specific manufacturers for patent violations ICD and now a part of the WDP design (Angels).
The patent is not as broad as is being reported.
Bill said most of the information in the quotes are GROSS exaggerationions !!! In fact Bill was with Bud Orr last week and there was no discussion of the nature that is attributed to Bud in the quotes. Bill doubts thier accuracy.
Bill also explained that Patent law is very complex and they are only trying to enforce some specific designs that they feel are express violations of thier Patents. They are not attacking the E-Marker industry. No one can say with accuracy how this will resolve, but for now it only involves two companies and even if they win the patent it will only force the companies to change thier designs.
I dont like to perpetuate mis information that is why I called Smart Parts Directly, to get real information. Smart Parts is preparing a Press Release regarding the patent issue, I will forward that information to anyone interested when it arrives.

[Bo-Bo]

I agree with Bryce. SP isn't really a big deal to most paintball industries. Although, I do like the burning idea :D

[Benfica4ever]

What sp is doing is just going to kill paintball. It will become even more expensive over time seeing as how they want 75 or somthin for each product that resembles theirs. i could be wrong so dont flame me for it.

[845]

These threads are getting old. If I keep seeing them I think I will buy a 2k3 Shocker just to be rebellious.

[Mega Man]

I also agree these threads are getting old. but since I havent expressed my feelings on the matter I'll do it here lol. Smart Parts is NOT going to kill paintball as we know it, if the patent is enforced and goes through with it is will effect us but not in a large of scale as you may think. The statement that Bryce made sounds to me, to be very true. Also I think all this anti-smartparts and I hate smart parts stuff is stupid. I dislike the action they are taking with the patent enforcment but besides that I like Smart Parts very much, infact they are one of my favorite companies. I've owned an Evolution, Max-Flo, an Impulse, and a Smart Parts jersey and find all their products to be great. Lol I remember when AO first caught wind of the new shocker and nerve and despite a few dislikers most of AO seemed to drool over them, now they are sporting Nazi Smart Parts and and smart parts logos in their sigs, making sites, clubs, and far to many threads about it all. Just my 2 cents.

[Automaggin2]

Originally posted by Digits
The only person he'd even have to inforce the patent on would be smart parts..

And even if they do get what they deserve.. What happens when ICD goes out of buisness? It's not like they'll just bounce back because smart parts is finally done with there cap..

And whos to say SP wont come after AGD.. I'd say atleast patent the tanks and keep it on the downlow.. Then if smartparts tries to pull a biotch move, you can retaliate.

I dunno, I just think it's stupid to sit back and watch companies deteriorate.


ICD and Smart Parts have hated each other for years. They have been in legal battles in the past. They have a history of it. It's not going to stop.

[Digits]

Why can't they all just get along :confused:

[madmatt151]

I too am sick of these threads, but haven't expressed my opinion either. ow can you people get mad for a company trying to enforce a patent it legally attained. They may nothave been the origianl electronic marker, but apparently were the first to patent it. This shows foresight and interest in something. As far as I am concerned, if any of the other companies who weremaking electro guns did not patent them or try to, they didn't have a serious interest. SMart parts didn't patent them last year, it did quite a while ago. This was truly when they had the major available electro marker out. It always struck me funny when I saw the NAgel come out and thethen slew of other electros. I always wondered if there was a patent or not. It is just not fair to make a product that is like someone elses, especially if there is a patent. Imagine if you will if someone made a mag clone. People here would be up in arms. You guys must take a chill pill, wait for oficial statements and court rulings and then see who is right, wrong and being unfair. Enforcing a legally attained patent is not wrong. These companies are in business to make money. That money they make finances them to further research and develop new ideas etc. Do you really think car amnufacturers and building better cars to "better the industry"?? No way, its to make money. My $.02, sorry.

[manike]

Originally posted by Crimson_Turkey
"And man turned to pig and pig to man"

George Orwell, Animal Farm

An excellent book. I see that happening in the UK right now :(


Originally posted by madmatt151
how can you people get mad for a company trying to enforce a patent it legally attained. ....... Enforcing a legally attained patent is not wrong.

I agree completely. I believe in the concept of the patent system and the rights to intellectual property, IF you were the first, and IF it was legally obtained.

I don't personally believe that was the case here.

If I thought it was the case I would be championing SP's side in this.

[Frontline Newbie]

You can't patent a tank, and chances are that smart parts patent won't pass either, and even if it did, there are always ways around patents. I hear about crazy patents and lawsuit that never pass all the time. Remember when ninendo tried to stop producton playstation 1 and 2 and all playstation games, and then move all playstation games over to gamecube by saying that it was somehow a "modified supernintendo"?

[gamarada717]

But hasn't the electronic switch been out for over a year?

[DiRTyBuNNy]

well..if Tom can't do anything...why don't we call Obi-Wan...he was Princess Leia's only hope too...

[adam shannon]

Originally posted by gamarada717
But hasn't the electronic switch been out for over a year?

yes, but they filed a patent years ago when the shocker/impulse was released and have just recently applied and been granted an extention to the patent to cover the switch. its the patent was of sneaking something in the back door. they have also been in court on the patent for years so everything was on file on time...its just now coming to court.

[MarkM]

Originally posted by madmatt151
I too am sick of these threads, but haven't expressed my opinion either. ow can you people get mad for a company trying to enforce a patent it legally attained. They may nothave been the origianl electronic marker, but apparently were the first to patent it. This shows foresight and interest in something. As far as I am concerned, if any of the other companies who weremaking electro guns did not patent them or try to, they didn't have a serious interest. SMart parts didn't patent them last year, it did quite a while ago. This was truly when they had the major available electro marker out. It always struck me funny when I saw the NAgel come out and thethen slew of other electros. I always wondered if there was a patent or not. It is just not fair to make a product that is like someone elses, especially if there is a patent. Imagine if you will if someone made a mag clone. People here would be up in arms. You guys must take a chill pill, wait for oficial statements and court rulings and then see who is right, wrong and being unfair. Enforcing a legally attained patent is not wrong. These companies are in business to make money. That money they make finances them to further research and develop new ideas etc. Do you really think car amnufacturers and building better cars to "better the industry"?? No way, its to make money. My $.02, sorry.


Mag Clones have already existed and from what I recall as long as a certain percentage of the design was different you were free and clear.
To other posts in this thread think now if what will happen IF all the companys start to patent everything...nothing will change other than the share of the pie (in retail terms for the product) thats all. If however the paintball companys DON'T patent the ideas they come up with, then individuals NOT connected with paintball will then patent those ideas and sit back and wait until there are lots of the product being made then they will nail them (paintball companys)and retire to the Bahamas...only an extension of the many get rich quick schemes available online...the other favourite being registering a domain name and then waiting for the original company to buy it off you, ok this is being over turned with alarming regularity now but a lot of people DID make money off the major companys when they had no "real" right to in the first place.

[Animal Mother]

Two wrongs don't make a right, it makes revenge.

Eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth.

[The Yellow Dart]

Everyone, all of AO and all of the paintball world are overreacting to this Smartparts patent issue. I looked at the patent and it is way to broad. There is no way that Smart Parts would ever win the trials against ICD or WDP. This is not a big deal.

[manike]

Originally posted by The Yellow Dart
Everyone, all of AO and all of the paintball world are overreacting to this Smartparts patent issue. I looked at the patent and it is way to broad. There is no way that Smart Parts would ever win the trials against ICD or WDP. This is not a big deal.

And your professional experience and knowledge in this field is?

I'd be interested in hearing your qualifications that allow you to make that judgement.

Hopefully you are the trial judge :D

[The Yellow Dart]

First of all Manike, sorry i forgot to mension my dad is a lawyer and a law professor, so therefore I think i do have knowledge on this issue. And second of all this is just an opinion not a judgement.

[shinobidice]

if you cant patent something after a year or whatever, how can sp change thier patent to make switches thiers?

[aaron_mag]

Originally posted by The Yellow Dart
First of all Manike, sorry i forgot to mension my dad is a lawyer and a law professor, so therefore I think i do have knowledge on this issue. And second of all this is just an opinion not a judgement.

Have your dad look it over and give an opinion. Personally I think you may be right but I'll readily admit I'm no legal expert. It would be interesting to see what he thinks (especially if he is removed from paintball and can look at it from an independent perspective).

[The Yellow Dart]

Aaron_mag he is gone untill tomorrow afternoon. I'll show it to him then and see what he thinks about it.

[Automag1]

Originally posted by Digits
[rant]

God I wish I was friends with Bill Gates.. Then he could buy smart parts and crush them :(.

I don't know about you guys, but I wouldn't buy a whole company just to crash it. Even if i was bill gates, its still seems like this guy took some "happy pills" when he wrote this thread :)

emmmmmm happy pills