are u really that serious about a bomb not being that much different then a stock 3 way... maybe a stock oracle 3 way.... but i have had all 3 and still love my bomb more cause.... it goes shorter then both of them.....
Angel
Angel (tricked stock ex. Warped sportz dark)
Autococker (stock)
Autococker (tricked stock, ex. kapp cocker)
Bushmaster
Intimidator
Money? Whats that? Oh, thats the stuff that my mommy bought my angel with.
What are you talking about, the whole damn sport is expensive.
Registered User
are u really that serious about a bomb not being that much different then a stock 3 way... maybe a stock oracle 3 way.... but i have had all 3 and still love my bomb more cause.... it goes shorter then both of them.....
IF I WANTED AN ANGEL AIR I WOULD GLUE A GAMEBOY TO MY FRIKIN TANK.
[IMG][/IMG]
Registered User
bump
MiniMag
Lapco Drop
68 CI Steel 3000 PSI N2 Tank
SP Progressive Barrel
Registered User
ok now....... Palmer's Pursuit Shop.....
Blazer. 400
2 finger .45 frame 95
vertical mounted stabe, 120
matched, ported barrel, 59
vertical feed 50
that's like 724
stock VF cocker.... 350
freak kit 200
hinge 100-120 (I'll use 100)
comparable Regulator 100
that's 750, and you don't even have pneumatics as good as on the blazer yet...... for a full pneumatic kit, 200-250........ and unless you're a cocker guru, pay someone 30-50 bucks to tune it...... you just spent about 900 bucks, and you just might put a 50 dollar bolt in that cocker for some reason, and maybe a new hammer and valve, and springs!
the blazer's pneus are COMPLETELY INTERNAL.... they don't need a (optional) shroud......
and I've shot PPS guns, you need that freak kit to compare in the accuracy department......
and the Blazer is lighter......
by the way, a Typhoon is pricey, they made the Blazer to be better than the phoon and is costs less money... the whole point of buying a phoon over a blazer is the awesome style points for having a hand built gun......
I'm going through paintball withdrawal, I haven't been able to play since November 2003!
Conservative Jihadi
they cost more because they're hand built.Originally posted by mykroft
The other guns are even more expensive. I can get a completely custom, one-off Automacker from Punisher for the price of a Typhoon, which certainly isn't a one-off gun.
$900 cockers include milling & ano, which is most of the price difference.
My claim stands, Palmers are overpriced.
quality costs.
what's the "One off" cocker going to be worth in ten years? If it's even working. I have two PPS Typhoons that are over 10 years old and BOTH of them are still working and BOTH of them are still worth about 85% of their original retail. When you go to sell your cocker, you better bring some sneakers for the walk home.
WHo gives a crap about milling? Does it add anything to the performance of a marker? NO.
This sport for some reason has forgotten that FORM FOLLOWS FUNCTION.
You can have your silly milling and cute anodising, I'll take reliability, customer service, exclusivity, and resale value over that any day of the week.
One last point. If all these custom cockers are so great, why are they all for sale used, in the want ads?
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Registered User
facts of life, good insight, theres someone who actully doesnt say 'cockers are more accurite" lol anyway theres someone who knows something everybody i agree 100%
Nissin from pbn <Epic>
-Facts of life.You can have your silly milling and cute anodising, I'll take reliability, customer service, exclusivity, and resale value over that any day of the week.
not to flame, but exclusivity is just like milling. is has just about the same place in paintball. reputation/how you look. sometimes it's almost bad, like w/ freeflows. sometimes it's so custom that some ppl won't buy it because of the parts you chose/didn't choose to put on it. if i'm gonna buy a used cocker, it better have what i want on it.
-again, Facts of Life. you see just as many angels as other 'guns out there.One last point. If all these custom cockers are so great, why are they all for sale used, in the want ads?
Last edited by [M@g_D@ddy]; 10-09-2002 at 03:17 PM.
Drive it like you stole it.
Shoot it like you borrowed it.
Who Dares, Plays.
Conservative Jihadi
Originally posted by [M@g_D@ddy]
-Facts of life.
not to flame, but exclusivity is just like milling. is has just about the same place in paintball. reputation/how you look. sometimes it's almost bad, like w/ freeflows. sometimes it's so custom that some ppl won't buy it because of the parts you chose/didn't choose to put on it. if i'm gonna buy a used cocker, it better have what i want on it.
-again, Facts of Life. you see just as many angels as other 'guns out there.
I would certainly agree with your first point. If I'm going to plunk down my hard earned cash on a marker, ANY marker, it better have what I want on it. Or damn close.
Right now for me, other than them lovely EMag Extreme's, the PPS stuff is doing it for me.
But I can't agree with you completely on your second point. There are far far more cockers of all varieties up for sale on the various forums than anything else I've seen lately. And this includes Spyders/Tippmans/Mags.
It's unbelieveable what I've been seeing up for sale. Take a gander at pb reviews' semis for sale section, look on pb city's as well. There are literally hundreds upon hundreds of cockers up right now. And the thing I can't figure out, is that even with the market totally saturated by them, the sellers are demanding top dollar for mildy tarted up cockers.
And mags resale is still in the tank with a lot less of them for sale. Go figure.
Nissin from pbn <Epic>
-Facts of LifeAnd the thing I can't figure out, is that even with the market totally saturated by them, the sellers are demanding top dollar for mildy tarted up cockers.
heck yea, that's exactly right. a stock e-mag could tear up a $1200 cocker. but the cocker you can sell for like $900. You'd be lucky to get $850 for it. the classic 'mags are even worse.
Conservative Jihadi
yep for mags at least it's a serious buyers market. you could have a very nicely setup classic with blade intelli and drop, gas through and you might, MIGHT get 350 out of it with a decent barrel too!
level 10 is making them more price reasonable(for sellers) but it's a slow thing.
I do see Mags making a price jump in the near future though. My guess is the combination of level 10 and the possible new aluminum bodies will spark the interest of those that don't care if form follows function...
Registered User
well...... people want Cockers, so they're willing to pay more for them, and because people will pay a lot for them, more people will try and sell their Cockers....Originally posted by FactsOfLife
And the thing I can't figure out, is that even with the market totally saturated by them, the sellers are demanding top dollar for mildy tarted up cockers.
And mags resale is still in the tank with a lot less of them for sale. Go figure.
Mags aren't wanted by many average paintballers... (I actually talked to a Mag owner the other day, a young teenage one, that had no idea what Level 10 or the Intelliframe were) and since they're not in demand, there will be very few for sale because people aren't willing to pay a high price for them....
Conservative Jihadi
ender, that's a good point. demand follows supply. in this case it doesn't make much sense to me. the market being saturated by "high end" cockers should drive the cost down. but that's not the case.
Registered User
you would think so, but for the prices to drop, the demand would have to decrease. But since the demand is high, the sellers will be able to get a lot of money for their cockers.Originally posted by FactsOfLife
the market being saturated by "high end" cockers should drive the cost down.
think about peanut butter. If you own a Peanut Butter company, and people suddenly want a lot of peanut butter, you'll make a whole lot of it, and sell it for the highest price you can get....
but if the demand is low, you'll make just a little peanut butter, and sell it for whatever you can get....
Cockers are the high PButter demand, Mags are the low PButter demand.
Registered User
bump
damn...who agrees with me that this entire sport is so friggin expensive. everything is overpriced and we're all stupid enough to buy it cause its soo damn fun to play. paintball=the best stuff ever...well besides sex
Automaggot
I know this is 'automags.org' and all, and I am the proud owner of a mag, but 'mags are pretty freaking expensive guns, considering the features you see on other guns, and not mags, like 2x triggers, sightrails, etc. I know AGD doesn't include all this stuff because they want you to be able to upgrade your gun yourself, but still-its alot of money. And the xmags arn't going to be any better-the CnC fade xmag is going to set you back fifteen hundred bucks-thats sooooo much money considering its pretty much stock-thats more than any other stock angel, excall, whatever.
AO's Tippmann Guy
Maybe you guys are forced to!
Not me, I got a PGP for 50 bucks, and use that with 12 grams and 10-round tubes. I can play an entire day on 10 bucks.
The only reason it's expensive is because the player themselves make it expensive. Nobody forces you to buy a 1000 dollar marker, you aren't made to buy a case of paint every game, nobody takes your wallet and buys all the hopper and pods and harnesses and clothing lines and all that junk! It's expensive why? Becuase you make it expensive!
But a Splatmaster, buy a PGP, buy a Sidekick. Play stock class for a couple months. THEN tell me how expensive it is.
Registered User
1. AGD puts sight rails on new Mags, lots will take it off to reduce a few ounces of weightOriginally posted by Seanmn
I know this is 'automags.org' and all, and I am the proud owner of a mag, but 'mags are pretty freaking expensive guns, considering the features you see on other guns, and not mags, like 2x triggers, sightrails, etc
2. A $300 Sear-Tripper Spyder might have more features, if you can call a grip frame you can buy and put on a stock Mechanical Spyder and save money a feature.....
3. The stock Impulse or Cocker are more expensive, and they don't have any more "special features" than the mag.
4. If it shoots paint, and has a velocity adjuster, what other features do you want?
PaintPosseRepreesentin'
i was looking at some post and one wwas about palmers and i have to say that wgp stole the design from palmer. u can tell because the blazer. it works the same way as an aoutococker but its 10000000000000 times better. they made a bunch of crap that people stole from them. But i think u get what u pay for up to about 800 when they start to get the same. and people in the first page were talking about how viking and excalubers were good. then why are the stock trigggers cheap plastic and u have to "Break" the gun in. I have a mag and it is expensive. The barrels cost at least 10 more than other guns and i payed 30 for a sight rail. so aftermarket parts cost alot. but in genneral paintball is expensive. when u think that it $50 for a freakin case of paint. For people over 18 and have jobs it isnt that much but for kids like me that spend the whole month working for our neibors and our parents and only get to play once a month for that. also i can only get parts or new guns at holidays. But i think it starts to get easier when u have ur gun set up perfect so all u need is paint. Once i get my RAT Impulse ill only neeed to buypaintbut intil then it i probly will be woking on weekends not playin pball.
Kids That Play For Fun Always Lose! or Is It Because They All Have Spyders!
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Boogie Knight
1. Must be the high end mags. Don't see any clasics or minis that come with them stock. Most people don't use them so I don't see this as too much of a loss anymore.Originally posted by EnderWigginPballin
1. AGD puts sight rails on new Mags, lots will take it off to reduce a few ounces of weight
2. A $300 Sear-Tripper Spyder might have more features, if you can call a grip frame you can buy and put on a stock Mechanical Spyder and save money a feature.....
3. The stock Impulse or Cocker are more expensive, and they don't have any more "special features" than the mag.
4. If it shoots paint, and has a velocity adjuster, what other features do you want?
2. Amazingly, you can get a pretty full function everything spyder-type marker for under $200 now. They come pretty tricked out for the price, but 2-3 upgrades and you hit a wall, and you can do beter on consistancy with most "Higher end" markers
3. Foregrip, double trigger, barrel, they may not be great, but they don't come on a stock mag classic at all, and the cost of getting those on will be more than what you could get a new cocker for.
4. Then why a mag or anything else over a spyder compact or the like?
As someone who just spend the better part of the past several days shopping around for a mag, I can tell you that to get the features you want can get pretty expensive, even used. Paintball is made to be able to sink money into, Mags have upgrades just like Cockers, and unlike cockers, they actualy MAKE you buy them on the lower end mags.
I've fallen victem to the "Got to buy this" mentality, but if you're having fun, and enjoy your marker, then don't worry about the upgrades. Paintball is a game, not an arms race.
PaintPosseRepreesentin'
the gun is very inportaint. If u play with a spyder or well look in my sig. If u play with freind that arent good and all them play with spyders and u never go to feilds then it doesnt matter what gun u have. Let me tell u that if i could shoot a couple balls faster than my oppeonent i would win almost every time. And if u could calll a spyder trick. considering most tourney player tank cost more than there whole setup. Also people take there sight rails off to minimize there size of there guns and if u take time to aim(wit a sight rail) u would of already been hit by the guy on the other side of the feild shoot in 16bps. And mags arent that costly. u said once u set up ur mag it will cost more than a cocker. well once u add ur new cocker frame and accually time it(again) U could of been workin and bought that mag. And agd doesnt put a stck barrel on classics cuz everyone upgrades it anyways. And used mags arent that expensive. Considering if u get a LX, ana phase 2, new frame and new barrel ur gun almost can be upgraded anymore. And cockers u have to upgrade(this is gonna take a while) 3 way, lpr, hammer, bolt, trgger frame, sear, back block, beaver tail, barrel, new reg(cuz wgp isnt good), and some other things u got a tricked cocker but the tricked mag cost a lot less.
Bront u must own a spyder or cocker cuz it sounds like u hate mags.
Senior PBaller. 15+yrs
put a "new" e-mag on there. They've been over priced for years,so have angels. I would never buy a new e-mag/angel, used is about the right price, 600-800. X-Mags are still proll $200-300 overpriced. just cause this is a mag forum don't mean we have to wear knee-pads, right?!?! IR3's are prol $500 overpriced.
"Accuracy by volume has been, and will remain, the best way to score eliminations" Tom Kaye
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kAmAkAzEe of PBN
ir3s are worth every pennyOriginally posted by Oregon_pb_
put a "new" e-mag on there. They've been over priced for years,so have angels. I would never buy a new e-mag/angel, used is about the right price, 600-800. X-Mags are still proll $200-300 overpriced. just cause this is a mag forum don't mean we have to wear knee-pads, right?!?! IR3's are prol $500 overpriced.
D . Y . N . A . S . T ... Y!
iR3
Vote Bush
I like the phantom for the money
Aim Small Miss Small!!!
All in all when push comes to shove my little 68 clasic will take them all on and come out on top!!!!!!!!!HEHE!! Int he right hands that is..........
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