Level 10 Springs

[DamianTC]

I just finished playing a good 10 hours over this weekend and fired around 2000 balls. After almost every game, I had paint broken in the barrel. My current setup for the level 10 is: smallest carrier (no dot, no line), 3 shims, and the smallest spring. I am thinking about going up to the red spring.

My first question:
If I install the red spring, will the only thing I have to do is increase the velocity? or will I have to adjust the carrier and shims as well?

2nd question:
With the longer and strong spring, will my rate of fire go down compared to the smallest spring?

[secretweaponevan]

I just finished playing a good 10 hours over this weekend and fired around 2000 balls. After almost every game, I had paint broken in the barrel. My current setup for the level 10 is: smallest carrier (no dot, no line), 3 shims, and the smallest spring. I am thinking about going up to the red spring.

My first question:
If I install the red spring, will the only thing I have to do is increase the velocity? or will I have to adjust the carrier and shims as well?

2nd question:
With the longer and strong spring, will my rate of fire go down compared to the smallest spring?

1st answer:
Once you break in an o-ring and get the largest carrier that doesn't leak, don't change either. You are correct that springs and velocity is related. You want the spring that just starts to allow your marker to fire 20 fps below your target velocity. And use a shim if the bolt fails to reset after it encounters a jam.

2nd answer:
No.

3rd answer:
I like long walks on the beach.


How far down the barrel were the breaks? If not in the breach, you might have too strong a spring for your velocity. Remember, the correct spring will begin to allow the marker to fire 20 fps below your target velocity.

[DamianTC]

my target velocity is 290-295, I know the smallest spring starts at 260, so you that could be causing the breaks?

paint seems to be breaking throughout the barrel, its actually kinda hard to tell for sure

so your saying if the carrier and oring have no leaks, leave them alone.. and should I start with zero shims when I go up to the red spring and keep adding one at a time until the gun recocks good?

[secretweaponevan]

my target velocity is 290-295, I know the smallest spring starts at 260, so you that could be causing the breaks?

paint seems to be breaking throughout the barrel, its actually kinda hard to tell for sure


Since you are using the smallest spring and your target velocity is 290, it is probably not too long of a spring, rather a bad detente or too tight of a bore.
With too long of a spring and too tight of a paint to barrel match, I was thinking your lvl 10 might have been kicking in sending ball #1 halfway down the barrel. Next shot would send ball #2 into ball #1 causing a barrel break. But with the shortest spring and a velocity of 290, this shouldn't be the case.

Did you check your bore to paint size? Too small or way too big might be contributing to your barrel breaks. That and/or a bad detente that would allow a ball to roll halfway down the barrel.


so your saying if the carrier and oring have no leaks, leave them alone.. and should I start with zero shims when I go up to the red spring and keep adding one at a time until the gun recocks good?

Yes. As long as you are using the largest carrier that doesn't leak (try moving up .5 and removing all shims just to check) your carrier and o-ring are perfect. Yes, start with 0 shims and squeegie test, adding a shim if the bolt fails to reset. Repeat squeegie test and adding a single shim until bolt resets reliably.

Answers in blue.

[DamianTC]

the detent seems ok.

I am not sure of the paint size, I do have a little bit of left over field paint, can I use a (what the heck is it called.... digital c-something to measure the paint?. I am using a cocker threaded 16" all-american barrel, it actually doesnt have the bore size anywhere on the barrel.

I wil be able to mess around more on tuesday when I dont have school, so I will be able to give more info then..

.....digtal coupler?? no that kinda sounds right but not sure.. I was gonna buy one at home depot a few weeks ago but didnt....

I

[secretweaponevan]

Caliper, but don't worry about that.

Put the paintball inside the barrel and see how good of a fit it is. If it passes the "blow" test but doesn't roll down the barrel, it should be pretty good.

I think the old AA barrels had a fairly large/huge back.

[DamianTC]

this is a new AA, doesnt have the plain, silver back piece. I ordered it 3 months ago from SP

[DamianTC]

I have another question before I start messing with this tomorrow.. This gun also has a ULT. If I change around the Level 10, will I also have to change the number of shims in the ULT? The ULT is working fine with the setup I have now.

[DamianTC]

well, before I changed anything. I tested the smallest spring I had in the gun. held a ball halfway in the breech and fired... the level 10 is working perfectly. so its not the bolt breaking the paint... I am gonna have to look into this further... any more ideas?

[Looper]

I have another question before I start messing with this tomorrow.. This gun also has a ULT. If I change around the Level 10, will I also have to change the number of shims in the ULT? The ULT is working fine with the setup I have now.

No, the two items are separate.

The ULT function is to reduces the trigger pull weight
The Level 10 function is to reduce paint breakage

[athomas]

If you are not getting chops, then the problem is the paint or barrel. The paint may be too large for the bore of the barrel or it may be excessively brittle. I'm thinking that it if didn't break on your level 10 chop test, that your barrel id is too tight for the paint you are using.

[Spider-TW]

Caliper, but don't worry about that.

Put the paintball inside the barrel and see how good of a fit it is. If it passes the "blow" test but doesn't roll down the barrel, it should be pretty good.

I think the old AA barrels had a fairly large/huge back.

The other side of the detent problem is the size of paint versus how hard your loader is pushing it through. When the loader takes a running start at an empty breech and the detent is just a little loose for the paint, you can get an extra ball (or more).

"special" event paint can be especially bad because it was rushed through and done as a single batch with some special fill or shell that needed more or less time drying.

[athomas]

Yeah, the detents can be a problem. I had one come apart once. Paint started breaking down the barrel. I couldn't figure out why until I ran my finger along the inside of the breach and felt the missing detent. Even with the level 10 bolt, the mag can break balls in the barrel if the detent is weak or malfunctioning. Paint that is too small can get pushed past the detents as well and can have the same effect.

[DamianTC]

I have the standard detent that comes with the ULE body. The spring behind the plastic ball seems ok and has a good push to it. The field paint I was using that day was WGP paint. not sure of the type

[secretweaponevan]

I have the standard detent that comes with the ULE body. The spring behind the plastic ball seems ok and has a good push to it. The field paint I was using that day was WGP paint. not sure of the type

That would just leave barrel or paint to be the culprit. Is the paint breaking after where the barrel's 2 pieces come together?