X-Valve Issues

[WarHamster]

So I picked up an X-Valve cheap and I've been having trouble getting it running again. So I'd like some input and advice. The problem is that the moment you gas it up, the bolt goes 1/2 forward and it starts dumping air down the barrel.

It's a pretty straight forward stock tac-one setup with X-Valve, the only unusual part is the CF Single frame the previous owner installed.

So far I know the following:

-It's definitely a valve issue as other valves work fine with the exact same body, rail, seer, frame setup.
-It's not an on/off issue (I've tried swapping out two different on/off assemblies and it didn't help)
-A stronger bolt spring will only stop the leak at the cost of being too strong to let the mag fire.
-There are no obvious problems with the valve or any of the seals. I completely broke it down and all the seals seemed to be in good shape. Likewise, the seer and on/off seemed fine.

Does anyone have suggestions on what I should try next?

[secretweaponevan]

Hold the trigger when you gas up. Does the bolt still go halfway forward?
...If so, your on/off isn't sealing. (leaky/broken/missing o-ring, mal-adjusted trigger rod, broken sear)

If it doesn't leak with your trigger held, you have a leak forward of your on/off, so it would be in the powertube.

Post back and let us know.

[WarHamster]

Sorry I should have mentioned that. Yes it leaks regardless of whether the trigger was held.

[secretweaponevan]

Sorry I should have mentioned that. Yes it leaks regardless of whether the trigger was held.

Leaky on/off.
Could be:
Leaky on/off top o-ring.
Too short an on/off pin.
Possbily missing rail bushing (in case the hump on the back of the sear can't push the on/off pin up high enough to seal).
Richmond Italia.
Al Gore.

What on/off are you using? RT on/off or ULT?
Post back and let us know.

[Ando]

Sounds like a worn spring. Replace the spring and turn up the velocity a little more and you should be good. When you go from a weaker spring to a stronger one, it take more pressure to get it going.

Edit:

-A stronger bolt spring will only stop the leak at the cost of being too strong to let the mag fire.

You just fixed the problem. Turn up your velocity.

Edit 2: If your reg starts leaking out the back after you adj the velocity then that's another problem all together. Fixable tho. Some older valves have this problem when you install a Lvl 10 but it is a X-valve so shouldn't have anything to worry about.

[secretweaponevan]

Sounds like a worn spring. Replace the spring and turn up the velocity a little more and you should be good. When you go from a weaker spring to a stronger one, it take more pressure to get it going.

Edit:

You just fixed the problem. Turn up your velocity.

If it is leaking with the trigger held, there is another problem.

[WarHamster]

Leaky on/off.
Could be:
Leaky on/off top o-ring.
Too short an on/off pin.
Possbily missing rail bushing (in case the hump on the back of the sear can't push the on/off pin up high enough to seal).
Richmond Italia.
Al Gore.

What on/off are you using? RT on/off or ULT?
Post back and let us know.

I'm fairly certain it's an RT on/off because it looks the same as the on/off that came in my micromag RT valve.

I tried swapping both of the top o-rings in the on/off and it didn't help at all. I'm not sure how I'd go about checking if the on/off pin is too short (though I suspect that isn't the case), and I think the seer is fine (because when I threw my Micro RT valve in, it worked fine).

[secretweaponevan]

Measure your on/off pin. It should be smack-dab on 3/4" (.750").

If your used X-valve had been used on an Emag, it probably still has the .712" on/off pin in it.

If the gun leaks down the barrel with the trigger held, it is definitely an on/off problem.

[Ando]

Leaky on/off.
Could be:
Leaky on/off top o-ring.
Too short an on/off pin.
Possbily missing rail bushing (in case the hump on the back of the sear can't push the on/off pin up high enough to seal).
Richmond Italia.
Al Gore.

What on/off are you using? RT on/off or ULT?
Post back and let us know.

If it is leaking with the trigger held, there is another problem.

You are correct but not a on/off. He's done more then enough troubleshooting to pinpoint what it might be.

Too short of a on/off isn't going to make his bolt shoot 1/2 out, just go full auto.

A missing rail bushing will only cause his marker to not fire.

He's already installed a dif valve on the body (worked fine), installed 2 different on/offs (one that I'm assuming came from the valve that worked) same problem, different spring (fixed the leak but wouldn't fire) and which also makes your "leaky on/off" theory a moot point since it's not leaking while the trigger is pulled or static.

Only thing that will make a bolt shoot forward like that is a weak spring, low pressure in his tank or using a LP tank regulator. It would be a retarded coincidence that both his RT on/off were leaking and we know for a fact one isn't because one came off his other valve (speculating) that worked which would tell us, he has the correct on/off pin installed. We can also rule out the tank being a problem since his other valve worked fine in the body.

EDIT:

Dude. Install the spring that stopped the leak. Adj the velocity till it starts firing or you bottom the adj screw out. If it bottoms then there's defiantly something (Reg Valve Pin Assembly maybe) internally wrong but we'll get to that when the time comes.

Ck the pressure in your tank. Make sure you have over 1k in it.

[WarHamster]

You are correct but not a on/off. He's done more then enough troubleshooting to pinpoint what it might be.

Too short of a on/off isn't going to make his bolt shoot 1/2 out, just go full auto.

A missing rail bushing will only cause his marker to not fire.

He's already installed a dif valve on the body (worked fine), installed 2 different on/offs (one that I'm assuming came from the valve that worked) same problem, different spring (fixed the leak but wouldn't fire) and which also make your "leaky on/off" theory a moot point since it's not leaking while the trigger is pulled or static.

Only thing that will make a bolt shoot forward like that is a weak spring, low pressure in his tank or using a LP tank regulator. It would be a retarded coincidence that both his RT on/off were leaking and we know for a fact one isn't because one came off his other valve (speculating) that worked which would tell us, he has the correct on/off pin installed. We can also rule out the tank being a problem since his other valve worked fine in the body.

EDIT:

Dude. Install the spring that stopped the leak. Adj the velocity till it starts firing or you bottom the adj screw out. If it bottoms then there's defiantly something (Reg Valve Pin Assembly maybe) internally wrong but we'll get to that when the time comes.

Ck the pressure in your tank. Make sure you have over 1k in it.

Okay, so I had a few stronger springs but all of them were considerably longer then the old one. All of them stopped the leak, but wouldn't let the marker fire. The weakest one however allowed it to fire with the velocity turned up a little bit once I clipped a rung off the back of it.

Now the only problem is that the trigger sticks after a few shots and I have a VERY small window in turning up the velocity, between where the marker will shoot and where it's overpressurizing and venting out the back.

[Ando]

Okay, so I had a few stronger springs but all of them were considerably longer then the old one. All of them stopped the leak, but wouldn't let the marker fire. The weakest one however allowed it to fire with the velocity turned up a little bit once I clipped a rung off the back of it.

Now the only problem is that the trigger sticks after a few shots and I have a VERY small window in turning up the velocity, between where the marker will shoot and where it's overpressurizing and venting out the back.

Good we made some headway.
I couldn't understand what you said at the end of your fist paragraph.
EDIT: NM..."clipped a ring" is what you said right? lol Don't cut anything else!!! You might need the length.

Swap out the brass reg piston from your other RT into this valve then air it up. See what you get. It might do the same thing since it is an older valve.

Some older valves have this problem when you install a Lvl 10 but it is a X-valve so shouldn't have anything to worry about.

Last famous words...

I've never ran into a X doing this but I guess there's always a first. Mostly it's the steel body RT valves that have problems. You can order a new piston, which I highly recommend or you can do some maintenance on it and "try" to fix it.

Up to you.

[WarHamster]

I'm not sure swapping the pistons is necessary (though I do have a spare from a while back if I need to at some point).

I tried pulling the spring of my micro RT valve and that one seems to work just fine. What's weird is the spring off my microRT valve appears to be the same as the spring that was causing me problems and is considerably shorter then the other springs I was trying in it earlier.

Anyways, the new spring I swapped out from my microRT came out of a level-x kit originally so I should be able to replace it easily enough. I'm just crossing my fingers that I won't start seeing the trigger sticking again when it sees actual action.

Thank for the help guys!

[athomas]

If you are experiencing sticking, then there are other problems that need to be looked at. Sticking is generally caused by a carrier that is too tight, or a leaking oring in your on-off top. The level 10 bolts can leak for a couple of seconds following a shot if the trigger is held. Then it should stop. If not, then you have an issue with your on-off top. An excessively stiff bolt spring will help mask the problem, but it will prevent perfect operation. I would give the valve a good cleaning and replace both on-off top orings as a start.

[Ando]

I'm willing to bet when you get out on the field and adj the marker to what ever FPS is allowed, it's going to start leaking out the back. Take your spar piston with you to the field just in case.

Good luck