on/off ok, but still not firing

[gaussian88]

Hi everyone. I'm *really* looking forward to the responses on this issue I'm having. I'll try to be as clear and descriptive as possible.

My gun will not fire! (ok, I'll be more descriptive than this)
(It's a TAC ONE. X-valve + Level10. No ULT.)

At first, I thought the on/off pin was the problem. ie., that the pin was not resetting after I pull the trigger the first time. But after thinking about it a little bit, the on/off pin is resetting just fine. There is tension on the trigger at all times. I pull the trigger and nothing happens.

This problem seems to have started about 3 months ago and just got worse over time. I found that if I simply "tap" on the back of the gun (against the x-valve), the gun will fire again very nicely. If I stop firing for only a few seconds, the problem recurs. If I want to fire again, I have to tap the back of the gun again.

Well, now the gun has this problem and it just will not fire no matter how much or how hard I tap on the back. I have no idea where or how to troubleshoot this.

Thanks in advance for the help!!!

-Roger

[xero28]

Check your trigger rod length and make sure its up close to the trigger. I had a similar issue with my gun when I put a Y-frame on it. The trigger rod was too short and wouldn't engage the on/off correctly. After a couple of shots the trigger would be pretty limp and I'd have to hit the gun on the back like you're doing to get the sear and rod to return correctly. I unscrewed the rod and made it a little bit longer and it seems to be working ok. Your rod may be loose and it has screwed itself in over the months of firing it. That's all I've got for now. Good luck.

-X

[gaussian88]

X,
I will try this when I get home tonight and report back with my findings. If it works, I grant you superhero status!

-R

Check your trigger rod length and make sure its up close to the trigger. I had a similar issue with my gun when I put a Y-frame on it. The trigger rod was too short and wouldn't engage the on/off correctly. After a couple of shots the trigger would be pretty limp and I'd have to hit the gun on the back like you're doing to get the sear and rod to return correctly. I unscrewed the rod and made it a little bit longer and it seems to be working ok. Your rod may be loose and it has screwed itself in over the months of firing it. That's all I've got for now. Good luck.

-X

[tick {mwb}]

Two things i would try are :

1. Try turning the velocity up.

2. See if your bolt is sticking. When it locks up, push on the front of the bolt. If you hear it click into place, then you may need to adjust your shims and/or carrier size.

Hope this helps, but i'm no expert!

[insixdays777]

This sounds like the classic grip frame screw issue.

Try tighting the grip frame screw, or making it more loose. Some Mags are very picky about the tighting of this screw. Sounds like it is your issue because the gun will fire one the valve is pushed. Sounds like the grip frame screw or even the feild strip screw is not tight or in the position your mags likes them.

The screw will on some mags allow the body/rail/frame/trigger rod to move slightly based on how tight and/or loose the screw is. This movement/different position is enough to cause the issues you described above.

Try pushing on the body and rail in different direction when you tighting it up.

[maniacmechanic]

the Last 2 posts were on the nail
Velocity ?? unless you adjusted it down for some reason , probley not ( tick {mwb} )
Grip frame screws ?? mabey , some mags are picky ( like insixdays777 said )
Bolt stick ?? ( tick {mwb} ) more than likely this is your problem , go to the next larger carrier , then test . oil ; 2 or 3 before you play , 2 or 3 before you put it away

[211]

rail bushing?

[chefomar]

I had a similar problem once when I installed a new sear assembly. Once installed it just won't fire. You could feel some pressure at the trigger but nothing happened. The problem was that the assembly was screwed to far out not letting the on/off go all the way out. My suggestion is that you should take apart the frame and the rail with the sear assembly and do this, screw the sear assembly pin as much as you can then put it on your rail and then put it together with your frame, once that is done push the sear assembly down as the on off pin would do, and that is going to give you an idea of how long you can unscrew the sear pin. I did this with mine and went with it to a hair of touching the trigger and it's firing fine now. Hope it helps.

[gaussian88]

All. I think it's fixed!!!! THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR HELP!!!

It was the rod length after all. I unscrewed it about 1mm so that it sticks out behind the trigger. Some dry fire tests proved to be GOOD.

I'll know for sure after this weekend!

AUTOMAGS.ORG FTW!


-Roger

[xero28]

Booh Yeah! Dancing banana for me!

[Spider-TW]

rail bushing?

You do have your rail bushing? The same problem and fix could come from a missing rail bushing. The only trigger rods I've ever moved were very tight and difficult to turn.

xero should still keep his banana either way.

**edit**
I just mailed off a clevis/trigger rod that I had never used; it was loose enough to spin with my fingers. Definitely a problem.

[xero28]

I'll take it any way I can man!

[Watcher]

All. I think it's fixed!!!! THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR HELP!!!

It was the rod length after all. I unscrewed it about 1mm so that it sticks out behind the trigger. Some dry fire tests proved to be GOOD.

I'll know for sure after this weekend!

AUTOMAGS.ORG FTW!


-Roger

Sweet that you got it working. Double check the length though, there are specific specs for each type of frame/valve/etc but the general rule of thumb is this:

When aired up and you pull the trigger on safe to it's max (to take up any play), the rod should be 1mm from the back of the trigger. You can use a note card to help you eyeball it. Doing this makes the trigger pull very short and very consistant.

Make sure you take up the slack though, you don't want this thing firing on safe

[gaussian88]

Ah... good info. I'm going to be giving my mag a good cleaning tonight and I'll double check the distance between the trigger and the rod.

Sweet that you got it working. Double check the length though, there are specific specs for each type of frame/valve/etc but the general rule of thumb is this:

When aired up and you pull the trigger on safe to it's max (to take up any play), the rod should be 1mm from the back of the trigger. You can use a note card to help you eyeball it. Doing this makes the trigger pull very short and very consistant.

Make sure you take up the slack though, you don't want this thing firing on safe

[athomas]

As long as the trigger rod is close to the back of the trigger without touching it when the trigger is held forward, then you are good to go.

A limp trigger is not a trigger rod issue. It is most likely a bolt stick issue that won't allow the bolt to fully reset which in turn won't allow the sear to rotate and push the trigger rod forward.

If the gun won't fire but the trigger has tension, and there is no gap when the trigger is fully forward, then the trigger rod is probably too long. If there is too much gap, then the trigger rod is probably too short.

If the trigger rod is the proper length and the trigger has tension but the gun won't fire, then it is probably bolt stick as well.

Bolt stick can be fixed by using a larger carrier size in you level 10 setup. Most of the time, this is the issue with a mag not firing.