Is it a BAD thing to be a "spoiled" kid? Want to know your opinion...

[djbea]

Hi AO,

The posts at Paintball.com about Logan Holler (a 12 year old kid that plays tournament ball, in particular, the Super 7) have mentioned that this kid is SPOILED and people are name-calling him a WIGGER and basically posting HATER-style.

Now, is this not about jealousy and envy? If you can take a moment to read the posts (and the article associated with it), I'd like to get your point-of-view about kids playing paintball at such a young age, parents giving them everything they want, etc.

I personally don't think that it's a bad thing that his parents are so supportive by working as hard as they do to give their children the extra things in life that these kids have actually earned.

Your thoughts?

12-year old 4'9" tournament baller (http://paintball.com/pb/features/bea.cfm)
http://paintball.com/pics/sotd/august2003/logan_sotd.jpg

[Featherlite 80]

depends, IMO.

If the kid has never played before and buys a $2k setup then its bad. If they kid plays, and likes it, and keeps playing, and then moves up to a better setup, selling his old gun to help pay for it, then I dont see the problem.

[Mag Master 04]

buys his own gear..no, parents buy his crap...yes

[rx2]

Let me preface by saying I had an average upbringing. I wasn't spoiled, but I wasn't destitute, either.
_______

Ahh, capitalism. If you have qualms with kids getting expensive markers because their parents worked a little harder, or had it easy themselves, I would suggest you try communism.

Seriously speaking, though, I don't think that it is bad, per se. Problems arise when parents start using money and goods to compensate for interaction, and old-fasioned discipline. Often, those with money are more likely to buy their kids affection. However, this isn't something that is absolute. I know some spoiled kids personally, and they are quite well behaved, and rather personable. On the flip-side, I know a lot of angry people who use the fact that they had to work hard to get their gear as an excuse to condescend and badger the spoiled, or those who have expensive gear. Some of them are quite difficult to get along with on the field as they have a chip on their shoulder, and a superiority complex as they don't "compensate for lack of skill with high-priced equipment."

So, I think that buying expensive gear for your children is not a bad thing. Lack of parenting, which is oft associated with spoiling, is a bad thing.

I should also state that it can be good when kids have expensive gear bought for them. It makes it easier for people like me to purchase it when they quit, and sell it off for a price that is WAY too low, as they don't know the true value, and don't need the money anyways. My brother scored an 800 dollar guitar for 80 bucks that way.;)

[painball]

if your parents supported you that much wouldn't you gladly take all the stuff they gave you? C'mon. How would a kid that age support his addiction without his parents

hes sorta a wigga, but wiggaz are cool. www.wiggaz.com

[Troy]

Sounds like jealousy to me.

I'd do the same for my kid if they were into it.

[SlipknotX556]

I dont think it matters, that he plays tourny ball, people calling him a wigger, thats just wrong. The kid is 12 and is being called a white "N Word", thats just wrong.

[Will Wood]

Is it a bad thing? Sure. Greed is one of the sins, and so is Envy, so either side of the party could be quilty.

.. It's one thing if the "Spoiled" is outright spoiled, and their first time playing paintball they get a Xmag or something like that. They don't deserve it. But if they start out simple, and begin to like it, and advance in skill, and then get a high end marker to help them out, its nothing. But if they are like a jerk, and don't like any one try out their marker, it's bad. But if they are nice, everyone once in a while let the newbie shoot a hopper out of it or something, there is no problem with it. There will always be the jelousy no matter what. It's all about how the person is with the spoiledness.


.. People see me as spoiled. Am I? I guess. They don't go out and buy me everything I want, but I do have alot.

There's alot other people have, that I don't. I mean, it took us years of begging to get cable TV, we have only had it for 2 years now, and its the most basic thing. We don't go all out and get everything, what we have, everything has a purpose, it's just a better version.

.. I work my butt off at my work. I saved up alot. I got in a accident, I lost 1500 bucks to damage. My parents declined the other kids offer to pay for it (it was his fault) to help to teach me a lesson of the "real world". They are probably alot more harsh then alot of your parents. They try to teach me the skills needed to survive out there, but in return for being a bit more hard, I have some things better off.

[Benfica4ever]

Well he may be spoiled but if he is good enough to tourny ball then leave him be.
They had a pic of him bunkering someone before.

[CameraGuy]

I don't have a problem with this kid's parents supporting him in the sport of his choice if he appreciates what they're doing for him.
You're most likely correct in assuming that many of the people posting negative statements about him are motivated by jealousy because their parents didn't do the same for them (or perhaps some of their parents did, but they didn't appreciate it...).

[spider54]

definantly not a bad thing... i plan on doin it for my nephew... what there people dont realize is that kids startin that young will b so much better when they become the age of other players which will increase the skill level in the paintball community which will make the world a happy place...:rolleyes:

i wish someone did it for me

[Crazy]

MY MOMMY BUYS ALL MY GEAR

[KornKamp02]

Hey, I'm 13 and I have bought all my paintball stuff with m yown hard earned money (yes I mean hard earned as in Mowing 10 acres a week and working in a corn field) It has taken me awhile to gather my money but it is worth it.

[NJPaint]

There is a difference between giving a nephew a m98 for his birthday and giving him an Angel because he asked for it. Hell, I got my brothers to pool money to buy an m98 for my cousin for his birthday. Came out to a nice $30 each (and I put in $50 since I'm the oldest) And now we have a 4th player when we want to go out and play.

We had never gotten him anything in the past so it wasn't like we kept sending money to him... but it was a really sweet bday gift for a 12 year old :D

[painball]

Originally posted by SlipknotX556
people calling him a wigger, thats just wrong. The kid is 12 and is being called a white "N Word", thats just wrong.

i dont really think he's a wigger. ac tually i hate stereotypes so i just make fun of them (the stereotypes not the people)

[Cryer]

I think what contitutes someone being "spoiled" isn't necissarily that they're younger than you with better toys than you that they didn't pay for. (Although that certainly can and does contribute)

Its all in the attitude, methinks:
I think that if someone is grateful for that which has been given to them and uses that to better themselves, then its ok. (Isn't that what sponsorship does anyway?) As long as they remain humble.

For someone to be spoiled, they must at least fail to acknowlege the fact that someone else made them what they are (or at least that they had help to get to where they are now).
























That said, I believe his hat is too big.
http://paintball.com/pics/Bea/logan/logan2.jpg

[KornKamp02]

Originally posted by painball


i dont really think he's a wigger. ac tually i hate stereotypes so i just make fun of them (the stereotypes not the people) Same here....I hate it when people call me "goth"

[Miscue]

I say it's not the kid's fault.

If the kid doesn't learn how to appreciate things, then his parents aren't doing him any favors. But, if he can be cool about it and get stuff... that's great. Regardless I don't see why this has an effect upon other people.

Heck, if my parents got me a fancy paintball gun when I was 12... I'd take it!

[painball]

Originally posted by Miscue
Heck, if my parents got me a fancy paintball gun when I was 12... I'd take it!

pfft i'd throw it away and go buy a tippy. tippys are loud and heck, who doesnt like a loud gun?! its all about the intimidation. now how is something like an orracle supposed to intimidate people?!:D :D :p :p

[Miscue]

Threaten to put their finger between the body and back block. That'll teach 'em.

[gamarada717]

Well, he plays. He uses it. I see nothing wrong with it. What I don't understand is when I go to my field and get made fun of because I have an automag rt pro. Who knows what the people with angels get. In fact, I really hate it when people call me spoiled. Sure, I get allowance, but I still had to work for 3 months to get my gun, and the rest of it was saved up from the past year because the only thing I had bought besides paint was warcraft 3. I think I totally deserve my gun, and if I played as much as him, I would deserve a nice gun too.

[painball]

its not really about the gun its about the skill. Thats kid has some madd skill. and a nice gun to help out a little. guns dont make players. at my field we played a few games which was pretty much angels, cockers and stuff vs spyders. and guess who won almost every game? the spyders (and me w/ my friend POS BKO)

once again...

ITS THE SKILL!! and that kid has it

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by painball
if your parents supported you that much wouldn't you gladly take all the stuff they gave you? C'mon.
Couldn't have said it better myself. Stop raggin on him, the only reason to do it would be out of pure jealousy.

[f3rr3+]

i have a big problem with wiggers (or any "style/mindset), if there just doing it to fit in, i say be who are and thats the end of my reply on that part of the question.

I have to pay for all of my paintball stuff, and i know kids who dont know there barrel whole from there a.. ear hole, and still get 1k dollar set-ups they dont need/take care of/know anything about.

I think that its better to make a kid work for his stuff because he 1. knows the value of a dollar 2. take care for everything alot more 3. takes the time how to care for the marker correctly 4. has alot more willingness to work and earn money to support himself

For the most part, i really dont like spoiled kids, because of what they get, because of how they act, and because of how they treat stuff

Also alot of the spoiled kids ino have had there parents get them tvs, computers, game systems, ect. and they still treat there parents like sh... poo-poo... and thats what usually pisses me off the most is that they have no respect for there parents or the stuff there parents bought them.


(id like to mention that i didnt read alot of the posts posted before me)

[cris8762]

well if you read the posts buy DementedKidz1 and Bea in the article, you'll see that he appreciates what he has been given and works hard in school/around the house/and in other sports.

I wish i was as dedicated when i was his age! Not every kid with an angel or super pimp gun/setup is spoiled.

My parents got me my first tippman for x-mas. Since then i've upgraded the tippy to hell, sold it, bought a imp, upgraded that to hell, and sold that to hopefully get a Z timmy!

The only thing that my parents have ever paid for was that original tippmann setup. Since then i've mowed lawns, done housework, and gotten a job to fund my "paintball monkey" as my dad calls it. (monkey stuck on my back that's addicted to 'ballin).

I have had people come up to me when i'm at the field and ask me WHO payed for my stuff, like i was gonna answer "mommy and daddy!". People will ALWAYS make a snap judgement about you the second they see you (fat &slow, geeky, anorexic, homosexual, ugly, stuck up, SPOILED). But all you have to do to change that opinion is talk to people or let them know who you really are.

Logan seems like a great little kid that appreciates EVERYTHING he has and i think he will go far in life!


EDIT: guys, this kid is NOT a white "N" word. His parent said that the hat was too big for him and he had to wear a headband or wear it sideways for it to fit!! JEEZ! that's what i was talking about snap judgements. I wear a BK headband over a durag and people sometimes make comments about it. But guess what, IT'S MY STYLE AND DOESN'T CONCERN ANYONE ELSE!!!!

But, back to Logan, THIS KID IS TWELVE, YES TWELVE, YEARS OLD!!! I remember being 12 and thinking of EVERYONE as equal, noone was dumb or weird just because they acted a different way, dressed different. You people need to get a grip!

Also incase you were wondering i'm 16 years old. (if you want pics of me in my BK headband and durag IM me :D ;) )

Thanks,
Cris

[NORCAL]

Damn, green eyed monster strikes again. Its a shame how some people can get downright nasty on someone they have never met (especially a 12 y.o.). I would say that, "spoiled," is more of an attitude. Since most of us have never met this kid we really don't know. As far as the opportunities hes been given, I am glad to see that he is taking advantage of them, I know I would have. I give his father major credit for not only supporting his children's interest but gettiung involved and participating in them.

[Torbo]

here is my humble opinion:

regardless of what your parents buy for you, you should be working towords the same cause. I work, mowing lawns, doing yardwork and stuff, for almost all my gear. I ususally get some stuff for christmas/my birthday ( got a jersey, a hat, and a case of paint from my parents in the last year) Basically, i think that you appreciate something more if you work for it. Maybe not all of it, as thats kinda inpracticle in that 12 year olds case. the attitude is alot of it too. Its different in every case. Its bad when the person
"Is born on third base, and thinks he hit a triple to get there" ,
or dosnt appreciate what he or she has. just my 2cents

[Dryden]

Would anyone feel differently if the parents were spending hundreds ... or thousands of dollars on basketball camps, golf clubs and greens fees, travelling "everyone plays" soccer leagues, or music lessons?

What if the kid chose to play piano? Between the purchase of a decently playable used console piano and lessons, it's not unreasonable to invest > $5,000, and still not even know if the child will find any enjoyment in it.

Is a child spoiled just because his/her parents have the means to provide "non-essential" items for them?

If this is what the kid wants to do, and enjoys doing - more power to his parents for indulging his interests and not their own. At least in paintball, this kid can be competitive and make some "real" money through tournaments at the age of 12!

Ironic that so many people moan about the "image" of the game of paintball, and that the "sport" isn't given the just attention it deserves; and when the game finally has someone approximate to a Tony Hawk, everyone wants to dump on him 'cause his marker is better.

My mother once mentioned a story to me about a doctors visit when I was a child. She asked my pediatrician whether he thought I was a spoiled kid.

The pediatrician responded, "You cannot spoil your kids, you can only show them that you love them."

Of course, I probably made mom buy me a GI Joe or Transformer or something as a bribe for not throwing a tantrum in the waiting room. :p

[DiRTyBuNNy]

Well...what can I say...he's got skillz...if it wasn't for Earon Carter giving a punk kid named Dave Youngblood a little love when he was young then I wonder where the sport of paintball would be today...or think of a kid like Kenny Klamper when he came up in the mid-90's, or Shane Pestana, I mean..they called the guy Doogie Howser for heaven's sakes because he was so young..and those two started at 16 (or younger..i can't remember) and people thought the teams that picked them up were crazy...and look at them today, Kenny's still ripping it up with Shock and Shane left the sport to start a family a few years back...both put in their time and showed that they deserved the love they got when they were younger..



(btw, Dryden..love the sig pic..love it love it love it..I was just thinking of something like that the other day)

[gibby]

I believe, it's all about attitude. Like everyone said, if the parents are supportive about a kid's hobby/sport, then you can't take that away from the kid. Those kind of kids are the lucky ones...something to be jealous of...maybe. But jealous in the sense that I wished I had family members who could help me with what I like to do.

However, if the kid doesn't realize how lucky he is, and appreciates what comes his way, and acts like a total brat, allowing his ego to get the best of him, then I have something wrong with that.

Having respect towards others, the ones who supports you, the people you play against is a great quality in a player who has the potential to be a big icon in the sport. That to me deserves my respect no matter how old you are. That to me counts the most even if I were to be bunkered by this kid.

If another player, no matter what age, can come up to me after every game and shake my hand...win or lose...that to me defines someone with great character. I will also do the same no matter what happens on the field.

[robertjuric]

12 yo?? shouldnt he be out playing in the dirt or riding a bike or something? Anyways, Ive heard the kid is more of a publicity stunt then all skill(not saying he sux).

who knows maybe I am jealous b/c I have to work my *** off at McDonalds barely making enough to go play twice a month, and finally saved enough for a mag, then this little kid waltzes out of nowhere and is playing S7?? Doesnt seem right IMO. Oh well guess I am jealous, so what. Do I think the kid deserves it?? No, no way he has put in the hours, sweat, tears that even the other players in S7 have. I dont think Im jealous, b/c I personally rather like the feeling of earning something from my hardwork. I rather think that the kid doesnt deserve it.

But thats just my .02

[Lord_Whoopass]

Dude I thinks it cool for parents to back their kids in such a great sport... LOL I wish I was that lucky when I got into paintball... I started playing woods rec ball when I was 12 and borrowed equipment from a friend... then I had to save money and bought a stingray, a mask and a VL200 hopper from the local feedmill that my friends dad owned... And if my mom ever found out that I played paintball she would have put an end to it right there... but I managed to keep playing until I was 16 without her finding out and by that time I had upgraded to a M-98 and also had an original "Spyder" before kingman added names to them... lol so yeah let the kid be and I am sure his small profile makes him a good frontman... LOL if my lil brother was faster I would put him on my team and play him as a front...

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by robertjuric
12 yo?? shouldnt he be out playing in the dirt or riding a bike or something? Anyways, Ive heard the kid is more of a publicity stunt then all skill(not saying he sux).

who knows maybe I am jealous b/c I have to work my *** off at McDonalds barely making enough to go play twice a month, and finally saved enough for a mag, then this little kid waltzes out of nowhere and is playing S7?? Doesnt seem right IMO. Oh well guess I am jealous, so what. Do I think the kid deserves it?? No, no way he has put in the hours, sweat, tears that even the other players in S7 have. I dont think Im jealous, b/c I personally rather like the feeling of earning something from my hardwork. I rather think that the kid doesnt deserve it.

But thats just my .02
Man, McD's sucks. I work at Wendys and have enough to play every week and save for a new Viking.

If he has the skill, let his parents support him. You know just as well as I do that you'd accept free handouts if they were offered also. Also, it's not like he's old enough where it's possible to save up for the equipment he wants, it would be a shame for that to hold him back from playing national tournies.

[TheBigRaguPB4L]

I don't think it's right for any kid to be spoiled. It's all in what they deserve. I've seen kids demand their parents get them $2000+ plus setups simply because they wanted it. Absolutely unnecessary. I really don't know and you can't really tell how he is. Really though how many can you truthfully admit taht as a kid, if your parents would give you anything you wanted, you wouldn't take it so you wouldn't be spoiled? I'll bet none of you would refuse. I sure wouldn't have. As you get older maybe, but as a kid, no way.

Just because your parents by you everything, doesn't make you spoiled. If you worked hard for it(IE: chores, yardwork, housework, ect.) then you've earned it. Like i said, however, some parents give their kids everythiing and the kids don't respect them for it.

[einhander619]

As long as he's reasonably good and doesn't let the free gear go to his head, I'll say rock on to that little dude. Hell, I played tourney ball when I was 12!

[jdev]

look at it this way.

this is the same scenario as your parents buying you your own soccer equipment or football equipment.

I remember when I was younger, my parents paid for all of my football stuff. now, granted, my equipment didnt total $2000, but, its along the same premiss.

on the other hand. if this kid goes out and breaks a $1000 marker every game and his parents replace it for him, that is spoiled.

the kid is just getting into the sport and his parents are helping him along. If I had discovered paintball at the age of 12 and my parents offered to pay for my stuff, hell yes I would take it. jobs are hard to come by when you are 12 years old, aside from paper routes and yardwork.

[AngelBoy]

How is it wrong that his parents got off their butts and found a good paying career, and are now happily supporting their child? Isnt that what every parent wants to do? That might be the case, and it might not, I dont know and you probably dont either.

Maybe his parents buy him everything he wants instead of caring much about him? Would you trade your parents love for some stupid paintball gun? But again, we dont know the entire situation.

And for those of you that keep saying stuff like "Their parents buy them everything they want and they dont respect them, thats why its wrong."... You dont know if their parents deserve the respect or not. Since when has respecting your parents been just on how much they buy you?

And who are you to judge anyway?

[Python14]

The biggest question of all is.....Why are you arguing over something that has absolutely no effect whatsoever on you? I say let the kid get spoiled half-way stupid. Hopefully, one day, before his trust fund kicks in and after he is out on his own because he was kicked out of college for failing(because he's never done actual work), he'll learn exactly what it takes to earn a dollar, and exactly what you can buy with a dollar. But until then, he will be another kid with a cocker he didn't pay for.


In other news, if I was in his position, I'd graciously accept a free cocker from my parents. When I have little Python14s of my own, I'm gonna spoil them, but only on their birthdays and christmas because I don't want them to get used to it, but I do want them to be able to have some of the things that I don't, or didn't. It's what any level headed parent wants for his or her child(ren).

He does look kind of dumb with a oversized JT hat on sideways though. But then again, reading through FACEFULL, it seems to be the style for JT teams.:rolleyes:

[shartley]

As has been pointed out by many, this is not simply one issue.

I think spoiling a child is wrong. With that said, we must determine what “spoiling” is.

To me, it is giving a child everything they want or allowing them to do anything they want, with no demands made of them in return. And that, to me. is wrong.

As was stated by others, we see kids being supported in their activities all the time…. Think any sporting equipment is cheap? As a parent, when my children play a sport, I want them to have the best while doing so. It is for many reasons to include safety. But I will also admit that it is nice as a parent to be able to provide our children with the best things we can. When my children get something nice, that I have worked VERY hard to get for them, and they APPRECIATE it…. it fills my heart with pride and joy.

It is when I see kids use their “perceived” wealth (that of their parents, not their own) as a weapon against those less fortunate than them, that I have a problem. It is not simply an issue of “having” things, or “getting” things, it is an issue of how they are and how they interact with others because of it. And when things are taken for granted and as if it is some sort of birth right, THAT is a problem.

I think we all know (or have known) kids that fit in a wide range of categories concerning this. And I think those that hate because someone else HAS something are just as bad as those who act badly because they themselves DO have.

[SIGSays]

well... in a way yes... but we're just jealous

[AngelBoy]

Originally posted by shartley
As has been pointed out by many, this is not simply one issue.

I think spoiling a child is wrong. With that said, we must determine what “spoiling” is.

To me, it is giving a child everything they want or allowing them to do anything they want, with no demands made of them in return. And that, to me. is wrong.

As was stated by others, we see kids being supported in their activities all the time…. Think any sporting equipment is cheap? As a parent, when my children play a sport, I want them to have the best while doing so. It is for many reasons to include safety. But I will also admit that it is nice as a parent to be able to provide our children with the best things we can. When my children get something nice, that I have worked VERY hard to get for them, and they APPRECIATE it…. it fills my heart with pride and joy.

It is when I see kids use their “perceived” wealth (that of their parents, not their own) as a weapon against those less fortunate than them, that I have a problem. It is not simply an issue of “having” things, or “getting” things, it is an issue of how they are and how they interact with others because of it. And when things are taken for granted and as if it is some sort of birth right, THAT is a problem.

I think we all know (or have known) kids that fit in a wide range of categories concerning this. And I think those that hate because someone else HAS something are just as bad as those who act badly because they themselves DO have.


Very well put, props to you again.

[Duke Henry]

How can anyone online at all have any sort of opinion on what kind of person this kid is? I mean come on! How many of us have talked to him in depth? How many have hung out with him? How many have watched him play and practice? No one, well what a shock. Chalk up another victory for the internet police. Anyway, let's run a little scenario.

Let's say that the kid received a brand new setup worth $2000+ after expressing interest in the game. Does that mean then that he is a spoiled kid who is a brat and doesn't deserve any positive attention? Of course not. If this little scenario was the case, then perhaps an argument could be made for his father being a bit hasty in his purchase, but you cannot blame the kid for wanting to play a game.

Now, if I remember correctly in the article (I read it yesterday while surfing), this wasn't a hasty decision. They had played before, and used a few different guns and so they had an idea of what the game was about, and knew what they were getting into. So, after playing for a while and becoming accustomed to the game they decide to step it up to the next level and buy some more gear that they feel is better (either because it is simply more money, or perhaps because it is gear more suited to them - geez this problem doesn't sound unique at all). I fail to see what is soo bad about this!

Here you have the future of the sport, and people resort to name calling and whining about how he is getting "free" gear. Heck, we don't even know if this gear is "free" for him. We know it isn't free for his dad, or whomever is buying the gear. However, since we don't get the gear for "free" like he does, let's attack him because he is different.

That's where the rub is. I admit, seeing his pics with his sideways turned hat is funny (to me). To me, anyone who wears a hat like that looks funny. However, I won't call someone a name because of how they wear a hat, how they dress, or talk or whatever. What the heck is the point? Do we want everyone dressing, talking, walking, living the same? Wow, if that kind of homogenized world comes around then I will be in trouble because I tend to value my individualism.

So, let the kid play if he wants to. If you see him, perhaps talk to him and find out if he really has it to be the future of the game. And, if in the end you conclude that he is not the kind of person you want to say nice things about, then remember the old addage: "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all."

Have a nice day, eh!

[Lohman446]

I can speak from the sides on this - I was/am spoiled, kind of. My dad has owned a business my whole life - and since I was twelve or so I have been handed good money for the work I did there and given help on what I did. I was/am overpaid for what I do, if I need money I know it is available - but I have been always told, as long as I am working, my parents will help me, and working, as well as seeing my dad work 70+ hours my whole life (and still being there on the weekends for us) and getting to where he is today, has taught me the value of work.

As for those of you working your own jobs and living with your parents and whining about this kid being spoiled... when I was 18 and living at home I had a convertible Corvette... now I'm down to living on my own (married wiht kids) and driving an 8 year old Taurus. Get the point? Parents help there children, some can/will more than others, its a judgement call. If my children get to tournament level ball, why should they be hampered by there inability to pay for high-end equipment. Sometimes its a mental thing, I know that my gun is the best for me, but if my child is going to be hindered by using cheaper gun in a highly competitive tournament, why should I not get them better.

Admit it, a lot more of us are "spoiled" than claim to be, its a matter of looking at things differently. I just thank god I'm not in some country working for nothing an hour so I can feed myself. We (most of us) are all spoiled, we know there is food, we can afford it, we have time to think about other things besides scraping together enough to live.

[Muzikman]

I think supporting your kids in what they are good at, enjoy and love is a good thing, no matter what it costs. When I was young I use to race R/C cars (on a national level) and except for the stuff that I got from sponsorships, my father bought everything else, including the travel expenses. In many ways R/C car racing is more expensive than paintball. I am very gratful for this and in no way think I was spoiled.

Now, once I was old enough to get a job and pay for my hobbies myself, I did. I have been playing paintball for 11 years now and not once has anyone bought or paid for my gear. All 28 guns, paint, travel expenses, field fees, etc have been paid for by me (except IAO paint, Thanks Palmers).

[MagAl]

Damn... leave the kid alone If I was twelve and all of started callin me whatver.. this and that I would feel upset and stuff.... now for the spoiled part... I know for a fact even if I was really talented at paintball ( which I am not... been playing for like 4 years but I still suck :p) my parents would not buy me 1000 dollar guns... Hell even if they were RICH they would not buy me 1000 dollar guns.. I think its wrong for somebody that age to have something that expensive without knowing how hard his parents work to buy that crap for him... yes I would except the stuff you all would... but I would never ask for it, to think that my parents work all day to feed me.. cloth me.. pay the mortage... and I ask them for a 1000 dollar gun... thats not how I was raised.

Now they say he is talented... good for him.. I do not play paintball every week... nor do I want to.. its just something on the side to go out with friends and have fun.. then when we get home we talk about all the stories...

Also, this is kinda irrelavant. I do not believe somebody is born being talented in paintball... I think the more the play the better they get, I dont believe somebody is born being talented in "snapshooting" or a..... stuff that make you good in paintball.. I think all these skills are acuired while playing.. they more you play... the better people you play the better you get... I think its as simple as that... theres also the gun factor in there.. but that doesn't mean as much as raw skill. Sure some are just better then others I guess, then again some people are just better then others.. but becuase they work fot it... but I do not see how you can "just be naturally talented at paintball"

[bunkermaster10]

I think the kid is a freakin P.I.M.P and he has to be pretty good to be playin where he's at so I give the kid props... And by the way he's dad must be the best dad ever seriously. :)

[IceCool32]

Give the kid a break, as much as none of you want to...how many places do you know that will hire a 12 y/o to work? not many...you know why? It's illegal. So if you're going to say "blah,blah I have to work my butt off to get so and so stuff I want" then you're probably of the age you should have a job anyways.

I understand how you guys that pay for your stuff can be frustrated, but this kid can't...not yet, if he's good and can play, then why not give him the equipment to continue the sport?

I started playing paintball, and since my parents only supported me for what they wanted me to do(baseball), I've payed for everything with the sport since.

First marker: Rebel
Second: Piranaha STS
Third: Impulse
Now: System X Cocker

None of my markers were ever really "the one" or have been the best or most expensive, but I do use them regularly to justify the cost of them, and the sport...as long as something is getting use what's it matter?

[shutter13]

Im saving up to buy an RT Pro(only have 2 work 5 more days!!) and im only 13 but im really lucky cuz my dad PB's and buys me and my bro paint and hes the manager of his business so i work there and get paid pretty well even though he works me like a mexican :) so i think the kid is kinda spoiled that his parents buy him EVERYTHING but if they just bought him paint and helped him out a lil that alright but buying him an orracle and everything is spoiling him

[breg]

I really don't know the kid, so I can't bash him. That, and I've never seen him play, so I can't say that he sucks, or anything.
So what if his parents bought him all of this fancy stuff? Who isn't a little envious of those guys who get all the free gear? I know I am. Does it say anything about them as people? NO! It just says that they got hooked up in some fashion. Nothing more, nothing less.
If the kid's parents hook him up, I'm really happy for him.

A parent(s) that show support for what ever thier kid s into is a rare and wonderful thing.

[SyntaxError]

I think alot of people are overlooking some stuff. I don't mean to sound like a jerk or anything, but I'd be willing to bet that the only reason the kid has a spot on that team is cuz Daddy owns the field and cuts the team a deal, so long as junior here gets a starting spot.

It happens all too often, I've seen it personally, and it truly is unfortunate for both the kid and the team.

Maybe the kid can ball, who knows, but from alot of the comments made, I think that it can't really be determined whether or not the kid is spoiled or whatever from what we know, but you'd have to really look into it. I'd bet that daddy over there is putting in some cash or sponsorship deals to make sure his kid plays. Unfortunately, most teams arent picking up players based on merit or playing ability, they're picking up players who can get them hooked up with gear/paint/play time...

[SyntaxError]

in conclusion, spoiled=bad:D

[djbea]

Thank you for all of your points-of-view on this topic. Overall, Logan is a kid who does appreciate what his parents are doing for him and you can tell this when you talk to him in person.

If you get a chance to say HI to him if you are going to the New Jersey Super 7, perhaps you can introduce yourself and see for yourself? He's also playing at the event, so you can see the kid's natural talent and the potential for him to excel in the sport.

I LOVE AO and I LOVE your intellect. Reading the posts here is truly a fantastic learning experience. Thanks again and see you all soon.

Sincerely,
Bea

[Python14]

Originally posted by djbea
I LOVE AO and I LOVE your intellect.


aw shucks, I feel all smart now.:D

[PballCHick04]

it depends on whether or not, they are that serious about playing. if you start at like 11 and spend lots of money on it, then all of a sudden quit it was a waste, but if you're planning on playing for a long time and doing tournies and stuff, then its worth it. And as for being spoiled? some kids are, but if you're good at something, then its not spoiled when you can make things happen.

im getting tired i dont really know if ne of that makes sense??? lol

[845]

I think one of the things a kid needs to be successful in any sport is parent support. A lot of those kids whining about the kid being spoiled are probably just jealous there parents dont support paintball. I have a lot of firends who have to pay for their own stuff. When I ask them why their parents dont help them out they usually say something along the lines of, "My parents dont think its a sport". These are the same parents who would give their kid over $800 to play in-house(meaning non-tournament) hockey.

I never hear in any other sport "oh your spoiled because you got $500 hockey skates" or "your a loser because your parents pay for all your tennis tournament entrance fees."

[Furby]

Better paintball than rehab, hospital bills, child support, or bail money/legal fees.

If he's doing his thing and contributing to his team, then pfft...let him have at it!

[Jonno06]

its only bad to be spoiled if you act like it and rub it in other people's faces...if the little kid can play, its fine.

[FutureMagOwner]

i really cant speak about being spoiled seeing as how i am not. and i own 2 high priced guns that i worked for and i dont get pissed at other kids with high end stuff because they could be like me and work for it. the only time id dislike someone is if they are a piss head about it and that applies to anyone no matter how much they spend

[greyninja009]

Originally posted by robertjuric
12 yo?? shouldnt he be out playing in the dirt or riding a bike or something? Anyways, Ive heard the kid is more of a publicity stunt then all skill(not saying he sux).

who knows maybe I am jealous b/c I have to work my *** off at McDonalds barely making enough to go play twice a month, and finally saved enough for a mag, then this little kid waltzes out of nowhere and is playing S7?? Doesnt seem right IMO. Oh well guess I am jealous, so what. Do I think the kid deserves it?? No, no way he has put in the hours, sweat, tears that even the other players in S7 have. I dont think Im jealous, b/c I personally rather like the feeling of earning something from my hardwork. I rather think that the kid doesnt deserve it.

But thats just my .02

Yea, it hink it's just jealousy, because there's no way you would know how good he is unless you saw him. Bea Youngs did, and she posted an article bout him. I dunno who would say the kid os moreso a publicity stunt than skill.

[50 cal]

I've only seen one "spoiled" kid playing p-ball. At Paintball on the Plateau in Crossville Tn there was this kid that actually cussed his Mom and Dad cause they wouldn't buy him whatever was the hot shot Angel at the time. The kid was a really good player, his attitude was totally messed up. He was one of the people you see that don't need a p-ball gun in their hands at any time. I mean this kid was absolutely raging against his parents.

[gamarada717]

Shartly, you always make good posts on things like this that require debating. I say we make an AO debating team!

[Albinonewt]

There's nothing wrong with providing for your kid or providing for their hobby. For a parent to buy a kid a really stacked setup so he can play tournament ball and excel at something (is he any good?) is fine. I don't think most of us complain when a parent buys their kid a $1,000 trumpet or hockey equipment to play at the level they're aiming for, so I don't begrudge a kid for having their stuff provided.

Now, that being said there is a danger to spoiling a kid too much. If any kid grows up with everything handed to them they lack a certain appreciation for working for things and just a misunderstanding of the way money works. Neither of those is a good thing.

And being spoled really shouldn't last forever. Once you're in highschool you really should be working to some degree or another and probably through college as well (some people simply do too much not to, drinking doesn't count). In college internships and/or summer jobs are a must. That way when you actually get out you've been exposed to more then just handouts.

[walker2287]

I think it depends, if the person starts with an angel i thinks its wrong. if the have a cocky additude about it its wrong. if they dont play much and have an angel(just using angel as an example) its wrong. if they dont know how to use it, its wrong. i have a friend whos parents are loaded and he started with a tippy and worked up to an x-mag (arnt we all jealious). and he really nice about it lets people use his backup gun (hypermag) and doesnt let it get to his head. I mean he wont appreatiate his gun as much as me cuz im 16 and i work 40 hrs a week at mcddys and i currently dont have a real nice gun. also i think a 12 playing tournys is great. super 7 that a bit much backing up in national tournys is fine but the make it out like hes good

[Peach]

Hmmm. Wow, people complain about the sports image, then cuss out a 12 year old that could whipe them up and down a field with a spyder or his cocker. As people say, it's the player not the gun, so who cares what gun he has. I doubt anyone wouldn't accept help from parents paying for paintball. I also find it funny that many of these kids call him spoiled yet have a T.V. in their room with an X-box, ps2, and a 1,500 dollar computer. Give the kid a break. Hey, I'm 15 and would play tourney ball in his league without a second thought, but I'm not going to complain that he has a more expensive gun then me(Not that I know for sure if he does or not.) because he is 12 and his parents help pay for it. Face it, paintball is expensive and if he loves it and his parents support him, by all means buy his stuff. He probably does his chores and helps out in payments when he can. Try mowing laws once a week for 5 dollars and playing paintball on that, you can't. Give the kid a break and get over yourself if you have a problem with him.

-- Rock on little guy.

[bornl33t]

really theres more to it then being spoiled. with age comes wisdom. I HATE kids that act like they are something special cause they have the smae toys grown ups have. Make house payments, truck payments, suport a family, work 40 hours a week,... then i'll be impressed by your 2k$ setup and that nice acura you drive.

Some ppl earn the right to be grow up, others try and buy into it.

[sbpyro]

Bad thing to be a spoiled kid. YES
Since I do not know the kid I can't make a judgement on this case. Being spoiled is more of an attitude than it is about getting stuff. I know of ppl who grew up in a better life than I did and wouldn't consider them spoiled. But knew of kids that grew up in the projects that were spoiled even though their families were on welfare.
Now is this kid being called a wigger because of the way he wears his hat or his attitude. Cuz the way I see it most wiggers that I know of think they live the ghetto life.
I have no problems with a kid with a brand new gun that cost more than all my paintball equipment combined, I have a problem with a kid that didn't learn the game.
My $.02 - 30% for rent in the projects.

[beefstew]

I also started playing tournaments when i was 12. The issue is that he does nothing for his gear. Eclass and his own field, just handed to him. This might make him appreciate his parents but more than likely he doesnt understand that most people pay their own way. I spent almost all of my savings for paint at IAO. And he doesnt seem to be very good, which is my main quam, if you suck, there is no reason to be in an article, i dont care how old you are.

Phil
(only 15 now)

[Thordic]

If he is really serious about the sport, which he obviously is (since he is playing super 7), then not at all.

Do people call kids who play hockey spoiled because their parents bought them several hundred dollars worth of pads and equipment?

What about a very musical kid whose parents buy him a $1600 Yamaha keyboard?

There is nothing wrong with encouraging your kids to play sports. Paintball is somewhat more expensive than other sports, but the kid is out playing, at least hes not sitting at home being pasty and watching TV all day.

I think people are just jealous.

Some kid who hardly plays and doesn't have a clue but owns a $2000 angel setup is spoiled. All he needs is a Tippman and a Co2 tank, but a kid who is serious about the sport, no, thats cool with me.

[FutureMagOwner]

Originally posted by Thordic
at least hes not sitting at home being pasty and watching TV all day.

hey i resent that!!!!! :) ;)



anyway as i mentioned earlier in a slightly more simplistic form it comes down to attitude to me and it doesnt matter otherwise who bought this and who use it etc

[greyninja009]

I dont think it matters what gun he starts with; if he's worthy of his gear, I'm fine with it. I've met alot of cocks that aren't spoiled, they're just cocks, I've met some spoiled kids that aren't cocks, not al spoiled kids are cocks, my friend just got an orracle with 68/5000, payin barely enough of it to buy a couple tootsie pops, but last time i played, he did good, we just showed him how and he did the rest. He's worthy of his gear, and he's spoiled, nothing wrong with that.

[Evil Bob]

Everyone needs to keep in mind that top end gear allows you to play at your highest physical skill level, it removes artificial limitations that may be hardware limitations (slow cycle rates, failures, etc.) and puts those limitations on the player themselves.

You want someone to grow in the sport skillwise as quickly as possible, you provide them the best hardware money can buy, same thing goes with any sport people may compete in where the equipment used can and will impose artificial limitations on the participants performance.

I'll use myself and my son here as a further example:

I'm 6'3" and have no problems with the heavy warped Emag I haul around (almost 13 pounds with paint).
My 14 year old son is 4'11" and would suffer greatly with that kind of weight for more then one game, therefore I spent some hard earned cash and invested in a C&C Xmag for him. A marker mounted air setup was too heavy for him to wield comfortably, so we setup a remote line to his harness, his total marker weight (no warp) when loaded with paint is 4 pounds, something he can easily haul around and use all day long. As he grows, we will add onto his setup (warp, move air to on-marker, etc.), but for right now, he has the ideal setup for his size, strength, and endurance that allows him to play at his highest level skill wise.

Is he spoiled? I'll let you be the judge:

He has a local paper route and a weekly allowance he earns for doing chores around the house. I make him buy things he "wants" with his own money that he earns, my wife and myself provide him with the basic necessities of life (food, clothing, shelter, etc). We have a board on the wall in the kitchen showing chores and current outstanding totals (in his case), his total is currently at $-542.00, that's the remaining balance on his xmag, he expects to have it paid off completely by sept, nov at the latest. He volunteers to do chores for his brothers and earn the allowance money they would have if they had performed the chores, ho goes around the neighborhood and mows lawns and does odd jobs on weekends when we're not playing.

Normally we will only let the kids buy what they can afford with money they have already earned, but in the case of the xmag, my wife and I made an exception as it came up for sale unexpectedly and we jumped on the opportunitely to get one without waiting 6 months on the list. We also saw it as a good opportunity to teach our son about credit responcibility and made the exception to our normal rules and allowed him to go into the hole on paying it off.

-Evil Bob

[Albinonewt]

EvilBob:

That is exactly the right way to do it.

good for you, your kid is learning several valueable lessons!

[FutureMagOwner]

Originally posted by Evil Bob
Normally we will only let the kids buy what they can afford with money they have already earned, but in the case of the xmag, my wife and I made an exception as it came up for sale unexpectedly and we jumped on the opportunitely to get one without waiting 6 months on the list. We also saw it as a good opportunity to teach our son about credit responcibility and made the exception to our normal rules and allowed him to go into the hole on paying it off.


think of it as teaching him how banking and loans work :)

[speedyejl]

Well I was able to watch Demented Kidz play at the Super 7 @ NJ, and I have to say that Logan is really talented.

Some pics I took of him in action from the Grandstands.

http://www.elairsmiths.com/NPPLNJ/Logan1.jpg

http://www.elairsmiths.com/NPPLNJ/Logan2.jpg

[DWill]

Hmmmm... I'm spoiled but not spoiled. My mag which I got 3 years ago was saved up penny by penny doing chores and odd jobs around the block. My mom threw in an extra $100 for the tank because I wanted to start with CA and not deal with the problems c02 caused in mags. But that $100 dollars canceled out my future birthday present and she made me clean the basement and the garage (the dirtiest, dustiest and most untidy place you could imagine). The basement and the garage took 12 hours each to finish.
In that case I believe I had to work hard for my mag, but 5 days ago my mom and dad recently bought me a new flute (because my old one was very, very old and had been broken multiple times because of its age) which cost $822. Let me say that I am very grateful that my parents did this and now gives me a chance to excel in music. They even offered to buy the gold plated one but I turned it down :).
But there are some who are spoiled. First let me start with my cousin who is from Flordia and lives with my aunt who is having money problems. I have seen him more than once cuss and complain and whine to his mom because he doesn't get what he wants, and he has more than my brother and me combined. He had a total of 5 paintball guns, all broken, a Moped(sp) now broken, 8 basketball shoes etc... and didn't pay a penny for them. Another case is a local boy whose parents recently bought him a viper(yes the car viper made by dodge) This is his first car and he is racing down streets flicking people off and basicallly being an arse. These are examples of people not appreciating what their parents do for them and what other people had to do for their stuff and in my opinion it is mostly the parents fault for giving them all the stuff and not knowing when to draw the line. Just my .02 cents