ICD Pros and Cons

[dinger]

hi all. i was planning on getting an ICD BKO next year for my next gun, but the word from one mouth persuaded me to think otherwise for my next gun. SO, if anyone who has a BKO or a Bushie could be so kind to state pros and cons about the gun, it would be a great help! :D


thanks,

~dinger

[-=Squid=-]

Well, I have shot one, dont own one, but usually "word of mouth" is typical "my gun is better than yours" talk. The bushmaster will shoot just as nicely as an impulse, or a tribal, or whatever gun ripped off ICD's design. I am hard pressed to find a gun that shoots more accurately than another, its all mostly bragging rights in my oppinnion. That being said, I own an angel, but would play with an E spyder....just wanna look all pimp and stuff, ya know? go for it, bushys are nice guns.

[Benfica4ever]

yea what barrel threads do they take?
And can you put an lpr on it??

[xadamx]

bushy threads

yes

[dinger]

welps,

the guy who owns my local pro shop is super-duper helpful on any paintball topic. and quite frankly, he knows everything there is to know about paintball guns. which is way he was saying that people are always bringing in ICD products that are constantly breaking down. such as sear, solenoid [i still duno quite what that is], hammer, and he also stated that ICD has a warning saying not to put in more than 500psi into their regulator, or else its gonna bust. to me it sounded kinda retarded... but i take his word for it. then again, i was looking at bko's for about 3 or 4 weeks, and then he goes and bursts my bubble. i was so hyped up about it though, so im stil pursuing the real deal about the icd products.

besides, if it breaks, there's always replacement parts ^-^

[DWill]

With a $250 starting price you'll be getting a sweet gun for the money. Plus you there are some nice mods for the BKO, for example the chaos board, which gives you a higher rate of fire (you can go with the shocktech board which gives you 66.6 cps capibility but you'll never be able to shoot that fast anyways), SP ram which is basically a lvl 10 for bushmasters, a z grip trigger frame (under license from AGD) and vapor valve and bolt etc... Most of these are pretty cheap as well. I say go for it as you get the most for your $ and can make it so that it performs with the angels

[dinger]

oooo! i had no idea that you can stick all that nifty stuff on it. :eek:

hmm this is ups for my view on bko now.. hehe
but the only problem being that i havn't seen any of these upgrades... anywhere... and i've been to pleeenty of websites and whatnot. so if you have a link to these upgrades, please post :D :D :D

and if i can get a z-grip on it, i think ill buy one of those, and then maybe one of those, perhaps that too... :D

thanks

[Benfica4ever]

I checked pb gear and i dident see many pgrades were would you get these upgrades???links???

[DWill]

Did you try the PBnation ICD thread? I'll go find the FAQ section for you and you can cruise through that because I'm to lazy to post all the links....
FAQ section for upgrades (http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=284361) this is all the upgrade info you could possibly need :)

[DWill]

I decided that since I'm a loser with nothing to do at 1 in the morning that I would post all the links for you anyways.

Zenitram (http://templates.earthstores.com/template1/list.asp?id=7A656E697472616D6D6667&cat=188611)
Vaporworks (http://www.vaporworks.net/)
tantrum (http://www.tantrumpaintball.com/)
Shootpaint (http://www.shootpaint.com/index2.html)
MacDev (http://www.macdev.net/)
PBnation bushie database (http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=288525)
look at other peoples set up to help decide to get a bushie.

Alright took me 20 minutes but I'm done....enjoy :D

Only problems that I've heard about bushies is that they are hard to chrono due to having to adjust 2 regulators (1 high one low) to get the proper fps, but once you master it you should have no problem.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by dinger
welps,

the guy who owns my local pro shop is super-duper helpful on any paintball topic. and quite frankly, he knows everything there is to know about paintball guns. which is way he was saying that people are always bringing in ICD products that are constantly breaking down. such as sear, solenoid [i still duno quite what that is], hammer, and he also stated that ICD has a warning saying not to put in more than 500psi into their regulator, or else its gonna bust. to me it sounded kinda retarded... but i take his word for it. then again, i was looking at bko's for about 3 or 4 weeks, and then he goes and bursts my bubble. i was so hyped up about it though, so im stil pursuing the real deal about the icd products.

besides, if it breaks, there's always replacement parts ^-^
Um, Bushys don't use a sear.

[*ArKfEaR*]

Bro hes a friggin idiot.

The stock reg will regulate the pressure down as well as any aftermarket reg. Preset tank or not... it wont burst.

Anyway busheys fire via a microswitch what is he on crack? No wait no he just has no idea what hes talkin about.

You want an amazing gun?

Here:

http://www.paintballinc.com/app/site/site.nl/site.ACCT121803/mode.items/sc.2/category.20/.f

B2K Newest Gen... !!!299.95 get them before all the sweet colors are out of stock.

Go to www.vaporworks.net and get all the services (vapor mods, hoseless fmd w/ rock reg, chaos board with PDS, vapor valve, vapor bolt) Get a rise of your choice, after market HPR reg (Galdiator or Sidewinder personally) barrel or barrel kit (Dye Ultralight or Freak)... throw on a drop (preference) and a preset tank (LP 400PSI output should be best) and your set.

Also should look into SP mod.

You could build yourself a 20 BPS throwing, never chopping, easy maintainence, cheap (price wise) busy for about 600-800 depending on your budget. But that 600-800 includes just about every single upgrade, as well as a tank, loader, barrel/barrel kit and GUN! itself.

[Automaggin2]

Originally posted by dinger
welps,

such as sear, solenoid [i still duno quite what that is], hammer, and he also stated that ICD has a warning saying not to put in more than 500psi into their regulator, or else its gonna bust. .

besides, if it breaks, there's always replacement parts ^-^


Bushys and BKOs dont have sears.......


*EDIT*: Damn you Ov3rmind, you beat me to it :)

[magmonkey]

from an airsmiths stand point I have to say that the bushmaster has to be one of my least favorite markers to work on, I am not bashing them they are nice shooting markers but icd should really have used a bit hevier gauge of wire, I get alot of these markes in because someone wasn't paying attention taking them apart and they rip a wire, and also I am not a huge fan of the factory reg either.

other least favorite makers to work on
Clasic timmys
and for you old school players
customer:
"I was trying to do a trigger job to my VM68 and I can't get the trigger group back togther, can you help"

Me: "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHH HHHHHHHHHH"

[JimmyOOOOO]

Originally posted by dinger
welps,

the guy who owns my local pro shop is super-duper helpful on any paintball topic. and quite frankly, he knows everything there is to know about paintball guns.

9 times out of 10, somebody who thinks or projects the image that they know everything... doesn't

which is way he was saying that people are always bringing in ICD products that are constantly breaking down. such as sear, solenoid [i still duno quite what that is], hammer, and he also stated that ICD has a warning saying not to put in more than 500psi into their regulator, or else its gonna bust.

Bushys from 3 years ago had a HP regulator issue... it's been fixed for, oh, about 3 YEARS!

to me it sounded kinda retarded... but i take his word for it. then again, i was looking at bko's for about 3 or 4 weeks, and then he goes and bursts my bubble. i was so hyped up about it though, so im stil pursuing the real deal about the icd products.

For the money, there is no better deal out there than a BKO. With very minor modifications and intelligent tuning it will shoot just as well as markers costing hundreds of dollars more. And yes, I do own a 2003 BKO as well as a 2001 LCD Angel... so I have firsthand knowledge

besides, if it breaks, there's always replacement parts ^-^

You might approach your proshop 'guru' and find a polite way to tell him that he would be well served to update his level of knowledge on paintball markers (ICD anyway) as he is about 2 years behind.

:)

[DWill]

Now that I think about it I might make one of these myself if the B2k is $299 :D. Plus it will help out ICD, giving them a bit of money perhaps to use againist Smart Part's patent

[skife]

my team is saving right now, were going to buy 3 new BKO's
:D

hehe, we went down to the shop yesterday and the owner had one on the wall and let us shoot it, damn its fast

[coolcatpete]

they suck I have one and yeah sure its a nice trigger but I hate everything else I have a new 03 on there is bo;t stick there is everything. do not buy it you will regret it belive this I have one.

[DWill]

Congrats on 200, I just made 100!

[wimag]

had a B2K2 for a while and felt it was a great gun. It was a generation 8 so therefore did not require an adjustable tank. They have made great improvements with their regulator so that a preset is good to go.
The Bushie was light, and very fast and the trigger could be adjusted easily.
The wires though are a little on the thin side but if you take care not to yank the 9 volt out when replacing and tucking them in you should have no problem.

[JimmyOOOOO]

Originally posted by coolcatpete
they suck I have one and yeah sure its a nice trigger but I hate everything else I have a new 03 on there is bo;t stick there is everything. do not buy it you will regret it belive this I have one.

I promised myself long ago not to take the advice of somebody who can't even master basic sentence structure.

:D

[skife]

they suck I have one and yeah sure its a nice trigger but I hate everything else I have a new 03 on there is bo;t stick there is everything. do not buy it you will regret it belive this I have one.


i'll give you $200 for it

[coolcatpete]

No I just sold it to my friend. Sorry about how I had bad sentence structure but I got upset that you or anyone would want to buy one so my bad.

ps. this is a bko I like the b2k3

[Jonno06]

i love bushmasters..

[rehme]

yes bushys rock! i have a defiant man it out shoots my egg2 to easyly. IMO the sp mod is all hype all the does is drill holes in the ram to give it more vent but i got a hoseless micro rock i am going to wait for the new version the sp mod to come out it is suppose to do more things beside stop on paintballs. and when the mill them they give the more air flow so you dont needs as much psi and i have my lpr around 60psi and it stops on paintballs. also when you are adjusting your fps you only adjust one regulator i believe on bkos it is the lpr on b2ks it is the hpr. if you have any problems give me a PM. my friend just got his bko vaporized man it flys it got the vapor trigger, vapor valve, and the chaos chip.

[Abermose]

I have a 2k3 (diamond milling) BKO. For the price they are GREAT guns. They shoot so much nicer than any of the elecro spyders. But dont expect to get something that shoots like a high end electro (viking, angel, timmy).

The BKO uses a spring to return the ram, so it has trouble with high rates of fire. Everytime I tried walking it, not even that fast (13 or 14 bps), it would chop. You can get the SP mod which will cause the bolt to bounce off the paint and at $55 it is a great deal.

With the stock HP reg, the consistancy was lacking. It is also somewhat of a pain to get working. You have to adjust the LPR and HPR everytime you play (I did at least). I kept the regs nice a lubed, but it didnt seem to help.

With the stock bolt, my gun had SEVERE blow back. To fix this I had to get a vapor bolt which has orings on it.

The gun was definatly light, but also seemed kind of cheap. The anno was very thin and the gun just didnt seem solid. This is what keeps the cost down though.

Over all the gun would be great for someone who doesnt want to spend a fortune for a marker. Just dont expect to be ripping off strings of paint with one though.

As for ICD as a company, I wasnt impressed. I had to send my gun in to get the microswitch replaced and it has taken them almost 4 weeks (I still havent gotten it back). They are not very helpfull on the phone. Every solution they have is to "send the gun in". They are kinda rude too.

My 2 cents.

[magnj]

I also Own a bushy.
Wouldn't give it up for much.
-Cheap
-Original Design( before otheres ripped )
-Faster than an imp stock
-SP mod( NOT HYPE )look out for V3BETA and V4
-Stock LPR
-03 HPR's are decent

Things I dont like:
-Wiring harness
-"OH nice impulse"

If ne one needs any help with bushys head over to PBN or feel free to ask me

[old bones]

awesome gun, show me a gun that is light(2.2lbs), small. has dual regulators, a delrin bolt, a speed of 17 bps+, hard anno, smooth lines, and a trigger as adjustable as a bko for 255 bucks new. there is no other gun out there like a bko, in a its price range. there are sevral small companys offering intelligent upgrades for the bko, they have great products and customer service. get it

[old bones]

Originally posted by rehme
IMO the sp mod is all hype all the does is drill holes in the ram to give it more vent

well it does the job, how is that hype? i dont care if the sp mod consisted of bubblegum and toilet paper. it keeps me from chopping. thats all i care about. *shakes head* hype wtf, do you see a new shocker anywhere around?

[magnj]

yea. The SP mod works.

Yes holes are involved, but thats not all.

[punkncat]

I really can't speak for a BKO, I hear the new ones really rock.
I personally own a B2K.Changed the primary reg to a Palmer and it runs flawlessly.Once you adjust the LPR leave it alone , and use the main reg to adjust velocity.The "problems" that most people have with bushys relate to the stock HPR or not having the LPR adjusted right.
They are light , easy and cheap to upgrade.I would highly suggest one.

[Warewolf50]

I had one a while back, I really liked it. My only prob with it was that it felt kindof like a toy when u were hollding it, but it shot great. Only reason I got rid of it is cause i got my E-Mag and i didnt need it anymore.

[Trauma]

I totally agree on the wiring, horrible guage. I would really help everyone out if they made it thicker, but you shouldn't really be messing with the wiring anyway so as long as u leave it alone, you should be good

[Harbinger[TG]]

As an ICD Moderator elsewhere i can say a few things.

Bushies will at the very least keep up with any gun. They are easily upgradable, very affordable, and high quality. People think that because they cost less, that they are inferior guns....not the case.

IMO its always the player and not the gun, but with all these mega tourney guns..its all spray and pray/ABV.

I have people always wanting to shoot my gun. Its an older Gen4 with everything but a chip.
http://users.adelphia.net/~kptsolo/3.jpg



As for the SPMod, i dont have one. My LPR is around 60. While pics are decieving, making look as if its just a drilled ram, i have been assured its more than just adding holes. I have not seen any complaints, not even from the beta testers.

[Duke of Lawnchair]

I've seen some "upgraded" BKOs in action, and have used one of them on two occassions. I rocked with them. So, I can deduce one of two things from the two experiences, 1) BKOs rock, 2) I ROCK!

j/k

BKOs are great for the money and I'm seriously thinking about picking one up.

Jim

[old bones]

yep bump for the bko

[magnj]

now, picture the goodness of the BKO, multiply that by 3, and u have a bushy

[TheBigRaguPB4L]

I'm sure this has been answered as i got lazy and didn't read all of the replies, but oh well.

The old bushy stock reg's had a problem with regulating air down from 600+ psi. They changed a few things and have no problem now in this area.

Pro's:

Fairly light, can set up nice to my shooting position.

Consistant as anything out there(i rememeber having a defiant that could shoot 290 3-4+ times)

Fairly good out of the box gun(bushies anyways, not to sure about the BKO's)

One of the best guns for the money, out there

con's:

Stock board capped at 13bps

Sloppy trigger(kinda hard to really get good streams but i think it's because of the 13bps cap on it)

Worst part of the bushy is the wiring. The 26 gauge wire that they use is extremely easy to rip out.

[dcmander]

Yah, i would buy a 5$ solder kit. I had to resolder wires in my sonic bushy and that is a 990$ bushy....its just they get the guns from ICD and they were wired crappy and easy to pull out...soldering jobs are easy tho, and dont keep this from buying a bushy if you really want one.

[magnj]

New stock boards are capped at like 20 i beleive

[*ArKfEaR*]

I have a new 2K3 Board installed in my Sonic, its at 25.6 CPS.

:)

[dinger]

WOW! thanks for all the feedback on bkos and bushies!! info about the bushies aren't needed only because i cant afford one :\ but still, i appreciate the time put in to spread the word.

to the guy [sry for forgeting your name] who said the reg problems were fixed 3 years ago: thanks a bunch, and ill tell our pro shop guy all this "new" info.

im now thourghoughly [lol i butchered that word] convinced to buy a bko :D if the only major setback is the really thin wires, then ill just not touch them :x

once again, thanks everyone for the input and feedback about ICD guns.



p.s.- when someone says "bump", whats that mean?? and whats CPS stand for??

[DWill]

Bump means typing something to put the thread back at the top of the thread lists and CPS means cycles per second as opposed to BPS which means balls per second. CPS is basically how many times the marker can cycle per second without balls in it. I'm glad you decided to get a BKO tell me how it goes and maybe I'll get one as a backup for my mag(not that it will need one :) )

[dinger]

CPS... now that i know what it is, i see it as pointless. im not caring if a board can make it shoot 66.6cps. if it could shoot 66.6 BPS, well thats another story...

besides.. CPS wont help on the field if there isn't balls going through the gun hehe :D


DWill - i dont think ill be getting it til next year, but as this SP patent thing is getting more and more severe, i might buy it sooner because i dont feel like spending another 125$ because SP are greedy brews... [no off.]

[magnj]

I dont hti9nk anything is going to happen with the suits, but we will see.

Since you are set on the BKO, my only advice would be an Xboard revvy, SP low preasure mod, and chaos chip

[JimmyOOOOO]

Originally posted by magnj
Since you are set on the BKO, my only advice would be an Xboard revvy, SP low preasure mod, and chaos chip

As a BKO owner, here are my upgrade suggestions:

1. Empire Reloader (tested against Revvy... it's beter on a BKO)
2. Vapor Valve
3. AKA Mitey Max
4. Either a used High end barrel (Boomy) or a CP one piece
5. Chaos chip (only if you really need to spray and pray)

I have these mods on my BKO and it plays as well (if not better than) my mostly stock Angel LCD. As a matter of fact, I miss my BKOs trigger every time I shhot my Angel.

[shutter13]

well the new omens are 450 but on pbnation search for omens for sale and this guy has alot for $350 and they are sealed in the box. I got it from that guy... they are very fast and acurate and already have upgrades stock on it like a very very good reg. delrin bolt and a stock barrel that compares to a boomy and the CAM feed so look into one

[dinger]

hmm... i put another 80$ in the bank today, bringing my total to $245.51, and a bko s 255$ >_<

i still need like another 250$ so i can get a tank, df and asa, and i want the z-grip :D :D

but i was wondering if a bko can run on CO2? or is that gonna rape the internals of the gun?:confused:

[skife]

anything can be run on co2 if you do it right


Remoteline + palmer sabilizer that should run it fine but i don't use co2, i just seen this setup on some guys impy