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View Full Version : a rhetorical question



kosmo
08-10-2003, 09:38 AM
Ive been on this forum for quite some time. Since before AGD bought the rights to it anyway. I may not post much, but I do read a lot. And one of the things that Ive noticed is how the mag community has changed over the past few years.

It used to be that people bought mags because of their tremendous value. You could take a 280 dollar classic mag, and put a little time into it. Polish and bevel the sear, polish the on off assembly, a cheap spacer kit, throw some screws in the grip frame for trigger stops, and if youre really rolling in dough, maybe an eclipse splash kit. After all this stuff, youd have one heck of a tourney marker, with a trigger shorter and softer than a 1200 dollar westwood autococker. Sure, some of the upgrades may not have been the best for the longevity of your gun, but so what? A new sear and on off assembly cost 15 bucks. And if you did it right, it didnt screw anything up.

Nowadays, everyone seems to have gone off the deep end. Everyone started paying 115 bucks for a grip frame, 350 dollars for a lighter valve, 150 bucks for a lighter body. Im not sure how much for a hollowed out body rail when you couldve just taken a handfull of paint out of your hopper if youre that bothered by weight. Why? Does the x valve make you play 350 dollars better? Is that 115 dollar grip frame really twice as good as a 60 dollar Dye frame? Does your 200 some dollar hammerhead barrel system really perform that much better than my handful of cp and lapco barrels for half that price?

It just makes me wonder. Do people actually think that it is a better value for them to pay that much for a lighter valve and body instead of paying that much to practice, or are the principles of economics just completely lost on the paintball community? I mean sure, I get the tinker bug and I like to make my gun kick butt. I respect it when someone builds a cocker and mills the heck out of it from the parts of some gun they built for someone else. Or when someone picks up a surplus body and sets out to build a gun for under 200 bucks. Or when someone picks up a dremel and makes some wicked stuff out of a body rail and some sight rails. But when everyone and their sister pays so much for the same ULE body/frame/grip, Xvalved, intelliframed mag that everyone else has and they start to call it custom, I guess I just get a little annoyed. Especially when someone obviously still in the woods ball phase of paintball picks up a gun for cheap, still thinking such things as longer barrels are more accurate, wants to know what the heck this thing is in his hand that says automag on it. And immediately everyone goes to trying to get him to buy an intelliframe and x valve and such before he has even played with it.

I just have to ask though, do people here think theyre going to get better by spending their paychecks on parts, or by spending their money on paint and practice?

Kid_A
08-10-2003, 10:16 AM
good question

speeddemon
08-10-2003, 10:32 AM
I believe it was Tom Kaye who said something along the lines of The best way to win is accuracy through volume. If someone wants to do well, a fast gun will help. A lighter gun is more comfortable, and other than milling the rail, there really isn't any other way to do that. Hence buying the aluminum bodies. And with as much as you can do to a stock trigger, most people can shoot better with an Intelliframe, or some other frame, and the look better.

Now it is stupid to spend all of your money on your gear and then not play. But if someone has the money to spend a few thousand on gear, let them. And frankly, I would rather spend my money than just have it sitting in the bank doing me no good.

bunkerhugger
08-10-2003, 10:45 AM
Amen.

Better to spend your money on paint and practice then gear and jerseys. Great if you can do both, but if you have to skip a weekend to buy a better part then you're doing something wrong.

FalconGuy016
08-10-2003, 10:48 AM
I understand what you mean. But is that a bad thing? To have a lot of options to buy stuff. Its not like it is making anything worse, or any of that stuff is something you gotta have to achieve the same level of performance you could get in the past. Nothing has changed except now there is a bunch more to buy and add to your gun. And the valve is 225 with valve trade in, and that gives you level ten and an alluminum retro valve, which you cant argue doesnt help your performance. You just shouldnt let buying parts effect your playing time as much as possible. Ive talked to many people who just sat there and upgraded the hell out of their gun but played once or something, and I know someone who bought a cocker, slowly spent all hi smoney on orracle parts for it, and never played once! Thats not right.

Recon by Fire
08-10-2003, 11:07 AM
It's the "Jones" factor. Everyone wants bigger and better. Is it good or bad? Neither, I would say. I am just as happy playing with Spyder as I was with my X-Mag. To me, it does not matter what you use or how much you paid for it, just that you play :)

coolcatpete
08-10-2003, 11:13 AM
Well put. I think it is about how comfterable you are with you marker and it being light does that, and a Tom said accuracy by volume and so the x-valve delivers both lightness and speed. So I get what your saying but as long as you play every weekend then you all good upgrading. Here is an example I rejected an e-mag for my mag below because it was not comftterable, and I would have to pay even more for it to be, and I would miss playing time so you have been a little misled but that is ok as long as you get it now.

ps. It is also about how tight you can get into a bunker and I do that much better with my marker than the e-mag.

no_doz
08-10-2003, 02:33 PM
it just gives people pride to know that they put their hard earned time/money into a gun to make it the best that they think it can be. Or for other,s they have rich parents and just buy that stuff to show off.

SIGSays
08-10-2003, 03:01 PM
i just like it alot better than my old mag... i know it will shoot faster than my minimag valve... and weigh alot less...

Tyger
08-10-2003, 03:02 PM
Ok, a few thoughts.

"Boys and their Toys" theory. If you've got money, you're probably going to spend it. So, buy that Ultralight body or that "Gribble mod", it might do you good. And if it looks liek your gun was thrown together by a colorblind ape, who cares? I can outshoot YOU, can't I?

"Working Mans theory", and the one I subscribe to. I have a paintgun, I like it, but there's a few details that bother me. I'll buy a part to fix it. Like on a 'Mag. When I hammer, my brain reverts to the "Autococker" shooter in me and I chop paint. It happens. So, a "Level X" kit will help me. Same goes to barrels, internals, and so on.

"d3wd! It's k3w13R!!!!" **shivers** I hate using "733t sp33k" But a lot of guys will go cosmetic mods. Why? Well, it looks diffrent. Why have a "Cookie cuter" gun when you can get a custom cut one? It's diffrent, it's unique, it screams that you're striving to be diffrent. Just like eveyone else.

And remember people are gullable. They'll buy stuff becasue they see someone else use it, and so they want one too. I kinda subscribe to the idea that you shop around, find something you like, and play with it. Don't buy hype, buy quality.

-Tyger

lgavin
08-10-2003, 09:49 PM
you have a very very good point and question...you made me think about it and now im gonna practice more because i am the exact like u explained, i am still in woodsball and keep buying upgrades so now im gonna save my mmoney now to practice and paint...but i totally agree with what your saying

Skoad
08-10-2003, 10:15 PM
well i started with a m98, it was fun to play n all but decided to go for something a little more pricey, so i sold it and bought a classic mag.

As soon as I got that I noticed quite a change in how I played. Now i have an emag and I get more people out than I ever did. With the ole emag I found myself moving A LOT more than i used to. I don't know if it just boosts your confidence with the higher end parts, i do know i love my setup now. But I seem to play better with it :)

lgavin
08-10-2003, 10:26 PM
Originally posted by Skoad
well i started with a m98, it was fun to play n all but decided to go for something a little more pricey, so i sold it and bought a classic mag.

SO TRUE, the same thing i did, but i just worked on upgrading mine, so now i have a retro and all :p and now i have begun to play much betterm but as kosmo said i am now gonna spend it on practice!!